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Muslim Brothers and Sisters

Discussion in 'Christianity and World Religion' started by Chris†opher Paul, Sep 12, 2002.

  1. Zico

    Zico Alhamdu Lillahi Rabbil Alameen

    241
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    Single
    US-Republican
    Annabel and souljah,

    We know from the Qur'an that God does not hate people, He only hates bad deeds done by people as we see in these examples :

    017.026 Give the kinsman his due, and the needy, and the wayfarer, and squander not (thy wealth) in wantonness.
    017.027 Lo! the squanderers were ever brothers of the devils, and the devil was ever an ingrate to his Lord.
    017.028 But if thou turn away from them, seeking mercy from thy Lord, for which thou hopest, then speak unto them a reasonable word.
    017.029 And let not thy hand be chained to thy neck nor open it with a complete opening, lest thou sit down rebuked, denuded.
    017.030 Lo! thy Lord enlargeth the provision for whom He will, and straiteneth (it for whom He will). Lo, He was ever Knower, Seer of His slaves.
    017.031 Slay not your children, fearing a fall to poverty, We shall provide for them and for you. Lo! the slaying of them is great sin.
    017.032 And come not near unto adultery. Lo! it is an abomination and an evil way.
    017.033 And slay not the life which Allah hath forbidden save with right. Whoso is slain wrongfully, We have given power unto his heir, but let him not commit excess in slaying. Lo! he will be helped.
    017.034 Come not near the wealth of the orphan save with that which is better till he come to strength; and keep the covenant. Lo! of the covenant it will be asked.
    017.035 Fill the measure when ye measure, and weigh with a right balance; that is meet, and better in the end.
    017.036 (O man), follow not that whereof thou hast no knowledge. Lo! the hearing and the sight and the heart - of each of these it will be asked.
    017.037 And walk not in the earth exultant. Lo! thou canst not rend the earth, nor canst thou stretch to the height of the hills.
    017.038 The evil of all that is hateful in the sight of thy Lord.
    017.039 This is (part) of that wisdom wherewith thy Lord hath inspired thee (O Muhammad). And set not up with Allah any other god, lest thou be cast into hell, reproved, abandoned.


    And also :

    061.003 It is most hateful in the sight of Allah that ye say that which ye do not.


    God also warns Muhammad in 017:039 even when He knows that Muhammad would never do such thing, He only shows him what acts are hated.

    So we see from this that God does not hate people for whom they are, it's what they do that He hates.


    I hope this helps, and Allah knows best.
     
  2. Annabel Lee

    Annabel Lee Beware the Thought Police

    +1,102
    Christian
    US-Others
    Thank you Zico.
     
  3. kingcaboose

    kingcaboose New Member

    31
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    Christian
    For those christians who say that you worship the One true God, I am a Christian myself, I would like to ask you, is anyone who is not a Christian not loved by God?

    I myself would answer of course not, God loves the person who has a heart after his own heart. Think of the Jews, we both claim to worship the same God yet the Christians claim that the Jews are wrong because they do not know Christ, who is in fact God in human form come to complete the law.

    Also think of the ones who have not known the Christain belief because of isolation yet still has a heart of Compasion, Love and understanding. Would not God still love this person as much as some one who goes to Church every Sunday. Not only this but the ones who have been brought up in another faith, although they do not have the same claim that you have if they are faultless in Gods eyes what does there Denomination matter.

    God will Judge in the end the Guilty from his own and do you think that because you go to Church every weekend and you pray to a particular name and read a particular book that that will save you. No it is what is in your heart that matters, I have read stories of people who claim to be christain yet what they do and believe contradicts his nature.


    For the Christians read Romans and discover that God loves people not religions otherwise Christs message would have only been for the Jews and not for the Gentiles also.
     
  4. Brian45

    Brian45 Senior Member

    +151
    Christian
    Single
    1 John 2
    21I have not written to you because you do not know the truth, but because you know it, and that no lie is of the truth.
    22Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son. 23Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also.


    I believe the word christ means Messiah , so If muslims believe that Jesus is the messiah then they worship the same God as the Christians .

    If they do not acknowlege Jesus as the messiah , as the above verse states then they do not know the Father ,  the one and only true God  , thus making themselves Anti-christs .

     

    Muslims  ,  what are your answers to  :

    Question  1  -  Do you believe Jesus is the Messiah  ?

    Question  2 -  Do you believe jesus is the son of God ?

    Question  3  -  Do you believe that Jesus was the sacrificial lamb ?
     
  5. ansarthemystic

    ansarthemystic Member

    128
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    brian45,
    yes to the first question., but the idea that the messiah is divine, OR THAT THE jEWS EXPECTED A DIVINE MESSIAH, is FALSE.
    No, Allah has no sons or daughters
    No, there is no need for a scrificial lamb, if each individual is held individually accountable for his/her actions

    peace and blessings
    assalamu alaikum
    shalom aleykom
     
  6. Chris†opher Paul

    Chris†opher Paul Based on a True Story

    +4
    The Jews did not expect a divine Messiah, they expected a military leader, which is why they are still confused.
     
  7. ansarthemystic

    ansarthemystic Member

    128
    +0
    almost souljah!
    they expected a military,political,and spiritual/religious leader as per the scriptures. There was no expectations of a divine messiah, and Yeshauwah(AS) did not fulfill all the qualities of the Jewish Messiah.

    peacea and blessings
    assalamu alaikum
    shalom aleykom
     
  8. Sky

    Sky Active Member

    603
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    Jesus is the Messiah. And Jesus is God. allah has no sons(allah does not exist), but Jehovah God does!
     
  9. Brian45

    Brian45 Senior Member

    +151
    Christian
    Single
     

    I thought muslims believe that jesus was only a great prophet and nothing more  ?
     
  10. Zico

    Zico Alhamdu Lillahi Rabbil Alameen

    241
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    that dependes on how you define the word prophet.
     
  11. kingcaboose

    kingcaboose New Member

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    Did not Christ come to free us from the Religion and the Tradition that it brings, to bring us to realise that its not the religion that we follow that he wants but the heart. Take the parable of the Samaritan. He didn't follow the doctrine of the Jews and yet he was considered righteous. Or the Roman Centurion and his servant who was very sick, Jesus went so far as to say that this man had more faith than the whole of Israel.

    Though these people believed in other Religions they still had a heart that had faith in God's Love and compassion and therefore found favour in Gods sight. Peter Disowns Jesus when he was taken to be crucified does that mean he is an antichrist?

    Matthew 15:8 These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me. 9 They worship me in vain; their teachings are but rules taught by men.
     
  12. Brian45

    Brian45 Senior Member

    +151
    Christian
    Single
     

    What do you mean ?
     
  13. Chris†opher Paul

    Chris†opher Paul Based on a True Story

    +4
    Actually, Jesus does fit the scripture prophecies, not the Jewish idea of the Messiah. It is fairly easy to see in retrospect, but at the time, the Jews were confused. Today, many stick to this out of tradition instead of looking at the facts with an open mind.
     
  14. Job_38

    Job_38 <font size="1"> In perfect orbit they have circled

    +1
    Zico, a prophet is someone who predicts or can see the future. In order for them to be one, all their prophecies must be fulfilled, if something doesn't, lie if I say "I will go in thy room and findeth a doll." I go to the room, but no doll...

    Amen to that Souljah. The Jews wanted a King, which Christ was, but he didn't fit their view of one.
     
  15. Zico

    Zico Alhamdu Lillahi Rabbil Alameen

    241
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    Hello Job,

    &nbsp;

    This is from chapter 6 of&nbsp;the book " What did Jesus really say ? " :

    &nbsp;

    In the Bible we read of the test that the Jews applied to Jesus (pbuh) in order to ascertain his truthfulness. The Jews had a prophecy that required Elias to come before Jesus (pbuh):


    "Elias verily cometh first"

    Mark 9:12


    (also John 3:28). They had not seen Elias yet so they doubted the claim of Jesus (pbuh). Jesus, however, responded to them that Elias had already come but that they did not recognize him. In Matthew we read:


    "But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not.........Then the disciples understood that he spake unto them of John the Baptist."

    Matthew 17:12-13


    John, however refutes the claims of Jesus (pbuh). This is one of the Christian's "dark sayings of Jesus" that their scholars have tried to reconcile for centuries. We will leave this matter for them to work out among themselves (This matter is resolved in the Gospel of Barnabas. Please see chapter 7 for more).


    Now, in John we read


    "And this is the record of John, when the Jews sent priests and Levites from Jerusalem to ask him, Who art thou? And he confessed, and denied not; but confessed, I am not the Christ. And they asked him, What then? Art thou Elias? And he saith, I am not. Art thou that prophet? And he answered, No."

    John 1:19-21


    We notice that there are three distinct prophecies here: 1) Elias, 2) Jesus, 3) That prophet. The Jews were not waiting for two prophecies, but three. This can be further clarified by reading John:


    "And they asked him, and said unto him, Why baptizest thou then, if thou be:

    a) not that Christ,

    b) nor Elias,

    c) neither that prophet?"

    John 1:25


    If "that prophet" were Jesus (pbuh) wouldn't the third question in both verses be redundant? Further, we must remember that "That prophet" can not apply to any prophet before the time of Jesus (pbuh) because at the time of Jesus (pbuh) the Jews were still waiting for all three. Notice how when we let the Bible speak for itself, without forcing the holy spirit or other supernatural meanings on it in the commentary, or forcing three questions to be only two, how clear these verses become. For much more evidence in this regard, please read chapter 7 regarding the Dead Sea Scroll prophesies of "two messiahs" and how the Jews who wrote the scrolls and who were waiting for the coming of Jesus (pbuh) clearly state in these scrolls that they were waiting for not one, but TWO messiahs, the first of which would be announced by an eschatological prophet.

    &nbsp;

    There is more from where&nbsp;that came from.
     
  16. Zico

    Zico Alhamdu Lillahi Rabbil Alameen

    241
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    Muslim
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    Also for people interested, here is the link http://wings.buffalo.edu/sa/muslim/library/jesus-say/contents.html

    What you will find in chapter 6 " Muhammad in the Bible " :

    6.1 Three distinct prophesies
    6.2 Foretells the story of the chapter of 'Al-Alak'
    6.3 A Paraclete like Jesus
    6.4 The emigration (The Hijra)
    6.5 Isaiah's vision
    6.6 Truthfulness of Muhammad (pbuh)
    6.7 Moses foretells of Muhammad's coming
    6.8 Legitimacy of Hagar and Ishmael
    6.9 A rod out of the stem of Jesse
    6.10 Reference to Moses, Jesus, & Muhammad in that order
    6.11 God did not kill Muhammad for speaking in His name
    6.12 Glorifies Jesus (pbuh)
    6.13 The rejected stone
    6.14 Other Prophesies
     
  17. JeTmAn

    JeTmAn Guitar Geek

    117
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    I must interject that it's not correct to call Muslims "our brothers and sisters". These terms are usually reserved for Christians; you're not "brothers and sisters" with just anyone on the planet.

    The Bible says that either you are for Christ or against him. By rejecting the divinity of Christ (though respecting him as a mere prophet), the Muslim faith as well as every Muslim is against Christ and therefore not someone you should call a brother or a sister (unless they're blood-related, obviously!).
     
  18. Sky

    Sky Active Member

    603
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    True. Muslims are our enemies, not our "bwothers and sisters".

    This is not a personal attack on muslims. :)
     
  19. Hank

    Hank has the Right to be wrong

    +50
    Atheist
    CA-Conservatives
    Did you ever ask why that is/was?
     
  20. Sky

    Sky Active Member

    603
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    I don't know
     
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