Nagasaki - what was really targetted and why?

[RDKirk]

As a general rule I dont trust WIKI.
Or at least until checking the facts.

If for example you take any phenomenon linked to christianity you see sceptic pseudoscience and references replacing the real science.

And you trust a video instead?

How about if we search YouTube for scurrilous videos?

The question begged in the video was.. they deliberately avoided firebombing in areas that were nuclear targets. Why did they break their own rule?

General Curtis LeMay, who was commanding the conventional bombing of Japan at that time had a blanket order to "destroy every large and medium sized city on the Japanese mainland."

And he was proceeding to do that with extreme vigor. In fact, the Manhattan Project team feared that LeMay was afraid that LeMay would complete that mission before they had the atomic bomb ready.

 

[Albion]

General Curtis LeMay, who was commanding the conventional bombing of Japan at that time had a blanket order to "destroy every large and medium sized city on the Japanese mainland."

Which, by August of 1945, had almost been accomplished. Finding new targets with which to make a statement sufficient to persuade the Japanese government to surrender in short order was not the easiest thing to do.

 

[RDKirk]

Which, by August of 1945, had almost been accomplished. Finding new targets with which to make a statement sufficient to persuade the Japanese government to surrender in short order was not the easiest thing to do.

Back in the early 80s, the Japanese Imperial Army doctor who made the medical report of the atomic bombings to the Imperial Army general staff stated that the bombs actually saved Japan. In his opinion, an Allied land invasion would have ultimately succeeded, but at the cost of the majority of Japanese lives--far more than those lost in the atomic bombings.

 

[com7fy8]

and them stab themselves.

Kamikaze stuff. According to my info, that was the sort of way the hardcore Japanese imperialists could do things. But, I thought their tendency was to kill themselves only if they had failed in a mission and so they were shamed. So, if she killed a guy before doing anything with him, there would be no shame, and she might live to kill other soldiers. So, I don't know why they would not have her try to stay alive for future killing of soldiers.

Also, it might not have worked much, because word could get out pretty quickly, and females could be searched.

 

[Albion]

RDK...
did you mean far MORE than in the atomic bombings???

 

[EzekielsWheels]

I don't know that churches were specifically targeted but I do pray for the protection of all churches in any and all military campaigns.

 

[DamianWarS]

Evidence implies that the obvious second military target in Japan was ignored (which was in clear weather), and the replacement target Nagasaki (in much worse weather) had only one major military target - the mitsubishi ship yards.

But the bomb did not strike even close to the shipyard ...it was several KM north, the epicentre was the Cathedral. Nagasaki was the actually the thriving and growing centre of japanese Christianity and nicknamed "little Rome" because of it.

And those deciding the targetting were part of the so called "brotherhood of death" - a masonic society, determined to wipe out christianity.

It may be just a conspiracy theory, but it is particularly nasty.
And there never was a logic behind Nagasaki as a military target - which would have been way down any list of military target options.
You judge....

The Secret of Nagasaki

Christianity accounts for like 1% of Japan, I'm not sure what it was like in 1945 but it has always had low numbers. Japanese Christianity really didn't need to be kicked when it was down (it never really was up) even if their communities agreed with Japanese agendas at the time. I know a great Christian family and their kids boast about how a great uncle of theirs worked on the atomic bomb for Hiroshima and Nagasaki. I always tell tell them that's not something they should be proud of. My greater concern is the Christian involvement in dropping the bomb not the Christians it was dropped on.

 

[RDKirk]

Kamikaze stuff. According to my info, that was the sort of way the hardcore Japanese imperialists could do things. But, I thought their tendency was to kill themselves only if they had failed in a mission and so they were shamed. So, if she killed a guy before doing anything with him, there would be no shame, and she might live to kill other soldiers. So, I don't know why they would not have her try to stay alive for future killing of soldiers..

The same reason women on Okinawa did throw themselves off cliffs when the Allied victory became clear.

 

[Albion]

Aside from the idea that bombing a church building was the objective--which the video did not come close to demonstrating--the claim that doing this would somehow stop Asia from becoming Christian is simply ridiculous.

 

[RDKirk]

RDK...
did you mean far MORE than in the atomic bombings???

Yes.

Fixed.

 

[jacks]

Just for the record Nagasaki was known as "Little Rome" back in 1582, by 1587 all the missionary had been expelled. By 1597 they were crucified on Nishizaka Hill in Nagasaki.

 

[redleghunter]

In the first US aggression on Iraq, under Bush 41, most Christian churches in the country were bombed, including the very old cathedral in Baghdad.

You have evidence for this?

 

[redleghunter]

Evidence implies that the obvious second military target in Japan was ignored (which was in clear weather), and the replacement target Nagasaki (in much worse weather) had only one major military target - the mitsubishi ship yards.

But the bomb did not strike even close to the shipyard ...it was several KM north, the epicentre was the Cathedral. Nagasaki was the actually the thriving and growing centre of japanese Christianity and nicknamed "little Rome" because of it.

And those deciding the targetting were part of the so called "brotherhood of death" - a masonic society, determined to wipe out christianity.

It may be just a conspiracy theory, but it is particularly nasty.
And there never was a logic behind Nagasaki as a military target - which would have been way down any list of military target options.
You judge....

The Secret of Nagasaki

So you are posting this on the day Americans died from Japanese attacks on Pearl Harbor.

Have you no shame. !?

 

[marineimaging]

Evidence implies that the obvious second military target in Japan was ignored (which was in clear weather), and the replacement target Nagasaki (in much worse weather) had only one major military target - the mitsubishi ship yards.

But the bomb did not strike even close to the shipyard ...it was several KM north, the epicentre was the Cathedral. Nagasaki was the actually the thriving and growing centre of japanese Christianity and nicknamed "little Rome" because of it.

And those deciding the targetting were part of the so called "brotherhood of death" - a masonic society, determined to wipe out christianity.

It may be just a conspiracy theory, but it is particularly nasty.
And there never was a logic behind Nagasaki as a military target - which would have been way down any list of military target options.
You judge....

The Secret of Nagasaki

Or, is it possible our President and leaders were trying to stop a war and that where and when they dropped the bombs were part of a plan that worked. Notice that we are not writing in Japanese?

 

[com7fy8]

women on Okinawa did throw themselves off cliffs when the Allied victory became clear.

I think I remember being told that ones in power in Japan told women that they would be violated by the Americans if they got caught. But if that is true, it was the ones Japanese . . . or not truly Japanese . . . who betrayed those women.

My opinion now is that in every country there is a number of psychopaths ready to go with some evil person who takes power. And they can be used to intimidate or trick many others into helping them control a country.

But I would say there were Japanese who all along knew how wrong the imperialists were. I don't know how they handled that. I don't think I would kill myself, but if I was forced into military action, I might make sure I did not shoot toward anyone.

 

[chilehed]

Evidence implies that the obvious second military target in Japan was ignored (which was in clear weather), and the replacement target Nagasaki (in much worse weather) had only one major military target - the mitsubishi ship yards.

As was typical for Japanese industrial centers during the war, the manufacturing facilities were distributed throughout the entire city into individual homes: the entire city was the factory. It wasn't possible to distinguish between civilian and military targets, because no such distinction existed.

 

[JackRT]

As a student of military history, I am of two minds about Hiroshima and Nagasaki. I am appalled at the terrible loss of life both at the time and since then due to radiation effects. The total I believe may be several hundred thousand.

On the other hand, the invasion of the Japanese main islands was scheduled for the spring of 1946. Military planners were already well aware that the Japanese defense would be desperate and deadly. The official Japanese slogan of the day was "90 million die together”. The Allied planners were preparing for 6 million casualties in the invasion. It was estimated that 2 million of those would be deaths.

It must have been a heart wrenching decision for Truman to have to make. Remember that he had available only those two bombs. Another six would be available in 1946. He may very well have made the right decision based on the lesser of two evils proposition.

What Truman did not know, and is still little known today, is that the Japanese nuclear program was well advanced and was not years behind but only a few weeks behind. Their main research and development facility was located in what is now North Korea at a location known as Project Z. There is evidence that the Japanese actually conducted a successful nuclear test in the Sea of Japan off the coast of North Korea on the day before the Emperor intervened and forced the Japanese surrender.

Interestingly enough, Project Z fell into the hands of the Russian occupiers of North Korea and Russia was a nuclear power within a few short years.

 

[marineimaging]

Wrong.

I was on the targeting teams, and you're just plain wrong.

RD - My brother was a hard and fast family man, Christian, conservative..., but he could believe those fairy tales left and right. Deny the educators and educate the ignorant liars. Just like today on TV on Discovery and History Channel where they are supposed to be telling truthful information, listen to how many times they say "Could it be...", or "It is possible...?" Satan's formula to take over the world. Thanks for your service from one to another. God bless you and your family.

 

[gideon123]

Can I please try to STOP the conspiracy theories. It is enough to go with the truth. The truth is painful enough. You will have to trust me, when I tell you that I have some knowledge of these things.

Nagasaki and Hiroshima were military targets. The USA wanted to stop WW2 quickly. The estimates were that a huge number of American casualties would occur, if America invaded the mainland of Japan. Undoutedly, all these things were true.

Nagasaki was a backup target, just as you say. The city was a target because it represented a "military test" of the new weapon ... the atomic bomb. There is the painful reality. A group of criteria were put together to choose targets that would allow evaluation of the effects of the weapon. That was the reason. All the other conspiracy theories are complete rubbish. Isnt the truth painful enough? Yet there are still many in America who say the atomic bomb explosions were perfectly justified.

One extra painful .reality was that Nagasaki was the home of Christianity in Japan. The Catholic Church was centered there. On the day that the bomb fell, many Catholics were incinerated. But it is not clear that military planners in the USA were aware of this, and probably they did not know. Things were rushed. The whole atomic bomb project was moving at a very rapid pace. There was a war going on.

And the result was the bombing of Nagasaki, just as you mention.

 

[Lazarus Short]

You have evidence for this?

No - I trusted my source at the time, a Christian organization known as the Northpoint Teams.

 

[com7fy8]

The official Japanese slogan of the day was "90 million die together”.

The imperialists, I have been told, were demanding that every Japanese fight to the death. It would be considered a shame to surrender to what they considered to be inferior beings.

The total I believe may be several hundred thousand.

. . . that because of the nukes falling on Japan. I think in Rwanda the ethnic cleansing killed more than that. On the ground killing can kill many more. A quick Net check source says half to a full million were killed. And one newscast seems to have said that a hundred thousand noncombatants were killed while the U.S. took out Saddam.

the Japanese nuclear program was well advanced and was not years behind but only a few weeks behind.

I was told that also the Nazis were just about to get the bomb. That's interesting, that both regimes could be that close, at the same time as they were about to be taken out. So, this is fable to justify stopping these people, or it was coincidence. If both were so close, this can show how God is in control of how things coincide, managing how far an evil development can go.