National Sunday Law

[HARK!]

And I don't just go by that, but the many lists of serious sin listed in the new testament, never mention the breaking of the Sabbath, or not eating unclean foods.

(CLV) Hb 1:9
Thou lovest righteousness (kept THE LAW) and hatest injustice (disregard for THE LAW) ; Therefore Thou art anointed by The God, (tou theou) (YHWH), Thy God, with the oil of exultation beyond Thy partners."

(CLV) 1Jn 3:9
Everyone who is begotten of The God, (tou theou) (YHWH) is not doing sin, for His seed is remaining in him, and he can not be sinning, for he is begotten of The God (tou theou) (YHWH).

(CLV) Mt 5:17
"You should not infer that I came to demolish THE LAW or the prophets. I came not to demolish, but to fulfill.

(CLV) Mt 5:18
For verily, I am saying to you, Till heaven and earth should be passing by, one iota or one serif may by no means be passing by from THE LAW till all should be occurring.

(CLV) Ps 119:160
The sum of Your word is truth, And all of Your righteous ordinances are eonian.

(CLV) Mt 5:19
"Whosoever, then, should be annulling one of the least of these precepts, and should be teaching men thus, the least in the kingdom of the heavens shall he be called. Yet whoever should be doing and teaching them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of the heavens.

(CLV) Lk 16:17
Yet it is easier for heaven and earth to pass by than for one serif of THE LAW to fall.

(CLV) 1Jn 3:4
Everyone who is doing sin, is doing LAWLESSNESS also, and sin is LAWLESSNESS.

(CLV) Mt 24:12
And, because of the multiplication of LAWLESSNESS, the love of many shall be cooling.

(CLV) Mt 24:13
Yet he who endures to the consummation, he shall be saved.

(CLV) 1Jn 2:4
He who is saying that I know him, and is not keeping his precepts, is a liar; and the truth of The God, (tou theou) (YHWH) is not in this one.

(CLV) 1Jn 3:8
Yet he who is doing sin is of the Adversary, for from the beginning is the Adversary sinning. For this, was the Son of The God (tou theou) (YHWH manifested, that He should be annulling the acts of the Adversary.

(CLV) Mt 23:28
Thus you, also, outside, indeed, are appearing to men to be just, yet inside you are distended with hypocrisy and LAWLESSNESS.

(CLV) Mt 7:21
"Not everyone saying to Me `Lord! Lord!' will be entering into the kingdom of the heavens, but he who is doing the will of My Father Who is in the heavens.
(CLV) Mt 7:22
Many will be declaring to Me in that day, `Lord! Lord! Was it not in Your name that we prophesy, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name do many powerful deeds?'

(CLV) Mt 7:23
And then shall I be avowing to them that `I never knew you! Depart from Me, workers~ of LAWLESSNESS!'
(CLV) Mt 13:41
The Son of Mankind shall be dispatching His messengers, and they shall be culling out of His kingdom all the snares and those doing LAWLESSNESS,

(CLV) Hb 10:28
Anyone -repudiating Moses' LAW is dying without =pity on the testimony of two or three witnesses.
(CLV) Hb 10:29
Of how much worse punishment, are you supposing, will he be counted worthy who tramples on the Son of God, and deems the blood of the covenant iby which he is hallowed contaminating, and outrages the spirit of grace?

 

[Kenny'sID]

(CLV) Hb 1:9
Thou lovest righteousness (kept THE LAW) and hatest injustice (disregard for THE LAW) ; Therefore Thou art anointed by The God, (tou theou) (YHWH), Thy God, with the oil of exultation beyond Thy partners."

(CLV) 1Jn 3:9
Everyone who is begotten of The God, (tou theou) (YHWH) is not doing sin, for His seed is remaining in him, and he can not be sinning, for he is begotten of The God (tou theou) (YHWH).

(CLV) Mt 5:17
"You should not infer that I came to demolish THE LAW or the prophets. I came not to demolish, but to fulfill.

(CLV) Mt 5:18
For verily, I am saying to you, Till heaven and earth should be passing by, one iota or one serif may by no means be passing by from THE LAW till all should be occurring.

(CLV) Ps 119:160
The sum of Your word is truth, And all of Your righteous ordinances are eonian.

(CLV) Mt 5:19
"Whosoever, then, should be annulling one of the least of these precepts, and should be teaching men thus, the least in the kingdom of the heavens shall he be called. Yet whoever should be doing and teaching them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of the heavens.

(CLV) Lk 16:17
Yet it is easier for heaven and earth to pass by than for one serif of THE LAW to fall.

(CLV) 1Jn 3:4
Everyone who is doing sin, is doing LAWLESSNESS also, and sin is LAWLESSNESS.

(CLV) Mt 24:12
And, because of the multiplication of LAWLESSNESS, the love of many shall be cooling.

(CLV) Mt 24:13
Yet he who endures to the consummation, he shall be saved.

(CLV) 1Jn 2:4
He who is saying that I know him, and is not keeping his precepts, is a liar; and the truth of The God, (tou theou) (YHWH) is not in this one.

(CLV) 1Jn 3:8
Yet he who is doing sin is of the Adversary, for from the beginning is the Adversary sinning. For this, was the Son of The God (tou theou) (YHWH manifested, that He should be annulling the acts of the Adversary.

(CLV) Mt 23:28
Thus you, also, outside, indeed, are appearing to men to be just, yet inside you are distended with hypocrisy and LAWLESSNESS.

(CLV) Mt 7:21
"Not everyone saying to Me `Lord! Lord!' will be entering into the kingdom of the heavens, but he who is doing the will of My Father Who is in the heavens.
(CLV) Mt 7:22
Many will be declaring to Me in that day, `Lord! Lord! Was it not in Your name that we prophesy, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name do many powerful deeds?'

(CLV) Mt 7:23
And then shall I be avowing to them that `I never knew you! Depart from Me, workers~ of LAWLESSNESS!'
(CLV) Mt 13:41
The Son of Mankind shall be dispatching His messengers, and they shall be culling out of His kingdom all the snares and those doing LAWLESSNESS,

(CLV) Hb 10:28
Anyone -repudiating Moses' LAW is dying without =pity on the testimony of two or three witnesses.
(CLV) Hb 10:29
Of how much worse punishment, are you supposing, will he be counted worthy who tramples on the Son of God, and deems the blood of the covenant iby which he is hallowed contaminating, and outrages the spirit of grace?

You need to think before you post, and I don't mean that in a mean way. Some people here just slap verses up there that aren't even related to the problem.

See, there is no question in my mind that we should be obedient, but an answer to what exactly is disobedient or not here, is. I wish I could just say, "well your right" (I hope you aren't expecting that) because it would be a lot easier, but with these crackpots out there today, I'd just a soon figure some things out for myself, and I haven't done that just yet.

Worse case scenario here is you think because I didn't draw a same conclusion/agree with you, that I am now guilty of breaking the law because you have put yourself in a place where you think your word is infallible/law, so to speak, so you have now moved directly to accusing me. I don't think that has happened, but I suppose it is a possibility and the reason you answered as you did when I told you I was undecided.

 

[HARK!]

You need to think before you post

I've given this subject great thought. What have I missed?

I don't mean that in a mean way. Some people here just slap verses up there that aren't even related to the problem.

What problem? I simply provided verses that were related to your comments.

See, there is no question in my mind that we should be obedien

Glory to Yahweh!

but an answer to what exactly is disobedient or not here, is. I wish I could just say, "well your right" (I hope you aren't expecting that) because it would be a lot easier, but with these crackpots out there today, I'd just a soon figure some things out for myself, and I haven't done that just yet.

I was trying to help you with that. To the best of my knowledge and ability, I quoted pure scripture. If I somehow, in your opinion, fall into the category of a crackpot; please send me a personal message explaining why. I'm not offended by sincere constructive criticism.

Worse case scenario here is you think because I didn't draw a same conclusion/agree with you, that I am now guilty of breaking the law

We are all guilty of breaking the law. My opinion on this subject is irrelevant on that point. That is between, each of us individually, and Yahweh.

because you have put yourself in a place where you think your word is infallible/law

I didn't present my words. I presented pure scripture, again, only to the best of my knowledge and ability.

so you have now moved directly to accusing me

It's not an accusation. It's an alert. When I read scripture, and I feel conviction; I give credit the Ruach HaKodedsh. I don't take offense to the printer of the text.

I don't think that has happened

I thank Yahweh for that. Shalom.

I suppose it is a possibility and the reason you answered as you did when I told you I was undecided.

I thought that I could help you with that. I apologize if my zeal to cut to the heart of the truth, in my still yet limited understanding (the law is a deep subject), has offended you.

Again, Shalom.

 

[Kenny'sID]

I've given this subject great thought. What have I missed?



What problem? I simply provided verses that were related to your comments.



Glory to Yahweh!



I was trying to help you with that. To the best of my knowledge and ability, I quoted pure scripture. If I somehow, in your opinion, fall into the category of a crackpot; please send me a personal message explaining why. I'm not offended by sincere constructive criticism.

We are all guilty of breaking the law. My opinion on this subject is irrelevant on that point. That is between, each of us individually, and Yahweh.


I didn't present my words. I presented pure scripture, again, only to the best of my knowledge and ability.

It's not an accusation. It's an alert. When I read scripture, and I feel conviction; I give credit the Ruach HaKodedsh. I don't take offense to the printer of the text.



I thank Yahweh for that. Shalom.



I thought that I could help you with that. I apologize if my zeal to cut to the heart of the truth, in my still yet limited understanding (the law is a deep subject), has offended you.

Again, Shalom.

I was clear what the problem was but you still ask, as if I never gave any detail, driving home the very premise of my post, you need to pay closer attention. Thanks just the same.

 

[listed]

What was Paul telling his formerly Pagan disciples at Colosse in his letter? Was he contradicting Yahshua, by telling them it's OK to break Yahweh's law? Of course not.

Why would he tell anyone not to judge them for turning away from Paganism; and keeping Yahweh's law, as Yahshua did? Who would judge them; fellow disciples who had turned from lawlessness themselves? Doubtful.

I suspect that it was the Pagan friends and families of these former Pagans, who were trying to drag them back into their old lawless ways.

Lets look at this verse in that context:

Let no man therefore judge you in meat (as you eat kosher. I remember the pressure that my family put me through when I gave up pork), or in drink (as you abstain from drunkenness. I remember the pressure that my friends would put on me, in my younger years, to indulge in their drinking and drug parties.) , or in respect of an holyday, (as you keep Yahweh's Moedim as Yahshua and even Sha'ul (Paul) did.) or of the new moon, (as you keep them as commanded by Yahweh.) or of the sabbath days:(as you keep them as a sign between Yahweh and the sons of Israel, forever.)

Paul is addressing the conflict between at least so called believers within the Church. Paul isn't addressing paganism. The Judaizers kept days.

 

[listed]

(CLV) Hb 1:9
Thou lovest righteousness (kept THE LAW) and hatest injustice (disregard for THE LAW) ; Therefore Thou art anointed by The God, (tou theou) (YHWH), Thy God, with the oil of exultation beyond Thy partners."

Your verse doesn't say what you added in.

 

[listed]

I've given this subject great thought. What have I missed?

What problem? I simply provided verses that were related to your comments.

Glory to Yahweh!

I was trying to help you with that. To the best of my knowledge and ability, I quoted pure scripture. If I somehow, in your opinion, fall into the category of a crackpot; please send me a personal message explaining why. I'm not offended by sincere constructive criticism.

We are all guilty of breaking the law. My opinion on this subject is irrelevant on that point. That is between, each of us individually, and Yahweh.

I didn't present my words. I presented pure scripture, again, only to the best of my knowledge and ability.

It's not an accusation. It's an alert. When I read scripture, and I feel conviction; I give credit the Ruach HaKodedsh. I don't take offense to the printer of the text.

I thank Yahweh for that. Shalom.

I thought that I could help you with that. I apologize if my zeal to cut to the heart of the truth, in my still yet limited understanding (the law is a deep subject), has offended you.

Again, Shalom.

I would very much like to comment here but I'll refrain to keep from being reported. Any response would only be taken as a personal accusation.

 

[Kenny'sID]

I was trying to help you with that. To the best of my knowledge and ability, I quoted pure scripture. If I somehow, in your opinion, fall into the category of a crackpot; please send me a personal message explaining why. I'm not offended by sincere constructive criticism.

I see that you may not understand my concern for the way you answered my post with just warnings, and for the most part I'll not explain any more, but I will say, you may not have been able to help that, and I don't see you as a crackpot, I just don't want to leave this with you thinking that.

You understood that as me calling you a crackpot because of the way you looked at my post in general (why I was complaining about you not paying attention). But if you look closely, you will see, I diodn't say you were a crackpot at all, just that I like to make up my own mind with things, because there are so many out there passing off very bad info. It's a general rule I have, and though his doesn't even fall into my category of "bad info" my rule to make up my own mind still remains.

 

[HARK!]

(CLV) Hb 1:9
Thou lovest righteousness (kept THE LAW) and hatest injustice (disregard for THE LAW) ; Therefore Thou art anointed by The God, (tou theou) (YHWH), Thy God, with the oil of exultation beyond Thy partners."

Your verse doesn't say what you added in.

The Torah does.

Righteousness:

Deuteronomy 6:25
New International Version
And if we are careful to obey all this law before the LORD our God, as he has commanded us, that will be our righteousness."

Injustice:

Deuteronomy 16:19

"You shall not distort justice; you shall not be partial, and you shall not take a bribe, for a bribe blinds the eyes of the wise and perverts the words of the righteous.

 

[listed]

The Torah does.

Righteousness:

Deuteronomy 6:25
New International Version
And if we are careful to obey all this law before the LORD our God, as he has commanded us, that will be our righteousness."

Injustice:

Deuteronomy 16:19

"You shall not distort justice; you shall not be partial, and you shall not take a bribe, for a bribe blinds the eyes of the wise and perverts the words of the righteous.

You can have that kind of righteousness as far as I'm concerned. I want the righteousness given to Abraham and the righteousness provided for by and of Jesus Christ. Jesus' righteousness is the only way into heaven.

 

[listed]

The Torah does.

Righteousness:

Deuteronomy 6:25
New International Version
And if we are careful to obey all this law before the LORD our God, as he has commanded us, that will be our righteousness."

Injustice:

Deuteronomy 16:19

"You shall not distort justice; you shall not be partial, and you shall not take a bribe, for a bribe blinds the eyes of the wise and perverts the words of the righteous.

Doesn't change your verse. It also doesn't support your idea.

 

[Shimshon]

You can have that kind of righteousness as far as I'm concerned. I want the righteousness given to Abraham and the righteousness provided for by and of Jesus Christ. Jesus' righteousness is the only way into heaven.

Amen.
There is no righteousness in the way he is using the Law, against itself. If one truly follows the commandments of God they would be going to Jesus for the righteousness that brings life to the soul. Instead of returning to Moses and his ministry of death, that only foreshadowed and patterned the true ministry of Life.

The claim is righteousness comes by obeying the commandments of God. Very true. But what is the commandment of God for all believers?

John 6:44-51 No one can come to me unless the Father — the One who sent me — draws him. And I will raise him up on the Last Day.

It is written in the Prophets, `They will all be taught by ADONAI. Everyone who listens to the Father and learns from him comes to me. Not that anyone has seen the Father except the one who is from God — he has seen the Father.

Yes, indeed! I tell you, whoever trusts has eternal life: 48 I am the bread which is life. Your fathers ate the man in the desert; they died. But the bread that comes down from heaven is such that a person may eat it and not die. I am the living bread that has come down from heaven; if anyone eats this bread, he will live forever. Furthermore, the bread that I will give is my own flesh; and I will give it for the life of the world.”
​

Jesus is the only Way. No one can be found righteous without coming to Jesus for it. Everyone who listens to the Father, His Torah, comes to Jesus for righteousness, and eternal life. The bread our fathers ate, the Torah dealing with sins and death, did NOT offer the 'bread of life' that Jesus does. If you eat of the bread, Torah, of our father you will still die in your sins. It does NOT produce righteousness by sole obedience to the commands. However, the gospel speaks of an obedience the comes by faith.

Romans 1:5 Through him and for his name’s sake, we received grace and apostleship to call people from among all the Gentiles to the obedience that comes from faith.6 And you also are among those who are called to belong to Jesus Christ.

16 I am not ashamed of the gospel, because it is the power of God for the salvation of everyone who believes: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile.

17 For in the gospel a righteousness from God is revealed, a righteousness that is by faith from first to last, just as it is written: “The righteous will live by faith.”
​

The gospel describes an Obedience that comes through faith…. and reveals a righteousness from God “that is by faith from first to last” Meaning the righteousness has to do with NOTHING else but faith.

We are commanded to believe (obedience that comes from faith), and this faith reveals a righteousness from God sent as a gift.

To believe in the result of one act of righteousness that justified and brought life to all men. That through the obedience of the one man the many will be made righteous through faith, by the grace of God.

The result of one act of righteousness was justification that brings life for all men.

Through the obedience of the one man the many will be made righteous.

Grace reigns through (this) righteousness to bring eternal life through Yeshua.

Obedience that comes by faith….Faith observant! Observant to faith in the righteousness of Yeshua. Who he is and what he has done, for us. Grace reigns through the righteousness of Messiah, for all who are obedient in faith.

Romans 5

16 Again, the gift of God is not like the result of the one man's sin: The judgment followed one sin and brought condemnation, but the gift followed many trespasses and brought justification. 17 For if, by the trespass of the one man, death reigned through that one man, how much more will those who receive God's abundant provision of grace and of the gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man, Jesus Christ.

18 Consequently, just as the result of one trespass was condemnation for all men, so also the result of one act of righteousness was justification that brings life for all men. 19 For just as through the disobedience of the one man the many were made sinners, so also through the obedience of the one man the many will be made righteous.

20 The law was added so that the trespass might increase. But where sin increased, grace increased all the more,21 so that, just as sin reigned in death, so also grace might reign through righteousness to bring eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
​

​

 

[Shimshon]

Righteousness:

Deuteronomy 6:25
New International Version
And if we are careful to obey all this law before the LORD our God, as he has commanded us, that will be our righteousness."

We should desire a righteousness that does not fade, a glory that continues to reside forever in the place God set it.

The Torah of the Spirit (of God) is the Torah of Messiah.

Yeshua spoke the words of God by the Spirit of God within him. The Torah of the Spirit is the Torah of Messiah, because Messiah was given the Spirit to announce the justice of God to the world in regards to sin, righteousness, and judgement. God has spoken again from heaven, from above. And as prophesied by Moses in Deut 18, if we do not listen to ‘his words’ we will surely die, in our sins.

Matthew 12
18 “Here is my servant, whom I have chosen, my beloved, with whom I am well pleased; I will put my Spirit on him, and he will announce justice to the Gentiles.
​

Messiah received the Spirit of God within him to announce justice to the nations of the world.

John 6
63 It is the Spirit who gives life, the flesh is no help. The words I have spoken to you are Spirit and life,
​

The Spirit gives life, following laws dealing with sin and death are of no help to bring life to you. The words Yeshua speaks are life, applying the works of the flesh, laws dealing with sin and death are of no help giving life to the world. Only receiving the Spirit within will accomplish the giving of life to your soul.

2 Corinthians 3
17 Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.
​

Where the Spirit of God is there is freedom over sin and death.

The Torah does.

Do you really understand the righteousness that came through the Torah?

Romans 7
1 Surely you know, brothers – for I am speaking to those who understand Torah – that the Torah has authority over a person only so long as he lives?

4 Thus, my brothers, you have been made dead with regard to the Torah through the Messiah’s body, so that you may belong to someone else, namely, the one who has been raised from the dead, in order for us to bear fruit for God.

5 For when we were living according to our old nature, the passions connected with sins worked through the Torah in our various parts, with the result that we bore fruit for death. 6 But now we have been released from this aspect of the Torah, because we have died to that which had us in its clutches, so that we are serving in the new way provided by the Spirit and not in the old way of outwardly following the letter of the law.

9 I was once alive outside the framework of Torah. But when the commandment really encountered me, sin sprang to life, 10 and I died. The commandment that was intended to bring me life was found to be bringing me death!

13….it was sin working death in me through something good, so that sin might be clearly exposed as sin, so that sin through the commandment might come to be experienced as sinful beyond measure. 14 For we know that the Torah is of the Spirit;

Romans 8
1 Therefore, there is no longer any condemnation awaiting those who are in union with the Messiah Yeshua. 2 Why? Because the Torah of the Spirit, which produces this life in union with Messiah Yeshua, has set me free from the “Torah” of sin and death.
​

The Torah of the Spirit releases us from the Torah that deals with sin and death because having been united with Messiah through his death we are living in a new way provided by the Spirit. (Romans 7:1-13)

Because we are dead to the Torah dealing with sins and death there is no longer any condemnation now or in the future for those who are in union with the Messiah Yeshua. Because the Torah of the Spirit which produces this life in union with Messiah Yeshua has set me free from sin and death by uniting my heart with the Spirit of God. (Romans 8:1-2)

 

[listed]

Amen.
There is no righteousness in the way he is using the Law, against itself. If one truly follows the commandments of God they would be going to Jesus for the righteousness that brings life to the soul. Instead of returning to Moses and his ministry of death, that only foreshadowed and patterned the true ministry of Life.

The claim is righteousness comes by obeying the commandments of God. Very true. But what is the commandment of God for all believers?

John 6:44-51 No one can come to me unless the Father — the One who sent me — draws him. And I will raise him up on the Last Day.

It is written in the Prophets, `They will all be taught by ADONAI. Everyone who listens to the Father and learns from him comes to me. Not that anyone has seen the Father except the one who is from God — he has seen the Father.

Yes, indeed! I tell you, whoever trusts has eternal life: 48 I am the bread which is life. Your fathers ate the man in the desert; they died. But the bread that comes down from heaven is such that a person may eat it and not die. I am the living bread that has come down from heaven; if anyone eats this bread, he will live forever. Furthermore, the bread that I will give is my own flesh; and I will give it for the life of the world.”
​

Jesus is the only Way. No one can be found righteous without coming to Jesus for it. Everyone who listens to the Father, His Torah, comes to Jesus for righteousness, and eternal life. The bread our fathers ate, the Torah dealing with sins and death, did NOT offer the 'bread of life' that Jesus does. If you eat of the bread, Torah, of our father you will still die in your sins. It does NOT produce righteousness by sole obedience to the commands. However, the gospel speaks of an obedience the comes by faith.

Romans 1:5 Through him and for his name’s sake, we received grace and apostleship to call people from among all the Gentiles to the obedience that comes from faith.6 And you also are among those who are called to belong to Jesus Christ.

16 I am not ashamed of the gospel, because it is the power of God for the salvation of everyone who believes: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile.

17 For in the gospel a righteousness from God is revealed, a righteousness that is by faith from first to last, just as it is written: “The righteous will live by faith.”
​

The gospel describes an Obedience that comes through faith…. and reveals a righteousness from God “that is by faith from first to last” Meaning the righteousness has to do with NOTHING else but faith.

We are commanded to believe (obedience that comes from faith), and this faith reveals a righteousness from God sent as a gift.

To believe in the result of one act of righteousness that justified and brought life to all men. That through the obedience of the one man the many will be made righteous through faith, by the grace of God.

The result of one act of righteousness was justification that brings life for all men.

Through the obedience of the one man the many will be made righteous.

Grace reigns through (this) righteousness to bring eternal life through Yeshua.

Obedience that comes by faith….Faith observant! Observant to faith in the righteousness of Yeshua. Who he is and what he has done, for us. Grace reigns through the righteousness of Messiah, for all who are obedient in faith.

Romans 5

16 Again, the gift of God is not like the result of the one man's sin: The judgment followed one sin and brought condemnation, but the gift followed many trespasses and brought justification. 17 For if, by the trespass of the one man, death reigned through that one man, how much more will those who receive God's abundant provision of grace and of the gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man, Jesus Christ.

18 Consequently, just as the result of one trespass was condemnation for all men, so also the result of one act of righteousness was justification that brings life for all men. 19 For just as through the disobedience of the one man the many were made sinners, so also through the obedience of the one man the many will be made righteous.

20 The law was added so that the trespass might increase. But where sin increased, grace increased all the more,21 so that, just as sin reigned in death, so also grace might reign through righteousness to bring eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.​

Excellent post, well done!

 

[listed]

We should desire a righteousness that does not fade, a glory that continues to reside forever in the place God set it.

The Torah of the Spirit (of God) is the Torah of Messiah.

Yeshua spoke the words of God by the Spirit of God within him. The Torah of the Spirit is the Torah of Messiah, because Messiah was given the Spirit to announce the justice of God to the world in regards to sin, righteousness, and judgement. God has spoken again from heaven, from above. And as prophesied by Moses in Deut 18, if we do not listen to ‘his words’ we will surely die, in our sins.

Matthew 12
18 “Here is my servant, whom I have chosen, my beloved, with whom I am well pleased; I will put my Spirit on him, and he will announce justice to the Gentiles.
​

Messiah received the Spirit of God within him to announce justice to the nations of the world.

John 6
63 It is the Spirit who gives life, the flesh is no help. The words I have spoken to you are Spirit and life,
​

The Spirit gives life, following laws dealing with sin and death are of no help to bring life to you. The words Yeshua speaks are life, applying the works of the flesh, laws dealing with sin and death are of no help giving life to the world. Only receiving the Spirit within will accomplish the giving of life to your soul.

2 Corinthians 3
17 Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.
​

Where the Spirit of God is there is freedom over sin and death.

Do you really understand the righteousness that came through the Torah?

Romans 7
1 Surely you know, brothers – for I am speaking to those who understand Torah – that the Torah has authority over a person only so long as he lives?

4 Thus, my brothers, you have been made dead with regard to the Torah through the Messiah’s body, so that you may belong to someone else, namely, the one who has been raised from the dead, in order for us to bear fruit for God.

5 For when we were living according to our old nature, the passions connected with sins worked through the Torah in our various parts, with the result that we bore fruit for death. 6 But now we have been released from this aspect of the Torah, because we have died to that which had us in its clutches, so that we are serving in the new way provided by the Spirit and not in the old way of outwardly following the letter of the law.

9 I was once alive outside the framework of Torah. But when the commandment really encountered me, sin sprang to life, 10 and I died. The commandment that was intended to bring me life was found to be bringing me death!

13….it was sin working death in me through something good, so that sin might be clearly exposed as sin, so that sin through the commandment might come to be experienced as sinful beyond measure. 14 For we know that the Torah is of the Spirit;

Romans 8
1 Therefore, there is no longer any condemnation awaiting those who are in union with the Messiah Yeshua. 2 Why? Because the Torah of the Spirit, which produces this life in union with Messiah Yeshua, has set me free from the “Torah” of sin and death.
​

The Torah of the Spirit releases us from the Torah that deals with sin and death because having been united with Messiah through his death we are living in a new way provided by the Spirit. (Romans 7:1-13)

Because we are dead to the Torah dealing with sins and death there is no longer any condemnation now or in the future for those who are in union with the Messiah Yeshua. Because the Torah of the Spirit which produces this life in union with Messiah Yeshua has set me free from sin and death by uniting my heart with the Spirit of God. (Romans 8:1-2)

You're on a very good roll!

 

[Lulav]

If keeping the Torah did not bring righteousness or life (which it does state in the OT) then what was it's purpose. (And not looking for the answer to show us our sins)

 

[listed]

If keeping the Torah did not bring righteousness or life (which it does state in the OT) then what was it's purpose. (And not looking for the answer to show us our sins)

• To show our need
• To provide a basis to punish evil
• To be able to grant mercy to all (Romans 11:32)

I know you might say all that was done without the law. Mercy was granted only to a select few. I can not explain why except God's love for mankind to carry out His purpose.

 

[Shimshon]

If keeping the Torah did not bring righteousness or life (which it does state in the OT) then what was it's purpose. (And not looking for the answer to show us our sins)

First, The commands the LORD gave Moses to teach the children of Israel related to the land they were crossing over the Jordan to possess. Deut 6 The purpose was 'so that' Israel would fear the LORD and have long life, 'increasing greatly in the land'. That was the promise the LORD made with Israel through Abraham regarding the land.

The commands the LORD commanded that day were to be on the hearts. BUT how was it to be ministered? Through the indwelling of the Spirit of God as it is today, or by teaching each person to 'know the LORD' through things that patterned his true righteousness?

Today we all know the LORD from the least to the greatest through the Spirit of God he has gifted us. It teaches us all wisdom, reminds us of all his words, and unites us as one with Messiah Yeshua. We have no need to teach others 'know the LORD' because the Law of the Spirit produces a life in union with Messiah Yeshua. He dwells within us. Emmanuel.

However, under the covenant ministered through Moses every man was to teach another to 'know the LORD' through obeying the words given on the mountain. Hence we then had instruction to;

7 Impress them on your children. Talk about them when you sit at home and when you walk along the road, when you lie down and when you get up.
8 Tie them as symbols on your hands and bind them on your foreheads.
9 Write them on the doorframes of your houses and on your gates.​

To teach them, display them on our bodies, and write them on the property in the land. When was this to be done?

10 When the LORD your God brings you into the land he swore to your fathers, to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, to give you—a land with large, flourishing cities you did not build,
11 houses filled with all kinds of good things you did not provide, wells you did not dig, and vineyards and olive groves you did not plant—then when you eat and are satisfied,
12 be careful that you do not forget the LORD, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery.​

Today in the kingdom of God we are all taught by the Lord who has gifted us who believed in him the Spirit of the Living God. We are in union with Messiah through the Spirit that lives within us. This was not the purpose of the Laws given through Moses. This is what is stated;

Deut 6:18
Do what is right and good in the LORD’s sight, so that it may go well with you and you may go in and take over the good land the LORD promised on oath to your ancestors,
19 thrusting out all your enemies before you, as the LORD said.​

There is that 'so that' again. So that you will be righteous in God's sight? or that it would go well with us in the land promised to Abraham? All these mitzvot deal with the land.

20 In the future, when your son asks you, “What is the meaning of the stipulations, decrees and laws the LORD our God has commanded you?”
21 tell him: “We were slaves of Pharaoh in Egypt, but the LORD brought us out of Egypt with a mighty hand.
22 Before our eyes the LORD sent signs and wonders—great and terrible—on Egypt and Pharaoh and his whole household.
23 But he brought us out from there to bring us in and give us the land he promised on oath to our ancestors.
24 The LORD commanded us to obey all these decrees and to fear the LORD our God, so that we might always prosper and be kept alive, as is the case today.
25 And if we are careful to obey all this law before the LORD our God, as he has commanded us, that will be our righteousness.”
​

And now the context has been made. What is the purpose of all these stipulations, decrees and laws the LORD commanded. What is the purpose of the Law? To prosper in the land promised to Abraham. Israel was sold as slaves into Egypt but the LORD brought them out with signs and wonders to dwell in the land promised to Abraham. If Israel wanted this blessing to remain they would have to obey all the Law as given. Teaching every man to know the LORD through teaching the commands. These things related solely to the land. Because the curse for not following the commands was to be rejected by the LORD 'by removing them from the land'. Direct correlation with the Law and the Land.

However, let's focus on 'that will be our righteousness'. Our righteousness comes only if we are careful to obey all the law as commanded to Moses for Israel? This is what the Spirit through Yeshua taught the disciples? Or did God state 'the righteous will live by faith'? Yes, we know faith without works is dead, not faith at all. Yet, we also know that our works do not produce our righteousness, but faith produce works of righteousness, and those works are not our own but of the One who lives and dwells within us. This is where Paul's writings make so much sense. It takes faith to become obedient to the commandments. I'd say if they are faithful to obey all this law before the LORD as commanded it will be their righteousness. Because only faith produces obedience that leads to righteousness.

 

[Shimshon]

If keeping the Torah did not bring righteousness or life (which it does state in the OT) then what was it's purpose. (And not looking for the answer to show us our sins)

And, concerning 'what' is our righteousness?

Jeremiah 23
3 "I myself will gather what remains of my flock from all the countries where I have driven them and bring them back to their homes, and they will be fruitful and increase their numbers.
4 I will appoint shepherds over them who will shepherd them; then they will no longer be afraid or disgraced; and none will be missing," says ADONAI
5 "The days are coming," says ADONAI when I will raise a righteous Branch for David. He will reign as king and succeed, he will do what is just and right in the land.

6 In his days Y'hudah will be saved, Isra'el will live in safety, and the name given to him will be ADONAI Tzidkenu [ADONAI our righteousness].

7 "Therefore," says ADONAI, "the day will come when people no longer swear, 'As ADONAI lives, who brought the people of Isra'el out of the land of Egypt,' 8 but, 'As ADONAI lives, who brought the descendants of the house of Isra'el up from the land to the north' and from all the countries where I drove them. Then they will live in their own land.​

Our righteousness is found in Yeshua, who dwells within us. Something only shadowed and patterned through the Law, but now a reality to those in union with Messiah through the Law of the Spirit. Administered under a new covenant, not like the one made with our fathers who came out of Egypt.

The book of Hebrews explains this all to well.

The high priest stood before the sanctuary and was to enter into the presence of God's Spirit through the sacrifice of animals using their blood. The people would come to the priest to present their offerings to God for the forgiveness of their sins (not discussing other offerings here, the most important and pertinent is the sin offering). By faith the people offer to the priest, by faith the priest offers to God. The actual ritual of sacrificing the animal and pouring the blood does nothing to add to life. It can not bring righteousness to the one who works the command. ONLY through faith will the offering be acceptable. ONLY through faith will they receive any blessing from God. Faithful obedience. Obedience to the faith. It took faith to operate the laws given Moses!

Just as it takes faith to operate the law of the Spirit given through Yeshua. The righteous will live by faith. Obedience through faith produces righteousness. The gospel describes an Obedience that comes through faith…. and reveals a righteousness from God “that is by faith from first to last” Observant to faith in the righteousness of Yeshua. Who he is and what he has done, for us. Grace reigns through the righteousness of Messiah, for all who are obedient in faith.


Today Yeshua is our high priest whom all authority in heaven and earth has been given. He sits before the heavenly sanctuary at the right hand of God. Waiting for his enemies to run their course. Today Yeshua sits in the chambers of our soul (our hearts) because of the once and for all sacrifice of his life with his blood. We have union with him through the Spirit and are thus united with Messiah and God. We have been placed in our heavenly home, and wait for God to complete his work of redemption, as our righteousness is being perfected. Lived out through acts of the Spirit within us. Being sealed until the day of our redemption. None of this was possible through the Law, it only pointed to this blessed gift from God. And is now fulfilled in those who follow the law of the Spirit. Because the LORD our righteousness has produced in his children a life in union with Messiah Yeshua through the Spirit. There is no more condemnation, no law against us who live according to the commands of Yeshua.

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

Interesting the shift from the national Sunday Law the Op was referring to and the topic currently being hashed out....