Most Christians have no concept of what Heaven is really like

[NerdGirl]

I don't trust any extra biblical expressions of heavenly tourists. What we have from the prophets and apostles is a lot of singing which.. yeah, I know OP is referring to me in a thread I did about the mansions that some people see as something to look forward to. I don't value material wealth much so I don't get ally jazzed about any promises of material wealth. But I also expressed to him that I don't enjoy singing, some others of you might also know this.

It creates a very pessimistic view of heaven for me when the thing displayed most in heaven is something I don't like doing.
Try to put yourself in my shoes for a moment and imagine, if the word of God displayed heaven as something that you don't like doing, in every time heaven is described.
Like imagine if it was washing the dishes before the throne of God instead of singing, if you like singing (I can't imagine people who really like doing dishes, it's a chore they do because they have to). If that's what heaven was described as, an eternity of washing dishes, would you be as excited?

There will be a lot more going on than mansions and singing

 

[NerdGirl]

So, if you make it the only thing you want to do, is stare at Jesus, well then yes, God is going to give you that, it's promised.
Anything else? *some restrictions may apply

and with that agreement I just get that you're telling me "well then just stop wanting things like marriage and children so you can't be disappointed"?

That's not what I said, or am saying, at all.

 

[NerdGirl]

I still think I will be missing out on things that are good. That's not fullness of joy if you're missing things, and the fact that it is a guaranteed missing out on those things for eternity, that precisely makes it more painful, if it was temporary, that'd be easy. I know that while my disabilities limit me now and cause me pain now, that will be gone. The only things that they concern me as far as eternity goes is that I can do less for the Lord in this life because of my physical limitations, so my life matters less and there seems to be less purpose for all this pain because I can't find a way to use it to God's glory. That and, because it means I miss out on some things that are only possible on this earth and are not available in eternity. That hurts to be told "you want this? well you will never ever have it".
That and for a God who knows everyone better than they know themselves, it sure does seem like it's a one size fits all solution, fall on your face and sing for pleasure. If you don't like singing? If the LAST thing you'd do to express joy is sing?

You're just being stubborn at this point.

We've given you Scripture after Scripture to reassure you that Heaven will be a place of joy, peace, usefulness, comfort, happiness, etc. Not just for other Christians but ALL Christians, including yourself. You're just refusing to believe it. And that is something nobody here can change for you. That's up to you.

 

[NerdGirl]

That's still a smaller world than we currently dwell in, and if we're tired of sin and death we'd be confined to a smaller space than this current planet. That's a very disappointing future.

That's ONLY the city. There's still an entire new planet for us to live on.

 

[Jesus is YHWH]

You're just being stubborn at this point.

We've given you Scripture after Scripture to reassure you that Heaven will be a place of joy, peace, usefulness, comfort, happiness, etc. Not just for other Christians but ALL Christians, including yourself. You're just refusing to believe it. And that is something nobody here can change for you. That's up to you.

If people don't give Jesus the time and devotion to Him on this earth its no wonder they are skeptical about heaven. No desire here translates to skepticism there. I like reading your posts they are very insightful. Keep up the good work sister !

 

[NerdGirl]

If people don't give Jesus the time and devotion to Him on this earth its no wonder they are skeptical about heaven. No desire here translates to skepticism there. I like reading your posts they are very insightful. Keep up the good work sister !

That's so kind of you, thank you!

 

[mmksparbud]

Correct. Yet the Gates of the City remain open and the spirit and the Bride call "Come" from within the city to all outside its gates who thirst, "come drink freely from the water of Life"...



Correct, Evildoers are on the New Earth, Just outside the gates of the City.


"But outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie."

"Practices" here is present tense, present at the time of existing outside the gates of the city.

It's not people who used to practice, who once practiced, who formerly were practicing...

Sorry, but that is boloney. That means these people will not be on the the earth---at all. They will not be outside the city for there will be no evil. This is everyone is saved lies. The evil are destroyed in the brightness of God. Evil can not live in the presence e of God. Man can see God and live, evil dies in His presence. All sin is destroyed at the end---all. Sin will not rise a second time

Nah_1:9 What do ye imagine against the LORD? he will make an utter end: affliction shall not rise up the second time.

Satan will be done away with.

Eze 28:18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.
Eze 28:19 All they that know thee among the people shall be astonished at thee: thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more.

 

[parousia70]

Sorry, but that is boloney. That means these people will not be on earth

Then who are these thirsty people, outside the gates of the city, that the spirit and the bride are calling to, to come and drink?

It can’t be those already saved because “one drink and you shall never thirst again”
so who are the thirsty people scripture says are there, being called out to?

Satan will be done away with.

Is Satan required in order for human beings to do evil? Or are human beings fully capable of evil all on our own?

 

[parousia70]

I think you and I are just interpreting things differently.

Care to illuminate the difference?
Do you disagree that the Gospel is healing the Nations today? Is your view that the gospel is impotent in this regard? That it does not have the power to heal and is therefore doomed to fail?

Is Jesus not presently wiping away the tears of His people? Am I wrong to ascribe His soothing presence in my life to my tears being actively wiped away by Him?

If these are your views than yes, we definitely interpret it differently.

 

[mmksparbud]

Then who are these thirsty people, outside the gates of the city, that the spirit and the bride are calling to, to come and drink?

It can’t be those already saved because “one drink and you shall never thirst again”
so who are the thirsty people scripture says are there, being called out to?


Is Satan required in order for human beings to do evil? Or are human beings fully capable of evil all on our own?

It is bile speak for those who will never be saved, those who will be lost in the fire that is God purity. You can not take one verse out of context of all the other verses talking about this subject.

Rev 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

If there were sinners out there---there would be sorrow, crying, pain---all these will be done away with--where there is one sinner---there is sin. And yes! The saved do have to take that drink! If you never drink, you are not saved---It is a real River of Life.

Rev_22:1 And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.
Rev_22:2 In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations.

We will be drinking throughout eternity---not being thirsty is different from never drinking. We eat of the tree of life every month ---it has 12 different fruits every month. We are not just going to eat and drink one time.

 

[mmksparbud]

1Co_2:9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.

I do not believe that anyone has seen the actual heaven---I've had my own dreams of it. We do not have the eye's capacity to truly see the purity that is heaven until we have our eyes changed at His return for us. We have what the bible describes, but we just don't have the capacity to actually see it yet, even in dreams, or visions, not fully, not yet.

 

[parousia70]

If there were sinners out there---there would be sorrow, crying, pain---all these will be done away with--where there is one sinner---there is sin.

Those in the LoF suffer, in sorrow, crying and pain, IN THEIR SIN, for eternity. Faith in Jesus Christ Is the only thing that can ransom the sinner from their sin.

And yes! The saved do have to take that drink! If you never drink, you are not saved---It is a real River of Life.

So we have to keep drinking from it in order to stay saved?

We eat of the tree of life every month ---it has 12 different fruits every month. We are not just going to eat and drink one time.

So our glorified bodies will require constant, repeated nutrition from this tree to stay alive? To stay saved?
And if there’s no sun and no night, how long is a month?

 

[fhansen]

Over the last couple of weeks there have been a couple of threads that have left me with the impression of the title of this post. It seems to me that people really do not know what to expect when in heaven. I've just done a reply to one but would like to do a thread based purely on what peoples expectations of heaven are. In that post I linked the article below and put in these quotes from it which really highlight my views on what to expect in heaven. I really think heaven is far more amazing than most Christians think and there is a real lack the concept of what it is like.
"and as startling as the impact of first love."
"I understood that they made the music because they could not contain it. It was the sound of sheer joy."
"filled to overflowing with indescribable, unconditional love."
(I will just add that some of this does appear to be metaphorical, such as the speck on a wing a of a butterfly)

What heaven's really like - by a leading brain surgeon who says he's been there: Read his testimony before you scoff...it might just shake your beliefs | Daily Mail Online

So what I want to ask is have you ever done any study on what heaven is like, have you had any revelation of it and whatever the answer to these what do you actually expect heaven to be like?

In classical understanding perhaps, still limited since we're speaking of something far beyond our imagination, infinitely far, God, Himself, is the source and fulfillment of all human desire. All thirst for anything more, all expectations, all of our innate desire for happiness and well being are completely and totally quenched and satisfied by His Presence, by our meeting Him "face to face", 1 Cor 13. Unconditional love is experienced, is known, on an ineffable scale. And it's never-ending; God's sheer goodness has no limits, no bottom. As I once heard it put, "God is heaven".

 

[Jamdoc]

So sorry that you feel this way..

well be happy that I still love the Lord, and will still serve the Lord despite my own expectations to not be totally fulfilled myself.
That's just the way I interpret denying yourself to follow Jesus.

 

[Jamdoc]

"Without" or "outside" simply means they aren't in the Holy City. Which means they could be far away from it. Like in hell.

I've always interpreted that as in they're outside of the new creation itself, in Hell.
and I don't interpret the "dogs" to be literally the animal, just people that would be referred to as dogs. Paul called people dogs a time or two.

 

[Kenny'sID]

And if there’s no sun and no night, how long is a month?

Really?

There will still be math/time.

 

[JacksBratt]

well be happy that I still love the Lord, and will still serve the Lord despite my own expectations to not be totally fulfilled myself.
That's just the way I interpret denying yourself to follow Jesus.

The "denying yourself and following Jesus" is for this earthly life.

In eternity we will worship Him constantly.. There will be nothing to "deny" our selves of. All that will remain to do is live as we were initially designed. No death, no pain, no sorrow, no tears... You won't have to sleep.. You won't have to eat.. but you can if you want to...

You can talk to Adam, Moses, Mary, David, Enoch, and whoever else you would like to.. for as long as you want to talk with them...

I am pretty sure that you would have to be a real Eeyore to not be overwhelmed by the beauty, the music, the colors, the smells the warmth... the totally penetrating light and love...The Joy and rejoicing.... far beyond what is on this earth or what we cannot even imagine.

 

[mmksparbud]

Those in the LoF suffer, in sorrow, crying and pain, IN THEIR SIN, for eternity. Faith in Jesus Christ Is the only thing that can ransom the sinner from their sin.



So we have to keep drinking from it in order to stay saved?



So our glorified bodies will require constant, repeated nutrition from this tree to stay alive? To stay saved?
And if there’s no sun and no night, how long is a month?

If that makes you happy.

Rev 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

Rev 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

If anyo9ne is in hell burning---there is pain, crying---I take God at His word, when He says there will be nor more tears, no more pain---there will be nor more tears and no more pain. It is over and done with. What kind of joy is there is watchin g anyone burning forever? Maybe for yo0u, certainly not for me.

It's ridiculous to think that a God that has no pleasure in the death of the wicked, is going to have pleasure in the everlasting burning of them.

Eze_33:11 Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?

The fruit of the tree is for eating, you think God makes fruits to rot on the tree? We will be eating and drinking. We will plant our own vineyards, Jesus will drink of the fruit of the vine, and not in order to stay saved---God Gave Adam and Eve to eat of all the trees in the Garden of Eden, they ate and drank and so will we. Jesus ate and drank after His resurrection. And the bible does not say there will be no sun or moon---it says they will not be needed for light, for Jesus is the light.

Isa 66:22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.
Isa 66:23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.

There will be times, and Sabbaths and new moons---time will not matter for we have eternity, it is not that it does not exist.

 

[Jamdoc]

The "denying yourself and following Jesus" is for this earthly life.

In eternity we will worship Him constantly.. There will be nothing to "deny" our selves of. All that will remain to do is live as we were initially designed. No death, no pain, no sorrow, no tears... You won't have to sleep.. You won't have to eat.. but you can if you want to...

You can talk to Adam, Moses, Mary, David, Enoch, and whoever else you would like to.. for as long as you want to talk with them...

I am pretty sure that you would have to be a real Eeyore to not be overwhelmed by the beauty, the music, the colors, the smells the warmth... the totally penetrating light and love...The Joy and rejoicing.... far beyond what is on this earth or what we cannot even imagine.

Because a lot of what's described is contrary to things that I like.
I'm a nightowl, I like the quiet and serenity, the cool, the peace of evening and night, the gentle light of moon and stars, how they show the vastness of God's creation and beauty, how they are majestic, and yet calming and peaceful, more than I like the hustle and bustle and chaos of daytime, the heat and glaring and assaulting light of the sun, that burns the skin and blinds the eyes
I like the sea, again, majestic, yet calming, the regular waves dashing against the shore, the cool sea breeze and and even the smell of the sea breeze, is something I enjoy.

But most people, see the night as something that is evil and fearful, especially in the 1st century, and most people see the seas as something dangerous and fearful.
So it was promised to them that in eternity these things don't exist.
It's customized for other people, not me. For me, I have to forget my preferences and accept what other people prefer.

 

[mmksparbud]

Because a lot of what's described is contrary to things that I like.
I'm a nightowl, I like the quiet and serenity, the cool, the peace of evening and night, the gentle light of moon and stars, how they show the vastness of God's creation and beauty, how they are majestic, and yet calming and peaceful, more than I like the hustle and bustle and chaos of daytime, the heat and glaring and assaulting light of the sun, that burns the skin and blinds the eyes
I like the sea, again, majestic, yet calming, the regular waves dashing against the shore, the cool sea breeze and and even the smell of the sea breeze, is something I enjoy.

But most people, see the night as something that is evil and fearful, especially in the 1st century, and most people see the seas as something dangerous and fearful.
So it was promised to them that in eternity these things don't exist.
It's customized for other people, not me. For me, I have to forget my preferences and accept what other people prefer.

But you don't. It doesn't say there is no moon or sun, it says they are not needed in the city, the new Jerusalem , for Jesus is the light. There were no chapters and verses in the original---so this is actually describing the city. But there is a new moon and there is time in the new earth, the rest of the world.

Isa 66:22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.
Isa 66:23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.

We can't blot out that there will be no moonlight and stars and dark. You can't blot out large lakes, very large ones even. It just means there are no salt water just for certain fish to use. There really is no reason to think your preferences are null and void. A huge lake will be just as beautiful as a salt water ocean, but far more useful for we can drink from and all manor of fish will be able to utilize it.
-Besides---there are other worlds we also can go to and visit. And who knows what they will have. Do not limit God to be able fulfill your desires. Not to mention, the light and the sun will not be blistering---it will be gentle as the Garden of Eden was, no rain, but a gentle dew to water the earth. And there was evening there---
Gen 3:8 And they heard the voice of the LORD God walking in the garden in the cool of the day: and Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the LORD God amongst the trees of the garden.

He was the light of the world then also. And He made evening and morning. So don't think you are doomed to some elses' paradise.