Neither the Old nor New Testament address the LGBT subject

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Cuddles333

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Due to some deliberate mistranslations, for many, many, years people have been consciously and unconsciously taught to truly dislike (even hate) those who they perceive to possess the characterizations of this teaching. I am willing to debate the person who takes either the Affirmative or Negative of the Proposition.
 

Tree of Life

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Due to some deliberate mistranslations, for many, many, years people have been consciously and unconsciously taught to truly dislike (even hate) those who they perceive to possess the characterizations of this teaching. I am willing to debate the person who takes either the Affirmative or Negative of the Proposition.

I would argue that the commands of Scripture (both OT and NT) have meaning for LGBT issues. Though homosexual orientation is a 20th century concept and, thus, is alien to Scripture, the commands of Scripture still tell us how to think about what we know as "homosexuality" and "heterosexuality".

Are you willing to debate this?
 
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Cuddles333

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I would argue that the commands of Scripture (both OT and NT) have meaning for LGBT issues. Though homosexual orientation is a 20th century concept and, thus, is alien to Scripture, the commands of Scripture still tell us how to think about what we know as "homosexuality" and "heterosexuality".

Are you willing to debate this?
Yes. I am Cuddles222. Has been so long and have new electronics. Could not sign in under my old 222. Please define what you mean in your post. I find it vague and I know it has been a while
 
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Tree of Life

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Yes. I am Cuddles222. Has been so long and have new electronics. Could not sign in under my old 222. Please define what you mean in your post. I find it vague and I know it has been a while

My position would be that the data that we have in the OT and NT gives us everything that we need to make a judgment about homosexual behavior.

"Homosexuality", "heterosexuality", and "sexual orientation" are artificial, 20th century concepts. People did not think nor define themselves using these terms before the 20th century and certainly not in biblical times. So the Bible, for this reason, does not talk about sexual orientation. However, the info it does give us is adequate to make judgments about these concepts and behaviors.
 
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Cuddles333

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My position would be that the data that we have in the OT and NT gives us everything that we need to make a judgment about homosexual behavior.

"Homosexuality", "heterosexuality", and "sexual orientation" are artificial, 20th century concepts. People did not think nor define themselves using these terms before the 20th century and certainly not in biblical times. So the Bible, for this reason, does not talk about sexual orientation. However, the info it does give us is adequate to make judgments about these concepts and behaviors.
Since the scriptures teach that where there is no Law (New nor Old Testament) there therefore is no sin, and you believe that there is something in either of them that teaches there is, are you willing to sign Propositions to defend your position?
 
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Tree of Life

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Since the scriptures teach that where there is no Law (New nor Old Testament) there therefore is no sin, and you believe that there is something in either of them that teaches there is, are you willing to sign Propositions to defend your position?

The Scriptures do not teach that where there is no law there is no sin. They teach that where there is no law there is no transgression (violation of law). Still, sin reigned from Adam to Moses.

Am I willing to sign propositions defending my position? If it were important for a church position statement or for ordination then I would gladly sign my name to a confession or statement of my position on this issue.
 
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Tree of Life

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I am not sure if you have backed off of your post number 2 from last July 31st or not. If you haven't, let's do this.

Ok. Could you alert a moderator that we're going to start a formal debate on this subject?

Also to be clear - the question of the debate is: "Do the Scriptures (OT, NT, or both) address the subject of homosexuality?"

I will be answering in the affirmative and the thesis I will defend is: "Yes. While 'homosexuality' is a modern, post-biblical concept, the Scriptures give us enough data to make the judgment that homosexual behavior is immoral and homosexuality is deeply misguided."
 
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Tree of Life

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Actually, the subject of the thread is that neither the Old nor New Testament address the LGBT issue.... not just the gay (homosexuality) issue, and it is this 3-In-1 that I would defend. If you agree, I will notify the moderator.

That's fine. And your position is that the OT and NT do not address these things?
 
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Tree of Life

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It is actually MarkRohfrietsch that controls the Formal, Proposal, and Peanut Gallery. We will have to wait on him as it appears that this site has removed any other way for posters to contact them or each other anymore.
@MarkRohfrietsch
 
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MarkRohfrietsch

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1. The topic and title of the debate:
Neither the Old nor New Testament address the LGBT subject

2. Cuddles333 Will assert that neither the Old or New Testament the LGBT subject while Tree of Life will be taking the position that the Bible does address the LGBT subject.

3. The number of rounds within the debate. If each party makes three alternating posts, that would equal a debate with three rounds.

4. The posts will be made alternating with Cuddles333 making the first and Tree of Life responding.

5. Time limit between posts. You may select any length of time (within reason) as a maximum amount your opponent may take to formulate a response. If the time limit is 1 week, that means within one week of the affirmative making his/her post, the opposing position needs to reply. The post can be made earlier, of course.

6. The maximum length for each post. You can set a limit of say 1000 or even 5000 words for each post in a round. The length is the upper limit.

7. Whether or not quotes and outside references are allowed. Please note that all quotes will fall under the 20% copyright rule, but the participants may decide to disallow quotes or limit them to a certain amount of the overall word total.

8. And, finally, the start date of the debate.

These rules need to be agreed upon by both participants and approved by a moderator.

Once a debate is accepted by both parties, the proposal thread is closed and a moderator creates the debate thread in the Formal Debate forum, with a link to the proposal thread. A discussion thread is created by a moderator in the Peanut Gallery for non-debate participants to comment upon the debate. The posts in the peanut gallery discussion thread may be moderated depending on the topic.


Standard Formal Debate Rules

1. One participant will argue the affirmative side of the topic; the other will argue the negative side.

2. A moderator will open the debate thread once the proposal has been agreed two by both parties.

3. The poster who makes the first post will present his or her main arguments.

4. The responder will then reply with his or her own introductory post which presents his or her main arguments.

5. There will then be exactly three alternating follow-up and rebuttal posts from each debater, in which the debaters may address and refute points made by the other person, or bring up any additional information as needed.

6. Each debater will post one concluding post, summing up his or her side of the debate. Following the concluding posts, the thread will be closed by the moderator.

7. Debaters will determine the maximum amount of time to respond to the other members post. If they do not post in the required time limit, the debate will be declared finished, and the thread closed.

8. Debaters may not post more than five posts in total. There will be an intro post, three debate posts, and a conclusion post; however they are free to continue the discussion in the Peanut Gallery AFTER the debate has concluded.

9. Debaters may include links to any supporting information, quotes, or references in their posts as long as those external sources stay within the 20% copyright rule.

10. Individual posts may not exceed a predetermined maximum word count, including any quotes or supporting material.

11. Debaters may not post in the peanut gallery discussion thread until after the conclusion of the debate.

Fill in any stipulations that have not been specified, agree on them and I will set this up.

Thanks,

Mark
CF Admin
 
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