"Negative" theology

[PuerAzaelis]

If the soul is to see God, it must look at nothing in time; for while the soul is occupied with time or place or any image of the kind, it cannot recognize God. If it is to know Him, it must have no fellowship with nothingness. Only he knows God who recognizes that all creatures are nothingness. For, if one creature be set over against another, it may appear to be beautiful and somewhat, but if it be set over against God, it is nothing. I say moreover: If the soul is to know God it must forget itself and lose itself, for as long as it contemplates self, it cannot contemplate God. When it has lost itself and everything in God, it finds itself again in God when it attains to the knowledge of Him, and it finds also everything which it had abandoned complete in God. If I am to know the highest good, and the everlasting Godhead, truly, I must know them as they are in themselves apart from creation. If I am to know real existence, I must know it as it is in itself, not as it is parceled out in creatures.

http://krishnamurti.abundanthope.org/index_htm_files/Meister-Eckharts-Sermons.pdf

NEGATIVE THEOLOGY

Definition

That approach to Christian thought which rises by way of negation to the infinite and nameless One who is beyond all finite comprehension. It is the favorite approach of those who favor a mystical experience of God in preference to a rational proof of his existence and understanding of his attributes. Meister Eckhart (1260-1327), a writer in mystical theology, is the best known extremist in negative theology, claiming, for example, that all creatures are an absolute nothing: "I do not say that they are a small thing or that they are nothing but that they are an absolute nothing" (Denzinger, 976). Eckhart was condemned by Pope John XXII in 1329. There is, however, a legitimate use of negative theology to sharpen a believer's sense of God's incomprehensibility. Negative theology is sometimes distinguished from positive theology, but the latter refers rather to a branch of dogmatic theology.

Dictionary : NEGATIVE THEOLOGY

Is there any room for this kind of mystical "negative" theology in our faith? Or should it be avoided?

 

[GOD Shines Forth!]

There is, however, a legitimate use of negative theology to sharpen a believer's sense of God's incomprehensibility.

I thought your quote from the Catholic Dictionary said it well. There is truth in many philosophies, but not THE Truth. For that Scripture holds the secrets, freely shared by God there.

 

[pdudgeon]

If the soul is to see God, it must look at nothing in time; for while the soul is occupied with time or place or any image of the kind, it cannot recognize God. If it is to know Him, it must have no fellowship with nothingness. Only he knows God who recognizes that all creatures are nothingness. For, if one creature be set over against another, it may appear to be beautiful and somewhat, but if it be set over against God, it is nothing. I say moreover: If the soul is to know God it must forget itself and lose itself, for as long as it contemplates self, it cannot contemplate God. When it has lost itself and everything in God, it finds itself again in God when it attains to the knowledge of Him, and it finds also everything which it had abandoned complete in God. If I am to know the highest good, and the everlasting Godhead, truly, I must know them as they are in themselves apart from creation. If I am to know real existence, I must know it as it is in itself, not as it is parceled out in creatures.

http://krishnamurti.abundanthope.org/index_htm_files/Meister-Eckharts-Sermons.pdf

NEGATIVE THEOLOGY

Definition

That approach to Christian thought which rises by way of negation to the infinite and nameless One who is beyond all finite comprehension. It is the favorite approach of those who favor a mystical experience of God in preference to a rational proof of his existence and understanding of his attributes. Meister Eckhart (1260-1327), a writer in mystical theology, is the best known extremist in negative theology, claiming, for example, that all creatures are an absolute nothing: "I do not say that they are a small thing or that they are nothing but that they are an absolute nothing" (Denzinger, 976). Eckhart was condemned by Pope John XXII in 1329. There is, however, a legitimate use of negative theology to sharpen a believer's sense of God's incomprehensibility. Negative theology is sometimes distinguished from positive theology, but the latter refers rather to a branch of dogmatic theology.

Dictionary : NEGATIVE THEOLOGY

Is there any room for this kind of mystical "negative" theology in our faith? Or should it be avoided?

My vote goes for avoidance of the negative theology in regards to God, for the simple reason that the Book of Genesis, (the first Book of the Bible) begins with the positive theology of Creation, and ends with the positive recreation of both Heaven and Earth, and the destruction of sin and death.

 

[zippy2006]

Is there any room for this kind of mystical "negative" theology in our faith? Or should it be avoided?

Without negative theology man confuses himself for God. Negative theology is founded on the idea that God transcends us. It is essential to Christianity.

42 God transcends all creatures. We must therefore continually purify our language of everything in it that is limited, image-bound or imperfect, if we are not to confuse our image of God--"the inexpressible, the incomprehensible, the invisible, the ungraspable"--with our human representations. Our human words always fall short of the mystery of God.

43 Admittedly, in speaking about God like this, our language is using human modes of expression; nevertheless it really does attain to God himself, though unable to express him in his infinite simplicity. Likewise, we must recall that "between Creator and creature no similitude can be expressed without implying an even greater dissimilitude"; and that "concerning God, we cannot grasp what he is, but only what he is not, and how other beings stand in relation to him."

(Catechism of the Catholic Church)​

 

[RaymondG]

If the soul is to see God, it must look at nothing in time; for while the soul is occupied with time or place or any image of the kind, it cannot recognize God. If it is to know Him, it must have no fellowship with nothingness. Only he knows God who recognizes that all creatures are nothingness. For, if one creature be set over against another, it may appear to be beautiful and somewhat, but if it be set over against God, it is nothing. I say moreover: If the soul is to know God it must forget itself and lose itself, for as long as it contemplates self, it cannot contemplate God. When it has lost itself and everything in God, it finds itself again in God when it attains to the knowledge of Him, and it finds also everything which it had abandoned complete in God. If I am to know the highest good, and the everlasting Godhead, truly, I must know them as they are in themselves apart from creation. If I am to know real existence, I must know it as it is in itself, not as it is parceled out in creatures.

http://krishnamurti.abundanthope.org/index_htm_files/Meister-Eckharts-Sermons.pdf

NEGATIVE THEOLOGY

Definition

That approach to Christian thought which rises by way of negation to the infinite and nameless One who is beyond all finite comprehension. It is the favorite approach of those who favor a mystical experience of God in preference to a rational proof of his existence and understanding of his attributes. Meister Eckhart (1260-1327), a writer in mystical theology, is the best known extremist in negative theology, claiming, for example, that all creatures are an absolute nothing: "I do not say that they are a small thing or that they are nothing but that they are an absolute nothing" (Denzinger, 976). Eckhart was condemned by Pope John XXII in 1329. There is, however, a legitimate use of negative theology to sharpen a believer's sense of God's incomprehensibility. Negative theology is sometimes distinguished from positive theology, but the latter refers rather to a branch of dogmatic theology.

Dictionary : NEGATIVE THEOLOGY

Is there any room for this kind of mystical "negative" theology in our faith? Or should it be avoided?

Seems similar to denying oneself, picking up your cross, and following Him.....who is unseen.

 

[The Liturgist]

In general, I think Apophatic Theology (we should not call it Negative Theology, because this carries the wrong impression), is the only way of reasoning about God outside of the explicit revelations received by the Church, primarily through Scripture. Cataphatic theology, the via positiva, only works in my opinion, with what God has revealed, but we can reason from these revelations deductively. I do not believe in the Scholastic concepts of created grace or absolute divine simplicity; I believe grace is uncreated, and God is comprehensible only in His energies, and not His essence (basically, the theology of Gregory of Palamas, who was almost unknown in the West until recently).

 

[The Liturgist]

If the soul is to see God, it must look at nothing in time; for while the soul is occupied with time or place or any image of the kind, it cannot recognize God. If it is to know Him, it must have no fellowship with nothingness. Only he knows God who recognizes that all creatures are nothingness. For, if one creature be set over against another, it may appear to be beautiful and somewhat, but if it be set over against God, it is nothing. I say moreover: If the soul is to know God it must forget itself and lose itself, for as long as it contemplates self, it cannot contemplate God. When it has lost itself and everything in God, it finds itself again in God when it attains to the knowledge of Him, and it finds also everything which it had abandoned complete in God. If I am to know the highest good, and the everlasting Godhead, truly, I must know them as they are in themselves apart from creation. If I am to know real existence, I must know it as it is in itself, not as it is parceled out in creatures.

http://krishnamurti.abundanthope.org/index_htm_files/Meister-Eckharts-Sermons.pdf

NEGATIVE THEOLOGY

Definition

That approach to Christian thought which rises by way of negation to the infinite and nameless One who is beyond all finite comprehension. It is the favorite approach of those who favor a mystical experience of God in preference to a rational proof of his existence and understanding of his attributes. Meister Eckhart (1260-1327), a writer in mystical theology, is the best known extremist in negative theology, claiming, for example, that all creatures are an absolute nothing: "I do not say that they are a small thing or that they are nothing but that they are an absolute nothing" (Denzinger, 976). Eckhart was condemned by Pope John XXII in 1329. There is, however, a legitimate use of negative theology to sharpen a believer's sense of God's incomprehensibility. Negative theology is sometimes distinguished from positive theology, but the latter refers rather to a branch of dogmatic theology.

Dictionary : NEGATIVE THEOLOGY

Is there any room for this kind of mystical "negative" theology in our faith? Or should it be avoided?

It is the main approach in the Sui Juris Eastern Catholic churches in communion with Rome. In the Roman Rite it is less popular due to a perceived incompatibility with Thomism, but this is not neccessarily the case; the via negativa of theologians like Basil the Great and psuedo-Dionysius the Aereopagite was well known to Thomas Aquinas, and the work of Aquinas actually parallels that of Gregory Palamas on several key points.

By the way @PuerAzaelis , I can link you to Christian websites, primarily Eastern Orthodox and Eastern Catholic (the Byzantine Rite Catholic churches in communion with Rome and the Pope, like the Ruthenian Greek Catholic Church and the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church, as well as other Eastern rites in the Roman catholic communion, like the Chaldean, Maronite and Coptic Catholics), which explain the “via negativa” or apophatic theology. I am not familiar with the works of Meister Eckhart, but I myself try to avoid websites that are apparently Hindu like krishnamurti.com, when studying the Christian religion.

 

[Chesterton]

My vote goes for avoidance of the negative theology in regards to God, for the simple reason that the Book of Genesis, (the first Book of the Bible) begins with the positive theology of Creation, and ends with the positive recreation of both Heaven and Earth, and the destruction of sin and death.

In the context of it's pagan time and place, Genesis does involve negative theology. For example, where people were worshipping the sun or trees, Genesis says "God is not the sun or trees, but is the creator of them". That is apophatic.

 

[Pavel Mosko]

NEGATIVE THEOLOGY

Not exactly on the OP, but on the general topic, a Facebook friend posted a funny meme with a point. (ugh this one has been hard to grab)

View attachment 267871

 

[Pavel Mosko]