New Covenant Whole Gospel:

[SkyWriting]

Yes the Bereans checked the existing scriptures as you say but why do you ignore that they found nothing in what Paul said to be in conflict with the written word, Now if they checked Paul's preaching and found it to be true why would you question it? The Bible has been checked and rechecked over thousands of years, trust me if there were Theological errors they would have been found a long time ago, you can totally rely on what is written.

There are topics that have been the center of debate for centuries. Also for the decades I have been in this forum. So I have no idea what you mean.

 

[BABerean2]

Proof-positive that there are two different gospels: the people following Paul don't even see the Gospel of the Kingdom.

Paul proves otherwise in the verse below.

Rom 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.


There is only one Gospel in the verse above to both the Jew and the Greek.

Paul gave a severe warning below to those who would pervert this one Gospel.

Gal 1:6 I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:
Gal 1:7 Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.
Gal 1:8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
Gal 1:9 As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.


.

 

[BABerean2]

Scripture says He does control my free will.

Does God make a robot and preprogram its every step, or does God make a man and have the foreknowledge to know every step he will make?

Did God force Satan to rebel against Him, or was it Satan's choice?

Did God force Adam to eat of the forbidden fruit, or was it Adam's choice?


.

 

[Ligurian]

So the newest scriptures must mesh with the old. Or they should be set aside.

Your hard-and-fast rules need a little work. Maybe you're remembering that a prophet doesn't set aside the words of a previous prophet?

Exodus 21:24 eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot,

Matthew 5:38-39 Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth: But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.

The reason for the changes

Matthew 19:7-8 They say unto Him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away? He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so.

Matthew 5:19-20 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least Commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the Kingdom of Heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the Kingdom of Heaven.For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed [that] of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the Kingdom of Heaven. (Matthew 23:27)

God does not trust just one writer with the fundamentals of His theology.

Yeah, He does.

Deuteronomy 18:15-19 The Lord thy God shall raise up to thee a prophet of thy brethren, like me; him shall ye hear: 16 according to all things which thou didst desire of the Lord thy God in Choreb in the day of the assembly, saying, We will not again hear the voice of the Lord thy God and we will not any more see this great fire, and so we shall not die. 17 And the Lord said to me, They have spoken rightly all that they have said to thee. 18 I will raise up to them a prophet of their brethren like thee, and I will put My words in His mouth, and He shall speak to them as I shall Command Him. 19 And whatever man shall not hearken to whatsoever words that prophet shall speak in My name, I will take vengeance on him.LXX

John 12:44-50 Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on Me, believeth not on Me, but on Him that sent Me. 45 And he that seeth Me seeth Him that sent Me. 46 I am come a light into the world, that whosoever believeth on Me should not abide in darkness. 47 And if any man hear My words and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world. 48 He that rejecteth Me and receiveth not My words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day. 49 For I have not spoken of Myself: but the Father which sent Me He gave Me a Commandment, what I should say and what I should speak. 50 And I know that His Commandment is Life Everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto Me, so I speak.KJV

Strictly speaking, it's not one writer but one speaker... with the two witnesses of Matthew and John. (Matthew 21:37)

 

[SkyWriting]

Your hard-and-fast rules need a little work. Maybe you're remembering that a prophet doesn't set aside the words of a previous prophet?

Exactly. The Bereans did. They examined new writings to see if they were legit.
Let's count up all the claims that Jesus blinded somebody. One.
Lets count up where Jesus caused the blind to see or was considered "the light" that illuminates. Scores.

 

[Ligurian]

Proof-positive that there are two different gospels: the people following Paul don't even see the Gospel of the Kingdom.

Rom 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

There is only one Gospel in the verse above to both the Jew and the Greek.

Benjamite Paul belongs to the half of the Divided Kingdom called the house of Juda... composed of Judah, Benjamin, and Levi.

John 7:1 After these things Jesus walked in Galilee: for he would not walk in Jewry, because the Jews sought to kill Him.
Ioudaia = feminine of Ioudaios; the Judaean land (i.e. Judaea), a region of Palestine:--Judaea.

Which came first, the chicken or the egg?

The Gospel of the Kingdom is preached in Galilee 6+ years before Paul came from Arabia.

Galileans are not Judeans, they belong to the northern half of the Divided Kingdom known as the House of Israel, aka the 10-tribes.

1 Peter 1:1 to the diaspora: Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia

Unfortunate overlap, right? Two different gospels were being preached in the provinces of Asia and Galatia.

John 14:15-17 clearly shows that the Holy Spirit comes by keeping the Law of Jesus.
...
but Galatians 3:3-5 says, by hearing apart from works.

Gal 1:7 Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.

It's not a perversion if you're not taught Paul's gospel in the first place...
whew... Galileans had the Kingdom Gospel yeeeaars before that.

 

[Ligurian]

Exactly. The Bereans did. They examined new writings to see if they were legit.
Let's count up all the claims that Jesus blinded somebody. One.
Lets count up where Jesus caused the blind to see or was considered "the light" that illuminates. Scores.

Deuteronomy 13:1-3 If there arise among you a prophet, or a dreamer of dreams, and giveth thee a sign or a wonder, 2 And the sign or the wonder come to pass, whereof he spake unto thee, saying, Let us go after other gods, which thou hast not known, and let us serve them;

Revelation 2:14 and Revelation 2:20.

 

[Ligurian]

Yes clearly if you know the truth but fail to accept it you are responsible that is not the same as invincible ignorance. As I said God is just, you are not responsible for things you do not know.

Then I take it you don't believe in that "original sin" nonsense?

 

[BABerean2]

Benjamite Paul belongs to the half of the Divided Kingdom called the house of Juda... composed of Judah, Benjamin, and Levi.

John 7:1 After these things Jesus walked in Galilee: for he would not walk in Jewry, because the Jews sought to kill Him.
Ioudaia = feminine of Ioudaios; the Judaean land (i.e. Judaea), a region of Palestine:--Judaea.

Which came first, the chicken or the egg?

The Gospel of the Kingdom is preached in Galilee 6+ years before Paul came from Arabia.

Galileans are not Judeans, they belong to the northern half of the Divided Kingdom known as the House of Israel, aka the 10-tribes.

1 Peter 1:1 to the diaspora: Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia

Unfortunate overlap, right? Two different gospels were being preached in the provinces of Asia and Galatia.

John 14:15-17 clearly shows that the Holy Spirit comes by keeping the Law of Jesus.
...
but Galatians 3:3-5 says, by hearing apart from works.



It's not a perversion if you're not taught Paul's gospel in the first place...
whew... Galileans had the Kingdom Gospel yeeeaars before that.

Paul's warnings against using "genealogies" in our faith prove you are wrong.

1Ti_1:4 Neither give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: so do.

Tit_3:9 But avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions, and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain.


.

 

[Ligurian]

Benjamite Paul belongs to the half of the Divided Kingdom called the house of Juda... composed of Judah, Benjamin, and Levi.

John 7:1 After these things Jesus walked in Galilee: for he would not walk in Jewry, because the Jews sought to kill Him.
Ioudaia = feminine of Ioudaios; the Judaean land (i.e. Judaea), a region of Palestine:--Judaea.

Which came first, the chicken or the egg?

The Gospel of the Kingdom is preached in Galilee 6+ years before Paul came from Arabia.

Galileans are not Judeans, they belong to the northern half of the Divided Kingdom known as the House of Israel, aka the 10-tribes.

1 Peter 1:1 to the diaspora: Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia

Unfortunate overlap, right? Two different gospels were being preached in the provinces of Asia and Galatia.

John 14:15-17 clearly shows that the Holy Spirit comes by keeping the Law of Jesus.
...
but Galatians 3:3-5 says, by hearing apart from works.

It's not a perversion if you're not taught Paul's gospel in the first place...
whew... Galileans had the Kingdom Gospel yeeeaars before that.

Paul's warnings against using "genealogies" in our faith prove you are wrong.

1Ti_1:4 Neither give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: so do.

Tit_3:9 But avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions, and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain.
.

Philippians 3:5 Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, [of] the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;

 

[BABerean2]

Philippians 3:5 Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, [of] the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;

Php 3:1 Finally, my brethren, rejoice in the Lord. To write the same things to you, to me indeed is not grievous, but for you it is safe.
Php 3:2 Beware of dogs, beware of evil workers, beware of the concision.
Php 3:3 For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh.
Php 3:4 Though I might also have confidence in the flesh. If any other man thinketh that he hath whereof he might trust in the flesh, I more:
Php 3:5 Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;
Php 3:6 Concerning zeal, persecuting the church; touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless.
Php 3:7 But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ.
Php 3:8 Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,
Php 3:9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
Php 3:10 That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;
Php 3:11 If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.

Context.

.

 

[SkyWriting]

Deuteronomy 13:1-3 If there arise among you a prophet, or a dreamer of dreams, and giveth thee a sign or a wonder, 2 And the sign or the wonder come to pass, whereof he spake unto thee, saying, Let us go after other gods, which thou hast not known, and let us serve them;Revelation 2:14 and Revelation 2:20.

I wonder what kind of sacrifices are edible afterwords?
Is this a problem?

 

[SkyWriting]

Your hard-and-fast rules need a little work. Maybe you're remembering that a prophet doesn't set aside the words of a previous prophet?

We determine the validity of claims based on previous writings.

 

[disciple Clint]

But getting back to the church approved scriptures, we'll focus on those:

Proverbs 21:1
The king's heart is a stream of water in the hand of the Lord; he turns it wherever he will.

Proverbs 19:21
Many are the plans in the mind of a man, but it is the purpose of the Lord that will stand.

Genesis 50:20
As for you, you meant evil against me, but God meant it for good,

Proverbs 16:9
The heart of man plans his way, but the Lord establishes his steps.

Proverbs 16:1
The plans of the heart belong to man, but the answer of the tongue is from the Lord.

Proverbs 21:30
No wisdom, no understanding, no counsel can avail against the Lord.

Each passage explains that what man considers to be evil, is actually part of God's plans.


Your "Free will" was God's plan for you before creation.
Since God controls everything you experience in life
it's not exactly as free as you might think it was.

Yes I can find a bunch of unrelated scriptures that will support almost anything. You are not even checking to see if these scriptures mean what you think they mean.

 

[SkyWriting]

You are not even checking to see if these scriptures mean what you think they mean.

Each passage explains that what man considers to be evil, is actually part of God's plans.
They were hand picked as they all have the same message that "Free Will" is all orchestrated by God.

Psalm 37:23
The steps of a man are established by the Lord, when he delights in his way;

Psalm 17:5
My steps have held fast to your paths; my feet have not slipped.

Proverbs 20:24
A man's steps are from the Lord; how then can man understand his way?

Jeremiah 10:23
I know, O Lord, that the way of man is not in himself, that it is not in man who walks to direct his steps.

Isaiah 46:10
declaring the end from the beginning and from ancient times things not yet done, saying, ‘My counsel shall stand, and I will accomplish all my purpose,’

Acts 2:23
this Jesus, delivered up according to the definite plan and foreknowledge of God, you crucified and killed by the hands of lawless men.

 

[disciple Clint]

The scriptures you don't quote tell us that your not quoting scripture about free will.

There are different perspectives in scripture. From God's perspective, your entire life is in His memory already. Beginning to end.

If you cannot see the logic or do not want to believe what is commonly accepted theology I would be wasting my time.

 

[disciple Clint]

There are topics that have been the center of debate for centuries. Also for the decades I have been in this forum. So I have no idea what you mean.

how can I help you when you do not accept the very scripture that you quoted yourself in your previous post, you want to believe what you want to believe go ahead.

 

[SkyWriting]

Yes I can find a bunch of unrelated scriptures that will support almost anything.

Anything that God says is true, yes.

 

[SkyWriting]

how can I help you when you do not accept the very scripture that you quoted yourself in your previous post, you want to believe what you want to believe go ahead.

Thanks! Much appreciated.

 

[SkyWriting]

If you cannot see the logic or do not want to believe what is commonly accepted theology I would be wasting my time.

I have found a number of issues in commonly accepted theology that don't hold up to examination.
If they don't hold up, then they don't. For example "Church Traditions" is full of worthless junk. "Sermons" or "Teaching" is another one that has been abused.