New Jersey is prioritizing cigarette smokers for COVID-19 vaccines

[dqhall]

One link is behind a "create free account" wall, so I'm posting two....

New Jersey is prioritizing cigarette smokers for COVID-19 vaccines because of their risk of severe disease

Smokers in N.J. Are Eligible for Vaccine. No Proof Needed.


"I'll take rewarding people for bad decisions for $500, Alex" (RIP)


I fail to see how someone making perpetually poor decisions (that increase the likelihood of poor Covid outcomes) should warrant them moving to the front of the line.

By that logic, a state could make a case to prioritize anti-maskers for the vaccines since their voluntary behavior is leading to a higher likelihood of a poor covid-related outcomes. (much like the voluntary behavior of smoking does)

Of course, the glaring flaw with this plan:
NJ Department of Health Commissioner Judy Persichilli said in a press conference Wednesday that the state will not ask for proof that people smoke if they show up for a shot.

"No documentation of the medical condition or your age will be required," she said.

People with high blood pressure are at higher risk for complications from COVID. That is 45% of the population.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

People with high blood pressure are at higher risk for complications from COVID. That is 45% of the population.

Given that it's going to be the "honor system" for claiming whether or not one is a smoker or having other pre-existing condition (and they're not going to require proof for any of it)...seems like they should've just said

"Hey, we've got some vaccines in, first come, first served"...since that's how it's likely going to play out anyway with the way they're handling it.

 

[Sparagmos]

...but as I said, by that logic, anyone who engages in particularly risky health behavior would fall in that category.

IE: Anti-maskers are at higher risks from covid than people who wear a mask and socially distance. How well do you think it'd go over with the public if they announced that they were going to prioritize people who identified as being "opposed to mask wearing" for the vaccine?

Also, the last part...where they claim they're not going to ask for any proof that a person is a smoker...I think we all know what's going to happen there. There are going to be hundreds (if not thousands) of people who lie about that just to cut the line.

But this is about people who are at higher risk of dying if they get COVID. Not that I don’t get your point. But at the end of the day, hospitals being full of people on ventilators hurts us all. If only operation warp speed” wasn’t a complete joke and there wasn’t a scarcity of vaccines...

 

[ThatRobGuy]

But this is about people who are at higher risk of dying if they get COVID. Not that I don’t get your point. But at the end of the day, hospitals being full of people on ventilators hurts us all. If only operation warp speed” wasn’t a complete joke and there wasn’t a scarcity of vaccines...

I understand the externalities associated with it, but even using that rationale, their implementation approach of "no questions asked" seems like it's just asking for abuse of that provision.

What would prevent a healthy 30 years old (who just wants to cut the line) from going to the location, saying "yeah, I'm a smoker (wink)" and getting the vaccine?

At the very least, make the person show a receipt for buying a carton (even if they don't smoke them).

The federal taxation on cigarettes is $1.01 per pack (or $10.10 per carton), and the average additional state tax is another $0.70 per pack (or $7.00 per carton) - some states being higher, some being lower - and a large portion of cigarette tax collected is used to augment federal and state healthcare budgets and fund CHIP (a program that gives health insurance to kids whose parents can afford it)

That way even if the person is lying about being a smoker, and just tosses the carton in the trash, they at least chipped in ~$15 toward the healthcare budget. (which obviously needs more funding help than ever before at this point in time)

 

[Sparagmos]

I understand the externalities associated with it, but even using that rationale, their implementation approach of "no questions asked" seems like it's just asking for abuse of that provision.

What would prevent a healthy 30 years old (who just wants to cut the line) from going to the location, saying "yeah, I'm a smoker (wink)" and getting the vaccine?

At the very least, make the person show a receipt for buying a carton (even if they don't smoke them).

The federal taxation on cigarettes is $1.01 per pack (or $10.10 per carton), and the average additional state tax is another $0.70 per pack (or $7.00 per carton) - some states being higher, some being lower - and a large portion of cigarette tax collected is used to augment federal and state healthcare budgets.

That way even if the person is lying about being a smoker, and just tosses the carton in the trash, they at least chipped in ~$15 toward the healthcare budget.

Yeah I agree the the lying. Very surprised they are just taking people’s word for it.

 

[Elliewaves]

Yes, people who would lie about being a smoker to get this is not right. But, it's also not like the smokers personally lobbied and pressured the health professionals making this choice so they could jump in line.

 

[grasping the after wind]

One link is behind a "create free account" wall, so I'm posting two....

New Jersey is prioritizing cigarette smokers for COVID-19 vaccines because of their risk of severe disease

Smokers in N.J. Are Eligible for Vaccine. No Proof Needed.


"I'll take rewarding people for bad decisions for $500, Alex" (RIP)


I fail to see how someone making perpetually poor decisions (that increase the likelihood of poor Covid outcomes) should warrant them moving to the front of the line.

By that logic, a state could make a case to prioritize anti-maskers for the vaccines since their voluntary behavior is leading to a higher likelihood of a poor covid-related outcomes. (much like the voluntary behavior of smoking does)


Of course, the glaring flaw with this plan:
NJ Department of Health Commissioner Judy Persichilli said in a press conference Wednesday that the state will not ask for proof that people smoke if they show up for a shot.

"No documentation of the medical condition or your age will be required," she said.

As far as I can tell Governments have prioritized rewarding poor decisions for quite a while now. Why should this particular action have been any different? Just as not checking to see if one is eligible under the rules has become SOP.

 

[MyOwnSockPuppet]

There's two schools of thought when it comes to minimizing the damage that something like covid happens and a sensible order needs to be come up with to vaccinate people:

1) Vaccinate those who are most likely to be the worst affected - if you vaccinate the people most likely to be killed or require long-term hospitalization then your healthcare system isn't going to get swamped while you get enough vaccine to develop herd immunity.

2) Vaccinate those most likely to spread it - if you vaccinate people who (by the nature of their jobs or because they're idiots who don't understand how transmitting viruses to other people is a bad thing) then the infection rate is lowered enough to buy you the time.

Smokers would probably be group 1, anti-mask people group 2.

 

[MyOwnSockPuppet]

Furthermore, since the government hasn't made cigarettes illegal, they need to take responsibility for that decision.

In much the same way that you can't kill the cow and still get milk, you can't ban something and still tax it. I believe that the income from tobacco taxation in Canada is of the order CA$ 8-9 billion per year.

Even governments tend to notice numbers with the letter B in them.

 

[High Fidelity]

Why stop there? Being overweight is an underlying condition that hurts their chances too....

For all the fumbles my country has made I do agree with starting at 85 and over, care home residents and workers and then going down in 5-year increments is the best way to do it, also including frontline healthcare staff near the top of the list.