LDS Mormons and The Exemplar They Must Follow

[Rescued One]

Like I say, there are 3 degrees of glory and depending how well you followed the example of Jesus, you end up in 1 of those 3 kingdoms. It is really simple. God will be the judge, and He will be assisted by His Son Jesus Christ and by the apostles in Jesus's time and by JS and others in our time.

If you think that is a strange doctrine that someone besides God will do some of the judging see Matthew 19:28.

We were talking about the difference between eternal life and damnation. The only Mormons who will have eternal life are the ones who become gods and dwell in His presence.

 

[Peter1000]

Priesthood: It was handed down to only the Levites. From father to son, if no son, closest male relative in that branch. There is not one word mentioned about obeying all the ordinances and commandments in order to qualify. Keeping the ordinances and commandments was expected of everyone. The High Priest offered sacrifice for his own sins as well as those of the congregation. He had to be married.

The high priest must be married; to guard against contingencies it was proposed to hold a second wife in readiness immediately before the Day of Atonement (Yoma i. 1); but polygamy on his part was not encouraged (

= "one wife"; Yoma 13a; "Yad," l.c. v. 10). He could give the "ḥaliẓah," and it could be given to his widow, as she also was subject to the Levirate; his divorced wife could marry again (l.c.; Sanh. 18).
After the Exile, the succession seems to have been, at first, in a direct line from father to son; but later the civil authorities arrogated to themselves the right of appointment. Antiochus IV., Epiphanes, for instance, deposed Onias III. in favor of Jason, who was followed by Menelaus (Josephus, "Ant." xii. 5, § 1; II Macc. iii. 4, iv. 23).

Herod nominated no less than six high priests; Archelaus, two. The Roman legate Quirinius and his successors exercised the right of appointment, as did Agrippa I., Herod of Chalcis, and Agrippa II. Even the people occasionally elected candidates to the office. The high priests before the Exile were, it seems, appointed for life (comp. Num. xxxv. 25, 28); in fact, from Aaron to the Captivity the number of the high priests was not greater than during the sixty years preceding the fall of the Second Temple.

HIGH PRIEST - JewishEncyclopedia.com

How did Jesus qualify to be a High Priest under Jewish law? And He was not appointed by Roman law.

Do you believe that if Herod appointed a High Priest to the Jewish priesthood, that God would in any way recognize that High Priest as His legitimate representative on earth? No. So the true priesthood of God was lost to the Jews and by the time that Jesus came it had to be restored to the earth.

It may be that Melchizedec came back in the form of an angel to ordain Jesus to the priesthood. It could also be that since it was the priesthood after the order of Jesus Christ, he being the head of it, he did not need to be ordained to it. I would rather think that as a mortal he needed to be ordained, so I am going with an angel ordained Jesus to the Melchizedec priesthood.

 

[mmksparbud]

Do you believe that if Herod appointed a High Priest to the Jewish priesthood, that God would in any way recognize that High Priest as His legitimate representative on earth? No. So the true priesthood of God was lost to the Jews and by the time that Jesus came it had to be restored to the earth.

It may be that Melchizedec came back in the form of an angel to ordain Jesus to the priesthood. It could also be that since it was the priesthood after the order of Jesus Christ, he being the head of it, he did not need to be ordained to it. I would rather think that as a mortal he needed to be ordained, so I am going with an angel ordained Jesus to the Melchizedec priesthood.

It was not restored--Jesus took over--there was no need for any priest after Him. None of the apostles were appoinbte4d priests by Jesus--not one. And the apostles appointed no priest. And certainly no angels can appoint anyone to the priesthood--none but God.

 

[fatboys]

It was not restored--Jesus took over--there was no need for any priest after Him. None of the apostles were appoinbte4d priests by Jesus--not one. And the apostles appointed no priest. And certainly no angels can appoint anyone to the priesthood--none but God.

He laid his hands on his them and gave them authority. Did ancient prophets have authority from God or could they just feel like they had his authority and be a prophet?

 

[Peter1000]

It was not restored--Jesus took over--there was no need for any priest after Him. None of the apostles were appoinbte4d priests by Jesus--not one. And the apostles appointed no priest. And certainly no angels can appoint anyone to the priesthood--none but God.

You have no knowledge if it was restored or not.

Did the apostles appoint any other priesthood holder to any position in the new church of Jesus Christ?

You have zero knowledge as to whether an angel can be sent from the presence of God to ordain someone to the priesthood?

 

[mmksparbud]

He laid his hands on his them and gave them authority. Did ancient prophets have authority from God or could they just feel like they had his authority and be a prophet?

Even Elijah had to let God decide about Elisha.
2Ki 2:10 And he said, Thou hast asked a hard thing: nevertheless, if thou see me when I am taken from thee, it shall be so unto thee; but if not, it shall not be so.
Prophets were called by God. Authority does not equal prophet, or priest.
Luk 9:1 Then he called his twelve disciples together, and gave them power and authority over all devils, and to cure diseases.

 

[Rescued One]

Bump

 

[mmksparbud]

Forgotten all about this one--have to review what it was about.

 

[mmksparbud]

Do you believe that if Herod appointed a High Priest to the Jewish priesthood, that God would in any way recognize that High Priest as His legitimate representative on earth? No. So the true priesthood of God was lost to the Jews and by the time that Jesus came it had to be restored to the earth.

It may be that Melchizedec came back in the form of an angel to ordain Jesus to the priesthood. It could also be that since it was the priesthood after the order of Jesus Christ, he being the head of it, he did not need to be ordained to it. I would rather think that as a mortal he needed to be ordained, so I am going with an angel ordained Jesus to the Melchizedec priesthood.

Good grief---angels can not ordain men to any priesthood. Jesus needed no ordination--He became our High Priest at His resurrection. He is innately divine and needs no one to lay hands on Him.

However---this does not seem to be what the topic is about---Seems to have gotten off topic, but I just had to respond to that!

LDS Mormons and The Exemplar They Must Follow

Hmm---that example would be Joseph Smith?

 

[Rescued One]

Good grief---angels can not ordain men to any priesthood. Jesus needed no ordination--He became our High Priest at His resurrection. He is innately divine and needs no one to lay hands on Him.

However---this does not seem to be what the topic is about---Seems to have gotten off topic, but I just had to respond to that!

LDS Mormons and The Exemplar They Must Follow

Hmm---that example would be Joseph Smith?

No, Jesus. So He had to have had His endowments and celestial marriage or His followers don't need to.

 

[Rescued One]

Sometimes even LDS don't know that, per Mormonism, eternal life in God's presence requires taking out one's endowments and having a celestial marriage (among other requirements).

Doctrine and Covenants 132
15 Therefore, if a man marry him a wife in the world, and he marry her not by me nor by my word, and he covenant with her so long as he is in the world and she with him, their covenant and marriage are not of force when they are dead, and when they are out of the world; therefore, they are not bound by any law when they are out of the world.

16 Therefore, when they are out of the world they neither marry nor are given in marriage; but are appointed angels in heaven, which angels are ministering servants, to minister for those who are worthy of a far more, and an exceeding, and an eternal weight of glory.

17 For these angels did not abide my law; therefore, they cannot be enlarged, but remain separately and singly, without exaltation, in their saved condition, to all eternity; and from henceforth are not gods, but are angels of God forever and ever.

18 And again, verily I say unto you, if a man marry a wife, and make a covenant with her for time and for all eternity, if that covenant is not by me or by my word, which is my law, and is not sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise, through him whom I have anointed and appointed unto this power, then it is not valid neither of force when they are out of the world, because they are not joined by me, saith the Lord, neither by my word; when they are out of the world it cannot be received there, because the angels and the gods are appointed there, by whom they cannot pass; they cannot, therefore, inherit my glory; for my house is a house of order, saith the Lord God.

19 And again, verily I say unto you, if a man marry a wife by my word, which is my law, and by the new and everlasting covenant, and it is sealed unto them by the Holy Spirit of promise, by him who is anointed, unto whom I have appointed this power and the keys of this priesthood; and it shall be said unto them—Ye shall come forth in the first resurrection; and if it be after the first resurrection, in the next resurrection; and shall inherit thrones, kingdoms, principalities, and powers, dominions, all heights and depths—then shall it be written in the Lamb’s Book of Life, that he shall commit no murder whereby to shed innocent blood, and if ye abide in my covenant, and commit no murder whereby to shed innocent blood, it shall be done unto them in all things whatsoever my servant hath put upon them, in time, and through all eternity; and shall be of full force when they are out of the world; and they shall pass by the angels, and the gods, which are set there, to their exaltation and glory in all things, as hath been sealed upon their heads, which glory shall be a fulness and a continuation of the seeds forever and ever.

20 Then shall they be gods, because they have no end; therefore shall they be from everlasting to everlasting, because they continue; then shall they be above all, because all things are subject unto them. Then shall they be gods, because they have all power, and the angels are subject unto them.

Eternal life is the phrase used in scripture to define the quality of life that our Eternal Father lives. The Lord declared, “This is my work and my glory—to bring to pass the immortality and eternal life of man” (Moses 1:39). Immortality is to live forever as a resurrected being. Through the Atonement of Jesus Christ, everyone will receive this gift. Eternal life, or exaltation, is to live in God's presence and to continue as families (see D&C 131:1–4). Like immortality, this gift is made possible through the Atonement of Jesus Christ. However, to inherit eternal life requires our “obedience to the laws and ordinances of the Gospel” (Articles of Faith 1:3).
https://www.lds.org/topics/eternal-life?lang=eng

This is what Peter wrote:
What is the reward?

 

[mmksparbud]

No, Jesus. So He had to have had His endowments and celestial marriage or His followers don't need to.

That's what I mean---They can't follow Jesus for He was never married or had endowments.

 

[Rescued One]

That's what I mean---They can't follow Jesus for He was never married or had endowments.

They said He kept all the commandments!

 

[mmksparbud]

They said He kept all the commandments!

Yes He did--or does that mean all Mormon commandments? They claim he was married? What prove do they offer?

 

[Rescued One]

Yes He did--or does that mean all Mormon commandments? They claim he was married? What prove do they offer?

They don't even talk about His marital status. All those years I spent with them, they didn't mention it once.

It is taught that He kept ALL the commandments. That is the only way to become a God and to qualify as the Savior. I'd hunt for the quotes, but I've done way too much of that yesterday and today. I don't even think I'll get online tomorrow. I know I've posted it before.

Have a great night!

 

[Ironhold]

Is there a reason for the thread necromancy?

As it is, individual members *will* sometimes debate whether Jesus was married, but it's not considered a big enough concern for most to bother with on a day-to-day basis.

 

[mmksparbud]

Is there a reason for the thread necromancy?

As it is, individual members *will* sometimes debate whether Jesus was married, but it's not considered a big enough concern for most to bother with on a day-to-day basis.

You must admit--it is rather interesting that your faith says you must be married to attain this exaltation and be in the presence of God---Yet Jesus never was. How can something that Jesus did not do, be mandatory?

 

[Ironhold]

You must admit--it is rather interesting that your faith says you must be married to attain this exaltation and be in the presence of God---Yet Jesus never was. How can something that Jesus did not do, be mandatory?

If it doesn't happen in life through no fault of the person's own, it'll be taken care of on the other side.

So... it's not really an issue.

 

[Rescued One]

Okay, mmksparbud, I'll find the quotes.

Milton R. Hunter: "Jesus became a God and reached His great state of understanding through consistent effort and continuous obedience to all the Gospel truths and universal laws" (The Gospel Through the Ages, p.51).

Bruce McConkie claimed: "Jesus kept the commandments of his Father and thereby worked out his own salvation, and also set an example as to the way and the means whereby all men may be saved" (The Mortal Messiah, Vol.4, p.434).

To qualify as the Redeemer of all our Father’s children, Jesus had to be perfectly obedient to all the laws of God. Because He subjected Himself to the will of the Father, He grew “from grace to grace, until he received a fulness” of the Father’s power. Thus He had “all power, both in heaven and on earth.” (D&C 93:13, 17.)10
TEACHINGS OF PRESIDENTS OF THE CHURCH: EZRA TAFT BENSON,

• CHAPTER 6: JESUS CHRIST, OUR SAVIOR AND REDEEMER

https://www.lds.org/manual/teaching...jesus-christ-our-savior-and-redeemer?lang=eng

 

[Rescued One]

The Mormon god commands marriage. He expects people to obey.

1 Nephi 3
7 And it came to pass that I, Nephi, said unto my father: I will go and do the things which the Lord hath commanded, for I know that the Lord giveth no commandments unto the children of men, save he shall prepare a way for them that they may accomplish the thing which he commandeth them.