Now electric vehicles are BAD for the environment

[Larniavc]

Maybe individual cells weigh that much, but there's no way an EV batter weighs only 10KG.

ETA: The battery of a long range Tesla Model 3 weighs 480KG

Correct. I was mistaken. I’ll edit my post.

 

[Whyayeman]

The grid is already overworked, hence the rolling blackouts we're already seeing.

I believe American infrastructure has suffered from under-investment for some time. The grid needs to be improved even without any extra load from EVs. Having an inadequate electricity supply does not alter the need for EVs, indeed is irrelevant.

 

[durangodawood]

We should all drive around in slot-cars.

 

[Bradskii]

Interesting. I cant quite see it for most people, considering how many would be required in city density. And I think horses require waaaay more care than a bike.

And methane is worse than CO²...

 

[Bradskii]

Not when you take into consideration the energy loss through all those long power lines, which is what you have with a centralized source. The grid is already overworked, hence the rolling blackouts we're already seeing. Add vehicles powered on electric, and the workload on the grid will make the electricity for your car, home, business and anything else that relies on it unreliable.

Get solar and drive for free.

 

[Bradskii]

Maybe individual cells weigh that much, but there's no way an EV batter weighs only 10KG.

ETA: The battery of a long range Tesla Model 3 weighs 480KG

My Toyota Rav 4 hybrid battery weighs 340kg. Toyota will recycle the battery when it's past its used-by date. Of that weight, around 334kg is recycled.

 

[Subduction Zone]

And methane is worse than CO²...

Yes and no. In the short run it is worse since molecule for molecule it has far more of an effect. But CO2 is worse in the long run. Methane has a much shorter atmospheric half life than CO2. It eventually oxidizes. Carbon dioxide can hang around for hundreds of years. From various articles it appears that methane hangs around for 10 to 12 years and carbon dioxide about 200 years on average.

 

[DamianWarS]

the electricity needs to be generated somewhere, so introducing electric cars to countries with largely fossil fuel based grids will worsen the car-based emmissions - and likely require expansion of those grids with their concomittent extra environmental effect.

I remember when people were switching to CF bulbs (now LED) from incandescent and one of the complaints was that new light bulbs use less power so they produce less heat and everyone's heat bill went up. But that's a poor reason to not switch, light bulbs are poor ways to heat homes and we should be using more efficient ways to provide both light and heat.

Saying switching to e-vehicles and saying it's worse on the environment because of fosil fuel power plants is the same argument. Increased demand with e-vehicles means an increased pressure on the supply of power to change to clean energy options.

 

[Whyayeman]

Methane has a much shorter atmospheric half life than CO2. It eventually oxidizes.

Yes, and the end product? CO2 and water.

CH4 -> CO2+2H2O

So methane is worse than CO2 in the short run and just as bad in the long run. If you are going to get sciency, do it right!

 

[Bradskii]

Yes, and the end product? CO2 and water.

CH4 -> CO2+2H2O

So methane is worse than CO2 in the short run and just as bad in the long run. If you are going to get sciency, do it right!

Now I've looked into this, there are suggestions that removing the methane by converting it to C02 would be a benefit in the short term. Turn Methane into CO 2 to Reduce Warming, Experts Propose

Sounds counter intuitive...

 

[Aldebaran]

I believe American infrastructure has suffered from under-investment for some time. The grid needs to be improved even without any extra load from EVs. Having an inadequate electricity supply does not alter the need for EVs, indeed is irrelevant.

They haven't been needed yet, and we certainly don't need something that further stresses or collapses our energy grid anytime soon.

 

[Aldebaran]

Get solar and drive for free.

After reading a review from someone who had an electric vehicle with a solar panel in the roof he was excited about for that very reason, he soon discovered that even a full day in the sun didn't add any measurable amount of power to the vehicle's battery.

 

[Subduction Zone]

They haven't been needed yet, and we certainly don't need something that further stresses or collapses our energy grid anytime soon.

Did you tell Texas that? If you don't know what I am talking about Ted Cruz certainly does.

 

[Subduction Zone]

After reading a review from someone who had an electric vehicle with a solar panel in the roof he was excited about for that very reason, he soon discovered that even a full day in the sun didn't add any measurable amount of power to the vehicle's battery.

He could have realized that if he ran the numbers of how much energy his solar panels can make and how much the vehicle uses. It takes far more solar panels to run a car than one can put on its roof.

 

[Occams Barber]

I often wonder what it would have been like if horses were still the main mode of transportation. In some California cities, like Compton, it's not uncommon to see people riding horses in the city.

View attachment 309173
View attachment 309174

Where I live its completely normal to see horses being ridden alongside the road.

It's also absolutely normal to see kangaroos hopping through the streets without a rider.

OB

 

[Aldebaran]

He could have realized that if he ran the numbers of how much energy his solar panels can make and how much the vehicle uses. It takes far more solar panels to run a car than one can put on its roof.

Tell that to the author of post 45.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Tell that to the author of post 45.

I do believe that was a tongue in cheek post.

EDIT: Rereading it he may have been serious. There was nothing in that post about the panels being on the car.

 

[Bradskii]

After reading a review from someone who had an electric vehicle with a solar panel in the roof he was excited about for that very reason, he soon discovered that even a full day in the sun didn't add any measurable amount of power to the vehicle's battery.

One solar panel? That's about 300w. He'd need ten times that in full sun for a full day to charge a small EV. You'd think he'd have checked first.

 

[Aldebaran]

One solar panel? That's about 300w. He'd need ten times that in full sun for a full day to charge a small EV. You'd think he'd have checked first.

I'm sure he did, but I didn't say it didn't charge it all the way up, but rather that it didn't add a measurable charge. That means if the battery is at 36% and the car with the panel is sitting in the sun all day, you'd normally expect the battery to be at more than 36% at the end of the day.
But don't take me as an anti-solar person. I realize it's gotten more efficient lately. I even bought a 21 watt solar charger and tested it with my phone on a completely overcast day. My 2100 Mah battery went up 20% in 2 hours. In the sun, it went up 60% in an hour and 40 minutes. I like the idea of being able to get power from the sun if the grid goes down for my phone and for flashlight batteries. But the idea of getting enough solar panel to drive every car on the street, and to power every home and business is something solar cannot fulfill.

 

[Bradskii]

I'm sure he did, but I didn't say it didn't charge it all the way up, but rather that it didn't add a measurable charge. That means if the battery is at 36% and the car with the panel is sitting in the sun all day, you'd normally expect the battery to be at more than 36% at the end of the day.
But don't take me as an anti-solar person. I realize it's gotten more efficient lately. I even bought a 21 watt solar charger and tested it with my phone on a completely overcast day. My 2100 Mah battery went up 20% in 2 hours. In the sun, it went up 60% in an hour and 40 minutes. I like the idea of being able to get power from the sun if the grid goes down for my phone and for flashlight batteries. But the idea of getting enough solar panel to drive every car on the street, and to power every home and business is something solar cannot fulfill.

Any size solar panel will increase the power in a battery. And a normal size installation for a house (say 6.6kW which is what I'm thinking of) will charge an EV in one day, assuming all electrical appliances are not running. In two days if the house is running as normal (and you can reverse the flow and run your house off your car if necessary). So yeah, with a relatively small installation then you can run your car and your house.