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Featured [moved] Prophets receiving messages from angels?

Discussion in 'Christianity and World Religion' started by mathinspiration, Jan 4, 2018.

  1. mathinspiration

    mathinspiration Member

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    John Smith said he received the Book of Mormon from an angel of God and Mohammad, the prophet also got all his instructions from the angel Gabriel on writing Koran. It was amazing that he memorized the whole book since he didn't know how read or write yet he was merchant of some sort?
     
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  2. Jane_Doe

    Jane_Doe Well-Known Member

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    I can't speak for Muslim belief at all, so no comment there.

    But member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS for short), believe that one of God's prophets (named Moroni) recorded his testimony of Jesus Christ (and other people's testimonies too). These were written down. Years later, through the power of God, Joseph Smith was able to receive this record and translate it. This became known as "the Book of Mormon: Another Testament of Jesus Christ", as that's what it is: more testimony of Christ.
     
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2018
  3. Phoebe Ann

    Phoebe Ann From Mormonism to Christ Supporter

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    Joseph Smith, not John. Mohammed wasn't involved. Go to Debate Other Religions & Faiths if you're really interested in learning about Mormonism.
     
  4. BigDaddy4

    BigDaddy4 Movin' on...

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    This is a misleading statement. The BoM is not more of the same testamony of Christ, as found in the New Testament. Rather it is another, as in completely separate and unique, testamony. And one that is rejected by most of Christianity because it violates Galatians 1 and 2 Cor 11 regarding "another gospel".
     
  5. Jane_Doe

    Jane_Doe Well-Known Member

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    You're of course entitled to your opinion. But no, I'm not being dishonest. Having read and studied the whole book cover to cover many times, I'm telling you my honest beliefs. Same gospel: Christ is our Savior, redeemer, no one comes to the Father but through Him. He was born of a virgin, lived perfectly, atoned for our sins, and rose again on the first day. I love Him with all my heart.
     
  6. BigDaddy4

    BigDaddy4 Movin' on...

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    Jesus Christ did not come to the Americas. Different gospel, different locations, different people. You continue to be misleading. "Another" means something different than the original, i.e., not the same. It's in the title of your official doctrine. You cannot deny that.
     
  7. Peter1000

    Peter1000 Well-Known Member

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    The BOM would violate your sources if it were another gospel. But it is not. It is a mosaic of more prophets receiveing revelations from Jesus and these prophets telling the people about Jesus. Same Jesus, same doctrine. Read it and you will find it to be the same. This is how God works, this is how Jesus works. Prophets of God and Jesus revealing his doctrines and his church, and the prophets revealing these things in verbal and written words to the people of God. Same ole, same ole.

    The BOM is a set in a different land and so there are manorisms that are different than the manorisms of Jerusalem, but the preaching about Jesus are right on biblical.
     
  8. Peter1000

    Peter1000 Well-Known Member

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    Are you serious??????????? Did you look up the definition of 'another' before you made this silly statement????????????

    The word 'another' does mean that it could be a different gospel. But 'another' can also mean that it is a second witness of the same gospel. Who is misleading??????????????

    Yes you are right, the BOM is in a different location, so what?????????????
    Yes you are right, the BOM taught to a different people, so what?????????????????
    No you are wrong, the BOM is a different gospel.

    Jesus did come to America, and when that becomes so crystal clear to you, I expect you to be a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, and I will ordain you to the real priesthood of God. Is that a deal????????????????
     
  9. Peter1000

    Peter1000 Well-Known Member

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    You are aware that an angel Gabriel was supposed to have taught Mohammad what he knew. But are you aware that an angel Gabriel also talked to Mary about her son Jesus Christ's birth?

    Angels are simply messengers from God. Many angel stories in the bible.
     
  10. BigDaddy4

    BigDaddy4 Movin' on...

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    That's quite a non-sensical statement. No idea what you mean by "your sources". My source is the Bible. And the BoM violates that.
    The BoM does nothing but copy already existing texts from the Bible. Not too difficult to do. Making a different setting in a different land with different people believeable is very difficult to do. The BoM disqualifies itself as believeable due to the lack of evidence that millions of people existed in an undefined North American location, having crops, animals, and technology that did not exist during the 2400 years of the story, and then vanished without a trace.

    Stick your heads in the sand if you want, but details matter if you want the story to be believeable. Plagerizing the Bible does not make the story more true. The BoM offers nothing new about Christ that the Bible didn't already contain.
     
  11. BigDaddy4

    BigDaddy4 Movin' on...

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    You obviously don't know the definition of another. The bold in #2 is the best fit given the setting of the BoM. Mark, John, Luke, and Matthew reflect definition #1 and/or #3.

    another
    Examples
    See more synonyms on Thesaurus.com
    adjective
    1.
    being one more or more of the same; further; additional:
    another piece of cake.
    2.
    different; distinct; of a different period, place, or kind:
    at another time; another man.
    3.
    very similar to; of the same kind or category as:
    What we need today is another Thomas Jefferson.
    pronoun
    4.
    one more; an additional one:
    That first hot dog tasted so good I'd like another.
    5.
    a different one; something different:
    going from one house to another.
    6.
    one like the first:
    one copy for her and another for him.
    7.
    a person other than oneself or the one specified:
    He told her he loved another.
     
  12. Peter1000

    Peter1000 Well-Known Member

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    BigDaddy4 says:
    .

    Well now, if that is your experience with reading the BOM, and that is all you have been able to learn, then you need to stop telling people what you know about the BOM. It is misleading to the extreme, and you know it. The interesting thing is, you make this statement as if you do not know it. That is the extreme side of misleading.
     
  13. Peter1000

    Peter1000 Well-Known Member

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    OK this is moving into the relm of silly. Notice my post again. I am the one that acknowledged that the word 'another' has 2 meanings. Now if you notice the first meaning above, you will note that it says, "being one more or more of the same". That is the definition that LDS use when it says the BOM is another witness of Christ. The first definition means another or one more of the same. We also declare that the BOM is a second witness of Christ. Meaning it is one more of the same witness that Jesus is the Christ.

    Now you will also notice in my quote that I said that the word 'another' could be used to conote a different gospel.

    So I am the one that mentioned both meanings to you. You have shown me all the meanings of 'another', but have highlighted the second meaning, which means 'different', but not the first meaning that means 'the same'.

    LDS use the first meaning when they declare that the BOM is 'another' withness of Jesus Christ.

    I will also maintain my challenge that when there is perfect knowledge of Jesus coming to the Americas after his resurrection, will you become a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, and let me ordain you to an elder in the priesthood of God, with proper priesthood keys????
     
  14. Peter1000

    Peter1000 Well-Known Member

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    I went back to your original statement, and here it is:
    "Another" means something different than the original, i.e., not the same. (see your post #6)

    This is why I said you are misleading. But now I take that back. You are not misleading, you are just ignorant of the real meanings of 'another'. Why do you think the first meaning is put in the first position??????????? Why is the second meaning put in the second position???????????? I'm going to tell you. The first meaning, in the first position is there because that is the use that is normally associated with the word. (the LDS meaning). The second meaning in the second position is there because of other reasons, but is used less frequently. (not LDS meaning).

    Have you ever compared the 4 books gospels and seen the differences and similarities of each. Their different manorisms, their different perspectives, their different stories, their different reflections, their different takes on the same story, the same event, the same Christ?????????????????? That is why they are true, because they are different. John's gospel is way different than Matthews. John gets into areas about God and Jesus that none of the others do. He is way out there in logos world. But it all rings true. The 4 gospels bring us the whole gospel of Jesus Christ.

    The BOM just gives you another look at some things that Jesus also did, different than the 4 gospels, but the same pattern as the 4, just as the 4 are different from each other, the BOM just adds to the whole gospel story.

    If Jesus did come and preach to the house of Israel in America, would you not want to include that visit and preaching in your scriptures????????????? You will someday know that he did, and you will want to have them included in your gospel library.
     
  15. BigDaddy4

    BigDaddy4 Movin' on...

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    Glad you agree. This will be my last post on the subject.
    "Could" but is not. The setting is different, hence #2 applies.
    I will never become a member of your church. I pray that when it is revealed to you that Jesus did not come to America, it is not too late to change your decision in this life, or that God would have mercy on you, despite your erronous lds beliefs, at His Judgement Throne.
     
  16. BigDaddy4

    BigDaddy4 Movin' on...

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    What's with all the ??????????'s???? Weird.
    Jesus did not "preach to the house of Israel in America". Pick a place, any place, from this list of places mentioned in the BoM, that refers to a location in what is now America where any of the peoples mentioned in the BoM would have resided and provide verfiable, objective evidence that it exists or existed.

    List of Book of Mormon places - Wikipedia
     
  17. redleghunter

    redleghunter Abide Boldy my friend Supporter

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    Who is the prophet Elias in the BOM?
     
  18. Phoebe Ann

    Phoebe Ann From Mormonism to Christ Supporter

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    If the Mormon teachings were the same gospel as the one mentioned in Galatians Chapter One, the Mormon teachings would be identical to the Bible. There would be no contradiction.

    Instead, the Book of Mormon and other Mormon teachings contradicts the Bible.

    Book of Mormon excerpt:

    This is what the LDS teach about the Bible:

    24 And the angel of the Lord said unto me: Thou hast beheld that the book proceeded forth from the mouth of a Jew; and when it proceeded forth from the mouth of a Jew it contained the fulness of the gospel of the Lord, of whom the twelve apostles bear record; and they bear record according to the truth which is in the Lamb of God.

    25 Wherefore, these things go forth from the Jews in purity unto the Gentiles, according to the truth which is in God.

    26 And after they go forth by the hand of the twelve apostles of the Lamb, from the Jews unto the Gentiles, thou seest the formation of that great and abominable church, which is most abominable above all other churches; for behold, they have taken away from the gospel of the Lamb many parts which are plain and most precious; and also many covenants of the Lord have they taken away.

    27 And all this have they done that they might pervert the right ways of the Lord, that they might blind the eyes and harden the hearts of the children of men.

    28 Wherefore, thou seest that after the book hath gone forth through the hands of the great and abominable church, that there are many plain and precious things taken away from the book, which is the book of the Lamb of God.

    29 And after these plain and precious things were taken away it goeth forth unto all the nations of the Gentiles; and after it goeth forth unto all the nations of the Gentiles, yea, even across the many waters which thou hast seen with the Gentiles which have gone forth out of captivity, thou seest—because of the many plain and precious things which have been taken out of the book[Bible], which were plain unto the understanding of the children of men, according to the plainness which is in the Lamb of God—because of these things which are taken away out of the gospel of the Lamb, an exceedingly great many do stumble, yea, insomuch that Satan hath great power over them.
    Book of Mormon, 1 Nephi 13: 24-29
     
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2018
  19. Jane_Doe

    Jane_Doe Well-Known Member

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    The Boo of Mormon doesn't talk about Elias.
     
  20. redleghunter

    redleghunter Abide Boldy my friend Supporter

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    Sure it does.

    "12 After this, Elias appeared, and committed the dispensation of the gospel of Abraham, saying that in us and our seed all generations after us should be blessed.
    13 After this vision had closed,another great and glorious vision burst upon us; for Elijah the prophet, who was taken to heaven without tasting death, stood before us, and said:
    14 Behold, the time has fully come, which was spoken of by the mouth of Malachi--.


    The point is Elijah=Elias. Joseph Smith clearly did not know this yet he differentiated such making them two different persons.

    Elijah is the OT rendering of the NT Elias. Yet JS held two different conversations with what he clearly delineated were two different prophets.

    So one or both of the visions were fraudulent.
     
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