More women priests being ordaned than men.

[Zoii]

Where are the moral standards you are appealing to? You are already discrediting the bible, so where is the source of your moral standards? And why must I apply them to myself?

I cited what I accept as a standard and what I dont in an earlier post - you may disapprove but here it is again

So what we should stone women who had sex?
We should give our daughters to their rapists?
We condone the murder of children (born and unborn) as armies are commanded to slaughter a whole town?
That we should not eat shell fish
Behead homosexuals
Inflict corporal punishments

Or...... is it that we should be good hearted people - think on God - - not thrown stones - have compassion - love people...

I am focussed more on the words of Jesus, and far less on the OT which has standards that can be very difficult to reconcile in today's society

 

[Radagast]

BUT I do - I placed this thread as a celebration.

I guess the thread went downhill after it was pointed out that the news story only applied to Brisbane. You may want to request a thread closure.

throwing comments around to an actual pastor which was just short of saying metaphorically 'burn the witch'

I'm pretty sure I didn't do that, and nothing I've said was intended as a criticism of that fine Christian lady.

 

[Zoii]

Like I said, many have been explicitly repealed in the New Testament (like the one about shellfish), while others have been explicitly reaffirmed (like the Ten Commandments).

Just to de-rail my own thread for a second...... I have issues reconciling the ten commandments as well...
eg Thou shall not kill:

But the bible is littered with Gods commandments to execute or go to war or has extracted his own genocide (ie the flood).

To me even the commandments evolved did they not? Sont Kill unless:
Commanded by God
In an act of war
An execution as a result of a crime
In the defence of self or others


Anyway - a side issue..... but your commented triggered the thought

 

[Radagast]

I am focussed more on the words of Jesus, and far less on the OT

And what about the Pauline Epistles?

 

[Zoii]

nothing I've said was intended as a criticism of that fine Christian lady.

Thank you for saying that - I felt very bad for her

 

[Hazelelponi]

Well does that mean you accept those OT standards in their entirety? I doubt anyone here does- and that's my point despite your attempt to ridicule me.

It means you misunderstand them, in my honest opinion, in their entirety.

But, the old testament and well, the basics of Christianity as a whole that I learned prior to even being saved is not only lengthy but far far off topic.

And the 'do my worst invitation' you made, no dear. You misunderstand me in my entirety as well. I wasn't here to prove ordination of women wrong, but rather to learn something..

You have, however, made the case perfectly clear and in this moment in time I feel absolutely certain of the truth of the matter.

 

[Radagast]

Just to de-rail my own thread for a second...... I have issues reconciling the ten commandments as well...
eg Thou shall not kill:

Do you mean Deuteronomy 5:17? It is generally translated this way:

CSB: Do not murder.
ESV, NASB, NIV, NRSV: You shall not murder.
NLT: You must not murder.

It does not rule out warfare or judicial execution.

I'm no expert on Hebrew, but in the Septuagint and the New Testament the verb is phoneúō (murder).

 

[Zoii]

It means you misunderstand them, in my honest opinion, in their entirety.

But, the old testament and well, the basics of Christianity as a whole that I learned prior to even being saved is not only lengthy but far far off topic.

And the 'do my worst invitation' you made, no dear. You misunderstand me in my entirety as well. I wasn't here to prove ordination of women wrong, but rather to learn something..

You have, however, made the case perfectly clear and in this moment in time I feel absolutely certain of the truth.

It is perhaps that God allows us to be tempted to sin - whether or not we succumb is up to us.

And thats fine - I have repeatedly said you are free to attend the church and male pastor of your liking; and to worship in the manner according to your denomination.

Its your insistence that those who are - or those who seek out - female pastors are in some way NOT obedient to God that I find abhorrent.

You state your mind is even clearer on the issue now. Again - Youre free to think what you will.

I still thank God he has delivered us women seeking that vocation despite your criticisms.

 

[Zoii]

Do you mean Deuteronomy 5:17? It is generally translated this way:

CSB: Do not murder.
ESV, NASB, NIV, NRSV: You shall not murder.
NLT: You must not murder.

It does not rule out warfare or judicial execution.

I'm no expert on Hebrew, but in the Septuagint and the New Testament the verb is phoneúō (murder).

Sigh - yes well therein lies another debate again - because that's not what any bible I've read says.....still not the OP so - best stay on track.... as much as I know I am a minority view

 

[section9+1]

I cited what I accept as a standard and what I dont in an earlier post - you may disapprove but here it is again



I am focussed more on the words of Jesus, and far less on the OT which has standards that can be very difficult to reconcile in today's society

I like the words of Jesus, too. But I understand that the old covenant with Moses and its requirements has been supplanted by the new covenant. Many of the requirements of the Mosaic law were simply given to separate the Jews from the people around them. They were supposed to be a different people and it didn't have anything to do with any wickedness of eating shellfish. It was about segregation and keeping them an intact people group, which they are still doing today. The rest of the OT is still valid.

 

[Zoii]

I like the words of Jesus, too. But I understand that the old covenant with Moses and its requirements has been supplanted by the new covenant. Many of the requirements of the Mosaic law were simply given to separate the Jews from the people around them. They were supposed to be a different people and it didn't have anything to do with any wickedness of eating shellfish. It was about segregation and keeping them an intact people group, which they are still doing today. The rest of the OT is still valid.

I appreciate your explanation (which I knew actually) but can you not see that your own explanation is explaining how biblical laws have been altered societally -

 

[section9+1]

No, they've been altered biblically. They've been tossed out by society.

 

[Dave-W]

I'm no expert on Hebrew, but in the Septuagint and the New Testament the verb is phoneúō (murder).

It is more properly rendered "Murder" in Exodus 20 as well.

 

[Zoii]

It is more properly rendered "Murder" in Exodus 20 as well.

lol Dave I clicked the link - it says thou shall not kill.

That said I shall bow to those with knowledge of the original language in which it was written.

 

[Dave-W]

lol Dave I clicked the link - it says thou shall not kill.

That said I shall bow to those with knowledge of the originally language in which it was written.

Apparently the link goes to the ASV, which was intentionally kept close to the KJV.

It was the KJV translators that picked "kill" instead of "murder," probably for political reasons.

Check out the various renderings:

Exodus 20:13 - Bible Gateway

 

[Zoii]

Apparently the link goes to the ASV, which was intentionally kept close to the KJV.

It was the KJV translators that picked "kill" instead of "murder," probably for political reasons.

Check out the various renderings:

Exodus 20:13 - Bible Gateway

Nice link - The tricky bit for me is - those commands to kill every man, woman and child (born or in utero) .... was that murder? The le Hague international court might argue its genocide.

 

[Dave-W]

The tricky bit for me is - those commands to kill every man, woman and child (born or in utero) .... was that murder?

Good question. It certainly seems like it.
But it could be that the children were cut from this life to have eternal bliss in the next. We just do not have the full picture on that.

The le Hague international court might argue its genocide.

I think the Hague would definitely say that.
But genocide is not a concept or term that is biblically recognized.

 

[Zoii]

Well its perhaps time to wrap up this thread.
And I chose to have the last word.

My thanks and congratulations to those women who seek a vocation as a pastor/priest.

To those who don't support this; I trust you've had your say and my summary of your views is that you do not accept that such appointments are legitimate biblically. Those of you in that camp, I guess I wont be seeing you at church any time soon.

Different denominations have differing interpretations of the bible. We all need to accept and respect that.

As I think we have all said what we wanted to say, I shall ask for the thread to be closed.

 

[section9+1]

I think you could say that God is the killer of every human. But only God can take life because only God can give it back.

 

[~Zao~]

I think you could say that God is the killer of every human. But only God can take life because only God can give it back.

Beware of Him who can not only kill the body but the soul as well.