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Modesty, Conviction vs. OCD, God Speaking

Discussion in 'Obsessive Compulsive Disorder' started by tuliplane, Mar 1, 2017.

  1. miknik5

    miknik5 "Let not your heart be troubled"

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    Mine too
     
  2. faroukfarouk

    faroukfarouk Fading curmudgeon

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    It does trouble that there is a cultural mindset by which some religious groups will nitpick people's subjective preferences to a minute detail...and then you discover that they don't even believe in the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, clearly revealed in Scripture. The design I got on my arm years ago faded; wasn't a success. I myself haven't worn earrings for years, though it doesn't trouble me if both genders wear them; maybe you feel the same way?
     
  3. Galatea

    Galatea Well-Known Member

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    That's good! He can help you out. :)
     
  4. faroukfarouk

    faroukfarouk Fading curmudgeon

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    I think also that many things that are worn are not really on the modesty-supposed immodesty paradigm, but rather they can be symbolic and therefore pragmatically useful as tools in witness. For example, while I think it was you who said you talked to someone who showed you her five sided star tattoo, I think some Christians like to use faith based ink designs as a tool in witness (e.g., Christian fish sign <>< on a wrist, etc.), which is a proven effective tool in conversation. Others prefer their initial witness to be silent. Re. whatever articles of clothing, tattoos, etc., it's often not a question of whether they fit someone's supposed canons of modesty at all, one way or the other.
     
  5. Sammy-San

    Sammy-San Newbie

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    If the shorts cover the thighs on both women, how would it be immodest on the curvy one?

    Also, what is the nuance of the term lady? Polite?
     
  6. Galatea

    Galatea Well-Known Member

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    Well, I don't know about your particular tastes, but most men prefer curvier women to stick thin women. They've done lots of studies, and a curvier woman is considered more attractive by most of the men in every survey and study. A stick thin woman looks like a boy or a kid, so a woman with thin legs is not going to be as sexually appealing as a woman with shapely legs. There's a reason why dancers' legs are considered attractive, it is not because they are stick thin.

    And, thin women can wear tank tops, but curvier women probably shouldn't. A top on Kelly Ripa might be okay- but the same top on Sophia Vergara would be indecent. So thin women can generally get away with wearing things thata curvy woman can not.

    I heard this definition of a lady. I like it very much: A lady is a woman who makes a man want to be a gentleman.
     
  7. Galatea

    Galatea Well-Known Member

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    You got the wrong lady, I don't recall a conversation about someone with a five sided star tattoo.
     
  8. faroukfarouk

    faroukfarouk Fading curmudgeon

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    You might have called it a pentagram; but anyway.
     
  9. faroukfarouk

    faroukfarouk Fading curmudgeon

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    Nice quote.
     
  10. Galatea

    Galatea Well-Known Member

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    No, I don't know anyone with a pentagram tattoo. That must be someone else.
     
  11. faroukfarouk

    faroukfarouk Fading curmudgeon

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    Although I thought this was you, it doesn't really matter, I guess. The point I was making I suppose was that it's not all about whether something is subjectively modest or not (although there are extreme cases when it does matter). It's also whether there is any symbolic value, and whether it can be used to promote what the symbol refers to, whether positively or negatively; and here ppl's views will vary depending on what it is. But never mind about the origin of the quote, above. Blessings.
     
  12. mcarmichael

    mcarmichael Novice

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    I think a lot of women understimate how great they look in dresses, and that is why they wear jeans so often.
     
  13. Zoii

    Zoii Well-Known Member

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    Wow I totally agree. To the OP I would like to say you got across well just how tough OCD can be and I hope you're doing OK.
    But I really support the above comments and I wear things according to:
    1. the weather
    2. my mood
    3. what I think looks good on me at the time
    Now I am totally able to control myself regarding what a guy might be wearing. I expect guys to be able to do the same and the fact that so many cant is a problem with those individuals and I refuse to take responsibility for their inadequacies.
     
  14. miknik5

    miknik5 "Let not your heart be troubled"

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    I love dresses.
     
  15. Sammy-San

    Sammy-San Newbie

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    I've read it was an ancient Christian symbol. Is that true?
     
  16. Sammy-San

    Sammy-San Newbie

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    Do you feel women are objectified as much as it is claimed?

    a usually unmarried young woman of grace, manners, or distinction.

    Definition of YOUNG LADY

    So the words have different meanings or depends on how its used?
     
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2017
  17. miknik5

    miknik5 "Let not your heart be troubled"

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    I think the one with a pretty face will always be looked at even if she is trying to be modest

    Should we put a bag over our faces too?

    That's what I meant in my first post here

    I think that those who are very attractive might have to consider what they wear but still will get looks regardless

    I was 14 years old when I was molested. I was fishing with my sister and I know it had nothing to do with what I was wearing
     
  18. miknik5

    miknik5 "Let not your heart be troubled"

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    I have a daughter

    Not only will I not let her wear certain clothes but I will never allow her to walk to a friends house

    There were many other times where I was stopped by cars and after what happened to me when I was 14 a fear was instilled in me that made me more aware of my surroundings and ready if I needed to defend myself

    In my teen years I would put my keys between each of my knuckles if I had to go into the parking lot after work if I was alone
     
  19. miknik5

    miknik5 "Let not your heart be troubled"

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    Thatcwe have to worry that men can control themselves is already a sin

    But we also have to be aware that there are men who do not control themselves

    A young girl needs to be made aware of that

    I think
    I hate to scare my daughter. Right now she is never far from me but she needs to know and she needs to be safe

    So what does this mean?

    I don't know

    But be aware where you are and don't wear clothes that are suggestive and be aware of your surroundings. Don't onout at night alone. Don't run or jog at night. Change your routine

    Please understand I have gotten over this. I'm not trying to instill fear and I am not afraid or scarred by this

    I'm a pretty tough cookie
    But these things happen and shouldn't happen
     
  20. tuliplane

    tuliplane Newbie

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    Wow, I am so sorry that happened to you! My sister and I were taken advantage of by our brother when we were very young and I know the problem lied with him and not with our little girl clothing. I have a friend who was also taken advantage of by her brothers and she was made to dress in very over-the-op modest clothes; again, it had nothing to do with what she was wearing. This proves the point that if males want to lust they will do it; if they have lust in their heart, then it doesn't matter if the female is wearing a potato sack. Interesting facts in both my friend's and my families are that: 1) We were made to wear clothes that covered very well and still had that happen to us.
    2) During the time the behavior was going on, both my friend and I were scrutinized by our brothers for "immodest clothing" (I still remember my brother tattling on me to my father for having 'immodest shorts' when I was 8 years old) even though they were doing very immoral things to us.
    3) Our parents preached about how girls need to cover up so as not to cause lust in the male and both my friend and I do not remember our parents teaching the boys not to have lustful eyes toward women.
    And last, this is kind of related: My dad would have these purity talks with us, likening a girl who did things before marriage to a used car, and 'Wouldn't you rather drive a new car than a car that was used?' He would say that girls who have done things before marriage were like cars that were taken on many test drives. Now, I am all for purity before marriage, I find it very important and what God calls us to do. BUT:
    1) The message was directed at how dirty a girl becomes and I do not remember the male having anything to do with it in that teaching, when both males and females are to blame (often males more so because they often initiate things and convince the girl to do it).
    2) Purity, while very important to God, is not where our worth lies.
    The message my father would preach is sadly a recurrent theme throughout the church. They focus so much on sex before marriage and probably not enough on other important things God expects of us and they like to shift the blame on women for sex outside of marriage. I have even read an analogy to a girl being like chewed up gum.
    It's just rather maddening...how women are viewed as something so degrading for being "used", but often nothing really was directed at the males who "used' them.
    Back to the topic of modesty though, another topic I'd like to mention is just because a woman has a more "womanly" body does not mean that she should feel ashamed and have to hide her curves just because she is more "sexually appealing". I am not at all saying she should in anyway flaunt it like a fishing lure as Kim Kardashian does, but she shouldn't have to feel like a lewd woman for simply having curves. I get that women with a more athletic build can "get away" with a lot more because they might not show cleavage etc., but simply having an attractive body is not her fault. It is also not a sin for a male to find her attractive, he just shouldn't lust after her. The same friend who was taken advantage of by her brothers has a very curvy figure and because of the message preached in her household, she thought she needed wear shapeless tops that went up very high because she didn't want to cause a boy to stumble. Her stepmother has even told her her clothes were too tight just because they fit her well and she happens to be very curvy, and complimented her outfit when it was very baggy and unflattering on her. I just don't believe women who are well-endowed should be made to feel ashamed and a sexual object just because of her natural shape, and that she needs to conceal herself because some man might find her sexually attractive! I read a great quote one time regarding modesty and likening it to the beautiful flowers God created: "Shall we throw a tarp over our flowerbeds?"
     
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