Neo-Darwinism is National Disgrace

[Chalnoth]

Gracchus...would you please point me to a neodarwin site that explains to me how evolution works if it is not done in small (nucleotide) increments?.. I would like to read about that. Here's one that verifies what I said.

http://www.howstuffworks.com/evolution.htm/printable

[FONT=arial,helvetica][SIZE=-1]Only about one nucleotide pair in a thousand is randomly changed every 200,000 years. Even so, in a population of 10,000 individuals, every possible nucleotide substitution will have been "tried out" on about 50 occasions in the course of a million years, which is a short span of time in relation to the evolution of species. Much of the variation created in this way will be disadvantageous to the organism and will be selected against in the population. When a rare variant sequence is advantageous, however, it will be rapidly propagated by natural selection. Consequently, it can be expected that in any given species the functions of most genes will have been optimized by random point mutation and selection. [/SIZE][/FONT]

And how else could evolution procede if natural selection did not select individual nucleotides? -- that's how animals supposedly built up!
​

By the way...why is it that it's always evolutionists who use that stupid hand-waving or tongue-wagging icon???

I'm not quite sure what your point is here. Single-nucleotide substitutions aren't the only type of possible mutation. They are significant because they are more easily beneficial. But there have been recorded situations of more complex mutations being beneficial.

 

[Skaloop]

maybe because the earth is 6000 years old lol

Yeah, 'cause that makes total sense.

Come on. Even John doesn't actually argue in favour of that load of garbage.

 

[notto]

But all it takes for them, evidently, is to wave the magic evolutionary wand to make it all happen in their mind. Who cares if there's no scientific method to make this hocus-pocus fairytale come true....as long as they can still hear the faint death rattle in the morals of decaying society, then all is well.

Now, lets compare what supersport accuses 'evolutionists' of and some of his own words.

Is the following a well informed scientific idea or is it the wave of a magic wand with no consideration of the scientific method and no mechanism to make this hocus-pocus fairytail come true.

I think lifeforms have a hidden intelligence within their being. It's hard to pinpoint exactly where this intelligence arises, but unlike evolutionists, I think of the body as a whole unit -- not as in millions or billions of parts. It works as a single entity -- and all the parts work in unison. There is an intelligence in every creature that is unviewable and unexplainable by science -- thus they pretend it's not there.

Credibility was last seen exiting through the 3rd floor fire escape.

 

[Gracchus]

Gracchus...would you please point me to a neodarwin site that explains to me how evolution works if it is not done in small (nucleotide) increments?.. I would like to read about that.

Here is one site: http://evolution.berkeley.edu/

You can find this on that site: http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evolibrary/article/evo_01

And this: http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evolibrary/article/mutations_01

Just Google “evolution” for others.

Here's one that verifies what I said.

http://www.howstuffworks.com/evolution.htm/printable

Only about one nucleotide pair in a thousand is randomly changed every 200,000 years. Even so, in a population of 10,000 individuals, every possible nucleotide substitution will have been "tried out" on about 50 occasions in the course of a million years, which is a short span of time in relation to the evolution of species. Much of the variation created in this way will be disadvantageous to the organism and will be selected against in the population. When a rare variant sequence is advantageous, however, it will be rapidly propagated by natural selection. Consequently, it can be expected that in any given species the functions of most genes will have been optimized by random point mutation and selection.

And how else could evolution procede if natural selection did not select individual nucleotides? -- that's how animals supposedly built up!

In a gene, three nucleotides form a codon, and a codon determines which amino acid will be added to a protein. A sequence of codons makes up a gene and a gene codes for a protein. Sometimes different codons code for the same amino acids. A single amino acid difference in a protein may or may not change the function of the protein. So, that is why we say that the nucleotide is not selected. It might make a difference or it might not. It is the physical expression of the genes, the phenotype, that is selected.

It is the phenotype, the body form determined by the sum total of all the genes, that is selected. Thus, thicker hair, more subcutaneous fat, or shorter limbs might be selected for in a colder climate and selected against in a warmer climate. Now those characteristics are determined by proteins. The proteins are determined not just by the sequence of amino acids that make them up, but also how the proteins are folded. Folded one way the protein does one thing. Folded another way it can do another. True, the proteins are determined by nucleotides, just as the ascii codes that represent letters are made up of bits. But most people don’t spell by analyzing the bits that make up the letters of a word.

By the way...why is it that it's always evolutionists who use that stupid hand-waving or tongue-wagging icon???

The smiley is used to indicate mood, which can be hard to convey, or sometimes for comedic effect. I use the wave as a good natured farewell. The tongue wagging razz is just that. I seldom, if ever razz. I often sigh when dealing with particularly thick headed creationists. I try not to post when angry .

 

[XTE]

I see two things:

1) The OP is having a mental break-down and appealling to emotion in his fellow believers and all the Atheist can do is alugh at it. I don't think he's here for you to laugh at. I'm still not through laughing at myself so let this man get his over with first. He's doing exactly what I did a little over a month ago which is:

Realizing then trying to blame everyone but myself.

Eventually you realize that you are the minority and you take back all the credit you give yourself and truly become open to truth, not just what is called "the truth."

2) I see the Christians, you know, the same ol' 3 vying for the respect of the Evolutionists here. Well, minus one and that's the OP which is understandable.

So not only are the Evos here making light of the OP, the believers are using him to establish differences between them and the OP and hence gain respect from us.

You Evos, you have Critical Mass and can't go with it. Sure, I know sometimes it seems you have to force someone to laugh at themselves, but if someone is getting hit from all directions WHAT USE IF YOURS?

I'm probably as much to blame now....

food for thought!

 

[Eudaimonist]

I don't think these people believe 95% of what they say. But then again neither did Satan in the Garden of Eden. In fact, deception is a consciously purposeful act. Likewise, I am convinced that the atheist activists who frequent Christian forums like this have no other purpose than pure deception. They love nothing more than the emotional high that comes from the possiblity of stealing someone's faith in the Almighty Creator. There's no other explanation.

Who are you trying to convince? Atheists? Or yourself?


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[belladonic-haze]

Neo-darwinism is truly a National disgrace. I do not say this as a cheap attempt at an insult. I say it with all honesty. Satan -- with the help of his little red-headed, mental-terrorist step-child (Charles Darwin) -- has turned this great nation upside-down. A small percentage of atheistic intelligence bandits have somehow managed to manipulate their way into the hearts and minds of the general population.

And this has been done though large-scale, mind-numbing, brainwashing techniques that have convinced a large portion ofAmerica that dumb creatures have evolved into intelligent ones. They have succeeded in convincing many that a tricycle can evolve into the space shuttle through blind and purposeless mutations guided by the mere notion that animals actually breed and have offspring. They have dumbed-down
society to the point where many people actually believe this stuff....people actually believe that the only differences between sweaty, bug-picking monkeys and humans are short arms and opposable thumbs. They think the difference between a hippo and a dolphin is just a series of random mutations that reshape the body. Little gets mentioned about how and where a dolphin's sonar came from. Little is mentioned of where a spider got his intelligence to do this:

http://mon-ile.net/carnet/IMG/jpg/spider-web_08-09-2005.jpg

All evolutionists can say is that the web-spinning spider and the sonar-using dolphin both had an imaginary common ancestor -- which supposedly possessed these abilities.

But the reality is, evolution as darwinists define it is genetically impossible. The follwing quote is from "Genetic Entropy" by Dr. J.C. Sanford:

The reality of biology is that selection acts on the level of the organism, not on the level of the nucleotide. Genes never exist in "pools", they only exist in massive clusters. Each nucleotide exists intimately associated with all the other nucleotides, and they are only selected or rejected as a set of 6 billion. No nucleotide is EVER inherited independently. Each nucleotide is intimately connected to its surrounding nucleotides and they only exist and have meaning in the context of other nucleotides. We now know that human nucleotides exist in large linked clusters or blocks, ranging in size from 10,000 to a million. These linkage blcoks are inherited as a single unit, and never break apart. This totally negates one of the most fundamental assumptions of the theorists -- that each nucleotide can be viewed as an individually selectable unit. Natural selection can never create, or even maintain, specific nucleotide sequences.

And this evidently is something that has been known for a long time -- at least since 1970 when Kimura proclaimed the same exact thing. But yet, the charade of lies continues. The massive brain-washing of society continues like a boulder rolling quickly down a hill. Cumulative selection is still invoked as the mechanism that turned a monkey into a man over at TalkOrigins....and the same mantra is being repeated and defended here daily.

Yet, somehow evolutionists have convinced themselves that whole organs have somehow accidently pieced themselves together one nucleotide at a time -- regardless of the fact that fully-formed organisms, with no-doubt fully-formed organs appeared abruptly in the fossil record. But all it takes for them, evidently, is to wave the magic evolutionary wand to make it all happen in their mind. Who cares if there's no scientific method to make this hocus-pocus fairytale come true....as long as they can still hear the faint death rattle in the morals of decaying society, then all is well.

And look at the eye. A simple 12 pixel image has 500 million possible connections. How can a series of mistakes account for this?....But the human eye has 126 Megapixels. How can blind accidents accomplish the staggering formation of such an organ? And the truth is there is no evolutionary mechanism that allows mutations to occur again and again in just the right place -- over and over and over until an organ is formed. This is an impossible myth, especially when you consider how many places a mutation can occur....there are BILLIONS of nucleotide locations that would have to be accidentally mutated at just the right time and place.

But you know what? I don't think these people believe 95% of what they say. But then again neither did Satan in the Garden of Eden. In fact, deception is a consciously purposeful act. Likewise, I am convinced that the atheist activists who frequent Christian forums like this have no other purpose than pure deception. They love nothing more than the emotional high that comes from the possiblity of stealing someone's faith in the Almighty Creator. There's no other explanation.These are the same people who see nothing wrong with puncturing the skull of a beautiful unborn child via late-term abortion. Debating them is pointless.

Stop stop...my face hurts!!!

 

[Garnett]

If an atheist or agnostic posted their thoughts in the terms and tone of the OP this thread would not have lasted a day.

Whatever you say about us, "Do unto others, as you would have done unto you" has, is, and will always be the most ironic maxim of Christian teaching.

 

[belladonic-haze]

If an atheist or agnostic posted their thoughts in the terms and tone of the OP this thread would not have lasted a day.

Whatever you say about us, "Do unto others, as you would have done unto you" has, is, and will always be the most ironic maxim of Christian teaching.

As a Christian I take these words serious. Treat others the way you want to be treated. It is such a simple sentence...but the words are very powerful.

But than again, I am not your typical Bible slapping Christian and I believe in evolution......

 

[Magnus Vile]

It's interesting to note that apes never learn how to lie, even though they can be taught to communicate through sign language. Lying is actually a creative exercise which is actually an interesting but dubious distinction that seperates us from apes.

Except Koko, who did lie.

The tendency of hominids to lie is universal. Even great apes tell porkies. A famous lie was when Koko the gorilla tore a steel sink out of its moorings and then used sign language to tell her handlers, 'Cat did it,' pointing at her pet kitten. Nobody can say if this was a joke or a real attempt to shift the blame.

 

[Kahalachan]

Except Koko, who did lie.

My University specializes in primates who communicate with sign language. We have Washoe, the first non-human to learn a human language.

I have seen these chimps personally, and they are capable of lying.

The staff was telling stories about how one of them (I forget which one) will sign "kiss" and ask for a kiss, and when you let them kiss you, it will poke you in fun. Then say "Sorry" and ask for another kiss with its finger poised to poke again.

This is an obvious use of deceit.


The interaction is very fascinating and they seem to be on par with deaf children.

 

[Abongil]

maybe because the earth is 6000 years old lol

And your God is a deciever of men.

 

[Abongil]

So... wait.... Its not gays, or aids, or abortion, or WAR or CORRUPTION that will be the downfall of this nation... but evolution?

I cant even respond to this.

 

[nvxplorer]

It's interesting to note that apes never learn how to lie, even though they can be taught to communicate through sign language. Lying is actually a creative exercise which is actually an interesting but dubious distinction that seperates us from apes.

A child is capable of seeing the commonality between humans and other apes (there's a Bible verse that covers the bolded phrase). Only the blind are incapable of seeing traits that humans and other apes share (more Bible).

Tool making, lying (as has been addressed), murder, creativity, culture; have all been observed among apes and ape populations. These apes have pets, for cryin' out loud!

Here is the painting "Apple Chase," by the deceased gorilla, Michael:

This is Michael's pet dog, which is the subject of "Apple Chase:"

Take a little time and compare the two, keeping in mind that Michael's artistic capability is somewhere around that of a five year old child.

 

[Skaloop]

We have Washoe, the first non-human to learn a human language.

Well, that's debateable. I'd hardly consider an 800-word vocabulary and a lack of basic rules of grammar to amount to having learned a human language. Learned to make signs, sure. Learned to use those signs to communicate, sure. But language? No. The research done with Nim Chimpsky, as well as research into the Washoe findings and follow-ups with some personnel involved with her show that she has not even come close to approaching the level of expertise that we would consider to be competence in language.

 

[RichardT]

My University specializes in primates who communicate with sign language. We have Washoe, the first non-human to learn a human language.

I have seen these chimps personally, and they are capable of lying.

The staff was telling stories about how one of them (I forget which one) will sign "kiss" and ask for a kiss, and when you let them kiss you, it will poke you in fun. Then say "Sorry" and ask for another kiss with its finger poised to poke again.

This is an obvious use of deceit.


The interaction is very fascinating and they seem to be on par with deaf children.

lol, funny apes..

 

[joey444]

I agree. Funny apes.

 

[Dr.GH]

My University specializes in primates who communicate with sign language. We have Washoe, the first non-human to learn a human language.

I have seen these chimps personally, and they are capable of lying.

The staff was telling stories about how one of them (I forget which one) will sign "kiss" and ask for a kiss, and when you let them kiss you, it will poke you in fun. Then say "Sorry" and ask for another kiss with its finger poised to poke again.

This is an obvious use of deceit.

The interaction is very fascinating and they seem to be on par with deaf children.

Koko's gorilla "buddy" Michael also lied his hairy butt off. He particularly was prone to blame Koko for everything he did that was "bad." There is a vague echo of Genesis 3:12 isn't there?

 

[Chalnoth]

Makes me think so much of my dog, Sparky.

Once, we had sent him to a kennel for a few days while we went on a trip. Upon picking him up, the very first thing that he did when we got home was run up the stairs and poop on Mom's bed. If that's not nonverbal communication, I don't know what is

At other times, when we return home after having left him, we can usually tell if he's done something he knows we won't like, because he won't be there to greet us, but will be hiding somewhere

He also seems to thoroughly enjoy stealing tissues or other papers.

 

[XTE]

I don't care how old the earth is so I figured I might as well be a young earth creationist.

Wow, hey, I don't care about abortion so I figured I might as well be pro-choice.

I don't care about religion so I figured I might as well be agnostic.

I don't care what we are having for dinner, so I figured we might as well have peanuts.

I don't care how hot the water is, so I figured I might as well stick my hand in.

Let's all contribute a comment likes these following the logic Mark Kennedy clearly prides himself on guys. Please, if you can spare just 2 seconds, write one down, it's takes little effort and even less thinking.