What you’ve quoted from Romans 9 is explaining how God showed mercy to the gentiles who were not seeking Him. The Jews were seeking God but by works and did not arrive at righteousness. NASB
What I quoted from Romans 9 is carried over from Romans 8
THAT is the context. Of course you are correct that there is an
application to the Jews and Gentiles.
Rom 9:24
Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only,
but also of the Gentiles?
So Romans 9 does talk about how the Jews were forsaken
and the Gentiles grafted in. And how God is saving BOTH the
Jew and Gentile now (where in the past it was ONLY the Jews)
But let's look at the CONTEXT leading up to Romans 9
Since we are looking at a narrative that actually began back
in Romans 1 and 2, was summarized in Romans 3 with the
passage say that NO MAN will seek God, no, not even one.
Remember, there were no chapters and verses in the original
text. Man has inserted that into the Scripture. So when we
study Romans 9 we need to back-up a little bit and read
chapter 8 to get a better feel for what is said in chapter 9
about God electing some for salvation and not others.
Rom 8:1-5
There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. For the law
of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of
sin and death. For what the law could not do, in that it was weak
through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful
flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: That the righteousness
of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but
after the Spirit. For they that are after the flesh do mind the things
of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
The passage then goes on to say that they that live in the flesh
cannot please God [v8], but those with the spirit of God are made
alive and will be transformed [v11]. And then it says this... and
keep in mind the word "us" or "ye" or "we" means Jew and Gentile.
Rom 8:14
For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye
have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children
of God: And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with
Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified
together. For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not
worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us.
And then it talks about the whole creation waits for the redemption
from our bondage of corruption [v21] and how we who have the
indwelling spirit are waiting for our adoption to be completed when
we receive our incorruptible spiritual bodies [v23], which of course
is talked about in 1Co 15. Then we read:
Rom 8:28-31
And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God,
to them who are the called according to his purpose.
For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. moreover
whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and
whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified,
them he also glorified. What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?
So, keep in mind, this includes both Jew and Gentile in Rome and
around the world. This is the process of election (talked about in
chapter 9). And "whom he did foreknow" does not refer (as many
like to claim) to God seeing some good we will do in our lives and
electing us based on our future works... again that issue is part of
the narrative in chapter 9. We cannot separate the two chapters.
And then the chapter ends with this passage which, again, includes
both Jew and Gentile. And this passage is what leads us into the
information recorded in chapter 9. So all the above sets the stage,
so to speak, for the information provided in Romans 9... it gives
us the CONTEXT of Romans 9 since everything above applies to
all those who are regenerated (both Jew and Gentile)
Rom 8:35-39
Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?
As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter. Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us. For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
So now we get into chapter 9 where Paul shows his distress with the
fact that his fellow Jews are rejecting Christ [v1-3] and how the Jews
had been God's people for so long, with Israel being the only people
that God was saving. And then he says this:
Rom 9:6-7
Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.
Then Paul again begins to address the same issue as he addressed
at the start of chapter 8... namely, WHO and HOW God decides to
save, in other words, the PURPOSE of God's election. And that
theme carries through most of chapter 9.
Now, since the Jews had been God's chosen people Paul, through
the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, gives EXAMPLES of God's election
using the only people that God had elected since the flood... Jews.
This does not mean that the text is separating Jew and Gentile,
only that there were no Gentile examples of God's election so the
Jews are used as an example... as is Pharaoh... who was no Jew.
So, I am aware that many try to DISMISS the information in
Romans 9 so as to NEGATE the PURPOSE of God's election by
saying He is only talking about Jews in chapter 9. But, as we
have just seen, the context of God's election did not START
in chapter 9... instead, it is just the continuation of what was
already discussed in chapter 8. Both chapters are focused on
showing God PURPOSE in election... for both Jew and Gentile.
And that is why the EXAMPLES given about election in chapter 9
are concluded with the following statement, showing that, like
chapter 8, God's purpose and process of election is the same
for both the Jew and Gentile:
Rom 9:24-26
Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles? As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.
And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people; there shall they be called the children of the living God.
So, there is no reason for me to re-post the passages posted
yesterday which talk about the purpose and process of election.
But it is a major mistake to pretend that the CONTEXT of chapter
9 is limited to the Jews (again, the hardening of Pharaoh is used
as an example of the hardening of ALL of those not elected).
The context of chapter 9 began back in chapter 8 and includes
all those who are saved by being in Christ Jesus (Jew and Gentile)
Rom 8:1
There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
So that is my answer to your suggestion that Romans 9 is NOT
talking about the election of people throughout the Christian era.
The fact that Jewish examples are used in Romans 9 is simply
because there were no Gentile examples that could be used as
Israel was God's "elected" or "chosen" people after the flood.
As I said above, I am well aware that many people PRETEND
that chapter 9 is not showing God's election program during
the Christian "Kingdom of Heaven", however (speaking frankly)
that is because they are trying to NEGATE what is written in
chapter 9 because they do not LIKE God's election program.
There is enough other examples in the Bible of God's election
program during the Christian Era where Romans 9 is not even
needed to demonstrate how God chooses to have mercy on
those HE decides to have mercy - and how He "hardens" them
he does NOT elect to salvation.
So we could throw out the entire chapter 9 of Romans and
still have plenty of passages establishing that God elects those
who HE chooses before the foundation of the world and that
election is NOT because of any good or evil those people would
do during their lifetime. God's election is based entirely on His
own Good Purpose... that is repeated in other passages.
So, to repeat myself, people who try to NEGATE Romans 9
are only doing so because they do not LIKE God's plan of
election. But they are only trying to fool themselves. As
already noted, there are enough election passages that
Romans 9 is not needed to illustrate election.
In fact, when the disciples of Jesus realized that He was teaching
salvation by election [John 6] many of them abandoned Him.
Unsaved men do not LIKE the idea that God is Sovereign in the
salvation process. They want a salvation plan where THEY get
to initiate the process... where they are Sovereign instead of God.
That is the common thread in ALL "works gospels"... that MAN
is Sovereign and once MAN initiates the process (through some
good work) then God is OBLIGATED to save them. It's sad.
Men teach you can
save yourself by saying a "sinner's prayer"
or you can
save yourself by making an altar call, or you can
save yourself by receiving water baptism, or you can
save
yourself by repenting of some sins, or you can
save yourself
by "accepting" Jesus into your heart, or you can
save yourself
developing some "belief" or some "faith" in yourself and when
God
SEES that good work you have done (in initiating your
salvation) then He is
OBLIGATED to finish the process.
These are all "works gospels", or a "Boaster gospel"
Eph 2:8-9
For by grace are
ye saved through faith;
and that
[faith is] not of yourselves:
it is the GIFT OF GOD:
Not of works, lest any man should boast.
I appreciate your post. This is my response to the notion that
Romans 9 can be isolated from Romans 8... or that we do not
even need Romans 9 to have Biblical support for election, as it
is taught by Jesus and throughout the Scriptures OT and NT.
There can be no doubt (Biblically) that God is Sovereign in the
process of election and man cannot initiate anything because
he is spiritually
DEAD until God decides to "
draw" him, and
ALL MEN God draws "
shall come" to Christ and He will lose
NONE of them.
Jim
