Need some clarity on Mid-Acts Dispensationalism

now faith

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Evvidently, you did not read where I said:

"Provided it's God's will, and provided we have the faith of God, we could raise the dead."




So you don't believe what the bible says in other words.



Technically, your wrong again. Ever heard of a person in scripture named "Lazarus"?

Wasn't he the first to come back from the dead?

And technically, who was it that caused Jesus to arise from the dead?

Hint: read Rom. 6:4.



Again, you don't believe the words of Jesus Himself?

And once again, from the Greek we get "have the faith of God".



Didn't Peter heal the sick? (cf. Acts 5:15)

Didn't Paul raise the dead? (cf. Acts 20:7-12)

There is a big difference in what I have said verse what Copeland, Hinn, Meyer, Olsteen have said.

I quote scripture, as shown above.

Copeland preaches:

"He allowed the devil to drag Him into the depths of hell as if He were the most wicked sinner who ever lived ... Every demon in hell came down on Him to annihilate Him ... [They] tortured Him beyond anything that anybody has ever conceived ... In a thunder of spiritual force, the voice of God spoke to the death-whipped, broken, punished spirit of Jesus ... [in] the pit of destruction, and charged the spirit of Jesus with resurrection power! Suddenly His twisted, death-wracked spirit began to fill out and come back to life ... He was literally being reborn before the devil's very eyes. He began to flex His spiritual muscles ... Jesus Christ dragged Satan up and down the halls of hell ... Jesus ... was raised up a born-again man ... The day I realized that a born-again man had defeated Satan, hell, and death, I got so excited ... !"

"The Price of it All," Believer’s Voice of Victory, September 1991, p. 4

Can you show me any of that in scripture?

Everything I have said can be shown in scripture.

God Bless

Till all are one.

Amen I have always disagreed with the Jesus in Hell teaching.
1 The Bible doesent say such a thing.
2 this is the only account given of Christ time below:

1 Peter: 3. 18. For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit: 19. By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison; 20. Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water. 21. The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ: 22. Who is gone into heaven, and is on the right hand of God; angels and authorities and powers being made subject unto him.
The man made reasoning that Christ was tormented in Hell,is wrong.
CHRIST was the sacrifice for mankind,but himself knew no sin.

Luke: 23. 45. And the sun was darkened, and the veil of the temple was rent in the midst. 46. And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost.
 
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now faith

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Today Christians are powerless against the devil so they rejoice over being beaten.
Their witness gone ,because these are the days of those who have a form of godliness but Denied the power thereof.
Many have fallen into a state of apostasy and follow after the creature more than the creator
.


Note my spell check has a mind of its own!
 
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now faith

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One Profound statement I heard from a mid Acts dispensationist ,was that the new Testament was completed by Paul with 2nd Timothy being the last book.
This was the dispensation of the Church age that did not start until Paul was sent.
All the rest of God's Word was for the Jews,so the book of James does not apply for us and revelation ,only the Pauline Epistles were the Gentiles Bible.
We used this verse in Peter to show Paul was commissioned as a Apostle2 weeks ago.

2 Peter: 3. 15. And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; 16. As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction. 17. Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness. 18. But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.

Now I find myself showing that paul preached to both Jew and Gentile.
If Peter only taught to Jews why is he giving Paul credit in verse 15?
 
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DeaconDean

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Today Christians are powerless against the devil so they rejoice over being beaten.
Their witness gone ,because these are the days of those who have a form of godliness but Denied the power thereof.
Many have fallen into a state of apostasy and follow after the creature more than the creator
.


Note my spell check has a mind of its own!


How true.

A good example is what happened in this thread. Its a sad state when even "Christians" tell you that following scripture means your making yourself equal to God.

Sad that scripture says you can, "Christians" say you can't.

God Bless

Till all are one.
 
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DeaconDean

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One Profound statement I heard from a mid Acts dispensationist ,was that the new Testament was completed by Paul with 2nd Timothy being the last book.
This was the dispensation of the Church age that did not start until Paul was sent.
All the rest of God's Word was for the Jews,so the book of James does not apply for us and revelation ,only the Pauline Epistles were the Gentiles Bible.
We used this verse in Peter to show Paul was commissioned as a Apostle2 weeks ago.

2 Peter: 3. 15. And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; 16. As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction. 17. Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness. 18. But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.

Now I find myself showing that paul preached to both Jew and Gentile.
If Peter only taught to Jews why is he giving Paul credit in verse 15?

The only reference that even remotely suggests a Mid-Trib dispensation is Mt. 24:29.

This was the dispensation of the Church age that did not start until Paul was sent.

Well, who started the Church at Jerusalem if it wasn't Paul?

And the content of Acts 15 makes it clear also that by this time, at least a mixed congregation of both Jews and Gentiles was in existence.

You must also know that Paul went deep in most of what he taught. Which is reflected in "in which some things hard to be understood".

Also, did not Peter preach to Cornelius, a Gentile in Acts 10?

What did Peter do, rather was guilty of in Gal. 2?

God Bless

Till all are one.
 
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now faith

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How true.

A good example is what happened in this thread. Its a sad state when even "Christians" tell you that following scripture means your making yourself equal to God.

Sad that scripture says you can, "Christians" say you can't.

God Bless

Till all are one.

I suppose it is a humble teaching of I'm just a worthless sinner.
Never mind our adoption in Christ as Sons of God.
Through Christ we have all things ,we are filled with the Spirit of God.
How else would we be transformed and our minds renewed?

I do my best to accept God's Word,not to twist or use out of context but simply believe what it says.
We should never place exclusions on it or add to it or make it of private interptation by our supposed revelations.
We may as well be Mormons if we remove the Gospel.
 
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now faith

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The only reference that even remotely suggests a Mid-Trib dispensation is Mt. 24:29.



Well, who started the Church at Jerusalem if it wasn't Paul?

And the content of Acts 15 makes it clear also that by this time, at least a mixed congregation of both Jews and Gentiles was in existence.

You must also know that Paul went deep in most of what he taught. Which is reflected in "in which some things hard to be understood".

Also, did not Peter preach to Cornelius, a Gentile in Acts 10?

What did Peter do, rather was guilty of in Gal. 2?

God Bless

Till all are one.
-
-Amen this other movement is messed up,taking books and tossing them out because they were for Jews only.
They deny James is for us.
But I have peace about it,my family member will just have to go around the mountain one more time.
 
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DeaconDean

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-Amen this other movement is messed up,taking books and tossing them out because they were for Jews only.
They deny James is for us.
But I have peace about it,my family member will just have to go around the mountain one more time.


Sure you ain't a "closet" Baptist? :p

God Bless

Till all are one.
 
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Even Dispensationalism does not teach mid Acts was the beginning of the Church age or beginning of Grace.
The logical point is that it was finished when Christ sprinkled his blood on the mercy seat for us.
And nothing changes until he returns ,then a new dispensation will occur
 
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now faith

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Sure you ain't a "closet" Baptist? :p

God Bless

Till all are one.

I'm still in fellowship with the Baptist,being the son of a Baptist Preacher you never forget the foundation of truth in the Word of God.
Undoubtedly though I have been around as many Baptist out of context as Charismatics or Pentecostals.
 
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DeaconDean

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Even Dispensationalism does not teach mid Acts was the beginning of the Church age or beginning of Grace.
The logical point is that it was finished when Christ sprinkled his blood on the mercy seat for us.
And nothing changes until he returns ,then a new dispensation will occur

To me, and remember, I do hold to most Dispensational teachings, this "Dispensation of Grace" started the exact second Jesus said "Father, it is finished" and gave up the ghost".

God Bless

Till all are one.
 
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DeaconDean

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I must say you and Oz impressed me a lot in the other thread.
You call it like it is and are not parroting someone else's teaching I respect that very much.

Thank you.

Its funny that you mention Oz. Its very rare that we (he and I) agree. I will say this, however he is sincere in his convictions and beliefs. As am I. Where he and I divide is in our theology. We appear to be about as opposite as north and south are.

The reason why I go to such lengths is because I was taught in seminary classes that I need to study. That is why I go to such lengths. I read, I read commentaries, I study in the Greek, I cross reference.

Reason being, I was taught in seminary classes that when I preach, or teach, I have to be sure that what I say is what the scriptures say. If I preach or teach wrong, then what are the chances that somebody picks up what I taught and teaches that to another, and so-on, and so-on.

My incorrect teaching/preaching could be spread to 1,000,000 people. One day not only will I have to stand and answer for what I taught/preached, but I'll have to answer for perhaps one million wrongly taught.

I have to admit, I tell it like it is, and I also admit that not everybody may not like it. But in the end, I'd rather be right in God's eyes and word than right in the sight of man.

I also count on you to keep me in your prayers.

In the end, you either believe the scriptures or you don't. You cannot choose which ones to follow and which ones you can "throw" out.

I've always said that I was born, at least according to Baptist beliefs, out of time.

I'm an "olde tyme Baptist".

God Bless

Till all are one.
 
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DeaconDean

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Here is a brief look at Mid-Acts Dispensationalism:

"Mid-Acts dispensational theology is a unique form of the evangelical Christian faith also known as “The Grace Message.” It garners this title because of its emphasis on the gospel of the grace of God (Acts 20:24) and the dispensation of the grace of God (Eph.3:2). This theology, also described in Scripture as “the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery” (Rom.16:25-27), is distinctively Pauline in character but congruent with historically recognized Christian orthodoxy. At its foundation is the theonthropic character and vicarious sacrifice of the Lord Jesus Christ (Jn.1:1-18; Phil.2:5-11; I Cor.3:11 cf. Chalcedonian Creed). Grace theology is also consistent with the “5 Solas” of the Protestant Reformation as proclaimed by spiritual giants like Luther, Calvin, Knox, and Zwingli. In addition, the historic fundamentals of the Christian faith, as championed by R.A.Torrey and his contemporaries in the midst of the modernist/fundamentalist controversy of the early 20th century, are integral tenets of mid-Acts dispensational theology.

Grace theology hinges upon a literal-historical-grammatical interpretation of the Bible. This does not mean that there is not figurative or allegorical language in the Word of God but that Scripture is to be read and subsequently interpreted in a normal fashion much like any other piece of literature. Among dispensationalists, this approach to Scripture has been expanded, developed, and described by some as “rightly dividing the word of truth” (II Tim.2:15). To “rightly divide” (Gr. Orthotomeo) means to straightly cut and therefore make distinctions by understanding Scripture within its proper dispensational context. The thrust of this dispensational hermeneutic is encapsulated in the old adage, “While all of Scripture is written for us, it is not all written to us or about us, God’s Word must be rightly divided.” This approach to properly handling Holy Scripture is demonstrated by none other than the Lord Jesus Christ Himself in the synagogue at Nazareth (Luke 4:14-21; Isaiah 61:1-3).

Apparent Biblical contradictions are often the result of either a lack of comprehension of the immediate context or a failure to “rightly divide.” These perceptions drive the faithful student of Scripture to trust God the Holy Spirit for further understanding (I Cor.2:10-16; Eph.1:18). Biblical enigmas should not foster a sense of skepticism about the integrity of Scripture but rather a greater need to trust God for spiritual illumination. The authenticity of Scripture is not an issue for the believer in Christ because their fundamental presupposition is that the Bible is a reliable historical document that is also the verbally inspired Word of God. The objective standard of Scripture is therefore the first and final authority for all matters of faith and practice, orthodoxy and orthopraxy, belief and behavior, what Christians should believe and how Christians should live.

This foundational background contributes to understanding where mid-Acts dispensational theology fits within the overall framework of the evangelical Christian faith as well as comprehending its distinctions. The essentials of grace theology include the historical beginning of the Church, the body of Christ, in the mid-Acts period subsequent to Pentecost but prior to the writing of the Apostle Paul’s first epistle, the one Holy Spirit baptism whereby the believer in Christ is identified or placed into the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ at the moment of salvation, the temporary postponement and setting aside of God’s prophetic plan and purpose for Israel until after the pretribulational rapture of the Church, Jew and Gentile salvation apart from the instrumentality of Israel but freely received by the grace of God through faith alone in the risen Lord Jesus Christ and His finished work of redemption on behalf of lost sinners at the cross of Calvary."

Source

Mid-Acts Dispensationalism is also known by the term "Hyperdispensationalism".

"They specifically view the teachings of the Apostle Paul both as unique from earlier apostles and as foundational for the church (thus "Pauline Dispensationalism" but not of the Acts 2 variety). Paul's status is a result of having been commissioned as "the apostle to the Gentiles" and then personally taught by the risen and glorified Lord of Heaven (as opposed to Jesus in his humility). This perspective is sometimes characterized by proponents as the "Pauline Distinctive."

Classical dispensationalists such as Scofield identify Pentecost, in the second chapter of Acts, with the start of the Church (a new people of God) distinct from Israel as the historical chosen nation of God; mainstream dispensationalism may be referred to as the "Acts 2" position. Grace Movement Dispensationalists believe that the church started after Acts 2, emphasizing the beginning of the ministry of Paul in starting the church. They also deny the church as being an object of prophecy unlike Israel. Israel is seen as having an earthly destiny culminating in the millennial kingdom while the Church has a destiny to rule in the heavenly places. Thus it is important in their theology to make sharp distinctions between two programs: 1. the prophetic/earthly kingdom program (with its kingdom gospel) and 2. the Grace/"Mystery"(unprophesied)/heavenly church program (with its Grace gospel). This interpretive grid of "rightly-dividing the Word of God" allows them to explain and either harmonize or contrast any apparent contradictions in Scripture in defense of the inerrancy of scripture. Their dispensational schemes vary from 3 to 8 dispensations with most using Scofield's scheme adapted to the Mid-Acts start of the church. Typically a transition is shown from the last Jewish Mosaic/Law dispensation which begins fading away at mid-Acts while the present dispensation of Grace then starts and grows into place fully by the end of the book of Acts. This is in contradistinction to the Acts 28 position which rather has a Jewish church body lasting until the end of the book of Acts (Sir Robert Anderson went so far as to identify a separate dispensation during Acts). Hyper-dispensationalism exists in different intensities although all dispensational ideas trace back further to John Nelson Darby (1800–1882). J.C. O'Hair independently arrived at the Mid-Acts position after rejecting the Acts 2 position early on and then rejecting the Acts 28 position later. He was a Fundamentalist who based his Pauline dispensationalism on the teachings of the early American Classic Pauline Dispensationalists even though he reached conclusions which were more thoroughly consistent than his Acts 2 brethren.

Opponents of hyper-dispensationalism would be Traditional Dispensationalists like John Walvoord and Charles Ryrie, Classic Acts 2 Pauline Dispensationalists, and Ultra-dispensationalists (Acts 28 position).

Hyper-dispensationalism holds that the early Christian Church lost “four basic truths” starting near the end of the Apostle Paul’s ministry. The four truths are (in order of loss):

  • The Distinctive Message and Ministry of the Apostle Paul
  • The Pre-Tribulational Rapture of the Church, the Body of Christ
  • The Difference between Israel and the Church, the Body of Christ
  • Justification by Faith Alone, in Christ Alone.
The truths, advocates say, were gradually recovered in reverse order starting during the Protestant Reformation; for example, Martin Luther is credited with recovery of "justification by faith" and John Nelson Darby with "Church Truth."

Hyper-dispensationalists reject water baptism, (along with Charismatic gifts, Prophets, and Apostles) which divides them from mainstream dispensationalists who are often Baptists, like W. A. Criswell, or in earlier times Presbyterians like James H. Brookes. So instead of various water baptisms, they believe in the ONE baptism made WITHOUT hands and without water by the Spirit which occurs when one believes in Christ as their Savior whereby one is identified with Christ's death, burial, and resurrection: Romans 6:3-4; 1 Corinthians 12:12-13; 2 Corinthians 1:21-22; 2 Corinthians 5:5; Galatians 3:27; Ephesians 1:12-14; Ephesians 4:5; Ephesians 4:30; Colossians 2:11-12; Hebrews 9:8-10. While hyper-dispensationalists reject water baptism like Ultra-dispensationalists, they still practice the Lord's Supper as a memorial and not as an ordinance. (Ultra-dispensationalists also reject the Lord's Supper and water baptism.)

Source

Clear as mud now? :D

God Bless

Till all are one.
 
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DeaconDean

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Here is a good answer:

Premise:

"According to mid-Acts dispensationalism or the Grace Movement, the apostles Peter, James, John, and the rest were still operating under the Old Covenant in Acts 1—8. They were still dutifully keeping the Law and still meeting as a Jewish body in Jerusalem. Peter and the other apostles preached repentance to Israel, but there was no church until Paul. It was Paul, the “apostle to the Gentiles” (Romans 11:13), to whom the doctrine of the church—and the doctrine of grace—was revealed. It was only after Paul began to minister that the church actually began. Thus, the only parts of the New Testament that are applicable to believers today are the Pauline Epistles. The rest of the Bible was written for Israel."

Source

Problem:

"There are some other problems with mid-Acts dispensationalism. In particular, its views on salvation, water baptism, and the church’s origin are based on misunderstandings of some points of Scripture. Here are some of the difficulties inherent in the teaching that the church began with Paul:

To Paul were revealed the details of the church, which had been a “mystery” in the Old Testament (Colossians 1:25–27). Mid-Acts dispensationalism wrongly assumes that Paul’s revelation about the church equals the beginning of the church itself.

Mid-Acts dispensationalism misinterprets Galatians 2:7, “I [Paul] had been entrusted with the task of preaching the gospel to the uncircumcised, just as Peter had been to the circumcised.” The mid-Acts dispensationalist makes a distinction between a “gospel of circumcision,” taught by Peter, and a “gospel of uncircumcision,” taught by Paul. In reality, Paul is referring to different audiences, not different gospels. The Jews whom Peter ministered to were saved by grace through faith, just as the Gentiles to whom Paul ministered.

Mid-Acts dispensationalism or the Grace Movement denies the need for water baptism for believers, thus ignoring Jesus’ command in Matthew 28:19. They exclude water baptism on the basis that the baptism of the Spirit, which occurs at salvation, has replaced water baptism.

Mid-Acts dispensationalism overlooks the fact that Gentiles were part of the early church before Paul was converted. Acts 2:10–11 makes it clear that the crowd listening to Peter preach on the Day of Pentecost included Gentile proselytes to Judaism. And Acts 8 shows how Samaritans and an Ethiopian were baptized into Christ before Paul ever started preaching the doctrine of the church or of grace. Thus there was a joint church body of Jews and Gentiles before Paul began his ministry.

Most importantly, mid-Acts dispensationalism or the Grace Movement claims there are “different gospels,” one taught by Peter and one taught by Paul. This completely opposes biblical teaching (Galatians 1:6–7) and leads to the idea of a works-based salvation. The Old Testament (and the first part of the New Testament) does not teach salvation by works; the Jews in Galilee were not saved a different way from the Gentiles in Achaia.

Mid-Acts dispensationalism is opposed to several elements of orthodoxy. Its downplaying of half of the New Testament, its unwarranted exclusion of early Jewish believers from the body of Christ, its disregard of water baptism, and its allowance for a faith-plus-works gospel make the Grace Movement an unbiblical view.
"
Source

God Bless

Till all are one.
 
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DeaconDean

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I would say I'm a "Classic Dispensationalist" with the exception that I don't agree in a separation of Jew and Gentile.

"Dispensationalism has two primary distinctives: 1) a consistently literal interpretation of Scripture, especially Bible prophecy, and 2) a view of the uniqueness of Israel as separate from the church in God’s program."

Source

Of this:

"Dispensationalists understand the Bible to be organized into seven dispensations: Innocence (Genesis 1:1—3:7), Conscience (Genesis 3:8—8:22), Human Government (Genesis 9:1—11:32), Promise (Genesis 12:1Exodus 19:25), Law (Exodus 20:1Acts 2:4), Grace (Acts 2:4Revelation 20:3), and the Millennial Kingdom (Revelation 20:4–6). Again, these dispensations are not paths to salvation, but manners in which God relates to man. Each dispensation includes a recognizable pattern of how God worked with people living in the dispensation. That pattern is 1) a responsibility, 2) a failure, 3) a judgment, and 4) grace to move on."

Ibid

I do agree on.

God Bless

Till all are one.
 
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DeaconDean

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Standing opposite of Dispensationalism is Covenantalism (Covenant Theology).

It "is a conceptual overview and interpretive framework for understanding the overall flow of the Bible. It uses the theological concept of a covenant as an organizing principle for Christian theology. The standard form of covenant theology views the history of God's dealings with mankind, from Creation to Fall to Redemption to Consummation, under the framework of three overarching theological covenants: of redemption, works, and grace.

These three covenants are called theological because, though not explicitly presented as such in the Bible, they are thought of as theologically implicit, describing and summarizing the wealth of Scriptural data. Historical Reformed systems of thought treat covenant theology not merely as a point of doctrine or as a central dogma, but as the structure by which the biblical text organizes itself.

As a framework for biblical interpretation, covenant theology stands in contrast to dispensationalism in regard to the relationship between the Old Covenant (with national Israel) and the New Covenant (with the house of Israel (Jeremiah 31:31) in Christ's blood). That such a framework exists appears at least feasible, since from New Testament times the Bible of Israel has been known as the Old Testament (i.e., Covenant; see 2 Cor 3:14 [NRSV], "they [Jews] hear the reading of the old covenant"), in contrast to the Christian addition which has become known as the New Testament (or Covenant). Detractors of covenant theology often refer to it as "supersessionism" or as "replacement theology", due to the perception that it teaches that God has abandoned the promises made to the Jews and has replaced the Jews with Christians as his chosen people on the earth. Covenant theologians deny that God has abandoned his promises to Israel, but see the fulfillment of the promises to Israel in the person and the work of the Messiah, Jesus of Nazareth, who established the church in organic continuity with Israel, not as a separate replacement entity. Many covenant theologians have also seen a distinct future promise of gracious restoration for unregenerate Israel."

Source

Covenant theology generally agree on 7 "covenants":

"1. Adamic Covenant. Found in Genesis 1:26-30 and 2:16-17, this covenant is general in nature. It included the command not to eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, pronounced a curse for sin, and spoke of a future provision for man's redemption (Genesis 3:15).

2. Noahic Covenant. This general covenant was made between God and Noah following the departure of Noah, his family, and the animals from the ark. Found in Genesis 9:11, "I establish my covenant with you, that never again shall all flesh be cut off by the waters of the flood, and never again shall there be a flood to destroy the earth." This covenant included a sign of God's faithfulness to keep it—the rainbow.

3. Abrahamic Covenant. This unconditional covenant, first made to Abraham in Genesis 12:1-3, promised God's blessing upon Abraham, to make his name great and to make his progeny into a great nation. The covenant also promised blessing to those who blessed Abraham and cursing to those who cursed him. Further, God vowed to bless the entire world through Abraham's seed. Circumcision was the sign that Abraham believed the covenant (Romans 4:11). The fulfillment of this covenant is seen in the history of Abraham's descendants and in the creation of the nation of Israel. The worldwide blessing came through Jesus Christ, who was of Abraham's family line.

4. Palestinian Covenant. This unconditional covenant, found in Deuteronomy 30:1-10, noted God's promise to scatter Israel if they disobeyed God, then to restore them at a later time to their land. This covenant has been fulfilled twice, with the Babylonian Captivity and subsequent rebuilding of Jerusalem under Cyrus the Great; and with the destruction of Jerusalem in A.D. 70, followed by the reinstatement of the nation of Israel in 1948.

5. Mosaic Covenant. This conditional covenant, found in Deuteronomy 11 and elsewhere, promised the Israelites a blessing for obedience and a curse for disobedience. Much of the Old Testament chronicles the fulfillment of this cycle of judgment for sin and later blessing when God's people repented and returned to God.

6. Davidic Covenant. This unconditional covenant, found in 2 Samuel 7:8-16, promised to bless David's family line and assured an everlasting kingdom. Jesus is from the family line of David (Luke 1:32-33) and, as the Son of David (Mark 10:47), is the fulfillment of this covenant.

7. New Covenant. This covenant, found in Jeremiah 31:31-34, promised that God would forgive sin and have a close, unbroken relationship with His people. The promise was first made to Israel and then extended to everyone who comes to Jesus Christ in faith (Matthew 26:28; Hebrews 9:15)."

Source

Well, I said enough for tonight.

God Bless

Till all are one.
 
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DeaconDean

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Well, what is the difference between Coventantual Theology and Dispensational theology?

The biggest difference that I see is how each side views the "covenants" of the scriptures.

Dispensationalism views each "age", "era", or "dispensation" as being marked by the covenants and how man was treated. For example: take the Adamic Covenant; after sinning, God states man would earn his bread by the sweat of his brow. (Gen. 3:19) And that lasted until Noah. Noah still earned his bread by the sweat of his brow. But another "covenant" was made after the flood in which God said He would never again curse the earth for mans sake. The proof was in the rainbow, which to this day, still happens. The first "covenant" did not cease, even after the flood man still earned his bread by the sweat of his brow, but how God dealt with man was different. In all the subsequent "covenants" none made the previous one "null and void", only how God dealt with man.

Covenantentual theology sees the "covenants" generally as three views, a "covenant of redemption", a "covenant of works" and a "covenant of grace".

As a general rule, both sides claim a literal interpretation of the Bible. Where they differ is in the "eschatological" (apocryphal literature) view. Dispensationalists take a literal view, while Covententual generally takes a "symbolic" viewpoint.

Dispensaionalists generally separate Jews and the Gentiles, while Covenant theology sees the Gentiles as being "ingrafted". (Note: here I personally disagree with Dispensationalism)

Both Dispensationalism and Covenant theology do agree to a certain extent that since the Jews refused Jesus and the Gospel message, that has been taken from them and offered to the Gentiles.

I did read an article that points out a strong weak point (in my opinion) of an apocalyptic view held by some (again not all, but some) Covenant theologians:

"Zechariah 12 describes the final battle when the armies of the earth converge on Jerusalem to destroy it. Many Jews will be there, and God will fight for His people. Here is what will happen to Israel at this point according to Zechariah 12:10, “I will pour out on the house of David and on the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the Spirit of grace and of supplication, so that they will look on Me whom they have pierced; and they will mourn for Him, as one mourns for an only son, and they will weep bitterly over Him like the bitter weeping over a firstborn.” Finally, the house of David, Israel, will recognize Christ as the Messiah Who did come and Who is now setting up the kingdom on earth that they have desired for so long. These will have endured the tribulation period, according to dispensationalism, and they will repent as Christ then comes and sets up a millennial kingdom on earth. Covenant theology rejects this interpretation along with the idea of a millennial kingdom (c.f. Ezekiel 40-48), tribulation period, and so on. In their view, when Christ returns, He returns. The rest is all symbolic, a strange conclusion to draw for those who intend to take the Bible literally."

I do believe both have strong arguments and good valid points. I just agree that Dispensationalists have a better view of the timeline of the bible (i.e."dispensations), and a better viewpoint on eschatology.

God Bless

Till all are one.
 
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Thank you,Deacon that was a very concise teaching.
A lot of time was devoted to this,and all Christians need to pay attention to the effects of each theology.
My personal view is God's Word is alive ,it is beyond hermeneutics and text book study.
I can understand Dispensationalism in a logical manner ,with historic time lines to validate the dispensation.
I strongly disagree with the Church being based on the Pauline Epistles only,with another gospel for the Jews.
Gentile were grafted in before Abraham, this was prophesied by Noah.
A study on the generations of the sons of Noah shows this clearly.
Gentile believers were among the Hebrew people of the Old Testament.
We have to look at events up to Jacob / Israel to grasp there were people in God's Grace before Israel.
Abraham was from Chaldean tribes ,originating from Mesopotamia.
Later on we find the Chaledeans being extreme warriors who took over Babylon prior to Babylon defeating Israel and taking the Spoils.

My point is God's Word is deep in subject matter for all mankind.
Mid Acts Dispensationalism is a misunderstanding of God's Word,with man attempting to put it in his context rather than God's.
This is ignorance and stubborn at the same time.
I believe it is truly a private interpretation that would be similar to Josph Smith or Ellen White.
God Bless ,and I hope others will benefit from this teaching you have given.
 
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