Not the problem of evil

In addition, try googling up "work ethic" followed in turn by the words "in Judaism", "in Buddhism", "in Islam".

You will see very quickly that this supposed Christian value of the worth ethic is in fact a universally held position.

Euler said:

Ummmm. Our SECULAR notions of work are influenced by the philosophy that work is part of the worship of a god??

Really??

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Yes absolutely.

Here's Calvin -

"The magistrate will discharge his functions more willingly; the head of the household will confine himself to his duty; each man will bear and swallow the discomforts, vexations, weariness, and anxieties in his way of life, when he has been persuaded that the burden was laid upon him by God "

Somehow, secular values recognize that our work lives are placed there by a deity!

Uh, yeah.

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In a sense, yes. People often have a stronger sense of guilt or failure for being unemployed, for instance, if they come from a country with a stronger Calvinist religious tradition, since in the popular Puritan and Presbyterian piety of the 16th-17th centuries, failure in ones work could be interpreted as a sign that God had not elected them. That's what I was talking about in the research done on unemployment in England. Whereas historically prominent Lutheran countries do not have that sort of piety in their past, not focusing on election but on the visible sacraments of a state church that unified the state spiritually. That sort of solidarity translates to less individualism.

Why is this so hard to understand?

Euler said:

In addition, try googling up "work ethic" followed in turn by the words "in Judaism", "in Buddhism", "in Islam".

You will see very quickly that this supposed Christian value of the worth ethic is in fact a universally held position.

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No, I disagree... and I wasn't talking about a "work ethic" in general, but specific attitudes to work. The concept of vocation and life calling, and measuring our self-worth and achievement through our work, is much more unique to the West and a legacy of our religious traditions. The negative consequences, the depression and so forth, due to the declining and fragmenting influence of religion in their lives. But the influence is still there, it's just not as complete as in the past, and is being replaced by other narratives, such as the ones created by advertising agencies and Capitalism, Marxism, or other non-Christian voices.

FireDragon76 said:

No, I disagree... and I wasn't talking about a "work ethic" in general, but specific attitudes to work.

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And virtually the same attitudes towards work are found in those other religious traditions.

Oh, and Hindu as well. I took a look at it since my last posting and it, possibly more so than any of the others, embraces the concept of a 'life calling' and 'self worth through work' to your occupation. In fact the caste system virtually cements such a philosophy in place.

Try again.

Euler said:

Oh, and Hindu as well. I took a look at it since my last posting and it, possibly more so than any of the others, embraces the concept of a 'life calling' and 'self worth through work' to your occupation. In fact the caste system virtually cements such a philosophy in place.

Try again.

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I don't think the Hindu caste system is comparable to the Christian concept of vocation. Hindu castes are static things, whereas vocation is potentially dynamic. The Hindu castes also imply that certain kinds of work are atonement for sins in a paste life- definitely not what Christians believe about work.

FireDragon76 said:

I don't think the Hindu caste system is comparable to the Christian concept of vocation. Hindu castes are static things, whereas vocation is potentially dynamic. The Hindu castes also imply that certain kinds of work are atonement for sins in a paste life- definitely not what Christians believe about work.

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Vocation is a concept of people being suited to a particular line of work - a calling. That's what the word means. I am a teacher. Christians would say that it is more than my employment, it's what I've been 'called' to do, it's what I'm supposed to become.

Just like the Hindus believe.

So, can you explain then why people in England experience more depression than those in Spain or Germany, when they are unemployed?

FireDragon76 said:

So, can you explain then why people in England experience more depression than those in Spain or Germany, when they are unemployed?

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What!?

You know if you keep stretching that thing it's just gonna snap, don't you?

Good grief.

Human goodness? It is better to agree as JESUS stated.....

Mark 10:18King James Version (KJV)

18 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God.

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if we presume we are perfect and good we fool ourselves and deceive ourselves. We as humans are all sinners and non are perfect. While we can assume that walking in faith in JESUS CHRIST by the grace of GOD is the goodness that shelters us and that we follow him who walk in perfect righteousness, non of us should claim any goodness within; without the high priest and through him; being JESUS CHRIST.

Praise be to GOD the heavenly father and his son lord JESUS CHRIST forever>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

sunshine456 said:

Human goodness? It is better to agree as JESUS stated.....



if we presume we are perfect and good we fool ourselves and deceive ourselves. We as humans are all sinners and non are perfect. While we can assume that walking in faith in JESUS CHRIST by the grace of GOD is the goodness that shelters us and that we follow him who walk in perfect righteousness, non of us should claim any goodness within; without the high priest and through him; being JESUS CHRIST.

Praise be to GOD the heavenly father and his son lord JESUS CHRIST forever>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

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Who said, atheist or theist, that they thought they were perfect? And I feel sorry for you if you don't think you can claim any goodness within you.