Need advice about husband in bondage to sexual addiction

[dallasapple]

Dallas, have you ever seen that book: Drinking: A Love Story? Oh my gosh. I downloaded it to my Nook and read it one evening. It is the story of every single alcoholic, ever. Because it's written by a woman, I could identify so closely with her, and the reading of that book came at a time when I was feeling sorely tempted. The descriptions of drinking (before she quit) were a little hard to read, because that is one of my triggers, but once I got past that, it was very, very powerful.

I'll have to get that..((HUGS)))

Here is my deal..talk about 'hard to read".my whole family drinks..my mother both my sisters ..my brother..even my adult children..and my husband even has a few every few months or so..

It instead of beign a trigger right now for me..is a confirmation that I made the right choice and to keep on choosing that..at first when its the tinkling glasses ..the beer can popping..the colors so bright!..its a little..um shal I say.."maybe I can have one"..but then I EAT LOL!..and I bring myslef something "special " to drink..like Italian Soda..or a Fancy Cream Soda..for a fake Baileys I will drink Almond Milk over ice LOL!!

But its not long..later..when they are drunk as skunks..get in fights..or not..but just they look so bad..their eyes look like their brains have been scrambled..it makes me sad..

Another reason to keep choosing..my brother and sister both..say Im thier "hope"..(not that Im thier God)..but I think they are shocked..(thats how bad I was) and the fact we are geneticlaly related and raised in the same enviroment..that If I can ...its possible for them...

Dallas

 

[Conservativation]

But former addicts do carry their addiction within. That's the point, I think. It's a "lest I forget". Because I know I carry my addiction within, I can't ever have "just one drink, because I'm not an addict any more - I'm cured, I'm free." No I'm not. I'm free and cured for so long as I don't drink.

Do you really think that there is a mid-point and that alcoholics can drink "some" alcohol? That is so wrong. I disagree entirely. Would you tell a drug addict to just have a little heroin? Of course not. So why would an alcoholic be different? It's nonsense. It's not an accepted school of thought at all.

Uh.....I didnt say an alcoholic can then drink one drink....Im not in "that school of thought"....go ahead and enthusiastically reject it....but NOT as if I originated it.

I said that there are narrower criteria than just alcoholic and not alcoholic. Thats all I said. Lumping everyone into one of those two classes is silly, but done with religiosity by the most sold out adherants to "the program"....look if the program works for you then Im very happy. What Im saying is almost like when an atheist says Im fine with Christians just not those that prosthelytize. I dont subscribe to the ever expanding definitions that seek to drag others into the figurative same boat. Thats ALL I said

 

[Conservativation]

It's not about anyone reminding you - it's about you reminding yourself. It's a reality check, and it's what stops the addict from returning to their chains by thinking they are now safe, and that "that person" who they were no longer exists. That person does exist - they are that person, and if they don't remember that, then they will go back to their sin.

As an addict, I can tell you that this is true. I dont beat myself up, and I consider myself to be just as much saved by grace as anybody here, but I. am. an. addict. It would take only drink - that's all.

and thats fine that it works for you. But...keep that number in mind....5%...thats the "fruit" of the program...which includes verbally reminding addicts they are addicts.


Jesus is about OVERcoming....not reaching detante with the addiction. To say you cant have 1 drink means quite simply, you cant have one drink....thats all. Maybe look at it like an allergy (Im not saying CALL it an allergy like pawning off the seriousness) where you say "I cant have even ONE peanut"....anyway that example may stink the point is that I think its not Gods will that a bunch of Christians keep standing up saying My name is joe and IM STILL SICK!

 

[Conservativation]

I'll have to get that..((HUGS)))

Here is my deal..talk about 'hard to read".my whole family drinks..my mother both my sisters ..my brother..even my adult children..and my husband even has a few every few months or so..

It instead of beign a trigger right now for me..is a confirmation that I made the right choice and to keep on choosing that..at first when its the tinkling glasses ..the beer can popping..the colors so bright!..its a little..um shal I say.."maybe I can have one"..but then I EAT LOL!..and I bring myslef something "special " to drink..like Italian Soda..or a Fancy Cream Soda..for a fake Baileys I will drink Almond Milk over ice LOL!!

But its not long..later..when they are drunk as skunks..get in fights..or not..but just they look so bad..their eyes look like their brains have been scrambled..it makes me sad..

Another reason to keep choosing..my brother and sister both..say Im thier "hope"..(not that Im thier God)..but I think they are shocked..(thats how bad I was) and the fact we are geneticlaly related and raised in the same enviroment..that If I can ...its possible for them...

Dallas

here is a huge cyber back pat for you, I mean that....its sad glad happy sad stuff all of it. I hope, and Ive seen all the colors of this rainbow...I hope you can be the fun person or a fun person, happy and easy going and fun to be around without the drink as you were with.....dont misunderstand the fake fun isnt what Im saying....Ive known a couple men who 100% quit drinking....and never smiled or inflected theor voice again...like robots

 

[JaneFW]

I said that there are narrower criteria than just alcoholic and not alcoholic. Thats all I said. Lumping everyone into one of those two classes is silly, but done with religiosity by the most sold out adherants to "the program"....look if the program works for you then Im very happy.

Um, I'm not in a program, actually. Programs don't work for me.

So if there's not just alcoholic and not alcoholic, what is there? Occasional alcoholic?

I understand that people go through phases. My h went through a phase of crazy drinking when he was younger, but he doesn't care about alcohol at all now. Two beers and he is done, even when he is with other guys. He won't be tempted into more, especially when he is driving. His two buddies - Christian guys - will sink a couple of six packs each. I don't know if they have a drinking problem, unless they came to me and said they did, I'm not even going to consider it. I just know that that's a lot. I'm proud that he is not pulled into getting drunk with them.

 

[JaneFW]

and thats fine that it works for you. But...keep that number in mind....5%...thats the "fruit" of the program...which includes verbally reminding addicts they are addicts.


Jesus is about OVERcoming....not reaching detante with the addiction. To say you cant have 1 drink means quite simply, you cant have one drink....thats all. Maybe look at it like an allergy (Im not saying CALL it an allergy like pawning off the seriousness) where you say "I cant have even ONE peanut"....anyway that example may stink the point is that I think its not Gods will that a bunch of Christians keep standing up saying My name is joe and IM STILL SICK!

Like I said, I don't stand up in front of anyone. I don't even talk about it in general terms, I just tell people that I don't drink. If they want to know more, they can ask. I don't go around saying "my name is Jane and I'm an alcoholic" lol. It's just not me. I just know it, that's all. It doesn't define me, it's something within me that needs to be captured and taken before God whenever temptation arises.

 

[Romanseight2005]

Dont I see that?I just told you that Faith..No one EVER said you will NEVER struggle again. Usually and in fact..the sooner you quit the better into the addiction ..and then after you STOP the behavior..as time goes by you sturggle less and less frequently and with less and less intensity ...But the choice to not use is completely YOURS.

To use or NOT use is your choice..the fact you are an addict once you are an addict is NOT a choice anymore.

Its also your "choice" to make changes in the way you think..and in your other patterns of behaviors that were part of your routine.simple things..yes "easy" things but for an adddict very crucial..Like for me eating breakfast and lunch..instead of skipping one or both..leaving during the times of day I might have otherwise started drinking..

Its not what ya'll make me sound out to be saying..I quit..then never think about it again.thats ridiculous and I never have ever insinuated that..Its a CHOICE and in my examples above a series of choices and changes in patterns of behavior.

And besides cigarrettes and some of the chemical addcitions that require some medications to "wean " you off ..Its ALL cold turkey..With inappropriate content..there is NO advantage to continuing to use..thats like saying an alcoholic shoudl go ahead and get drunk 3 times a week instead of everyday for a month..then 2 times a week for a month..then 1 ..then only get drunk once every 2 weeks for a few months..then once a month..and so on ..

Even though I HAVE read recently some new studies..that for some alcoholics..if their physical chemistry is completely corrected..they can actually safely drink in moderation ..like a "normal" person(not get drunk just have a few every now and then).I dont know I would have to see a lot more evidence before I would buy into that..I cant let my mind go there..

Dallas

Right. You are talking about one of the forms of temptation.One meaning of temptation is being tested, but another definition, or form, is to be enticed. So, the fact that you are tempted in that area, is not at all the same as acting out in that area.

 

[dallasapple]

here is a huge cyber back pat for you, I mean that....its sad glad happy sad stuff all of it. I hope, and Ive seen all the colors of this rainbow...I hope you can be the fun person or a fun person, happy and easy going and fun to be around without the drink as you were with.....dont misunderstand the fake fun isnt what Im saying....Ive known a couple men who 100% quit drinking....and never smiled or inflected theor voice again...like robots

Thanks Cons that means so much to me..It is ..is sad..starts out so jubilant..then wham!..theres the reason this is poisoness gut rotting stuff.(for ME and many others )..

The fun person?..I was DEPRESSED one of the reasons TBH I struggled with just saying not part of my life anymore..I thought I was "the life of the party" at times and it wasnt me..it was the false energy ..the laughing at stupid stuff because..well your drunk..that I would lose my "spunk" my "spark"..

Didnt happen ..in fact ..what Gods gift to me is..I believe that I can FEEL more..I am HAPPIER..and believe it or not Im NICER...they are the ones that are having a great time one minute..before you know it..my sister is crying ..sobbing about somethign or another..sometimes its even what an alcoholic she is..my mother and my brother are screaming at the top of thier lungs about Obama..my mother as well who is otherwise a southern "propper" is saying the F word and screaming about how she and my father are LOVERS and she LIKES to have SEX with him ALL the TIME..My sisters husband (also a pitiful alcoholic) is comign up to me and holding my face ..REAL close to him saying "Dallas..you ....you ..you ..you ...you have ze most beautiful eyes....(hes from Nicaraugua) then he kisses me on the lips..My sister rolls her eyes..Later he might even "trip" over the edge of the carpet and fal completely backwards banging his head on the ground holding his drink STILL ..

Seriously its like a clown show..Im not laughing at them its horribly sad..Thats why I didnt liek Chazs comments about alcoholics livign "normal" lives....I usually about that point say I gotta go except unfortunately its only maybe 10 pm ....But Im really really not kidding when I say Im MORE fun ..just in everyday..not just at a party..I have MORE energy..Im healthier..things I wouldnt NOTICE even I see and are interestign and funny..or not everything is funny..things that would make me angry before do NOT make me angry..(Im calmer)My point is my real personality is out..and its a good one! LOL>..I must have great "rebound" because I was worried I had brain damage..and would be like those robots..

I think for me the PHYSICAL drain the alcohol was putting on my body just that alone was dragging me down so bad..Now I feel lite.and Im determined to BE HAPPY!

My sister told me one time she was "watching me" ..she said (like it surprised her) ..you seemed to be "really having fun"..

I think its interesting you brought that up..

Ramble..

Dallas

 

[dallasapple]

Like I said, I don't stand up in front of anyone. I don't even talk about it in general terms, I just tell people that I don't drink. If they want to know more, they can ask. I don't go around saying "my name is Jane and I'm an alcoholic" lol. It's just not me. I just know it, that's all. It doesn't define me, it's something within me that needs to be captured and taken before God whenever temptation arises.

I indentify completely with what you are saying..Its in your pshychi(excuse the spelling) it is part of "who you are"..at least for me becasue SO much of my life was involving it..it cant "never be"..Its your "history"..

I talked about havign a "glass of wine" one night..I didnt "almost do it" I just said it..that night I had a NIGHTMARE that I had drank..and gotten drunk..I woke up and thought ..did I REALLY do that please no !!!

Because thats another thing..Waking up and NOT remembering what if anything "bad" you did the day before..Being releived to finally remember that you only 'thought "about calling so and so and chewing them out..Cringing if you had or worse..Im also guilty of drivign under the influence..more than once..I dont mean arrested more than once..just that I have done it ..100's of times over the years..its things like that you remember..and you are thankful ...I dont say "my name is Dallas and Im an alcoholic"..I say my name is Dallas and I can drive this car perfectly fine thank you very much and Im PROUD of it"!

Anyway I get what you are saying..

Dallas

 

[dallasapple]

Right. You are talking about one of the forms of temptation.One meaning of temptation is being tested, but another definition, or form, is to be enticed. So, the fact that you are tempted in that area, is not at all the same as acting out in that area.

Right..and I think its ort of ridiculous to have to go around and around ..with its "not a choice" when it IS..only for someone to say ..well its not a choice to be an addict"..

I mean its like STRETCHING as far as you can to make the addict a COMPLETE victim..Its "not easy" its "impossible for some" its not a choice" etc...Thats a defeatest attitude and its no help to someone who suffers addiction and the TEMPTATIONS..For me it makes me angry and more determined..but I see the danger in feeding into someones mind how "helpless" they are..then call that "sympathy and compassion".

Dallas

 

[dallasapple]

The thing about saying I cant have one drink..???YOu CAN have one drink but do you really want to?..and do you really want to risk after that drink you wont CHOOSE to have another drink?then 15 of them..then wake up the next day and have one more to kill the pain in your head?

I say ..Im not going to drink just 1 drink..because knowing me..I might just drink untill Im stumbling drunk..Especially now with no tolerance..I woudl be drunk off of one or 2 beers..If I drank my max that I used to and still be standing..I would probably vomit and pass out.

Dallas

 

[JaneFW]

I indentify completely with what you are saying..Its in your pshychi(excuse the spelling) it is part of "who you are"..at least for me becasue SO much of my life was involving it..it cant "never be"..Its your "history"..

I talked about havign a "glass of wine" one night..I didnt "almost do it" I just said it..that night I had a NIGHTMARE that I had drank..and gotten drunk..I woke up and thought ..did I REALLY do that please no !!!

Because thats another thing..Waking up and NOT remembering what if anything "bad" you did the day before..Being releived to finally remember that you only 'thought "about calling so and so and chewing them out..Cringing if you had or worse..Im also guilty of drivign under the influence..more than once..I dont mean arrested more than once..just that I have done it ..100's of times over the years..its things like that you remember..and you are thankful ...I dont say "my name is Dallas and Im an alcoholic"..I say my name is Dallas and I can drive this car perfectly fine thank you very much and Im PROUD of it"!

Anyway I get what you are saying..

Dallas

That my dear is an addict dream. I still occasionally get them. In my dream I drink alcohol, and I wake up with a sense of dread until I remember it was just a dream.

I'm so proud of you Dallas. Love you girl. x

 

[Conservativation]

Thanks Cons that means so much to me..It is ..is sad..starts out so jubilant..then wham!..theres the reason this is poisoness gut rotting stuff.(for ME and many others )..

The fun person?..I was DEPRESSED one of the reasons TBH I struggled with just saying not part of my life anymore..I thought I was "the life of the party" at times and it wasnt me..it was the false energy ..the laughing at stupid stuff because..well your drunk..that I would lose my "spunk" my "spark"..

Didnt happen ..in fact ..what Gods gift to me is..I believe that I can FEEL more..I am HAPPIER..and believe it or not Im NICER...they are the ones that are having a great time one minute..before you know it..my sister is crying ..sobbing about somethign or another..sometimes its even what an alcoholic she is..my mother and my brother are screaming at the top of thier lungs about Obama..my mother as well who is otherwise a southern "propper" is saying the F word and screaming about how she and my father are LOVERS and she LIKES to have SEX with him ALL the TIME..My sisters husband (also a pitiful alcoholic) is comign up to me and holding my face ..REAL close to him saying "Dallas..you ....you ..you ..you ...you have ze most beautiful eyes....(hes from Nicaraugua) then he kisses me on the lips..My sister rolls her eyes..Later he might even "trip" over the edge of the carpet and fal completely backwards banging his head on the ground holding his drink STILL ..

Seriously its like a clown show..Im not laughing at them its horribly sad..Thats why I didnt liek Chazs comments about alcoholics livign "normal" lives....I usually about that point say I gotta go except unfortunately its only maybe 10 pm ....But Im really really not kidding when I say Im MORE fun ..just in everyday..not just at a party..I have MORE energy..Im healthier..things I wouldnt NOTICE even I see and are interestign and funny..or not everything is funny..things that would make me angry before do NOT make me angry..(Im calmer)My point is my real personality is out..and its a good one! LOL>..I must have great "rebound" because I was worried I had brain damage..and would be like those robots..

I think for me the PHYSICAL drain the alcohol was putting on my body just that alone was dragging me down so bad..Now I feel lite.and Im determined to BE HAPPY!

My sister told me one time she was "watching me" ..she said (like it surprised her) ..you seemed to be "really having fun"..

I think its interesting you brought that up..

Ramble..

Dallas

WAY cool and good. You may know the folks Im talking about who really ARE the drinking person,,,and no one else.
If you have it as you say....then I am noy gonna lecture you that hey you alcoholic how many days sober? Good good good for you. My best friend at work is a "recovered alcoholic" 25 years sober, and was near death, laying in a pile of his waste and dying when he went in treatment......he is a fun and well adjusted man now, I love him as a friend, dearly I love him. we are close. Im soooo very glad you are as you are. I pray God gives you what it takes to stay that way, because you are through him an overcomer on this matter. Good on you

 

[FaithPrevails]

Right..and I think its ort of ridiculous to have to go around and around ..with its "not a choice" when it IS..only for someone to say ..well its not a choice to be an addict"..

I mean its like STRETCHING as far as you can to make the addict a COMPLETE victim..Its "not easy" its "impossible for some" its not a choice" etc...Thats a defeatest attitude and its no help to someone who suffers addiction and the TEMPTATIONS..For me it makes me angry and more determined..but I see the danger in feeding into someones mind how "helpless" they are..then call that "sympathy and compassion".

Dallas

I didn't say what I did to make it sound like the addict is a victim. I agreed with you about the choice of engaging in the behavior or not. So, I'm not really seeing what the disconnect is between what I'm saying and what you're saying. Other than I seem to think that addicts deserve compassion and you don't - but maybe I'm wrong about that.

 

[dallasapple]

I didn't say what I did to make it sound like the addict is a victim. I agreed with you about the choice of engaging in the behavior or not. So, I'm not really seeing what the disconnect is between what I'm saying and what you're saying. Other than I seem to think that addicts deserve compassion and you don't - but maybe I'm wrong about that.

Maybe you are confused..with my compassion being so ENORMOUS that you cant even recognize it as compassion...becasue it far surpasses feeling sorry for an addict and moves to actual GRIEF and an urgent need and BELIEF that they CAN STOP..they do have a CHOICE.Your problem Is you dont see that I believe an addict deserves MORE than compassion.

I do the "comapassion" Faith..Compassion in my world is pulling my sister out a of spa with my husbands help like a rag doll for fear she will drown right in front of us..and wrapping her in a towel ..and taking her into her bedroom and helping her change into her bed clothes and putting her in the bed before I leave..and being terrified that when we leave she will get back up and get hurt.(which has happend she has had to have stitches in her back 25 of them from falling backwards tryign to "kick box")...

Compassion? Do you still believe I dont think and "addict" "deserves" compassion when Im trying to one of the many times calm my niece..who is now 15 who is having a nervous breakdown..crying saying she is just sick of it..when my sister has disapeared overnight..and this little girl has no idea where her mother is?And I tell her that she DOESNT deserve this..she has done NOTHING to bring it on ..that I understand why she is angry..and she is in a tough situation to have to be dealing with this..but that she has to RESPECT her mother my sister..that she is very ill..that she is a human being and that hard as it is she MUST respect her and always remember my sister loves her more than life itself..

Yeah Faith ..maybe you are wrong..maybe you dont even realize how wrong you are about me.To the point to me its even funny..that you would tell me I dont think an addict "deserves compassion".And to be quite frank..I dont care what you think ..people like you have no idea what I deal with ..and that its beyond "have compassion".Its grief.

Dallas

 

[Conservativation]

I believe there is lots of truth in what dallas says. Its not anyones fault that they have not lived in the deep grime and grit of hard core addiction.....and its not an insult to say "you dont understand"....I know that degree of horror too, having grown up my entire childhood and teens living in that mess. Its not some badge of honor...but it IS a level that most people dont fathom, even while most people will say "yes I have dealt with addiction and addicts". Maybe FP has too, I have no idea who has and who hasnt, but there are indeed degrees of messiness.
Compassion is there, WHILE you are up to your elbows in body waste or broken things, if it wasnt for compassion who in the world could even do those things you know

 

[FaithPrevails]

Maybe you are confused..with my compassion being so ENORMOUS that you cant even recognize it as compassion...becasue it far surpasses feeling sorry for an addict and moves to actual GRIEF and an urgent need and BELIEF that they CAN STOP..they do have a CHOICE.Your problem Is you dont see that I believe an addict deserves MORE than compassion.

I do the "comapassion" Faith..Compassion in my world is pulling my sister out a of spa with my husbands help like a rag doll for fear she will drown right in front of us..and wrapping her in a towel ..and taking her into her bedroom and helping her change into her bed clothes and putting her in the bed before I leave..and being terrified that when we leave she will get back up and get hurt.(which has happend she has had to have stitches in her back 25 of them from falling backwards tryign to "kick box")...

Compassion? Do you still believe I dont think and "addict" "deserves" compassion when Im trying to one of the many times calm my niece..who is now 15 who is having a nervous breakdown..crying saying she is just sick of it..when my sister has disapeared overnight..and this little girl has no idea where her mother is?And I tell her that she DOESNT deserve this..she has done NOTHING to bring it on ..that I understand why she is angry..and she is in a tough situation to have to be dealing with this..but that she has to RESPECT her mother my sister..that she is very ill..that she is a human being and that hard as it is she MUST respect her and always remember my sister loves her more than life itself..

Yeah Faith ..maybe you are wrong..maybe you dont even realize how wrong you are about me.To the point to me its even funny..that you would tell me I dont think an addict "deserves compassion".And to be quite frank..I dont care what you think ..people like you have no idea what I deal with ..and that its beyond "have compassion".Its grief.

Dallas

So, why then do you get so upset at the notion of compassion when I or chaz mention it?

As for what you deal with? I do understand and know. I've been there with my own family members and with my exMIL. I have had my exMIL show up completely bombed at my wedding. I've dealt with fallout from her being trashed at special events, holidays, and even just normal family dinners. I've been to her house and seen her so passed out drunk that my entry and her 3 dogs barking didn't even rouse her - to the point that I stood over her and watched to see if she was breathing b/c I wasn't sure if she was alive or not. I've worried every time I watched her drive up or drive away in a car b/c no one in my ex's family was willing to tell her NOT to drive. I worry even more now b/c I'm not married to my ex anymore and he actually lets his mom babysit our kids and drive them in her car.

So yeah, I get it. I've lived it. And it breaks my heart to know how it destroys a part of my children's family...it broke my heart that the history of it plays a part in the issues my ex has and won't deal with b/c it ultimately contributed to the demise of our marriage.

So, maybe you don't see that I do understand and get it, too.

 

[dallasapple]

I believe there is lots of truth in what dallas says. Its not anyones fault that they have not lived in the deep grime and grit of hard core addiction.....and its not an insult to say "you dont understand"....I know that degree of horror too, having grown up my entire childhood and teens living in that mess. Its not some badge of honor...but it IS a level that most people dont fathom, even while most people will say "yes I have dealt with addiction and addicts". Maybe FP has too, I have no idea who has and who hasnt, but there are indeed degrees of messiness.
Compassion is there, WHILE you are up to your elbows in body waste or broken things, if it wasnt for compassion who in the world could even do those things you know

I agree..its just maddening wihen you get PAST compassion..or the compassion involves STATING the FACT you can STOP THIS...Its PART of the compassion..Its the HOPE part..and some do gooder comes along talking about "where is your sympathy..your compassion..they cant help it..they are an addict..its beyond their control..they dont need judments..its a disease..OVER adn OVER and over Faith has accused me of having "no compassion"..or "sympathy"..

How could I have "no compassion or sympathy"..adn even ASSOCIATE then with some members of my family ?Not to mention >I have been knee deep in my own addiction.."drowning"..to the point no its not a "badge" Im embarrased to give a lot of details..includign my OWN "falling backwards" events..knowing what I put my OWN children through..And Im trying to and AM recovering ..in the middle of my families ACTIVE serious and dangerous addictions..

I have te added "pressure" and dare I say "honor" of beign an example to them of HOPE..but I have 'no compassion"..

I just seriously shouldnt even care what she or others like her think..I can just say her idea of "compassion" doesnt "inspire" a person like me to do the very THING that needs to be done and thats STOP.

And this disproportionate focus on the compassion for the addict..barely a mention of the DESTRUCTION ..it has on the OTHER people..the NON addicts..they dont get any compassion they dont have a "disease".They are "strong" they dont need any sympathy..

Even MY mother ..who has her drinking well under control now at 67..She takes meds that thin her blood and isnt really supposed to drink at all..I as her daughter..have to have "compassion " for HER that she is terrified and worried sick over my sister..and at one point ME ..my brother whole other story...

Its just..overwhelming I cant even really describe it would be a 500 page book..just on my little family's addictions.

It wasnt "always" this bad either..Its just been a "constant" my entire life..with peaks and valleys..different peopel at differnt times in the "hot seat"..whos the worse alcoholic in Dallas family this week..or month or year...right now its my sister..andlets not forget my brothers long term girlfriend who is a reclusive alcoholic as we speak..wont leave the house..

That reminds me..I have to "disperse" some "compassion" soon to her and my brother..go over there to keep her company ..and so he can get a break..

Dallas

 

[FaithPrevails]

I agree..its just maddening wihen you get PAST compassion..or the compassion involves STATING the FACT you can STOP THIS...Its PART of the compassion..Its the HOPE part..and some do gooder comes along talking about "where is your sympathy..your compassion..they cant help it..they are an addict..its beyond their control..they dont need judments..its a disease..OVER adn OVER and over Faith has accused me of having "no compassion"..or "sympathy"..

I have never - never - said that being an addict means that they can't or shouldn't stop the behavior. Which is what you keep harping on when I talk about addiction.

I just seriously shouldnt even care what she or others like her think..I can just say her idea of "compassion" doesnt "inspire" a person like me to do the very THING that needs to be done and thats STOP.

So, my idea of compassion is what exactly, dallas? You don't seem to know or you wouldn't be making these wildly inaccurate statements. I think this is laughable from a woman who had the audacity to challenge why I left my first marriage. Pot or kettle, eh?

And this disproportionate focus on the compassion for the addict..barely a mention of the DESTRUCTION ..it has on the OTHER people..the NON addicts..they dont get any compassion they dont have a "disease".They are "strong" they dont need any sympathy..

Never said that either. Quite the contrary. But, thanks for putting words in my mouth.

 

[dallasapple]

So, why then do you get so upset at the notion of compassion when I or chaz mention it?

As for what you deal with? I do understand and know. I've been there with my own family members and with my exMIL. I have had my exMIL show up completely bombed at my wedding. I've dealt with fallout from her being trashed at special events, holidays, and even just normal family dinners. I've been to her house and seen her so passed out drunk that my entry and her 3 dogs barking didn't even rouse her - to the point that I stood over her and watched to see if she was breathing b/c I wasn't sure if she was alive or not. I've worried every time I watched her drive up or drive away in a car b/c no one in my ex's family was willing to tell her NOT to drive. I worry even more now b/c I'm not married to my ex anymore and he actually lets his mom babysit our kids and drive them in her car.

So yeah, I get it. I've lived it. And it breaks my heart to know how it destroys a part of my children's family...it broke my heart that the history of it plays a part in the issues my ex has and won't deal with b/c it ultimately contributed to the demise of our marriage.

So, maybe you don't see that I do understand and get it, too.

I never accused you Faith ..of not believing an addict "deserves compassion"..that is what you have said to ME.

My assertion than an ADDICT can STOP ..which is a fact..that its a CHOICE..is what you turned around and flat out more than once have told me I dont BELIEVE an ADDICT deserves compassion..or sympathy.

What I dont believe IS COMPASSION ..is TELLING an addict they have LITTLE to no choice..they arent CHOOSING to use..that is a message of DOOM..that is not "compassion"..

Where is the sympathy..where is the compassion..On and on and on about that..when the point is ..SYMPATHY is NOT where it ends..feelign sorry for someone and sympathising ..is LIMITED as to if you are trying to DEAL with helping an addcit recover..Or you lets say sympathise but at the EXACT time draw a boundery..and NOT enable..not make it 'easy" ..Its part of the COMPASSION...tell them the REALITY..the part where they CAN do something about .

The difference between the compassion that I HAVE and the kind that YOU have..is that if there was someone that had clinical depression that is standing on the edge of a 10 story building fixign to jump?Is you would tell them..thats COMPLETELY understandable that you want to jump..its part of the depression it can lead to that..I have so much sympathy for YOU that you want to kill your self..you can NOT help that you feel that way..you have a disease..many people can not EASILY over come it and for some its downright impossible..and many many depressed people do in fact committ suicide..I feel SO sorry for you ..I hold NO judgment over you ..I have KNOWN people that were depressed..They tried and tried and just never got better..and that is so sad..I have SO much compassion for that..

Faith..they would NOT put YOU ..as much sympathy and compassion as you have.with your bleeding heart...on a team for suicide prevention..they would NOT send YOU up to negotiate with the potential suicide victim..in fact they woudl tell you "stand back lady"..

The people with REAL compassion would listen to them and what their problems are..know the details..pay attention sympathise....and then try and convince them they do not HAVE to do it..people do care and there is help.You can overcome this..OTHER people have had these feelings you are NOT alone..and they have recovered and gone on to feel happy again..but the first step is dont jump..then you MUST..recieve treatment..

You seem to be the one that wants to REJECT the part where they have a CHOICE..because for some reason you see that as being UNSYMPATHETIC and lacking compassion and I do NOT agree.I see that as trying to convince the person they are NOT helpless and there is HOPE.Which is a compassionate thing to do ..You do not tell them they dont REALLY have much choice in the matter because thats the "nature of depression".And everybody will understand if they go ahead and kill themselves..

Dallas