Fellowship Nicolaitan doctrines (teachings) which Jesus hated info' for spirit filled believers .

[Alithis]

Nico- means "victory" in Greek, and laos means "people" or, more specifically, "the laity".

Hence they take the word to mean "lay conquerors" or "conquerors of the lay people".

However those who ARE the suppressors of truth and who Practice this doctrine of devils that JESUS hates say , "Nicolaitan" (Greek: Νικολαϊτῶν; Νικολαΐτης) is the name ostensibly given to followers of the heretic Nicolas (Greek: )
However ,this is NOT the word or name used in revelation 2 vs 6 .the book of revelation does not use the name Νικόλαος.. They are making that up to maintain that very domination and control the lord Jesus hates .

the word used in revelations is correctly translated to nicolaitans (not a persons name )with the meaning of the doctrine of conquering over people
It does not refer to a single man at all but a devilish doctrine that taught that there is a (FALSE) spiritual elite over the common believer that stand between God and the common believer and the common believer have to submit to that authority .(but Christ Alone is that authority )

Any person or persons ,organisation ,denomination who seeks to rule over(dominate/control the body of Christ is a usurper of the authority of Christ (the only head ) over his Body . and is to be shunned .

G3531
n_ Gen Pl m
CONQUER-PEOPLES Rev 2 (those who dominate over others) a spiritual elite taking(self imposed right of ) ruler-ship /leadership OVER others .

an doctrine of DEVILS --

Do not follow after the doctrines of the nicolaitans which thing the lord Jesus said HE HATES.

 

[prodromos]

Interesting that Strong's Concordance does not give the false definition that you have.

Nicolaitans = "destruction of people"

1. a sect mentioned in Rev. 2:6,15, who were charged with holding the error of Balaam, casting a stumbling block before the church of God by upholding the liberty of eating things sacrificed to idols as well as committing fornication

 

[1stcenturylady]

Nico- means "victory" in Greek, and laos means "people" or, more specifically, "the laity".

Hence they take the word to mean "lay conquerors" or "conquerors of the lay people".

However those who ARE the suppressors of truth and who Practice this doctrine of devils that JESUS hates say , "Nicolaitan" (Greek: Νικολαϊτῶν; Νικολαΐτης) is the name ostensibly given to followers of the heretic Nicolas (Greek: )
However ,this is NOT the word or name used in revelation 2 vs 6 .the book of revelation does not use the name Νικόλαος.. They are making that up to maintain that very domination and control the lord Jesus hates .

the word used in revelations is correctly translated to nicolaitans (not a persons name )with the meaning of the doctrine of conquering over people
It does not refer to a single man at all but a devilish doctrine that taught that there is a (FALSE) spiritual elite over the common believer that stand between God and the common believer and the common believer have to submit to that authority .(but Christ Alone is that authority )

Any person or persons ,organisation ,denomination who seeks to rule over(dominate/control the body of Christ is a usurper of the authority of Christ (the only head ) over his Body . and is to be shunned .

G3531
n_ Gen Pl m
CONQUER-PEOPLES Rev 2 (those who dominate over others) a spiritual elite taking(self imposed right of ) ruler-ship /leadership OVER others .

an doctrine of DEVILS --

Do not follow after the doctrines of the nicolaitans which thing the lord Jesus said HE HATES.

That dissection of the word "Nicolaitan" about power over the people is rubbish. The doctrine of the Nicolaitans was known in the ancient church and written about by historians. John alluded to their teaching in 1 John 4:1-3. The Nicolaitans were Gnostics who did not believe that Jesus came in the flesh, but only in Spirit. They believed therefore that only sins of the spirit were actually sins, and sins of the flesh were not, showing the grace of God. Even Paul said, "Shall we sin so grace may abound? God forbid!" And John wrote "If we say we are without sin, we lie, and the truth is not in us." Both directly aimed at the false teaching of the Nicolaitans, a sect named after its founder Nicholas, who like some of our own liberal teachers turned the grace of God into licentiousness. Nicholas had all the men in the sect rape each other's wives. Like Luther, who said to "Sin boldly" Nicholas did the same.

The reference to Balaam in the text in Revelation shows that they promoted sexual sins of the flesh. That in itself show no relation to power over the people.

 

[Alithis]

t

That dissection of the word "Nicolaitan" about power over the people is rubbish. The doctrine of the Nicolaitans was known in the ancient church and written about by historians. John alluded to their teaching in 1 John 4:1-3. The Nicolaitans were Gnostics who did not believe that Jesus came in the flesh, but only in Spirit. They believed therefore that only sins of the spirit were actually sins, and sins of the flesh were not showing the grace of God. Even Paul said, "Shall we sin so grace may abound? God forbid!" And John wrote "If we say we are without sin, we lie, and the truth is not in us." Both directly aimed at the false teaching of the Nicolaitans, a sect named after its founder Nicholas, who like some of our own liberal teachers turned the grace of God into licentiousness. Nicholas had all the men in the sect to rape each other's wives. Like Luther, who said to "Sin boldly" Nicholas did the same.

The reference to Balaam in the text in Revelation shows that they promoted sexual sins of the flesh. That in itself show no relation to power over the people.

Think that through very carfully and in prayer .
the balaam followers dominated rule over people -and dominance IS sin of the flesh . do you think the rcc (and other )hierarchies of dominance over others originated from the holy Spirit ? i know you do not. the historians you speak of ,of what influence were they ? do you really expect to get a straight story from those who ARE the nicolatian , those who believed in and perpetuated dominance over the common man as if they are somehow a spiritual elite ? the Greek word in revelation literally translates as "people conquerors" .. it actually very simple not complicated . and who opposes it the most ?.. the established church system of hierarchical control -of course- because they ARE the nicolaitans .
seducing people AWAY from following Jesus and into following their church instead . look deeper then intellectual trickery . see into the spirit of the thing .. sexual sin ... of the SPIRITUAL ..seducing believers away from God and into a union with a false goddess whose name is later changed (yet again-its had many forms ) to mary . yes spiritual adultery, not just of the flesh . look deeper, ask the Holy Spirit to show you .

attributing the term to nicolas from antioch is a smoke screen - the lord Jesus never said they are following nicolus of anticho who has gone astray - in fact there is NOTHING in scripture to even suggest he did .
do you really think at a time when the Holy Spirit was establishing the foundation of his body, a time in which people were struck dead for telling a lie ..that he would cause such a man of wicked heart to be put into that servant hood . absolutely not .those old church usurpers of authority and nicolaitans plucked the only similar name out of acts ch 6 ..pointed the finger at him and said its him its him..! when in fact it was themselves . using Nicolas as a scapegaot to further deceive .
all you have to go on in regard to nicolas of acts 6 is .. the words of perpetrators of nicolaitanism .its like saying the other judas was the betrayer just because he has the same name . its oh so very weak .

think it all the way through my friend . who is it that desire to "conquer men " it is the very same spirit of Anti Christ that was already in the world the same spirit enticing nimrod to conquer all men in a rebellion against God in the tower of babel ... the same serpant the same devil ..
the lord Jesus would not have been so concerned but that this was a HUGE demonic encroachment into his body and he would NOT tolerate it . the word "Hate" he uses is the strongest word depicting hate abhorrence and loathing that could be used . consider it . don't accept the established church hierarchies explanation . the same one that encourages people to call a man "holy father " a term Jesus used only for GOD most high .. think it through

 

[prodromos]

Nico- means "victory" in Greek

Actually, it doesn't.
"Νίκη" means "victory". There is no form of the word as "Νίκο" except for the verb "Νικώ" or "Νικάω". All compound words formed from "Νίκη" have the letter "η" after the "κ". None have "ο" or "ω".

 

[1stcenturylady]

t

Think that through very carfully and in prayer .
the balaam followers dominated rule over people -and dominance IS sin of the flesh . do you think the rcc (and other )hierarchies of dominance over others originated from the holy Spirit ? i know you do not. the historians you speak of ,of what influence were they ? do you really expect to get a straight story from those who ARE the nicolatian , those who believed in and perpetuated dominance over the common man as if they are somehow a spiritual elite ? the Greek word in revelation literally translates as "people conquerors" .. it actually very simple not complicated . and who opposes it the most ?.. the established church system of hierarchical control -of course- because they ARE the nicolaitans .
seducing people AWAY from following Jesus and into following their church instead . look deeper then intellectual trickery . see into the spirit of the thing .. sexual sin ... of the SPIRITUAL ..seducing believers away from God and into a union with a false goddess whose name is later changed (yet again-its had many forms ) to mary . yes spiritual adultery, not just of the flesh . look deeper, ask the Holy Spirit to show you .

attributing the term to nicolas from antioch is a smoke screen - the lord Jesus never said they are following nicolus of anticho who has gone astray - in fact there is NOTHING in scripture to even suggest he did .
do you really think at a time when the Holy Spirit was establishing the foundation of his body, a time in which people were struck dead for telling a lie ..that he would cause such a man of wicked heart to be put into that servant hood . absolutely not .those old church usurpers of authority and nicolaitans plucked the only similar name out of acts ch 6 ..pointed the finger at him and said its him its him..! when in fact it was themselves . using Nicolas as a scapegaot to further deceive .
all you have to go on in regard to nicolas of acts 6 is .. the words of perpetrators of nicolaitanism .its like saying the other judas was the betrayer just because he has the same name . its oh so very weak .

think it all the way through my friend . who is it that desire to "conquer men " it is the very same spirit of Anti Christ that was already in the world the same spirit enticing nimrod to conquer all men in a rebellion against God in the tower of babel ... the same serpant the same devil ..
the lord Jesus would not have been so concerned but that this was a HUGE demonic encroachment into his body and he would NOT tolerate it . the word "Hate" he uses is the strongest word depicting hate abhorrence and loathing that could be used . consider it . don't accept the established church hierarchies explanation . the same one that encourages people to call a man "holy father " a term Jesus used only for GOD most high .. think it through

..

 

[JohnC2]

No.... It’s not just “sexual sin” - it’s way worse than that...

The intent behind Baalam’s teaching the specifics of how to lure Israel into sin was to force God’s hand to curse the very people whom God would not allow him to curse for money.... And he succeeded.

That is particularly wicked - because it requires very specific, in-depth knowledge of God and his ways, as well as specific prophetic revelation into God’s purposes that an outsider would not have otherwise.

Here’s a completely contrived example of something along those lines. Say the local Presbyterian and Episcopalian church are feuding over a shared parking lot. So the local Presbyterian church leadership decides to seek revenge by teaching a local Muslim sect how to infiltrate that Episcopal church to make them sin against God so that God will be forced to curse those evil parking lot hogging Episcopalians..... They teach them what to say and how to say it. They teach them how specifically to twist around the scripture to lure these unsuspecting Episcopalians into rejecting Jesus and accepting Muslim doctrine and then being cursed by God.... Two years later their attendance has fallen off by 75% and the parking lot problems are solved.... I mean - if they were truly The Elect, they wouldn’t have fallen for any of it, right?

That sort of thing is just so massively super wicked that it’s hard to imagine it happening... Yet it does.

 

[Knee V]

The earliest explanations of the word "nicolaitan" (and, frankly, the only historical explanations that I can find) are that the name comes from someone named Nicolas. Most heresies are named after the person who started the heresy, and that practice was common very early on.

Etymology only goes so far. Historical use of a word must be considered when figuring out what something means. After all, a butterfly has nothing to do with butter.

 

[Alithis]

The earliest explanations of the word "nicolaitan" (and, frankly, the only historical explanations that I can find) are that the name comes from someone named Nicolas. Most heresies are named after the person who started the heresy, and that practice was common very early on.

Etymology only goes so far. Historical use of a word must be considered when figuring out what something means. After all, a butterfly has nothing to do with butter.

those who adhere to and impose a system of hierachy using an ilite over the laity are always going to use that little nicolas story
its a finger pointing story
,the word means conqueror of people.
the nocolaitan doctrine was a teaching that encouraged spiritual elitism over the body of christ.
it usurped authority from the head of the body onto itself
it allowed for the making of a new and false mediator between the body and the head.
it was and is a devilish doctrine.

 

[Knee V]

The name "Nicholas" also has the same etymology as "Nicolaitan". Again, etymology alone cannot give the full meaning of a word. Historical usage has to be considered. After all, if my name were Nicholas, that wouldn't mean that I have conquered or will conquer anyone.

The idea that "Nicolaitan" means "conqueror of people" and refers to some kind of spiritual elitism and manifests through a hierarchy of clergy is a theory based on nothing other than the desire to discredit historical Christianity, and is not based on any kind of evidence. It was wishful thinking on the part of whoever thought of it.

There is historical evidence, and there is conjecture based a disdain for that same history. That someone has a beef with historical Christianity is not reason enough for me to believe their theories.

 

[Alithis]

The name "Nicholas" also has the same etymology as "Nicolaitan". Again, etymology alone cannot give the full meaning of a word. Historical usage has to be considered. After all, if my name were Nicholas, that wouldn't mean that I have conquered or will conquer anyone.

The idea that "Nicolaitan" means "conqueror of people" and refers to some kind of spiritual elitism and manifests through a hierarchy of clergy is a theory based on nothing other than the desire to discredit historical Christianity, and is not based on any kind of evidence. It was wishful thinking on the part of whoever thought of it.

There is historical evidence, and there is conjecture based a disdain for that same history. That someone has a beef with historical Christianity is not reason enough for me to believe their theories.

your history is based upon the writings of those who perpertrated spiritual elitism.
it has no biblical backing .
nor is it reliable being that they were the nicolaitans.

 

[prodromos]

your history is based upon the writings of those who perpertrated spiritual elitism.
it has no biblical backing .
nor is it reliable being that they were the nicolaitans.

Your little theory has no basis at all, as demonstrated by the other posts in this thread. It is based on a made up etymology. I can just as easily demonstrate that your name, "Alithis", means "away from rock", the Greek prefix "a" being short for "apo" and "lithis" coming from "lithos".

 

[Alithis]

Your little theory has no basis at all, as demonstrated by the other posts in this thread. It is based on a made up etymology. I can just as easily demonstrate that your name, "Alithis", means "away from rock", the Greek prefix "a" being short for "apo" and "lithis" coming from "lithos".

typical nicolaotan misdirection ylr entire establishment is built on spiritual ilitism between the body and the head,so your never going to admit anything ,just make up a story about a guy called Nicolas

 

[Francis Drake]

Hence they take the word to mean "lay conquerors" or "conquerors of the lay people".

If I recall correctly, a decade or so back as I was reading the book of Revelation, the Holy Spirit highlighted that name, so I checked the concordance and got the same result.

But the heresy of hierarchy usurping Christ's headship appears in many overlooked locations.

Here is an early attempt at power grabbing by the disciples.
Matthew20v21And he said unto her, What wilt thou? She saith unto him, Grant that these my two sons may sit, the one on thy right hand, and the other on the left, in thy kingdom. 22...………………………..

But when they others hear, they are jealous because James and John got there first!
24And when the ten heard it, they were moved with indignation against the two brethren.

Now Jesus has got their attention, he dissects the issue.
25But Jesus called them unto him, and said, Ye know that the princes of the Gentiles exercise dominion over them, and they that are great exercise authority upon them.
Yup, the disciples' thinking was perfectly normal in any society. To run the show, you need power and position!

But the kingdom of Jesus Christ is not just any society and He immediately slaps down their ideas of hierarchy!
26But it shall not be so among you:
This little phrase is probably the most ignored in scripture, but not just ignored, but entirely reversed by the church.

...........but whosoever will be great among you, let him be your servant;
Pastors are hailed as servants. But anyone bothering to fact check the average church will immediately know these pastors are the boss, not servants.

27And whosoever will be chief among you, let him be your slave:
Yes, it actually does say "slave" in there!
If the pastor is a slave why do people have to ask his permission before doing anything?

28Even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many.

The whole of this passage reveals Jesus's complete rejection of the antichrist hierarchical system that all churches have been built on since the early days.

Until the saints reject the headship of other men over them, they will never truly experience the headship of Christ.

 

[Alithis]

25But Jesus called them unto him, and said, Ye know that the princes of the Gentiles exercise dominion over them, and they that are great exercise authority upon them.
Yup, the disciples' thinking was perfectly normal in any society. To run the show, you need power and position!

But the kingdom of Jesus Christ is not just any society and He immediately slaps down their ideas of hierarchy!
26But it shall not be so among you:
This little phrase is probably the most ignored in scripture, but not just ignored, but entirely reversed by the church.

...........but whosoever will be great among you, let him be your servant;

..thankyou for the added matarial...
As you observed..i was lacking these points. They are Very clear.
Thankyou

 

[Francis Drake]

..thankyou for the added matarial...
As you observed..i was lacking these points. They are Very clear.
Thankyou

No, I thank you Alithis for starting an interesting thread.

To continue the Nicolaitan/church hierarchy theme, but from another angle.

In Corinthians, Paul confronts the saints for seeking after men, to be led by them, instead of seeking after the Lord.
His sharp rebukes shows that the ungodly hierarchical structures were already at work in the early church, and Paul blamed the infantile believers for seeking after it.​

1Cor1v10Now I exhort you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you all agree and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be made complete in the same mind and in the same judgment.
Here Paul calls for unity and a healing of those divisions, but look below to see what caused the division and disunity.

1Cor1v11For I have been informed concerning you, my brethren, by Chloe’s people, that there are quarrels among you. 12Now I mean this, that each one of you is saying, “I am of Paul,” and “I of Apollos,” and “I of Cephas,” and “I of Christ.”
In other words, I am a Baptist, I am a Congregationalist, I am an Elim man, I'm with Pastor Smith...……...etc.
Just like today's Christians, they were exalting men over their heads instead of Christ. They were into hierarchical structures and it was causing divisions.

13Has Christ been divided? Paul was not crucified for you, was he? Or were you baptized in the name of Paul? 14I thank God that I baptized none of you except Crispus and Gaius, 15so that no one would say you were baptized in my name.
There is no other way to view it other than if you put a man over your head, you displace Christ. That is the false doctrine of the Nicolaitans.

Paul picks up the theme again in chapter3

1Cor3v1And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.
This is the status of most of the church, as long as Christians seek after men to lead them, they remain carnal, spiritual infants, babes in Christ.

2I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.
Pardon the expression, but week after week, they suckle at the tit of their pastors.
Suckling babies lie back and drink pre-digested food, and then fall asleep, just like much of the church.
Back then, when there was no pre-packaged supermarket meat, eating would require carefully tearing meat away from gristle and bone to get at the good stuff.

3For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men? 4For while one says, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal?

It is carnal to imagine the Body of Christ to be like earthly institutions needing a manager or CEO etc.
The hierarchical system of management, as used throughout the world, is an excellent method for any successful organisation, big or small.
Hierarchy enables the King, CEO, Pope, General, President etc. to feed commands downwards to all parts of the nation, business, religion, army...….etc.
Hierarchy also enables information to be fed upwards to that King, CEO, Pope...……..etc.

However, to view the Church of the Lord Jesus Christ as an organisation is a foolish and carnal error.
We have a King, CEO, etc. Whilst his dwelling place is on high, it is also deep within our hearts.
Thus our King is perfectly able to send commands or other directions downwards to each and every member of His own body. And of course our King is perfectly able to receive information upwards from every member.

In short, there is no need of a hierarchy in Christ's body.
Worst still, by establishing that hierarchy, the children's heads are turned away from communion with their true head and into consulting and obeying an earthly head. A false usurper head.
The result is that our spiritual ears and eyes become deaf and blind from lack of use.

To make life easier, we tune our fleshly senses to a visible earthly head. We call it meat eating, but its already pre-digested by the pastor.
Christ remains on the periphery as our spiritual senses atrophy.

 

[ARBITER01]

Interesting.

If our churches are not to be structured as an hierarchical system, how then are they suppose to be structured in your view?

 

[Francis Drake]

Interesting.

If our churches are not to be structured as an hierarchical system, how then are they suppose to be structured in your view?

In order to seriously understand how the Body of Christ was meant to function, there are 3 absolute biblical facts that must be recognised.

1.) The body of Christ must never ever be thought of like man made organisations which are rightly controlled by hierarchical managements.

2). The Body of Christ was created as a living organism like the human body, and as such it needs one head only.

3). The imposition of alternative heads in the body dethrones Christ from his headship.

If you don't accept the above facts, then reading further is pointless.

There are several descriptions of the church in the NT, but I'm going to run through what Paul says in Ephesians.-
Eph4v11And He gave some as apostles, and some as prophets, and some as evangelists, and some as pastors and teachers.

12for the perfecting of the saints for the work of the ministry, to the building up of the body of Christ; ​

If year after year, your pastor is still preaching much the same message to much the same people, then he has failed and should be fired. He is not a pastor.
The purpose of the pastor is that he prepares the saints so that they are able to hear God and go off doing what the disciples did.
To perfect the saints, we need apostles prophets evangelists and teachers, not just pastors.

13until we all attain to the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a mature man, to the measure of the stature which belongs to the fullness of Christ.
This is not about the prophet or pastor creating a following of loyal church members. That's what Paul condemns in 1Cor1&3, as I explained in Post 16.
Unity of the faith will only come when the saints are constantly directed back to the Lord, to hear Him and remain close to Him.

14As a result, we are no longer to be children, tossed here and there by waves and carried about by every wind of doctrine, by the trickery of men, by craftiness in deceitful scheming;
Again we see immature Christians linked to following after men rather than following after the Lord himself.

15but speaking the truth in love, we are to grow up in all aspects into Him who is the head, even Christ,
And this hammers the point home. Each believer must grow up into the head, and there is only one head, Jesus himself. The whole hierarchical system is an enemy of Christ, a usurper of Christ's headship of the body.

16from whom the whole body, being fitted and held together by what every joint supplies,....
How can people miss the statement that, "every joint supplies"?
Church was never ever meant to be a pantomime orchestrated from the front to keep the saints occupied.

.....according to the proper working of each individual part, causes the growth of the body for the building up of itself in love.
Again, the working of each individual part unlike the passive audience in most churches.
When Jesus is allowed to be the head, and the only head, then His body will get back to what we saw in the early church.

There no justification that one pastor rules over the church. As I pointed out in Post14, this is about servanthood ministries, not ruling over the saints.
If Jesus came as a servant, how come the church is established on hierarchical rulership.


Currently, most Christians have lost their spiritual connection with their true head, being plugged instead to another head.
Church is largely controlled by academics, and even where the gifts are permitted, they are still under the rulership of a man made head instead of Christ.

The whole body of Christ remains infantile and largely inactive compared to the early church.​

 

[ARBITER01]

To be quite honest, I disagree, and here's why,..

1Co 12:27 And you are Christ’s body, and members in part.
1Co 12:28 And God placed some in the assembly,

firstly, apostles;
secondly, prophets;
thirdly, teachers;
then works of power;
then gifts of healing,
helps,
governings,
kinds of languages.

This is pretty clear-cut and I'm little surprised you didn't see it. The body of Christ certainly has an hierarchical ministry structure according to The Holy Spirit here, but it is up to each individual to sanctify The Lord Jesus in their heart and be led by The Holy Spirit.

Jesus knows what He is doing in His body, but some are not His.

 

[Francis Drake]

To be quite honest, I disagree, and here's why,..

1Co 12:27 And you are Christ’s body, and members in part.
1Co 12:28 And God placed some in the assembly,

firstly, apostles;
secondly, prophets;
thirdly, teachers;
then works of power;
then gifts of healing,
helps,
governings,
kinds of languages.

This is pretty clear-cut and I'm little surprised you didn't see it. The body of Christ certainly has an hierarchical ministry structure according to The Holy Spirit here, but it is up to each individual to sanctify The Lord Jesus in their heart and be led by The Holy Spirit.

Jesus knows what He is doing in His body, but some are not His.

Of course I saw those verses, but I also recognised that they have absolutely nothing to do with hierarchy.
If you make them about hierarchy, you contradict the rest of the chapter.

May I suggest you go back to the first verse and read it all together. You will see that all the gifts and ministries have equal status in the body of Christ with no head except Christ.

And of course, if you insist that it refers to hierarchy, does your church obey that hierarchy.
ie. I see you are a Pentecostal, so does your church have a pastor leading it?

Go read those verses and you will see that pastors aren't even mentioned!
Oooops!