New to this movement, please help clarify

[joshuanazar]

I was saved just over four years ago. And for the first three years of that I was completely separated from any church. It was just me, God, and his Word. So I learned from God and his word. Got out and found a nondenominational church who's focus was on showing God's love. Now I stumble upon this movement and I see that its four statements of faith line up with a majority of what I believe.

The question I want to ask is what are the essentials that we are to be united on?

 

[joshuanazar]

Is this movement dead or something? Where is everone?

 

[JohannAT]

Hello joshuanazar,

Greetings in Christ to you!

It does appear that this particular sub-forum is not that active anymore. Perhaps that can change . . .

I know of several Church of Christ discussion groups on yahoo that are fairly active and also know of a good number of Church of Christ groups on Facebook that are very active. The same thing most likely holds true for the Independent Christian Churches and the Disciples of Christ.

I certainly do not have a "definitive" answer to your question regarding essentials, but one way to approach your question may be to look at Ephesians chapter 4, verses 3-6. In verse 3, the apostle Paul speaks of "Endeavoring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace." In verses 4-6, Paul then lists seven "ones" that I believe are essentials: "There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called in one hope of your calling; one Lord, one faith, one baptism; one God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all." (Eph. 4:3-6, NKJV)

Seven essential items that we are to be united on, then, are the following:

1. God our Father
2. Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ (to me, the mention of "one Lord" implies everything that is revealed about our Lord Jesus Christ in the Scriptures: His birth from a virgin, His teachings, His miracles, His death, His burial, His resurrection and His ascension)
3. The Holy Spirit
4. The Body of Christ (the Church - see Eph. 1:22-23)
5. Baptism (in water)
6. The faith (that was "once for all delivered to the saints" - see Jude 3)
7. Our hope (of resurrection and eternal life with Jesus Christ and all His faithful ones)

Speaking of "one hope", I hope my comments are helpful to you.

Much grace, peace, and love be with you.

 

[joshuanazar]

Ok but I disagree with the one Baptism though. Wouldn't the Baptism into Jesus Christ, into his death and life, resulting in our salvation (Romans 6: 3-10)be way more important? I mean isn't water baptism just a physical act that is only symbolizing this life changing baptism? So shouldn't being baptized into Jesus be the One Baptism?

 

[JohannAT]

Hello there! It is good to "see" you again.

I believe we are both talking about the same thing. My reply focused on the outward act of water baptism, and your reply focused on the marvelous spiritual reality which takes place behind the scenes when one is baptized. Outwardly, we go down into the water and are raised up from the water. In the spiritual realm, we receive remission of sins; we are placed into Christ, into His death, burial, and resurrection; and we are placed into the Body of Christ (Acts 2:38, Gal. 3:27, Rom. 6:3-4, 1 Cor. 12:13)!

Peace be with you.

 

[joshuanazar]

Hello there! It is good to "see" you again.

I believe we are both talking about the same thing. My reply focused on the outward act of water baptism, and your reply focused on the marvelous spiritual reality which takes place behind the scenes when one is baptized. Outwardly, we go down into the water and are raised up from the water. In the spiritual realm, we receive remission of sins; we are placed into Christ, into His death, burial, and resurrection; and we are placed into the Body of Christ (Acts 2:38, Gal. 3:27, Rom. 6:3-4, 1 Cor. 12:13)!

Peace be with you.

But they two baptisms do not happen at the same time. For instance I was baptized into Christ when I was alone and I stayed alone for three years the entire time I was enjoying a relationship with Jesus and being taught by his Spirit. I didn't receive any water baptism for the entire three years and I know that I have been baptized into Christ's body.

 

[Thedictator]

No there is only one baptism the spiritual and physical parts of baptism take place at the same time. Just like there are three personalities of God but still one God, there is still only one baptism.

 

[greatdivide46]

Ok but I disagree with the one Baptism though. Wouldn't the Baptism into Jesus Christ, into his death and life, resulting in our salvation (Romans 6: 3-10)be way more important? I mean isn't water baptism just a physical act that is only symbolizing this life changing baptism? So shouldn't being baptized into Jesus be the One Baptism?

The one baptism (Eph. 4:5) is a baptism into Jesus Christ, into his death and resurrection (Rom. 6:3-4) and does result in our salvation (Titus 3:5; 1 Peter 3:21). It is baptism of water and the Spirit (John 3:5), but it is only one baptism.

 

[JohannAT]

The one baptism (Eph. 4:5) is a baptism into Jesus Christ, into his death and resurrection (Rom. 6:3-4) and does result in our salvation (Titus 3:5; 1 Peter 3:21). It is baptism of water and the Spirit (John 3:5), but it is only one baptism.

Hello there. It is good to "see" you here.

I fully agree. The Scriptures teach that it is only one baptism.

 

[EdwinWillers]

Agreed. The Scriptures are quite clear that there is but one baptism. It is by water and the Spirit, but one only - the one we submit to as in Acts 2:38.

Jesus commanded we be baptized. Mk 16:16, Mt 28:18ff
Peter taught we need to be baptized. Acts 2:38ff
Peter further explained that baptism was the point at which we receive the gift of the Holy Spirit Acts 2:38 (cf. Acts 19:2ff)
C.f. Rom 8:9 where Paul explicitly asserts that anyone who does not have the Holy Spirit does not belong to Him
Paul explained the why of baptism:
-- As the sharing in the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ. Rom 6:1ff, Col 2:9ff (cf. Gal 2:20)
-- As how we are put into Christ, become part of the "body" of Christ Col 2:9ff
-- As the basis of our identity in Christ. I Cor 1:10-13

Luke records baptism as part of the process of becoming a Christian in multiple locations:
-- The 3000 Acts 2:37ff
-- Simon, the Samaritans Acts 8:12ff
-- The Ethiopian Eunuch Acts 8:26ff
-- Saul (Paul) Acts 9:1-19 & Acts 22:3-16
-- Cornelius and his household Acts 10:44ff
-- Lydia and her household Acts 16:25ff
-- The jailer in Philippi and his household Acts 16:25ff

It is interesting (and very saddening) that what most people think they know about baptism has virtually zero Scriptural basis.

The above (and other passages) are quite clear, explicit, and concrete. There are no magical, mystical, or esoteric explanations needed to understand what they're saying; no mystery, no profoundly intricate explanations necessary. They are simple, straightforward, consistent with one another and with the rest of Scripture.

Ps 119:160 - "The SUM of Thy Word is truth..."

 

[outsidethecamp]

No there is only one baptism the spiritual and physical parts of baptism take place at the same time. Just like there are three personalities of God but still one God, there is still only one baptism.

But Cornelius was saved and filled with the Holy Spirit before he was baptized. (Acts 10)

The thief on the cross wasn't baptized before going to be with the Lord.

Paul says, that he did not come to baptize anyone but to preach the Gospel and many became believers under Paul's preaching.

Your baptism sounds like the Catholic "infant baptism" which ostensibly removes original sin.

 

[outsidethecamp]

Ok but I disagree with the one Baptism though. Wouldn't the Baptism into Jesus Christ, into his death and life, resulting in our salvation (Romans 6: 3-10)be way more important? I mean isn't water baptism just a physical act that is only symbolizing this life changing baptism? So shouldn't being baptized into Jesus be the One Baptism?

You are right. That is the "one baptism", Joshua. The baptism into Christ's death so that we are raised to newness of life. It is not talking about water baptism.