New Zealand/gun ban

[parousia70]

An AR is actually a carbine--a short-barreled rifle explicitly designed for close quarters.

So when people say they need one for hunting we should know that’s a load of horse feathers.
Thanks.

 

[parousia70]

I intended that statement to be chock full of irony. But I did neglect to attach the [Fe] [/Fe] tags.

Trust me, the irony of the phrase “fighting for American freedom” is not lost on me, nor is it lost on most folks these days.

U.S. has spent $6 trillion on wars that killed 500,000 people since 9/11, a report says

I wonder how much “American freedom” could have been secured if that $6 trillion were instead spent on Americans’ food, shelter, education, and healthcare?

 

[RDKirk]

So when people say they need one for hunting we should know that’s a load of horse feathers.
Thanks.

If they're claiming deer hunting, yes. Deer hunting is a sniper activity calling for a sniper-type rifle.

Pig hunting, no. Pig hunting is a close-in activity. You get a shot at the pig and then the pig gets a shot at you. It's better to be able to get off more than one shot really quickly.

 

[Jonathan Walkerin]

Do you know anyone who has done that?

Nope, because it is illegal and deemed overkill no matter what some gun nuts think about it personally.

 

[Jonathan Walkerin]

This is what I would like to see... Me, as a citizen, given the power to protect my home and own a firearm to do so..

How many people are breaking into a home knowing that?

Well the figure that has been floated here is around one million break in incidents in US yearly where it is quite safe to assume a household has a weapon so clearly just a knowledge of people probably owning weapons is clearly not such a strong deterrent that you believe it to be.

 

[JacksBratt]

My grandfather was one of Black Jack Pershing's Doughboys during the First World War, where he used a bolt-action Springfield. He was a life-long hunter (at least until he was in his 70s), never used an automatic or semiautomatic weapon but somehow always managed to get his buck. Why does anyone need a military-style semiautomatic?

You don't "need" a military style semiautomatic.... but the look of the gun changes nothing.

People could see a Winchester semi auto 308 and be fine... dress it up in military bling and shape.. now everyone is all afraid...

both fire the same ammunition..However the Winchester probably has a longer barrel, is heavier, longer fore-stock and thus.. much more accurate...

but... everyone loses their marbles if it's black plastic carbine with vents and a handle on top like they see in the movies.

 

[JacksBratt]

Well the figure that has been floated here is around one million break in incidents in US yearly where it is quite safe to assume a household has a weapon so clearly just a knowledge of people probably owning weapons is clearly not such a strong deterrent that you believe it to be.

Some parts of the US will have more of a chance that there is a firearm in the house. From what I know.. this is not the case for every house, not by a long shot.

I thought that everyone in Sweden must have a firearm in the house. Or, is that just bad intel?

 

[Jonathan Walkerin]

I thought that everyone in Sweden must have a firearm in the house. Or, is that just bad intel?

There is no nation in the planet that requires you have a gun in your house.

 

[Darkhorse]

I thought that everyone in Sweden must have a firearm in the house. Or, is that just bad intel?

You may be thinking of Switzerland...

My understanding is that every able-bodied male in Switzerland must serve 2 years in their army, and is issued a fully-automatic assault rifle, which they take with them and keep after their service is completed.

I haven't checked to see if this is still the case...I'm sure someone will point out any errors...

 

[Archivist]

You don't "need" a military style semiautomatic.... but the look of the gun changes nothing.

People could see a Winchester semi auto 308 and be fine... dress it up in military bling and shape.. now everyone is all afraid...

both fire the same ammunition..However the Winchester probably has a longer barrel, is heavier, longer fore-stock and thus.. much more accurate...

but... everyone loses their marbles if it's black plastic carbine with vents and a handle on top like they see in the movies.

Or, as I said in my post, people could just use a bolt-action rifle instead of a semi-automatic.

 

[RDKirk]

Nope, because it is illegal and deemed overkill no matter what some gun nuts think about it personally.

So why did you propose it as a possibility?

 

[RDKirk]

Well the figure that has been floated here is around one million break in incidents in US yearly where it is quite safe to assume a household has a weapon so clearly just a knowledge of people probably owning weapons is clearly not such a strong deterrent that you believe it to be.

No, the overwhelming statistical odds are against anyone in any given house being armed. Even in Texas.

 

[parousia70]

Well the figure that has been floated here is around one million break in incidents in US yearly where it is quite safe to assume a household has a weapon so clearly just a knowledge of people probably owning weapons is clearly not such a strong deterrent that you believe it to be.

Not only that, but at 130 million US Households, that means Less than 1% of US households are affected by a break in, in any given year.... so it's not really an epidemic that requires the level of response many seem to imply.

Makes no sense to swat flys with an Anvil.

 

[Philip_B]

The above table data sourced (List of countries by firearm-related death rate - Wikipedia) only shows countries where the firearms deaths per 100,000 is above 3, so that the list was manageable. What clearly becomes apparent is that numbers of guns per person does not directly relate to the incidence of gun fatality.

I think we should try to understand what are the issues, and how we better control these factors. The incidence of firearms fatalities in the USA is 12 times that of Australia and New Zealand, who with quite different gun laws and gun ownership statistics have had a very similar incidence of firearms fatalities, around one twelfth of the USA.

Canada on the other hand with a quarter of the gun ownership rate has a sixth of the death rate of its neighbour. In general the European nations seem to have much lower death rates.

To me it seems that Gun Control legislation is simply a way of balancing the need for freedom and the need for responsibility.

 

[Aldebaran]

My grandfather was one of Black Jack Pershing's Doughboys during the First World War, where he used a bolt-action Springfield. He was a life-long hunter (at least until he was in his 70s), never used an automatic or semiautomatic weapon but somehow always managed to get his buck. Why does anyone need a military-style semiautomatic?

I was answering a post by someone who was addressing a post about people using firearms for self defense.

 

[Aldebaran]

I guess I have a hard time seeing whipping out a rifle for close quarters self defense...lol

If I was going to want something bulky like that I think I'd buy a shotgun.

And they oftentimes do. But they have their drawbacks, of course. High recoil compared to a rifle, 2 hands needed to cycle the action for multiple shots which may not be possible if you've been injured by your attacker first, and a shotgun has far fewer rounds that can be fired, and not as quickly. Under the stress of an attack, it's not easy to place your shots where they need to go.

 

[Aldebaran]

You don't "need" a military style semiautomatic.... but the look of the gun changes nothing.

People could see a Winchester semi auto 308 and be fine... dress it up in military bling and shape.. now everyone is all afraid...

both fire the same ammunition..However the Winchester probably has a longer barrel, is heavier, longer fore-stock and thus.. much more accurate...

but... everyone loses their marbles if it's black plastic carbine with vents and a handle on top like they see in the movies.

It really comes down to what people are culturally trained to think. Not all that long ago, the M16/AR15 was what brave soldiers used as their main fighting tool on OUR side. Then it also became the tool of police departments all over the country to maintain law and order. Police wielding them in airports after 9/11 became a symbol of security. Then when school shooters started using it, it was splashed all over the news that way and now people see it as some kind of evil killing machine preferred by school shooters and needs to be banned, even though the military and police still rely on it. But Heaven forbid anyone else uses it for legitimate purposes!

 

[Aldebaran]

Or, as I said in my post, people could just use a bolt-action rifle instead of a semi-automatic.

They could if they choose to, but some choose a semi-auto for whatever reason. Maybe they choose it because it can be used for hunting, and then be viable for home defense as well which makes it a dual-use item instead of just for hunting. The semi-auto AR15 also has an extensive line-up of accessories available for customizing. Bolt actions don't have that. Semi-autos are also lighter in recoil. Any number of reasons exist. It's nice to have the option to select whatever works best for the individual.

 

[Archivist]

I was answering a post by someone who was addressing a post about people using firearms for self defense.

Yes, and, again, why does anyone need a semiautomatic weapon?

 

[Archivist]

They could if they choose to, but some choose a semi-auto for whatever reason. Maybe they choose it because it can be used for hunting, and then be viable for home defense as well which makes it a dual-use item instead of just for hunting. The semi-auto AR15 also has an extensive line-up of accessories available for customizing. Bolt actions don't have that. Semi-autos are also lighter in recoil. Any number of reasons exist. It's nice to have the option to select whatever works best for the individual.

So, a bolt-action rifle cannot be used for self defense?