Obedience Motivated by Love, Not Law

RobertPate

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The Pharisees thought that obedience and righteousness was motivated by their effort to keep the Mosiac law.

Under the New Covenant the Old Covenant of law and religion was abolished, Ephesians 2:15. Jesus nailed it to his cross, Colossians 2:14. The reason that it was abolished was because it was no longer applicable for New Testament Christians. Paul wrote, "Christ is the end of the law for righteousness" Romans 10:4.

Many Christians believe that the law is their teacher and their guide and that they should live by laws, rules and religion. This is exactly what the Pharisees thought. But the Bible teaches that the Holy Spirit is our teacher and our guide and not the law, John 16:13.

When God abolished the written law, he wrote the spiritual law on the hearts and minds of his people, Hebrews 8:10. The spiritual law is very different from the written law. The written law demands perfection or death. The spiritual law is an urging or prompting to do what is right. There is no condemnation for those that violate the spiritual law, Romans 8:1.

Under the New Covenant God's people don't live by rules, laws or religion. Paul wrote, "The just shall live by faith" Romans 1:17. They live by faith in Christ and his Gospel.
 

Ivan Hlavanda

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No one could have kept the law. God gave the law to show Israelites His holiness, His character, and how far we have fallen (and how impossible it is for us to keep the Holy Commandments, that there was no hope in us). The Israelites should have realised by constant sacrifices that they could not have kept the law, and depend God on salvation rather than themselves. And look forward to the promised Messiah.

It is the same today when people try to save themselves by doing good deeds rather than depend on God and His perfect sacrifice of His beloved Son on the cross, who either died for you and paid for your sins, or He did not and the wrath of God is on you.
 
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ICONO'CLAST

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The Pharisees thought that obedience and righteousness was motivated by their effort to keep the Mosiac law.

Under the New Covenant the Old Covenant of law and religion was abolished, Ephesians 2:15. Jesus nailed it to his cross, Colossians 2:14. The reason that it was abolished was because it was no longer applicable for New Testament Christians. Paul wrote, "Christ is the end of the law for righteousness" Romans 10:4.

Many Christians believe that the law is their teacher and their guide and that they should live by laws, rules and religion. This is exactly what the Pharisees thought. But the Bible teaches that the Holy Spirit is our teacher and our guide and not the law, John 16:13.

When God abolished the written law, he wrote the spiritual law on the hearts and minds of his people, Hebrews 8:10. The spiritual law is very different from the written law. The written law demands perfection or death. The spiritual law is an urging or prompting to do what is right. There is no condemnation for those that violate the spiritual law, Romans 8:1.

Under the New Covenant God's people don't live by rules, laws or religion. Paul wrote, "The just shall live by faith" Romans 1:17. They live by faith in Christ and his Gospel.
The Pharisees thought that obedience and righteousness was motivated by their effort to keep the Mosiac law.

Under the New Covenant the Old Covenant of law and religion was abolished, Ephesians 2:15. Jesus nailed it to his cross, Colossians 2:14. The reason that it was abolished was because it was no longer applicable for New Testament Christians. Paul wrote, "Christ is the end of the law for righteousness" Romans 10:4.

Many Christians believe that the law is their teacher and their guide and that they should live by laws, rules and religion. This is exactly what the Pharisees thought. But the Bible teaches that the Holy Spirit is our teacher and our guide and not the law, John 16:13.

When God abolished the written law, he wrote the spiritual law on the hearts and minds of his people, Hebrews 8:10. The spiritual law is very different from the written law. The written law demands perfection or death. The spiritual law is an urging or prompting to do what is right. There is no condemnation for those that violate the spiritual law, Romans 8:1.

Under the New Covenant God's people don't live by rules, laws or religion. Paul wrote, "The just shall live by faith" Romans 1:17. They live by faith in Christ and his Gospel.
You have this completely wrong.
Christians are not lawless.
God put the law in our hearts.
The law leads to Christ.
Love if the fulfilling of the law.. Rom13:8-10
 
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Carl Emerson

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You have this completely wrong.
Christians are not lawless.
God put the law in our hearts.
The law leads to Christ.
Love if the fulfilling of the law.. Rom13:8-10

Robert didn't say Christians were lawless.

The Law of the Spirit of Life has set us free from the Law of Sin and Death.

Robert said in the subject line that love is the motivation to obedience
 
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RobertPate

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No one could have kept the law. God gave the law to show Israelites His holiness, His character, and how far we have fallen (and how impossible it is for us to keep the Holy Commandments, that there was no hope in us). The Israelites should have realised by constant sacrifices that they could not have kept the law, and depend God on salvation rather than themselves. And look forward to the promised Messiah.

It is the same today when people try to save themselves by doing good deeds rather than depend on God and His perfect sacrifice of His beloved Son on the cross, who either died for you and paid for your sins, or He did not and the wrath of God is on you.

I agree with you. There are several purposes of the law.

The law pointes us to Jesus Christ, who is the epitome of the law.
The law Reveals the righteousness of God and the sinfulness of man.
The law is what brings us to Christ, so that we can be justified by faith, Galatians 3:24.
 
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RobertPate

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You have this completely wrong.
Christians are not lawless.
God put the law in our hearts.
The law leads to Christ.
Love if the fulfilling of the law.. Rom13:8-10

No, Christians that are indwelt with the Holy Spirit are not lawless, but they are not holy either. Yes, the law leads us to Christ, so that we can be justified by faith, Galatians 3:24
Jesus is God's justifier, Romans 3:26. He justifies the ungodly, Romans 4:5.
 
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Trusting in Him

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I am sure that obedience to God is motivated by love, but also that without faith it is impossible to please Him: for he that cometh to God must believe that He is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him. (Hebrews 11:6)

Of course if we our obedience to God is motivated by love, the rest as quoted above will also apply as well.
 
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We are no longer under the Law of Sin and Death.

But there is another big difference.

We have the Author of the Law within us who can personally guide us into righteousness.

This is a much more specific instruction than the Law ever was.
 
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RobertPate

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I am sure that obedience to God is motivated by love, but also that without faith it is impossible to please Him: for he that cometh to God must believe that He is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him. (Hebrews 11:6)

Of course if we our obedience to God is motivated by love, the rest as quoted above will also apply as well.

Right. A good son does not need instructions. He knows what is required of him and lives accordingly. He would never do anything to shame his father because he loves him.
 
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RobertPate

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We are no longer under the Law of Sin and Death.

But there is another big difference.

We have the Author of the Law within us who can personally guide us into righteousness.

This is a much more specific instruction than the Law ever was.

Right. The Holy Spirit is our teacher and our guide, Matthew 16:13.
 
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ICONO'CLAST

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Robert Pate,

Hello RP,
I think we need to use extreme caution to discuss the place of the law in the Christian life
.

[Under the New Covenant the Old Covenant of law and religion was abolished, Ephesians 2:15. Jesus nailed it to his cross, Colossians 2:14.]

The OLd Covenant was done away with.We are no longer to sacrfice animals, observe ceremonial feast days,food laws.
Does that mean the 10 commandments are "abolished"?

Which commandment are you free to break?
Can you take the lord's name in vain? worship other gods?
Can you murder your neighbor?

Paul teaches us differently;
8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.

9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbor: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

Paul had no trouble using the 10 commandments to describe how we love our neighbor.

[The reason that it was abolished was because it was no longer applicable for New Testament Christians.]
No this is not correct.

3 As I besought thee to abide still at Ephesus, when I went into Macedonia, that thou mightest charge some that they teach no other doctrine,

4 Neither give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: so do.

5 Now the end of the commandment is charity out of a pure heart, and of a good conscience, and of faith unfeigned:

6 From which some having swerved have turned aside unto vain jangling;

7 Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm.

8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;


9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,

10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;

11 According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.

[Paul wrote, "Christ is the end of the law for righteousness" Romans 10:4.]

Paul is quoting from Deut 30,which you have ignored.

10 If thou shalt hearken unto the voice of the Lord thy God, to keep his commandments and his statutes which are written in this book of the law, and if thou turn unto the Lord thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul.

11 For this commandment which I command thee this day, it is not hidden from thee, neither is it far off.

12 It is not in heaven, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go up for us to heaven, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it?

13 Neither is it beyond the sea, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go over the sea for us, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it?

14 But the word is very nigh unto thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart, that thou mayest do it.


15 See, I have set before thee this day life and good, and death and evil;

16 In that I command thee this day to love the Lord thy God, to walk in his ways, and to keep his commandments and his statutes and his judgments, that thou mayest live and multiply: and the Lord thy God shall bless thee in the land whither thou goest to possess it.

17 But if thine heart turn away, so that thou wilt not hear, but shalt be drawn away, and worship other gods, and serve them;

18 I denounce unto you this day, that ye shall surely perish, and that ye shall not prolong your days upon the land, whither thou passest over Jordan to go to possess it.

19 I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:



Paul uses this to point to Christ Jesus as our Covenant head and law keeper. He was the law giver, and He kept the law perfectly on behalf of His elect people.
We are saved by law keeping! Not our trying to keep it,[we cannot], but by the perfect law keeping of our Lord. That is what provides us with righteousness. CHRIST IS THE END OF THE LAW...FOR RIGHTEOUSNESS.
THE LAW POINTS TO CHRIST AS A SCHOOLMASTER TOOK CHILDREN TO SCHOOL. GAL3:24


10 Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved.

2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.

3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.

6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above:)

7 Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)

8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;

9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

10
For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.

12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.


[Many Christians believe that the law is their teacher and their guide and that they should live by laws, rules and religion. ]

Christians are law keepers...many have preached, the law is LOVES eyes.

[This is exactly what the Pharisees thought. ]

They taught we could keep the law in order to be saved which was false.



[But the Bible teaches that the Holy Spirit is our teacher and our guide and not the law, John 16:13.]

Any truth we welcome comes by way of the Spirit. You are using jn16:13 out of context which I will show when I start the thread on Apostolic uniqueness.That verse was given directly to the Apostles.

[When God abolished the written law, he wrote the spiritual law on the hearts and minds of his people, Hebrews 8:10. The spiritual law is very different from the written law.]

No, it is identical. The change is in the new heart, not in the law.
In the OT the law was mediated by Moses, in the NT. it is mediated by Jesus.

7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.

8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:

9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.



[The written law demands perfection or death. The spiritual law is an urging or prompting to do what is right. There is no condemnation for those that violate the spiritual law, Romans 8:1.]

We are not free to violate the law....real believers are not condemned because Jesus has paid for their sins.Those who sin will be disciplined by God.

5 And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaketh unto you as unto children, My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of him:

6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.

7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?

8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.

9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?

[Under the New Covenant God's people don't live by rules, laws or religion.]

A complete falsehood, we are not antinomian...[ie, against law]

31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

Robert, take some time to consider what is being offered here.
I had some of the same ideas you have expressed.
They are a combination of true ideas, but wrong conclusions.
feel free to offer any questions, or if you feel i am in error
, offer correction
 
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RobertPate

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Robert Pate,

Hello RP,
I think we need to use extreme caution to discuss the place of the law in the Christian life
.

[Under the New Covenant the Old Covenant of law and religion was abolished, Ephesians 2:15. Jesus nailed it to his cross, Colossians 2:14.]

The OLd Covenant was done away with.We are no longer to sacrice animals, observe ceremonial feast days,food laws.
Does that mean the 10 commandments are "abolished"?

Which commandment are you free to break?
Can you take the lord's name in vain? worship other gods?
Can you murder your neighbor?

Paul teaches us differently;
8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.

9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbor: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

Paul had no trouble using the 10 commandments to describe how we love our neighbor.

[The reason that it was abolished was because it was no longer applicable for New Testament Christians.]
No this is not correct.

3 As I besought thee to abide still at Ephesus, when I went into Macedonia, that thou mightest charge some that they teach no other doctrine,

4 Neither give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: so do.

5 Now the end of the commandment is charity out of a pure heart, and of a good conscience, and of faith unfeigned:

6 From which some having swerved have turned aside unto vain jangling;

7 Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm.

8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;


9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,

10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;

11 According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.

[Paul wrote, "Christ is the end of the law for righteousness" Romans 10:4.]

Paul is quoting from Deut 30,which you have ignored.

10 If thou shalt hearken unto the voice of the Lord thy God, to keep his commandments and his statutes which are written in this book of the law, and if thou turn unto the Lord thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul.

11 For this commandment which I command thee this day, it is not hidden from thee, neither is it far off.

12 It is not in heaven, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go up for us to heaven, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it?

13 Neither is it beyond the sea, that thou shouldest say, Who shall go over the sea for us, and bring it unto us, that we may hear it, and do it?

14 But the word is very nigh unto thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart, that thou mayest do it.


15 See, I have set before thee this day life and good, and death and evil;

16 In that I command thee this day to love the Lord thy God, to walk in his ways, and to keep his commandments and his statutes and his judgments, that thou mayest live and multiply: and the Lord thy God shall bless thee in the land whither thou goest to possess it.

17 But if thine heart turn away, so that thou wilt not hear, but shalt be drawn away, and worship other gods, and serve them;

18 I denounce unto you this day, that ye shall surely perish, and that ye shall not prolong your days upon the land, whither thou passest over Jordan to go to possess it.

19 I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:



Paul uses this to point to Christ Jesus as our Covenant head and law keeper. He was the law giver, and He kept the law perfectly on behalf of His elect people.
We are saved by law keeping! Not our trying to keep it,[we cannot], but by the perfect law keeping of our Lord. That is what provides us with righteousness. CHRIST IS THE END OF THE LAW...FOR RIGHTEOUSNESS.
THE LAW POINTS TO CHRIST AS A SCHOOLMASTER TOOK CHILDREN TO SCHOOL. GAL3:24


10 Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved.

2 For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.

3 For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God.

4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.

6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above:)

7 Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)

8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;

9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

10
For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.

12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.


[Many Christians believe that the law is their teacher and their guide and that they should live by laws, rules and religion. ]

Christians are law keepers...many have preached, the law is LOVES eyes.

[This is exactly what the Pharisees thought. ]

They taught we could keep the law in order to be saved which was false.



[But the Bible teaches that the Holy Spirit is our teacher and our guide and not the law, John 16:13.]

Any truth we welcome comes by way of the Spirit. You are using jn16:13 out of context which I will show when I start the thread on Apostolic uniqueness.That verse was given directly to the Apostles.

[When God abolished the written law, he wrote the spiritual law on the hearts and minds of his people, Hebrews 8:10. The spiritual law is very different from the written law.]

No, it is identical. The change is in the new heart, not in the law.
In the OT the law was mediated by Moses, in the NT. it is mediated by Jesus.

7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.

8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:

9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.



[The written law demands perfection or death. The spiritual law is an urging or prompting to do what is right. There is no condemnation for those that violate the spiritual law, Romans 8:1.]

We are not free to violate the law....real believers are not condemned because Jesus has paid for their sins.Those who sin will be disciplined by God.

5 And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaketh unto you as unto children, My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of him:

6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.

7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?

8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.

9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?

[Under the New Covenant God's people don't live by rules, laws or religion.]

A complete falsehood, we are not antinomian...[ie, against law]

31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

Robert, take some time to consider what is being offered here.
I had some of the same ideas you have expressed.
They are a combination of true ideas, but wrong conclusions.
feel free to offer any questions, or if you feel i am in error
, offer correction
The reason that Christ is the end of the law for righteousness is because, Jesus in our name and on our behalf, as our substitute and representative has fulfilled every jot and tittle of the law for us, Matthew 5:18. "We are complete in him" Colossians 2:10. No laws, rules or religion needed. All that receive this wonderful truth have entered into his rest, Hebrews 4:10.
 
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The reason that Christ is the end of the law for righteousness is because, Jesus in our name and on our behalf, as our substitute and representative has fulfilled every jot and tittle of the law for us, Matthew 5:18. "We are complete in him" Colossians 2:10. No laws, rules or religion needed. All that receive this wonderful truth have entered into his rest, Hebrews 4:10.
I agree with you here Robert.
He did what we could not do as our perfect and sinless Great High Priest.
The ten Commandments are still in effect, not under Moses, but rather under Christ.1 cor9 :21.
All ot.law was based on an expansion of the ten commandments.
All Nt. Law is also.
Love God,Love your neighbor.
Love fulfills the law..rom13:8-10..it does not throw it out.
We obey as sons not in order to be saved, but because we are saved.
 
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RobertPate

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I agree with you here Robert.
He did what we could not do as our perfect and sinless Great High Priest.
The ten Commandments are still in effect, not under Moses, but rather under Christ.1 cor9 :21.
All ot.law was based on an expansion of the ten commandments.
All Nt. Law is also.
Love God,Love your neighbor.
Love fulfills the law..rom13:8-10..it does not throw it out.
We obey as sons not in order to be saved, but because we are saved.
The law still exists, but not for the Christian. Where there is law there is judgment and condemnation. There is no condemnation for those that are in Christ, Romans 8:1. There is no condemnation because God sees them as perfect and complete in Christ, Colossians 2:10.

There are consequences for those that are under the law. Those that are under the law or subject to it are under a curse, Galatians 3:10.
 
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ICONO'CLAST

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The law still exists, but not for the Christian. Where there is law there is judgment and condemnation. There is no condemnation for those that are in Christ, Romans 8:1. There is no condemnation because God sees them as perfect and complete in Christ, Colossians 2:10.

There are consequences for those that are under the law. Those that are under the law or subject to it are under a curse, Galatians 3:10.
As a Christian do you sin against the law of God
 
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RobertPate

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As a Christian do you sin against the law of God
The law demands perfection, Genesis 17:1. Anything less than perfection is sin, Paul said, "There is none righteous, no, not one" Romans 3:10. In the light of that, I am a sinner, a saved sinner. Paul also referred to himself as "The chief of sinners" 1 Timothy 1:15. Do I deliberately sin? I try not to. There are terrible consequences to sin. Not only that, I don't want to disgrace my heavenly father.
 
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Carl Emerson

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Galatians 5

13 For you were called to freedom, brothers and sisters; only do not turn your freedom into an opportunity for the flesh, but serve one another through love. 14 For the whole Law is fulfilled in one word, in the statement, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” 15 But if you bite and devour one another, take care that you are not consumed by one another.

16 But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not carry out the desire of the flesh. 17 For the desire of the flesh is against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; for these are in opposition to one another, in order to keep you from doing whatever you want. 18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the Law.
 
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