My commentary on Daniel 9:24

Douggg

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What are the criteria that God will use to determine who is the Israel that will be saved?

1. Jewish DNA
2. Jewish religion
3. Jewish culture
4. Faith in the Son of God unto salvation

?
If you believe Jesus was a Jew - then John 1:11 informs you.
John 1:11 He came unto his own, and his own received him not.

There has been no break in the Jews' rejection of Jesus since the first century, and no breaks in them wanting to return to Israel. Which by the Will of God has taken place in these end times, and Israel a nation again.
 
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Dave L

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Dave, really, why are you continuing with this?
Because it shows how you take already fulfilled prophecies, rewrite them and use them to predict the future with.
 
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Douggg

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Because it shows how you take already fulfilled prophecies, rewrite them and use them to predict the future with.
No, it doesn't. It shows how desperate you are to hold onto a position that doesn't line up with Ezekiel 39:21-29.
 
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BABerean2

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There has been no break in the Jews' rejection of Jesus since the first century,


Ignore the about 3,000 from "all the house of Israel" on the Day of Pentecost, and ignore Romans 11:1-5, and ignore the Book of Hebrews, and ignore James 1:1-3, and maybe you can get your version to work...

.
 
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Douggg

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Ignore the about 3,000 from "all the house of Israel" on the Day of Pentecost, and ignore Romans 11:1-5, and ignore the Book of Hebrews, and ignore James 1:1-3, and maybe you can get your version to work...

.
Bab2, you are ignoring Ezekiel 39:21-29, Jesus Himself speaking. All of the house of Israel in Acts means some from each of the twelve tribes.
 
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jgr

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If you believe Jesus was a Jew - then John 1:11 informs you.
John 1:11 He came unto his own, and his own received him not.

There has been no break in the Jews' rejection of Jesus since the first century, and no breaks in them wanting to return to Israel. Which by the Will of God has taken place in these end times, and Israel a nation again.

The contextual definition of "own" (Greek "idios") in John 1:11 is the fellow countrymen and associates of one's native land, e.g. the residents of the land of Israel.

Thus God's criterion for determining who He includes in Israel is that the individual must reside within the land of Israel.

What if I can't afford to relocate?

What if the govenment rejects my relocation application?

What if I don't want to relocate because the dispens tell me that I have a 2/3 probability of being slaughtered when the end time arrives?

Am I out of luck?
 
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Calminian

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1) the kingdom is spiritual, not physical.

this argument assumes spiritual and physical are mutually exclusive. are we not both physical and spiritual?

3) only believers in Christ are biblical Israel.

Not according to Paul or Luke. Both reference jews as distinct from Christians.

4) There is no gap between Daniel's 69th and 70th weeks.

Yes there is an implied gap right in the text. If you believe there's a gap between the crucifixion and destruction of Jerusalem, there's no way around this.

5) Jesus fulfilled the 70th week offering himself in the middle of it as the only real sacrifice for sins.

This would mean Jesus was crucified after 70 AD. That's crazy.

6) the great tribulation happened in 70 AD and was Jewish, not gentile in scope.

Just silly. Anyone reading Revelation knows this doesn't fit. The Tribulation has to be greater is scope and severity than even the Flood.

7) the book of Revelation covers the time between the first and second advent followed by a view of the New Heavens and earth. If you can get these facts straight, you will begin to understand eschatology.

Now you're really being silly. John penned Revelation in 95 AD.
 
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Calminian

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The contextual definition of "own" (Greek "idios") in John 1:11 is the fellow countrymen and associates of one's native land, e.g. the residents of the land of Israel.

Thus God's criterion for determining who He includes in Israel is that the individual must reside within the land of Israel.

But in what sense? Obviously not in every sense, as Paul clearly refers to unbelieving jews. There is a sense in which Paul differentiates between believing and unbelieving Israel. God does this all throughout history differentiating the remnant (Romans 11:1-6). But God also acknowledges unbelieving Israel.

Rom. 11:25 I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers and sisters, so that you may not be conceited: Israel has experienced a hardening in part until the full number of the Gentiles has come in, 26 and in this way all Israel will be saved. As it is written:
“The deliverer will come from Zion;
he will turn godlessness away from Jacob.​

You've gone further than this, eliminating unbelieving Israel. Paul directly refutes you in this manner.
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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Right, Gog and Magog are going to raid Israel with spears and horses and steel their cattle?
Also, what about Armegeddon....horses, chariots and swords are used....
 
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Marilyn C

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What are the criteria that God will use to determine who is the Israel that will be saved?

1. Jewish DNA
2. Jewish religion
3. Jewish culture
4. Faith in the Son of God unto salvation

?

Hi jgr,

God`s word tells us who are those Jews who come through the tribulation.

`Then I was given a reed like a measuring rod. And the angel stood, saying, "Rise and measure the temple of God, the altar, and those who worship there. But leave out the court which is outside the temple, and do not measure it, for it has been given to the Gentiles. And they will tread the holy city underfoot for forty-two months.` (Rev. 11: 1 & 2)

`Then those who feared the Lord spoke to one another, and the Lord listened and heard them; so a book of remembrance was written before him for those who fear the Lord and meditate on His name.


"They shall be mine," says the Lord of hosts, "On the day that I make them my jewels, and I will spare them as a man spares his own son who serves him.` (Mal.3: 16 & 17)

`I will bring one-third through the fire, will refine them as silver is refined, and test them as gold is tested. They will call on my name, and I will answer them. I will say, "This is My people," and each will say, "The Lord is my God.` (Zech. 13: 9)


Marilyn.
 
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BABerean2

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But in what sense? Obviously not in every sense, as Paul clearly refers to unbelieving jews. There is a sense in which Paul differentiates between believing and unbelieving Israel. God does this all throughout history differentiating the remnant (Romans 11:1-6). But God also acknowledges unbelieving Israel.

Rom. 11:25 I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers and sisters, so that you may not be conceited: Israel has experienced a hardening in part until the full number of the Gentiles has come in, 26 and in this way all Israel will be saved. As it is written:
“The deliverer will come from Zion;
he will turn godlessness away from Jacob.​

You've gone further than this, eliminating unbelieving Israel. Paul directly refutes you in this manner.

Rom 11:23 And they also, if they do not continue in unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.
Rom 11:24 For if you were cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and were grafted contrary to nature into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these, who are natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree?
Rom 11:25 For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in.
Rom 11:26 And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written: "THE DELIVERER WILL COME OUT OF ZION, AND HE WILL TURN AWAY UNGODLINESS FROM JACOB;
Rom 11:27 FOR THIS IS MY COVENANT WITH THEM, WHEN I TAKE AWAY THEIR SINS."

See the passage below to find out if the verse above was fulfilled during the first century.

Heb 10:16 "THIS IS THE COVENANT THAT I WILL MAKE WITH THEM AFTER THOSE DAYS, SAYS THE LORD: I WILL PUT MY LAWS INTO THEIR HEARTS, AND IN THEIR MINDS I WILL WRITE THEM,"
Heb 10:17 then He adds, "THEIR SINS AND THEIR LAWLESS DEEDS I WILL REMEMBER NO MORE."
(Quoted from the promise of the New Covenant found in je
Heb 10:18 Now where there is remission of these, there is no longer an offering for sin.
 
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Douggg

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The contextual definition of "own" (Greek "idios") in John 1:11 is the fellow countrymen and associates of one's native land, e.g. the residents of the land of Israel.
Really, jgr? That's your rationale?

Come to grips with your position is doesn't fit with Ezekiel 39:21-29. Them who hold the same as you, have misconstrued new testament passages to think that the church has become Israel and gentiles have become Jews.

Jesus's people were the Jews. John 1:11 He came unto his own, and his own received him not.

John 19:18 Where they crucified him, and two other with him, on either side one, and Jesus in the midst.

19 And Pilate wrote a title, and put it on the cross. And the writing was, JESUS OF NAZARETH THE KING OF THE JEWS.

20 This title then read many of the Jews: for the place where Jesus was crucified was nigh to the city: and it was written in Hebrew, and Greek, and Latin.

21 Then said the chief priests of the Jews to Pilate, Write not, The King of the Jews; but that he said, I am King of the Jews.
_____________________________________________________________

Just come on over to the realists' side and watch what is going on with Israel and Europe, and the Gog/Magog nations.
 
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jgr

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Really, jgr? That's your rationale?

Come to grips with your position is doesn't fit with Ezekiel 39:21-29. Them who hold the same as you, have misconstrued new testament passages to think that the church has become Israel and gentiles have become Jews.

Jesus's people were the Jews. John 1:11 He came unto his own, and his own received him not.

John 19:18 Where they crucified him, and two other with him, on either side one, and Jesus in the midst.

19 And Pilate wrote a title, and put it on the cross. And the writing was, JESUS OF NAZARETH THE KING OF THE JEWS.

20 This title then read many of the Jews: for the place where Jesus was crucified was nigh to the city: and it was written in Hebrew, and Greek, and Latin.

21 Then said the chief priests of the Jews to Pilate, Write not, The King of the Jews; but that he said, I am King of the Jews.
_____________________________________________________________

Just come on over to the realists' side and watch what is going on with Israel and Europe, and the Gog/Magog nations.

Did it occur to you to click the link on "idios", Douggg?

Do that before opining.

Then attempt to answer my questions, if you're willing.
 
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Calminian

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Rom 11:23 And they also, if they do not continue in unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.
Rom 11:24 For if you were cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and were grafted contrary to nature into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these, who are natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree?
Rom 11:25 For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in.
Rom 11:26 And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written: "THE DELIVERER WILL COME OUT OF ZION, AND HE WILL TURN AWAY UNGODLINESS FROM JACOB;
Rom 11:27 FOR THIS IS MY COVENANT WITH THEM, WHEN I TAKE AWAY THEIR SINS."

See the passage below to find out if the verse above was fulfilled during the first century.

Heb 10:16 "THIS IS THE COVENANT THAT I WILL MAKE WITH THEM AFTER THOSE DAYS, SAYS THE LORD: I WILL PUT MY LAWS INTO THEIR HEARTS, AND IN THEIR MINDS I WILL WRITE THEM,"
Heb 10:17 then He adds, "THEIR SINS AND THEIR LAWLESS DEEDS I WILL REMEMBER NO MORE."
(Quoted from the promise of the New Covenant found in je
Heb 10:18 Now where there is remission of these, there is no longer an offering for sin.

Yes, they will. Unbelieving Israel, if they do not accept Jesus will be denied the Kingdom.

We agree on that, but you ignored the bigger point that there is such a thing as unbelieving Israel. You guys get really dodgy about this for some reason.
 
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jgr

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God`s word tells us who are those Jews who come through the tribulation.

Hi Marilyn,

You haven't yet defined who "Jews" are. You haven't specified the criteria by which God identifies and distinguishes them.

So you cannot know who comes through the tribulation, because you have not identified who enters it.

Here again are the legitimate choices. I've included a fifth relating to the discussion with Douggg.

1. Jewish DNA
2. Jewish religion
3. Jewish culture
4. Residence within the land of Israel
5. Faith in the Son of God unto salvation
 
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Douggg

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Did it occur to you to click the link on "idios", Douggg?

Do that before opining.

Then attempt to answer my questions, if you're willing.
Matthew 10:5 These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:

6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
 
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Douggg

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1. Jewish DNA
2. Jewish religion
3. Jewish culture
4. Residence within the land of Israel
5. Faith in the Son of God unto salvation
How about adding - Jesus's own who received him not, John 1:11, who God has taken out of the nations back to their own land of Israel, who's religion is Judaism.
 
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jgr

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How about adding - Jesus's own who received him not, John 1:11, who God has taken out of the nations back to their own land of Israel, who's religion is Judaism.
That's option 2, and it's not Judaism, it's Babylonian Talmudism, which says Jesus is boiling in feces in hell.
 
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