• Welcome to Christian Forums
  1. Welcome to Christian Forums, a forum to discuss Christianity in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

  2. The forums in the Christian Congregations category are now open only to Christian members. Please review our current Faith Groups list for information on which faith groups are considered to be Christian faiths. Christian members please remember to read the Statement of Purpose threads for each forum within Christian Congregations before posting in the forum.
  3. Please note there is a new rule regarding the posting of videos. It reads, "Post a summary of the videos you post . An exception can be made for music videos.". Unless you are simply sharing music, please post a summary, or the gist, of the video you wish to share.

Featured My studies with the Chronological Bible----continued

Discussion in 'Christian History' started by ilovejcsog, Jan 28, 2020.

  1. ilovejcsog

    ilovejcsog I am a Christian mutt. You can call me Rox

    +889
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Single
    US-Constitution
    I started studying a Chronological bible recently and was reminded of this scripture.
    "3 In the course of time Cain brought some of the fruits of the soil as an offering to the Lord. 4 And Abel also brought an offering—fat portions from some of the firstborn of his flock. The Lord looked with favor on Abel and his offering, 5 but on Cain and his offering he did not look with favor. So Cain was very angry, and his face was downcast."
    I don't understand why God treated Cain as he did and wonder the outcome had he showed the same love to Cain as he did Abel.
    Do you understand why God rejected Cain and his gift?
     
    We teamed up with Faith Counseling. Can they help you today?
  2. coffee4u

    coffee4u Well-Known Member

    +684
    Australia
    Christian
    Married
    Cain brought his offerings with the wrong motives and Abel with the right ones.

    Remember God is interested in the heart not outward appearances.
    1 Samuel 16:7
    7 But the Lord said to Samuel, “Do not look on his appearance or on the height of his stature, because I have rejected him. For the Lord sees not as man sees: man looks on the outward appearance, but the Lord looks on the heart.”

    We know that Cain's heart was not right because of what he went and did directly after that. Decent people no matter how angry don't go and bash their brother's head in and leave them dead in a field.


    You can also see his attitude was bad when he talked directly to God.
    9 Then the Lord said to Cain, “Where is Abel your brother?”
    He said, “I do not know. Am I my brother’s keeper?”
    He had just committed murder, he wasn't running in fear but lied to God with attitude. These all show us what Cain's true character was like, no matter how nice his offering might have looked.

     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2020
  3. brinny

    brinny everlovin' shiner of light in dark places Supporter

    +106,706
    Non-Denom
    Private
    US-Constitution
    Cain was willful and rebellious as evidenced by dismissing what God said was acceptable. Abel was obedient in bringing what was required. Cain neither had a heart for God nor paid Him any heed.

    Based on what he did, it indicates that he was also disrespectful and disobedient and dishonored his parents as well, for it was his parents who taught both him and Abel what was required as an offering.

    Cain was rebellious and stiff-necked. It is written that it is an abomination to God and is akin to witchcraft:

    "For rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness is as iniquity and idolatry." ~I Sam 15:23

    The "idolatry" is that we are "worshiping" ourselves, rather than God, for our rebellion is the fruit of that idolatry.

    As was already mentioned, it's a matter of our "heart-condition" before God. That is what God sees, and not our outward appearance.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Winner Winner x 1
    • List
  4. HTacianas

    HTacianas Well-Known Member

    +5,285
    United States
    Eastern Orthodox
    Single
    Cain misbehaved:

    Gen 4:7If you do well, will you not be accepted? And if you do not do well, sin lies at the door. And its desire is for you, but you should rule over it.”
    .

    It's the same today. Approaching the altar in an unworthy manner:

    1Co 11:29 For he who eats and drinks in an unworthy manner eats and drinks judgment to himself, not discerning the Lord's body.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Useful Useful x 1
    • List
  5. joshua 1 9

    joshua 1 9 Well-Known Member Supporter

    +3,524
    United States
    Christian
    Married
    There are many who believe that Cain's offering was not accepted because it was not a blood sacrifice like Abel's. "without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness." (Hebrew 9:22)
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Winner Winner x 2
    • List
  6. ilovejcsog

    ilovejcsog I am a Christian mutt. You can call me Rox

    +889
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Single
    US-Constitution
    Prior to Cains gift to God it says nothing about Cains negatives. Only after the gift does Cain show an attitude. I guess I am missing something. I appreciate your answers and realize you are right but wish that I could see these scriptures as you do. I am using the NIV chrono. Perhaps I need a more involved version.

    "4 Adam[a] made love to his wife Eve, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Cain. She said, “With the help of the Lord I have brought forth[c] a man.” 2 Later she gave birth to his brother Abel.
    3 In the course of time Cain brought some of the fruits of the soil as an offering to the Lord. 4 And Abel also brought an offering—fat portions from some of the firstborn of his flock. The Lord looked with favor on Abel and his offering, 5 but on Cain and his offering he did not look with favor. So Cain was very angry, and his face was downcast.
    Now Abel kept flocks, and Cain worked the soil. "
     
  7. ilovejcsog

    ilovejcsog I am a Christian mutt. You can call me Rox

    +889
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Single
    US-Constitution
    Bless you all who are responding to this thread and thank you:)
    I lost my teacher who was my guide.
     
  8. Aussie Pete

    Aussie Pete Well-Known Member Supporter

    +2,163
    Australia
    Non-Denom
    Divorced
    It helps to remember that an animal lost its life so that Adam and Eve could be clothed. God set a precedent there. Also, attitude does not appear instantaneously. Hebrews 11:4 states that Abel offered in faith, in contrast to Cain. Abel was a man of faith. And without faith, it is impossible to please God.
     
  9. joshua 1 9

    joshua 1 9 Well-Known Member Supporter

    +3,524
    United States
    Christian
    Married
    Holy Spirit of God is to be our Teacher and our Guide. "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, He will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you." (John 14:26)
     
  10. icxn

    icxn Bραδύγλωσσος αἰπόλος μαθητεύων κνίζειν συκάμινα

    +673
    United States
    Eastern Orthodox
    Private
    Abel's sacrifice was accepted because of his intention. He honored God by selecting the best of his produce (Genesis 4:4), whereas Cain chose randomly (Genesis 4:3). This is even more clear in verse 7 (in the Greek Septuagint text at least) "Hast thou not sinned if thou hast brought it rightly, but not rightly divided it?"
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • List
  11. joshua 1 9

    joshua 1 9 Well-Known Member Supporter

    +3,524
    United States
    Christian
    Married
    My mom use to wear a fur coat. I had a jacket made out of down once to stay warm in the winter. Even we had a real down sleeping bag that my son used. Man made insulation: Thinsulate was first sold in 1979. It became popular very fast. According to science a species can go east and west but north and south is more difficult. Most likely they used the fiber from the fig tree to make clothing. This was not warm enough to go very far north. This would be more for vanity and decoration and not really serve any function.

    "The sewing needle is said to have been invented sometime during the Upper Paleolithic time period, which began around 40,000 years ago. It's widely disputed when the first needles were used, with claims that range from 30,000 years ago to 60,000 years ago."
     
  12. Ken Rank

    Ken Rank Well-Known Member Supporter

    +5,406
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Married
    In Psalms it states that the sacrifices of the LORD are a broken spirit and contrite heart. What that means is that a REAL sacrifice to the LORD comes from the heart. When one sinned, it wasn't the smoke from the burning flesh of a lamb that pleased God... it was the broken heart of the sinner who had to offer that lamb BECAUSE of his sin that goes up before the LORD as a sweet savor.

    Cain's heart probably wasn't in the offering, and that is why it wasn't accepted as Abel's was. IMHO
     
  13. DavidPT

    DavidPT Well-Known Member

    +951
    United States
    Christian
    Married
    Food for thought----


    Genesis 3:17 And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;

    Genesis 4:3 And in process of time it came to pass, that Cain brought of the fruit of the ground an offering unto the LORD.
    4 And Abel, he also brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof. And the LORD had respect unto Abel and to his offering:
    5 But unto Cain and to his offering he had not respect. And Cain was very wroth, and his countenance fell.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • List
  14. Shrewd Manager

    Shrewd Manager Through him, in all things, more than conquerors. Supporter

    +1,489
    Australia
    Christian
    Single
    It's in the gift - Abel gave God his best, Cain just brought a bag of spuds. Where was the heart in Cain's offering? It was a merely perfunctory gesture. He "whatever'ed" God, whereas Abel gave 'of himself'.

    That's why when we hear 'every knee will bow and tongue confess', we can be sure that God will make Abels of us all through Christ, there will be no perfunctory genuflections. And Abel is a type of Christ, He has the spirit of self-sacrifice, of loving God before himself.

    So we see the seeds of God's great plan of universal salvation starting to sprout in the Cain and Abel story.
     
  15. joshua 1 9

    joshua 1 9 Well-Known Member Supporter

    +3,524
    United States
    Christian
    Married
    I use bible hub any rely on the original Hebrew & Greek quite a bit. It is interesting to see how different the different translations are.
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2020
  16. joshua 1 9

    joshua 1 9 Well-Known Member Supporter

    +3,524
    United States
    Christian
    Married
  17. coffee4u

    coffee4u Well-Known Member

    +684
    Australia
    Christian
    Married
    The Bible only ever shows a tiny slice of a person's life, a defining moment. Yes, it shows attitude after the gift but that would not incite a good, moral person to murder. Also you must read the entire passage before drawing any conclusions. In fact you might want to look up other verses as well to be sure you are getting the whole picture. If you only ever read a third or so and start joining dots prematurely you can get entirely the wrong idea. The Bible wasn't written in English and is from a different culture so it may not always arrange the text in the way you are used to.

    1 John 3:12
    not as Cain, who was of the evil one and slew his brother And for what reason did he slay him? Because his deeds were evil, and his brother's were righteous.


    Jude 1:11

    Woe to them! For they have gone the way of Cain, and for pay they have rushed headlong into the error of Balaam, and perished in the rebellion of Korah.
     
  18. ilovejcsog

    ilovejcsog I am a Christian mutt. You can call me Rox

    +889
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Single
    US-Constitution
    Bless you all for responding with very knowledgeable answers.
     
  19. joshua 1 9

    joshua 1 9 Well-Known Member Supporter

    +3,524
    United States
    Christian
    Married
    Two people wrote the Bible: Moses and Jesus. So we look at the Torah & the Red Letters. Everything else is either prophecy or commentary. Although it almost seems that David goes above and beyond because of his love for God and His love for the Law of God. Even though David was a man of blood and he was not permitted to build the temple of God.
     
  20. Soyeong

    Soyeong Well-Known Member

    +3,063
    Messianic
    Single
    The Bible doesn't say why God rejected Cain's offering, but we can speculate. Some think that it is because Abel offered the best portions of crops, however, it doesn't say that Cain did not offer the best portions from his produce. Likewise, God gain instructions for offerings other than animals (Leviticus 2:1), so the problem wasn't necessarily that Cain didn't offer animal.

    In Exodus, it ends with the glory of God descending on the tent of meeting and the problem of no one being able to approach, while Leviticus begins with God calling out instructions for how to draw close to Him, so Leviticus should be thought of as instructions for how to draw close to God, not as a butcher's manual, and indeed that is what the root word for offering means. So if someone were offering an animal without a broken and contrite heart that was full of repentance and the desire to draw close to God, then they were missing the whole point and accomplishing nothing more than depriving themselves of livestock (Isaiah 1:13-15). Our heart also needs to be right with our brother before we can become right with God (Matthew 5:23-24). So the main reason why God would not accept someone's offering was if their heart was not in the right place. This is likely also related to Genesis 4:6-7, where God told Cain that would be accepted if he did well and that sin was couching at the door.

    The penalty for murder is death, yet Cain was not given the death penalty, which indicates that he was not found guilty of murder. Rather, his concern for being killed by an avenger and with him being given protection shows that he was treated in a way that parallels God's instructions in Deuteronomy 19 for how to treat someone who is guilty of accidental manslaughter.
     
Loading...