Not keeping (sunday) sabbath

jameshjr

Active Member
Supporter
Feb 16, 2021
304
168
34
Hinckley
✟63,697.00
Country
United Kingdom
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Single
Hello all you saints,

I have been away for a while, and i am back with a quandary.

I am currently employed as a care worker, and this means that i am almost always working on a Sunday.

I have been doing this job for around one year now, and have never had any conscionable objections to working on a Sunday and not attending church as i beleived that i could choose a day in the week as a sabbath (where i did not go to church, though). I also have been able to attend a church service on a Wednesday often.

However, i came across this verse:

“There are six days when you may work, but the seventh day is a day of sabbath rest, a day of sacred assembly. You are not to do any work; wherever you live, it is a sabbath to the LORD.”

Leviticus 23:3.

So i am now wondering if i have been sinning all this time, and if i need to change my work situation so that i can live in accordance with this verse.

I am in the process of starting a Sunday evening service at my church and my employers have agreed to give me every Sunday evening off; however, i would be working every Sunday morning, therefore disqualifying it as a sabbath day for me.

Do you think it would be okay to switch my sabbath day to a Wednesday (where i would attend the weekday service at my church), and i would inform my employers that i cannot work Wednesdays.

Or do you think that it needs to be the same day that the majority of the church gather together?

P.s. i am aware that the jewish sabbath day was not Sunday- but an interesting point as to why it has been changed, and if God is okay with this and if so why.

Thanks a lot,

James.
 
  • Friendly
Reactions: Lost Witness
I am me
I am me
Hi, my explanation to this is possibly too long to post on this forum. So, visit my YouTube video for a more detailed explanation. Also please consider subscribing it will be greatly appreciated. link:
Upvote 0

Maria Billingsley

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Oct 7, 2018
9,578
7,775
63
Martinez
✟894,261.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Hello all you saints,

I have been away for a while, and i am back with a quandary.

I am currently employed as a care worker, and this means that i am almost always working on a Sunday.

I have been doing this job for around one year now, and have never had any conscionable objections to working on a Sunday and not attending church as i beleived that i could choose a day in the week as a sabbath (where i did not go to church, though). I also have been able to attend a church service on a Wednesday often.

However, i came across this verse:

“There are six days when you may work, but the seventh day is a day of sabbath rest, a day of sacred assembly. You are not to do any work; wherever you live, it is a sabbath to the LORD.”

Leviticus 23:3.

So i am now wondering if i have been sinning all this time, and if i need to change my work situation so that i can live in accordance with this verse.

I am in the process of starting a Sunday evening service at my church and my employers have agreed to give me every Sunday evening off; however, i would be working every Sunday morning, therefore disqualifying it as a sabbath day for me.

Do you think it would be okay to switch my sabbath day to a Wednesday (where i would attend the weekday service at my church), and i would inform my employers that i cannot work Wednesdays.

Or do you think that it needs to be the same day that the majority of the church gather together?

P.s. i am aware that the jewish sabbath day was not Sunday- but an interesting point as to why it has been changed, and if God is okay with this and if so why.

Thanks a lot,

James.
Since the Sabbath is on Saturday and we are not required to keep it ,your all good!
Jesus Christ of Nazareth is now our Sabbath rest everyday.
Blessings.
 
  • Like
Reactions: sandman
Upvote 0

Lost Witness

Ezekiel 3:3 ("Change")
Nov 10, 2022
1,694
977
38
New York
✟97,156.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Sabbath Starts at sundown on FRIDAY and lasts till an Hour after Sundown on Saturday.
 
jameshjr
jameshjr
Hello lost witness, thank you for the reply.

I was aware of this; however, it does not help me too much with my problem; additionally, trying to get my entire church to move from sunday worship to saturday worship is not going to be something i can do (if needed to do) in a day.
Upvote 0
Upvote 0

BobRyan

Junior Member
Angels Team
Supporter
Nov 21, 2008
51,118
10,509
Georgia
✟900,262.00
Country
United States
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
Hello all you saints,

I have been away for a while, and i am back with a quandary.

I am currently employed as a care worker, and this means that i am almost always working on a Sunday.

I have been doing this job for around one year now, and have never had any conscionable objections to working on a Sunday and not attending church as i beleived that i could choose a day in the week as a sabbath (where i did not go to church, though). I also have been able to attend a church service on a Wednesday often.

However, i came across this verse:

“There are six days when you may work, but the seventh day is a day of sabbath rest, a day of sacred assembly. You are not to do any work; wherever you live, it is a sabbath to the LORD.”
Take a close look at the Sabbath Commandment - it might just solve your problem entirely regarding Sunday (week day 1).

But first remember this - Jesus was resurrected on Sunday - week day 1 - according to the Gospels.

Now with that firmly in mind --

The actual Sabbath Commandment.

Ex 20 - the TEN Commandments.

Ex 20:8-11
8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 For six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD (YHWH) your God; on it you shall not do any work, you, or your son, or your daughter, your male slave or your female slave, or your cattle, or your resident who stays with you. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea and everything that is in them, and He rested on the seventh day; for that reason the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy.

Lev 23:3 - the seventh day Sabbath is a day "of holy convocation"
EX 16:23 "tomorrow IS the Sabbath" -- for 40 years no manna fell on "the seventh day"
Is 58:13 - no secular work on the weekly Sabbath
Is 66:23 "from Sabbath to Sabbath shall all mankind come before Me to worship" (for all eternity after the cross in the New Earth)

(It comes as a surprise to some - who may not know that they are a member of that mankind that God speaks of)

So the good news is - you are free to so whatever you wish on weekday 1 - Sunday, since the Sabbath is the seventh day
 
jameshjr
jameshjr
Hello Bob, Thank you for the reply.

I have just read Isaiah chapter 66 and it seems to me that it is a promise of things to come after the Lord returns; what are your thoughts on this conclusion?

My major concern is that i have not been keeping the sabbath correctly.

Do you beelive that in order to do so, one must do no work on the sabbath day (friday to Saturday) and assemble together with the church?
Upvote 0
Upvote 0

BobRyan

Junior Member
Angels Team
Supporter
Nov 21, 2008
51,118
10,509
Georgia
✟900,262.00
Country
United States
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
“There are six days when you may work, but the seventh day is the day of Sabbath rest, a day of sacred assembly. You are not to do any work; wherever you live, it is a sabbath to the LORD.” Leviticus 23:3.

So i am now wondering if i have been sinning all this time,
Good news - you were always free to do any work you wish on week-day-1 - Sunday.
 
Upvote 0

BobRyan

Junior Member
Angels Team
Supporter
Nov 21, 2008
51,118
10,509
Georgia
✟900,262.00
Country
United States
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
jameshjr
Hello Bob, Thank you for the reply.

I have just read Isaiah chapter 66 and it seems to me that it is a promise of things to come after the Lord returns; what are your thoughts on this conclusion?

Yes that is true - only after Christ returns will "all mankind" be as one - and unitedly honoring the Sabbath for all eternity.
Until then - 2 Cor 4:4 tells us that Satan is "The god of this world"

But the Is 66:23 statement is not saying "some day the scope for Sabbath application will be all mankind" - Christ Himself said the "Sabbath was MADE for mankind" Mark 2:27

No wonder almost every Christian denomination on Earth affirms the continued *"unit of TEN" (which includes the Sabbath)

[*]The Baptist Confession of Faith section 19
[*]The Westminster Confession of Faith section 19
[*]Voddie Baucham
[*]C.H. Spurgeon
[*]D.L. Moody
[*]Dies Domini by Pope John Paul II
[*]D. James Kennedy
[*]many others as well..

jameshjr

My major concern is that i have not been keeping the sabbath correctly.
You came upon that idea by reading scripture Lev 23:3 and what it says about the Sabbath. It tells you three things:

1. It is the seventh day of the week
2. IT is a day of holy convocation
3. It is not a day to do secular work

And so the good news is - your working on week-day-1 is not a problem for the Sabbath commandment as found in scripture

jameshjr

Do you belive that in order to do so, one must do no work on the sabbath day (friday to Saturday) and assemble together with the church?

That is what the text says, so that is what I do.

Take a look at this for a similar point made by Christ Mark 7:6-13 in the context of one of the other Ten Commandments. Tell me what you think.

Acts 17:11 "they studied the scriptures daily to see IF Those things spoken to them by the Apostle Paul -- were so" - and based on that they accepted the Gospel

==========================================

Having said that - I will remind you that Jesus healed on the Sabbath, He addressed healthcare needs on Sabbath, He relieved suffering on Sabbath. So while I think you should try to keep Sabbath as far as possible, I don't think that urgent situations, emergencies, or situations where the person would suffer if you did not provide that service - are included in the idea of Sabbath breaking so far as you can help it. But if you are choosing to work Sabbath when you have a choice of taking one or two days off each week - that might be different.
 
Upvote 0

sandman

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2003
2,458
1,640
MI
✟119,129.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Divorced
Politics
US-Constitution
Hello all you saints,

I have been away for a while, and i am back with a quandary.

I am currently employed as a care worker, and this means that i am almost always working on a Sunday.

I have been doing this job for around one year now, and have never had any conscionable objections to working on a Sunday and not attending church as i beleived that i could choose a day in the week as a sabbath (where i did not go to church, though). I also have been able to attend a church service on a Wednesday often.

However, i came across this verse:

“There are six days when you may work, but the seventh day is a day of sabbath rest, a day of sacred assembly. You are not to do any work; wherever you live, it is a sabbath to the LORD.”

Leviticus 23:3.

So i am now wondering if i have been sinning all this time, and if i need to change my work situation so that i can live in accordance with this verse.

I am in the process of starting a Sunday evening service at my church and my employers have agreed to give me every Sunday evening off; however, i would be working every Sunday morning, therefore disqualifying it as a sabbath day for me.

Do you think it would be okay to switch my sabbath day to a Wednesday (where i would attend the weekday service at my church), and i would inform my employers that i cannot work Wednesdays.

Or do you think that it needs to be the same day that the majority of the church gather together?

P.s. i am aware that the jewish sabbath day was not Sunday- but an interesting point as to why it has been changed, and if God is okay with this and if so why.

Thanks a lot,

James.
The sabbath requirement were with the previous covenant …
They do not apply in this administration of Grace.

Col 2:16
Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

Col 2:17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

That no man includes you….don’t judge or condemn yourself …
 
Upvote 0

sandman

Senior Member
Aug 17, 2003
2,458
1,640
MI
✟119,129.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Divorced
Politics
US-Constitution
But first remember this - Jesus was resurrected on Sunday - week day 1 - according to the Gospels.
Not so sure about that ...I believe it was Saturday before sunset.
 
Upvote 0

jameshjr

Active Member
Supporter
Feb 16, 2021
304
168
34
Hinckley
✟63,697.00
Country
United Kingdom
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Single
Yes that is true - only after Christ returns will "all mankind" be as one - and unitedly honoring the Sabbath for all eternity.
Until then - 2 Cor 4:4 tells us that Satan is "The god of this world"

But the Is 66:23 statement is not saying "some day the scope for Sabbath application will be all mankind" - Christ Himself said the "Sabbath was MADE for mankind" Mark 2:27

No wonder almost every Christian denomination on Earth affirms the continued *"unit of TEN" (which includes the Sabbath)

[*]The Baptist Confession of Faith section 19
[*]The Westminster Confession of Faith section 19
[*]Voddie Baucham
[*]C.H. Spurgeon
[*]D.L. Moody
[*]Dies Domini by Pope John Paul II
[*]D. James Kennedy
[*]many others as well..


You came upon that idea by reading scripture Lev 23:3 and what it says about the Sabbath. It tells you three things:

1. It is the seventh day of the week
2. IT is a day of holy convocation
3. It is not a day to do secular work

And so the good news is - your working on week-day-1 is not a problem for the Sabbath commandment as found in scripture



That is what the text says, so that is what I do.

Take a look at this for a similar point made by Christ Mark 7:6-13 in the context of one of the other Ten Commandments. Tell me what you think.

Acts 17:11 "they studied the scriptures daily to see IF Those things spoken to them by the Apostle Paul -- were so" - and based on that they accepted the Gospel

==========================================

Having said that - I will remind you that Jesus healed on the Sabbath, He addressed healthcare needs on Sabbath, He relieved suffering on Sabbath. So while I think you should try to keep Sabbath as far as possible, I don't think that urgent situations, emergencies, or situations where the person would suffer if you did not provide that service - are included in the idea of Sabbath breaking so far as you can help it. But if you are choosing to work Sabbath when you have a choice of taking one or two days off each week - that might be different.
@BobRyan If i understand you right, that the unit of ten is the keeping of the ten commandments post ressurection, then i do agree with this.

I did find an artcile which stated that: Romans 14:5-6; Galatians 4:9-11; and Colossians 2:16-17, are the most common scripture quoted to justify not keeping sabbath’s.

I did have a quick look through them and found that the only one that has any weight for that argument is Colossians 2: 16-17 (though i have not come to any frim conclusions on it yet).

I agree that it woulod absolve me of guilt over working on Sunday, but it would convict me that, when i thought i had been keeping sabbath on other days, i had in fact not.

Do you attend chruch on the Friday/Saturday sabbath? i know that here (in the UK) that would be difficult as i beleive most (if not all) churches aorund me meet for their main service on Sundays.

Regarding Mark 7:6-13; i think it is common practice in the church to justify worldly traditions in the church and disregard Gods word (usually under the guise of it being 'loving'). However, i am certainly not perfect and we learn as we go, the important thing is to conform yourself to Gods word, when you discover that you are not in line with it (rather than conforming the word of God to your own behaviour in order to justify it).

It is interesting however, that christians have been 'keeping' the sabbath day on a Sunday for such a long period of time, and it doesnt seem to be a topic that i hear come up in discussion ever.
 
Upvote 0

jameshjr

Active Member
Supporter
Feb 16, 2021
304
168
34
Hinckley
✟63,697.00
Country
United Kingdom
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Single
The sabbath requirement were with the previous covenant …
They do not apply in this administration of Grace.


Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

Col 2:17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

That no man includes you….don’t judge or condemn yourself …
Hello Sandman, thank you for the reply.

I am still persuaded that I should keep the sabbath; however Colossians 2:16 seems to be a good argument against this. i am going to look into it more, in order to be convinced one way or the other.

I think it reasonable to conclude that Paul is addressing memebers of the church that are being convinved that they have to keep Jewish law; however, Paul seems to say let no one judge you over sabbaths.

I think it reasonable to state that we do not know if Paul was talking about the observation of Sabbath or more specifically what is or not allowed on sabbaths.

After all, Paul reminds us to keep Gods commandments (specifically Romans 12: 8-10)
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Freth

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Jul 11, 2020
1,505
1,823
Midwest, USA
✟372,480.00
Country
United States
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Single
I would look to the commandment itself in Exodus 20.

Exodus 20:8-11 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: But the seventh day is the sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

  1. Remember. It's the only commandment where God says remember.
  2. Remember the Sabbath day, which is defined as the seventh day.
  3. Six days are for labor, but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord thy God.
Scripture does not give any leeway concerning the Ten Commandments, which includes the Sabbath commandment specific to the seventh day. If God wanted us to choose a day to set aside, He would have specified to remember any day, not the seventh day.

Let's look at two passages that are most used out of context as proof that we can pick a day to observe as the Sabbath.

Romans 14

Romans 14:1-5 Him that is weak in the faith receive ye, but not to doubtful disputations. For one believeth that he may eat all things: another, who is weak, eateth herbs. Let not him that eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him which eateth not judge him that eateth: for God hath received him. Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand. One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.

Christians are quick to take the above verses as proof that we can pick our own Sabbath day, but look closer.
  • Paul gives examples:
    • Eating or not eating (unclean meat, most likely)
    • Esteeming one day or every day (Sabbath is not mentioned anywhere in Romans).
  • Paul is not condoning eating unclean meant.
  • Paul is not condoning esteeming any specific day.
  • Paul is telling us not to judge others for following their convictions, even if they are against the commandments of God.
  • Paul is not being judgmental (the point/context) in the very language of the verses.
  • Most importantly, nowhere does Paul say it's okay to eat anything you want or to pick any day you want as the Sabbath.
The context is not judging others, not what you can and can't do.

Colossians 2

Paul again makes a similar statement, but more information is given.

Colossians 2:16-17 So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths, which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ.

Notice the context that is completely overlooked:

Let no man judge you in...
  • Food or in drink
  • Or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths.
The context...
  • Which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ.
The shadow of things to come is defined in Hebrews 10:

Hebrews 10:1 For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.

What is "the law" that Paul is referring to that has shadows of good things to come? It's not the Ten Commandments, it's the handwriting of ordinances, and the sacrifices and festivals which pointed to Jesus. The crucifixion nailed these to the cross. We don't have to go to Hebrews 10 to see this, we can look at Colossians 2:14, which gives context to 16-17.

Colossians 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross.

In Colossians, it is clear that Paul is talking specifically about ordinances that were nailed to the cross. These do not include the Ten Commandments. The Ten Commandments were placed inside the ark of the covenant. The ordinances were placed beside it, but not in it. This shows the difference and the significance given to the Ten Commandments (written on stone by the hand of God; the perpetual law of God) vs the handwriting of ordinances (written by Moses; shadows of things to come/Jesus).

Conclusion

Don't judge others, and don't let others judge you for your beliefs. Examples were given concerning food and drink and esteemed days, in the context of handwriting of ordinances, sacrifices, sabbaths/festivals, which were a shadow of things to come.

Paul's writings do not give us free license to pick and choose the Sabbath day we want to observe, or to eat the unclean meat we want to eat. He didn't say it was okay to do these things, He simply said do not judge others (for deviating) or let others judge you (for observing), and let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind. A person can be persuaded they are doing the right thing, against the law of God, but it doesn't make it right.

God would not have specified a six day work week and a seventh day of rest if He gave us free license to choose. He sanctified the seventh day at creation, making it the only day to observe Sabbath.

The Sabbath predates Jews. It was instituted at creation for man. If Jesus came to abolish the Sabbath, He would not have called Himself Lord of the Sabbath (Mark 2:27-28) and specified its purpose as being made for man; it's even a perpetual covenant (Exodus 31:13-16). He wouldn't have mentioned it as being kept post-crucifixion at the same time as the great tribulation (Matthew 24:20-21).

Sunday is the first day of the week. Saturday is the seventh day of the week. I would pray for discernment concerning the observance of the Sabbath, and follow your convictions as Paul suggested, but I would also search the scriptures, as there is nowhere in all of scripture that says Sunday is the Sabbath day, or that we can pick and choose a day that suits our work schedule or lifestyle.

Did God let Adam and Eve pick any tree to be the one they couldn't eat? No. God was very specific in His commandment to Adam and Eve.

The last call to worship in Revelation 14:6-12 has an important message.

Revelation 14:6-7 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people, saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.​
  • A call to worship which points back to the creation account, of which includes the Sabbath being observed and sanctified by God.
  • Judgment is come. Present tense. Happening now.
Revelation 14:8-11 And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication. And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand, The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.​
  • The consequences of not heeding the Three Angels' messages.
Revelation 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.​
  • The patience of the saints is the keeping of the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.
  • The commandments of God include the Sabbath commandment, which says to remember.
God bless!
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

jameshjr

Active Member
Supporter
Feb 16, 2021
304
168
34
Hinckley
✟63,697.00
Country
United Kingdom
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Single
I would look to the commandment itself in Exodus 20.



  1. Remember. It's the only commandment where God says remember.
  2. Remember the Sabbath day, which is defined as the seventh day.
  3. Six days are for labor, but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord thy God.
Scripture does not give any leeway concerning the Ten Commandments, which includes the Sabbath commandment specific to the seventh day. If God wanted us to choose a day to set aside, He would have specified to remember any day, not the seventh day.

Let's look at two passages that are most used out of context as proof that we can pick a day to observe as the Sabbath.

Romans 14



Christians are quick to take the above verses as proof that we can pick our own Sabbath day, but look closer.
  • Paul gives examples:
    • Eating or not eating (unclean meat, most likely)
    • Esteeming one day or every day (Sabbath, most likely, but may also pertain to festivals).
  • Paul is not condoning eating unclean meant.
  • Paul is not condoning esteeming any specific day.
  • Paul is telling us not to judge others for following their convictions.
  • Paul is not being judgmental (the point/context) in the very language of the verses.
  • Most importantly, nowhere does Paul say it's okay to eat anything you want or to pick any day you want as the Sabbath.
The context is not judging others, not what you can and can't do.

Colossians 2

Paul again makes a similar statement, but more information is given.



Notice the specific language context that is completely overlooked:

Let no man judge you in...
  • Food or in drink
  • Or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths.
The context...
  • Which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ.
The shadow of things to come is defined in Hebrews 10:



What is "the law" that Paul is referring to that has shadows of good things to come? It's not the Ten Commandments, it's the handwriting of ordinances, and the sacrifices and festivals which pointed to Jesus. The crucifixion nailed these to the cross. We don't have to go to Hebrews 10 to see this, we can look at Colossians 2:14, which gives context to 16-17.



In Colossians, it is clear that Paul is talking specifically about ordinances that were nailed to the cross. These do not include the Ten Commandments. The Ten Commandments were placed inside the ark of the covenant. The ordinances were placed beside it, but not in it. This shows the difference and the significance given to the Ten Commandments (written on stone by the hand of God; the perpetual law of God) vs the handwriting of ordinances (written by Moses; shadows of things to come/Jesus).

Conclusion

Paul's writings do not give us free license to pick and choose the Sabbath day we want to observe. God would not have specified a six day work week and a seventh day of rest if He gave us free license to choose. He sanctified the seventh day at creation, making it the only day to observe Sabbath.

The Sabbath predates Jews. It was instituted at creation for man. If Jesus came to abolish the Sabbath, He would not have called Himself Lord of the Sabbath (Mark 2:27-28) and specified its purpose as being made for man; it's even a perpetual covenant (Exodus 31:13-16). He wouldn't have mentioned it as being kept post-crucifixion at the same time as the great tribulation (Matthew 24:20-21).

Sunday is the first day of the week. Saturday is the seventh day of the week. I would pray for discernment concerning the observance of the Sabbath, and follow your convictions as Paul suggested, but I would also search the scriptures, as there is nowhere in all of scripture that says Sunday is the Sabbath day, or that we can pick and choose a day that suits our work schedule or lifestyle.

Did God let Adam and Eve pick any tree to be the one they couldn't eat? No. God is very specific.

God bless!
Freth, thank you for the message.

You ( and everyone else) has/have given me a lot to consider- I will have to log off of CF now as my mind is spinning.

Excellent point using Matthew 24:20-21; and also using Hebrews to give more clarification as to Pauls point in Colossians.

For clarification: to what do you mean/ think the scripture means when it uses the word ordinances? Do you think it means laws God set down that arent the ten commandments, or the ordinances that man added to the law?

You, being convinced that the sabbath is to be kept Friday/Saturday; what are your thoughts on the fact that most churches come together to worship on Sundays?
 
Upvote 0

Soyeong

Well-Known Member
Mar 10, 2015
12,416
4,600
Hudson
✟281,745.00
Country
United States
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
Single
Hello all you saints,

I have been away for a while, and i am back with a quandary.

I am currently employed as a care worker, and this means that i am almost always working on a Sunday.

I have been doing this job for around one year now, and have never had any conscionable objections to working on a Sunday and not attending church as i beleived that i could choose a day in the week as a sabbath (where i did not go to church, though). I also have been able to attend a church service on a Wednesday often.

However, i came across this verse:

“There are six days when you may work, but the seventh day is a day of sabbath rest, a day of sacred assembly. You are not to do any work; wherever you live, it is a sabbath to the LORD.”

Leviticus 23:3.

So i am now wondering if i have been sinning all this time, and if i need to change my work situation so that i can live in accordance with this verse.

I am in the process of starting a Sunday evening service at my church and my employers have agreed to give me every Sunday evening off; however, i would be working every Sunday morning, therefore disqualifying it as a sabbath day for me.

Do you think it would be okay to switch my sabbath day to a Wednesday (where i would attend the weekday service at my church), and i would inform my employers that i cannot work Wednesdays.

Or do you think that it needs to be the same day that the majority of the church gather together?

P.s. i am aware that the jewish sabbath day was not Sunday- but an interesting point as to why it has been changed, and if God is okay with this and if so why.

Thanks a lot,

James.
Hello,

Keeping the 7th day holy is in memorial of when God rested on the 7th day after Creation, not about picking any day out of a week to rest. For 40 years in the wilderness, the Israelites received a double portion of manna on the 6th day so that they could for the 7th day, so they knew on which day God rested and they kept it together as a community. There is not in Scripture that states that people were permitted the disunity of picking their own day of the week to rest or that God is okay with changing the Sabbath. On the contrary, in Deuteronomy 4:2, it is a sin to add to or subtract from what God has commanded, and in Deuteronomy 13:4-5, the way that God instructed His people to determine that someone was a false prophet who was not speaking for Him was if they taught against obeying what He has commanded. The 7th day is from Friday night to Saturday night at sundown.
 
Upvote 0

Soyeong

Well-Known Member
Mar 10, 2015
12,416
4,600
Hudson
✟281,745.00
Country
United States
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
Single
The sabbath requirement were with the previous covenant …
They do not apply in this administration of Grace.


Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

Col 2:17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

That no man includes you….don’t judge or condemn yourself …
God's word should not be interpreted as speaking against obeying God's word. In Psalms 119:160, all of God's righteous laws are eternal. In Acts 17:11, the Bereans were praised because they diligently tested everything that Paul said against OT Scripture to see if what he said was true, so we can either accept the validity of what Paul said with the understanding that nothing he said was contrary to OT Scripture or we can reject the validity of what he said, but it is contradictory to accept the validity of what he said while understanding what he said as being contrary to OT Scripture. In Deuteronomy 13:4-5, the way that God instructed His people to determine that someone is a false prophet who is not speaking for Him is if they taught against obeying what God has commanded, which again is something of which the Bereans would have been aware, so if someone interprets what Paul said as speaking against obeying what God has command, then according to God we should not accept the validity of what Paul said, however, thankfully Paul was a servant of God who never spoke against anyone obeying what He has commanded, so we should recognize the validity of what he wrote as being Scripture.

In regard to Colossians 2:16-17, it is ambiguous as to whether Paul was saying not to let any man judge them for keeping God's holy days or for not keeping them. However, if we look at the views of the people who were judging to Colossians, who were promoting human teachings, self-made religion, asceticism, and severity to the body (Colossians 2:20-23), then it because clear that they were being judged by pagans, which means that they were being judged because they were keeping God's holy days in obedience to what He has commanded and Paul was encouraging them not to let any man judge them an keep them from obeying God, so it ironic when people try to use those verses to justify their refusal to obey what God has commanded.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Soyeong

Well-Known Member
Mar 10, 2015
12,416
4,600
Hudson
✟281,745.00
Country
United States
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
Single
@BobRyan If i understand you right, that the unit of ten is the keeping of the ten commandments post ressurection, then i do agree with this.

I did find an artcile which stated that: Romans 14:5-6; Galatians 4:9-11; and Colossians 2:16-17, are the most common scripture quoted to justify not keeping sabbath’s.

I did have a quick look through them and found that the only one that has any weight for that argument is Colossians 2: 16-17 (though i have not come to any frim conclusions on it yet).
Please see my previous post in regard to the problem of interpreting Paul as speaking against obeying what God has commanded and in regard to Colossias 2:16-17.

In regard to Romans 14, the topic of the chapter is in regard to how to handle disputable matters of opinion in which God has given no command, not in regard to whether followers of God should follow what God has commanded. For example, in Romans 14:1-3, people were resenting and passing judgement on each other over the issue choosing to eat only vegetables which is not something in which God has commanded. Likewise, God gave no command to fast twice a week, but that had become a common practice in the 1st century and people were resenting and passing judgement on each other over that issue (Luke 18:12). In Romans 14:5-6, Paul spoke about those who were eating or refraining from eating unto the Lord, so he was speaking about those who esteem certain days for fasting as a disputable matter of opinion. Paul was not suggesting that we are free to commit adultery, theft, murder, idolatry, break the Sabbath or disobey any of God's other commands just as long as we are convinced in our own minds that it is ok, but rather that was only said in regard to things that are disputable matters of opinion in which God has given no command. The reason why we are to keep the 7th day holy is not because man esteemed it as a disputable matter of opinion, but because God rested on it, blessed it, made it holy, commanded His people to keep it holy, and because what is holy to God should not be profaned by man.

In regard to Galatians 4:8-11, Paul addressed what he was saying to those who formerly did not know God, also known as former pagans. As such, they were not formerly keeping God's holy days and Paul could not have been criticizing them for returning to them. So whatever Paul was referring to in verse 10 was in the context of paganism. In Exodus 33:13, Moses wanted God to be gracious to him by teaching him His way that he might know Him and Israel too, and in Matthew 7:23, Jesus said that he would tell those who are workers of lawlessness to depart from him because he never knew them, so the goal of God's law is to teach us how to know Him and Jesus, which is eternal life (John 17:3), which again means that those who formerly did not know God could not be referring to those who were formerly keeping God's commandments. So with all three of those passages, as well as others, we should be careful not to mistake what was only said against following the opinions of man as being against following the commandments of God.

I agree that it woulod absolve me of guilt over working on Sunday, but it would convict me that, when i thought i had been keeping sabbath on other days, i had in fact not.

Do you attend chruch on the Friday/Saturday sabbath? i know that here (in the UK) that would be difficult as i beleive most (if not all) churches aorund me meet for their main service on Sundays.

I have been blessed to be able to attend a congregation that keeps the Friday/Saturday Sabbath, though I do sympathize with how difficult it can be to do that in some areas.

Regarding Mark 7:6-13; i think it is common practice in the church to justify worldly traditions in the church and disregard Gods word (usually under the guise of it being 'loving'). However, i am certainly not perfect and we learn as we go, the important thing is to conform yourself to Gods word, when you discover that you are not in line with it (rather than conforming the word of God to your own behaviour in order to justify it).

It is interesting however, that christians have been 'keeping' the sabbath day on a Sunday for such a long period of time, and it doesnt seem to be a topic that i hear come up in discussion ever.
Agreed, though there is a "Sabbath and the Law" subform under "General Theology" in which those sort of topics are regularly discussed.
 
Upvote 0

Blade

Veteran
Supporter
Dec 29, 2002
8,165
3,989
USA
✟629,996.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Col 2:16 it can also be translated "stop letting anyone judge you". They were apparently were listening to false ideas and as a result were straying from their completeness in Christ. Because Christ had freed them from their former bondage to the requirements of the Mosaic law. They were to resist any attempt to ensnare them in a new bondage to legalistic requirements. They were told to stop allowing the user of the list of ceremonial matters that followed Pauls warning as a basis for judging their standing before God

'So i am now wondering if i have been sinning all this time, and if i need to change my work situation so that i can live in accordance with this verse."

I am no one. I find it better to ask someone you know that is over you as in a pastor. That being said I would say please don't let those thoughts in. That day was made for you not you for it. Its where your heart is. All that's going to happen is you will be more confused then before. Some believe its on Sunday some believe its on Saturday. To that Praise GOD. When Paul was telling those don't let other
 
Upvote 0

Soyeong

Well-Known Member
Mar 10, 2015
12,416
4,600
Hudson
✟281,745.00
Country
United States
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
Single
In Colossians, it is clear that Paul is talking specifically about ordinances that were nailed to the cross. These do not include the Ten Commandments. The Ten Commandments were placed inside the ark of the covenant. The ordinances were placed beside it, but not in it. This shows the difference and the significance given to the Ten Commandments (written on stone by the hand of God; the perpetual law of God) vs the handwriting of ordinances (written by Moses; shadows of things to come/Jesus).

In Colossians 2:14, it uses the Greek word "dogma", which is used to refer to the decree of Caesar (Luke 2:1, Acts 17:7) or to the decree of the Jerusalem Council (Acts 16:4), so justification needs to be given for why it should be interpreted as referring to any of the laws of God written by Moses, especially when all of God's righteous laws are eternal (Psalms 119:160) Jesus gave himself to pay the penalty for ours sins, so the handwritten ordinances that were against us were the list of our transgressions of God's law that were nailed to his cross so that he died in our place. Likewise, in Titus 2:14, it does not say that Jesus gave himself to free us from any of God's laws, but in order to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people of his own possession who are zealous for doing good works, so becoming zealous for doing good works in obedience to God's law is the way to believe in what he accomplished through the cross (Acts 21:20).

In 1 Corinthians 5:6-8, Paul spoke about how Passover foreshadowed Christ by making the connection of him being our Passover Lamb, however, instead of saying that we no longer need to bother with the foreshadows, he concluded that we should therefore continue to observe Passover. The foreshadows testify about what is to come and we should live in a way that testifies about what is to come, so by Paul saying that God's holy days are foreshadows of what is to come, he was emphasizing their importance in regard to why we should not let anyone judge us for keeping them.
 
Upvote 0

Soyeong

Well-Known Member
Mar 10, 2015
12,416
4,600
Hudson
✟281,745.00
Country
United States
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
Single
Why assume that commandments, reported to have been given to Israelites in the Bible, are intended for everyone?
In Matthew 4:15-23, Jesus began his ministry with the Gospel message to repent for the Kingdom of God is at hand, which was a light to the nations, and God's law was how his audience knew what sin is (Romans 3:20), so repenting from our disobedience to it is a central part of the Gospel of the Kingdom, which he prophesied would be proclaimed to all nations (Matthew 24:12-14), and which he commissioned his disciples to teach to the nations (Matthew 28:16-20). So it is not that we should assume that those commandments are intended for everyone that that Jesus commissioned his followers to teach them to everyone.

God has given instructions to Israel for their own good for how to live blessed lives, how to bless others in fulfillment of the promise by teaching others how to live blessed lives, for how to have eternal life by knowing Him, which is eternal life, for how to love Him, how to love our neighbor, for how to build godly character such as righteousness, for how to follow Jesus, for how to believe in Him, for how to represent Him through testifying about the nature of who He is, for how to restore the world, and so forth, so even if they were't intended for everyone, we should want to voluntarily accept them.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Soyeong

Well-Known Member
Mar 10, 2015
12,416
4,600
Hudson
✟281,745.00
Country
United States
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
Single
Col 2:16 it can also be translated "stop letting anyone judge you". They were apparently were listening to false ideas and as a result were straying from their completeness in Christ. Because Christ had freed them from their former bondage to the requirements of the Mosaic law. They were to resist any attempt to ensnare them in a new bondage to legalistic requirements. They were told to stop allowing the user of the list of ceremonial matters that followed Pauls warning as a basis for judging their standing before God

'So i am now wondering if i have been sinning all this time, and if i need to change my work situation so that i can live in accordance with this verse."

I am no one. I find it better to ask someone you know that is over you as in a pastor. That being said I would say please don't let those thoughts in. That day was made for you not you for it. Its where your heart is. All that's going to happen is you will be more confused then before. Some believe its on Sunday some believe its on Saturday. To that Praise GOD. When Paul was telling those don't let other
If God saved the Israelites out of bondage in Egypt in order to put them under bondage to the Mosaic Law, then it would be for bondage that God sets us free, however, Galatians 5:1 says that it is for freedom that God's sets us free. Rather, the Mosaic Law is of freedom (Psalms 119:45). In Psalms 119:142, God's law is truth, and in John 8:31-36, it is sin in transgression of God's law that puts us under bondage while it is the truth that sets us free. In Colossians 2:20-23, Paul described the false ideas that they had been listening to as human teachings, self-made religion, asceticism, and severity to the body, which is the teachings of pagans, however, he did not say a word about bondage to legalistic requirements. In Titus 2:14, it does not not say that Jesus gave himself to free us from God's law, but in order to free us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people of his own possession who are zealous for doing good works, so becoming zealous for doing good works in obedience to God's law is the way to believe in what he accomplished through the cross (Acts 21:20). In 1 John 2:6, those who are in Christ are obligated to walk in the same way he walked, and he walked in obedience to God's law, so following his example of living in obedience to it is not straying from our completeness in him, but just the opposite.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Pavel Mosko
Upvote 0