Modest Apparel

[jsarber]

1 Timothy 2:9-10:

In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array; But (which becometh women professing godliness) with good works.

I have felt personally convicted about summer wardrobes and swimsuits in particular. I host a daily podcast and thought I might discuss this issue on my show. I was curious to hear your thoughts on it. Obviously, our culture fully accepts most swimsuits and other revealing clothing as appropriate. As a Christian, what do you believe?

 

[JesusFreak78]

Not sure what to think when it comes to swimsuits, but what I think 1 Timothy 2:9 means is women isn't supposed to dress in a way that is drawing attention to her or her body.

 

[AlexBP]

There's been a thread on the topic running in this forum for the last several months in which others have said everything that I want to say and said it much better, so I'll just summarize my beliefs on this issue.

1) Certain other religions, particularly Islam, are known for their severe, hair-splitting stance on women's clothing. Jesus, however, said nothing on the topic. Scripture only gives us a general, common sense pointer in the direction of dressing decently, as opposed to specific instructions.

2) Ideally everyone should dress decently, both men and women. It's a part of good manners, which is part of loving our neighbors.

 

[WannaWitness]

I don't think I've worn a swimsuit since I was seventeen. I don't know... I just wouldn't feel right wearing one. I'd feel naked.

There are plenty of ways to keep cool in the hot summer and still be modest. My preference is for capris or shorts no higher than the knee. I also have culottes, and I even occasionally wear a casual skirt (a long multicolored "broomstick" style skirt) with a white T-shirt. Then, of course, there are sandals and flip-flops (and even the most conservative dressers don't seem to have trouble with those).

Anyway... that's just me.

 

[NorrinRadd]

1 Timothy 2:9-10: ...



I have felt personally convicted about summer wardrobes and swimsuits in particular. I host a daily podcast and thought I might discuss this issue on my show. I was curious to hear your thoughts on it. Obviously, our culture fully accepts most swimsuits and other revealing clothing as appropriate. As a Christian, what do you believe?

If you've "felt personally convicted," then by all means keep your nakedidity under wraps.

However, that particular passage you cited has more to do with flaunting one's wealth and status. (The apparel referenced was characteristic of the higher social classes.)

 

[Sketcher]

First of all, you need to consider the context. That context is church. It's supposed to be a house of worship, brotherhood, and sisterhood - not a house of fashion. It's not the place for women to get competitive and see who can out-dress the other each week.

Now, this isn't to say that their being modest for our sake doesn't have value, but it shouldn't be the first reason that people quote this verse. And if we are going to ask them to dress modestly for our sake, we should likewise dress modestly for their sake.

 

[St. Helens]

I have always been a very modest dresser. I mostly buy may clothes from the farm and fleet store because the clothes they sell in other stores is too skimpy for a woman my size. I am a tiny twiggy individual and its hard to find decent clothes for small people.

 

[desmalia]

I don't think I've worn a swimsuit since I was seventeen. I don't know... I just wouldn't feel right wearing one. I'd feel naked.

There are plenty of ways to keep cool in the hot summer and still be modest. My preference is for capris or shorts no higher than the knee. I also have culottes, and I even occasionally wear a casual skirt (a long multicolored "broomstick" style skirt) with a white T-shirt. Then, of course, there are sandals and flip-flops (and even the most conservative dressers don't seem to have trouble with those).

Anyway... that's just me.

It's kinda the same for me.

Even as a teenager I never liked to wear just a swimsuit, but preferred to have a t-shirt over top. (I was in fantastic shape too, so it wasn't a weight issue or anything). My mother made a comment recently on her blog that she was thrilled my sister and I preferred to cover our bodies up instead of flaunting them in little bikinis like many of our friends were doing. I never had any idea she was so happy about it! lol.

Even since I got married a few years ago, I find myself more and more aware of what might potentially be an issue, such as a shirt that's too tight or too low cut in the front. Just a reforming process, I suspect. I'm really not comfortable with potentially being a stumbling block to anyone. And I still find there are plenty of clothing options to choose from that are comfortable and stylish without being revealing.

As far as how men dress goes, well the only really immodest thing I see is the teens with their jeans hanging as far down as possible without them falling down (and sometimes they do fall down anyway, lol). But usually they at least have long baggy shirts on that cover anything that might accidentally be revealed. Still... I'm looking forward to the END of that little fashion trend.

 

[JesusFreak78]

As far as how men dress goes, well the only really immodest thing I see is the teens with their jeans hanging as far down as possible without them falling down (and sometimes they do fall down anyway, lol). But usually they at least have long baggy shirts on that cover anything that might accidentally be revealed. Still... I'm looking forward to the END of that little fashion trend.

I really wish this fashion trend would end too and I look at it as immodest. I have seen both girls and guys doing this, but it's most guys.

 

[Criada]

Do you consider swimming costumes appropriate if one intends to swim?
Personally, I can't see any other reason to wear one....

 

[J.B.]

Personally, I think most swim-wear related clothing is appropriate in the proper context, in which case it is of course swimming. Not to church though, unless you have absolutely nothing else, then I can see an exception made here justifiably.

I know it's somewhat off topic, but:

I've been meaning to ask some of you here though. Do you consider fedora hats to be "conservative?" Historically, the fedora has been the de rigeur style of headwear for men between the decades of the 1920s to the 1960s, to fall completely out of style by the 1970s where mostly only older or traditional men would have worn it. However, since our last decade, the 2000s, the fedora has seen a bit of a comeback amongst some celebrities (Johnny Depp, Bradd Pitt, Heath Ledger, etc...) and some teenagers and younger adult men. It is, to a certain extent, considered by some people to be "trendy." Personally, I love to wear my fedoras (they are the wide brimmed classic kinds of the 1930s and 40s, not the super-short, low-crown stingy brims popular today). Personally, I consider the fedora hat style to be "conservative," by definition because it has since the 1960s, fallen out of mainstream fashion, but they can still look good for that matter... I consider it more traditional, and not so "trendy."

 

[dies-l]

If I am going swimming, I wear a swimsuit. When I go to work, I wear a business suit. To wear a business suit at the beach or a swimsuit at the office would seem to me to be equally immodest.

 

[WannaWitness]

It's kinda the same for me.

Even as a teenager I never liked to wear just a swimsuit, but preferred to have a t-shirt over top. (I was in fantastic shape too, so it wasn't a weight issue or anything). My mother made a comment recently on her blog that she was thrilled my sister and I preferred to cover our bodies up instead of flaunting them in little bikinis like many of our friends were doing. I never had any idea she was so happy about it! lol.

Even since I got married a few years ago, I find myself more and more aware of what might potentially be an issue, such as a shirt that's too tight or too low cut in the front. Just a reforming process, I suspect. I'm really not comfortable with potentially being a stumbling block to anyone. And I still find there are plenty of clothing options to choose from that are comfortable and stylish without being revealing.

It's always good knowing that I'm not alone in feeling the way I do. I like to be as careful as I can. I don't consider myself to have a frumpy taste in clothes, although there are some who probably think differently. But it's bad enough that lust happens (even in the case of those who just happen to be "built right", and can't even hide their shapes in a muumuu.) So, we just have to do what we have to do.

As for me, I would like to find some good caprialls or longer shortalls for the warm weather (as I am an overalls kind of lady myself). Usually, the thrift stores are good for these kinds of things, but I lately haven't been having much luck. The closest things to this that they had was a couple of years ago at Wal-mart -- caprialls and shortalls -- but the caprialls all sold out, and there was nothing left but the shortalls, all of which were butt-cheek short and therefore a bit too revealing for my taste.

In the meantime, I'll just stick with what I have.

 

[Atlantians]

When Humans become sinful, God clothed the First Husband and Wife in coats of Animal skins.
What God hath clothed let not man unclothe.

We know that this was a Public clothing and not a clothing that remains in intimacy between the Husband and Wife. As the Song of Songs... rather clearly... illustrates. And is obviously implied in many other texts.
As far as being around others, even your family, of differing genders with whom you are not married.

What God hath clothed let not man unclothe.

If you a Christian Woman:
Please don't wear revealing clothes.
Even revealing bathing suits.
This includes overly tight clothing.

It is very hard for me to look a girl in the eyes and keep my focus there, when my peripheral vision sees much cleavage in the very low cut and tight shirt said girl is wearing.

I hate my lust. I hate it bitterly.
Yet, please realize that being forced to communicate respectfully with a lady who doesn't respect herself or me enough to cover her features which are meant for her husband's sight alone... is not pleasant. Understand that you are inviting and participating in lust and shaming yourself.
Yes. If you are dressing immodestly: You are inviting lust and participating in it.

Let me give a practical rule of thumb for modesty in general:

Coats of animal skins cover the torso and the bottom, maybe as far as the knee. But at least to the thigh. Shorts and a high-cut looser-fit tank top is the least that fits with that description.

If it is so tight your figure is obvious: It ain't modest.
If it is so loose or awkward that it is uncomfortable or inconvenient or impractical: It is legalistic.

Bikinis are simply a horrid travesty.

Some very lovely and seemingly Godly women I know insist on wearing low cut... TIGHT clothing and when near water, very small bikinis that cover less skin than my boxers.

Second rule of thumb: If my Boxers cover more skin than your bathing suit... for the sake of all things sacred, buy a dark T-shirt and long shorts. Wear that instead.

The stomach being revealed leads the eyes directly to the low centre of the torso emphasizing the bosom and the lower parts.
The thigh being largely revealed does the same.
Short shorts... well... seriously?

I think I have made myself clear.
I am a sinner. When I sin, please don't help me sin.
When I am fighting my wickedness, please don't take sides with the devil.
Thank you.

 

[Redneck12]

Seeing what the girls wear in the Middle School where I work, I think the Moslems have a good point! And the parents allow them to wear these clothes, even buy them for them.

 

[Pompa Mike]

If I am going swimming, I wear a swimsuit. When I go to work, I wear a business suit. To wear a business suit at the beach or a swimsuit at the office would seem to me to be equally immodest.

Absolutely great answer. Unfortunately a great number of people don't see it that way. Personally being a "normal" guy I find woman dressed modestly much more attractive than one's that dressed like hoochies. My feeling is that when a person dresses a certain way they might be trying to attract someone. Fortunately I'm not that someone and I don't have any interest in that.

 

[desmalia]

It's always good knowing that I'm not alone in feeling the way I do. I like to be as careful as I can. I don't consider myself to have a frumpy taste in clothes, although there are some who probably think differently. But it's bad enough that lust happens (even in the case of those who just happen to be "built right", and can't even hide their shapes in a muumuu.) So, we just have to do what we have to do.

As for me, I would like to find some good caprialls or longer shortalls for the warm weather (as I am an overalls kind of lady myself). Usually, the thrift stores are good for these kinds of things, but I lately haven't been having much luck. The closest things to this that they had was a couple of years ago at Wal-mart -- caprialls and shortalls -- but the caprialls all sold out, and there was nothing left but the shortalls, all of which were butt-cheek short and therefore a bit too revealing for my taste.

In the meantime, I'll just stick with what I have.

I'm not really the overalls type. They just don't work on my body and make me look huge, lol. But otherwise I think we're pretty similar about that kind of thing. The one I struggle with is finding t-shirts that are feminine and long enough to work with my long waistline, but not low-cut. It's hit and miss. Sometimes I can find several, sometimes none.

When Humans become sinful, God clothed the First Husband and Wife in coats of Animal skins.
What God hath clothed let not man unclothe.

We know that this was a Public clothing and not a clothing that remains in intimacy between the Husband and Wife. As the Song of Songs... rather clearly... illustrates. And is obviously implied in many other texts.
As far as being around others, even your family, of differing genders with whom you are not married.

What God hath clothed let not man unclothe.

If you a Christian Woman:
Please don't wear revealing clothes.
Even revealing bathing suits.
This includes overly tight clothing.

It is very hard for me to look a girl in the eyes and keep my focus there, when my peripheral vision sees much cleavage in the very low cut and tight shirt said girl is wearing.

I hate my lust. I hate it bitterly.
Yet, please realize that being forced to communicate respectfully with a lady who doesn't respect herself or me enough to cover her features which are meant for her husband's sight alone... is not pleasant. Understand that you are inviting and participating in lust and shaming yourself.
Yes. If you are dressing immodestly: You are inviting lust and participating in it.

Let me give a practical rule of thumb for modesty in general:

Coats of animal skins cover the torso and the bottom, maybe as far as the knee. But at least to the thigh. Shorts and a high-cut looser-fit tank top is the least that fits with that description.

If it is so tight your figure is obvious: It ain't modest.
If it is so loose or awkward that it is uncomfortable or inconvenient or impractical: It is legalistic.

Bikinis are simply a horrid travesty.

Some very lovely and seemingly Godly women I know insist on wearing low cut... TIGHT clothing and when near water, very small bikinis that cover less skin than my boxers.

Second rule of thumb: If my Boxers cover more skin than your bathing suit... for the sake of all things sacred, buy a dark T-shirt and long shorts. Wear that instead.

The stomach being revealed leads the eyes directly to the low centre of the torso emphasizing the bosom and the lower parts.
The thigh being largely revealed does the same.
Short shorts... well... seriously?

I think I have made myself clear.
I am a sinner. When I sin, please don't help me sin.
When I am fighting my wickedness, please don't take sides with the devil.
Thank you.

I really appreciate this post. There a lot of men out there who are not willing to admit this struggle. Yet I have no doubt it is a serious issue for most of you. Men need to train themselves not to look at the parts that will cause lust, but women must also be responsible to dress in such a way that we're not causing men to stumble.

I do think there are some decent swimsuits out there that are fine for the beach. But most of what's out there for women are far too immodest. Especially bikinis. Most mens' swim trunks are fine, and honestly I wish it was the fashion for women to wear something less tight fitting like that instead of something that looks more like underwear. And I'm sorry but I think it must be said - speedos on men should be outlawed! lol I mean really, no one needs to see that!

 

[dusky_tresses]

To be honest, I think this is an issue that really isn't as bad as people make it out to be...I really don't see a lot of problems with Christian women wearing immodest clothing. If you are Christian, it's common sense and knowledge that it's not appropriate to wear tight clothing, clothing which bares private areas, or looks like it's about to fall off. If you do see these things happen, it's mostly with teen girls-- the middle schoolers and even girls in their late teens. I see that at my university a lot with 18 year old women feeling the need to show as much cleavage as possible.

I'm 26 and I see a lot of Christian women dressing modestly who are around my age. There are times where I see a woman who is older wearing something I wouldn't dare, but other than that happening once a month, it doesn't occur a lot. And personally, the parents of these middle school girls need to open their eyes and pay more attention, along with laying down more rules. No one is interested in seeing an 11-year old's thighs, or a 12-year old wearing a miniskirt...unless you're a pedophile.

I don't think it's wrong to dress in a certain way to attract-- it's how you're dressed which matters. You can still attract the attention of that one guy or girl you like by dressing more nicely, wearing a different color, looking sharp and crisp, etc. But if you're wearing a speedo, which really NO ONE wants to see, or showing your goods, or wearing a tiny string bikini-- then it's inappropriate. That's not just attracting, that's trying too hard.

 

[salida]

Christian ladies should be modest-the culture can't dictate how we dress. I get tired of seeing ones cleavage-what is so special about that?

 

[Atlantians]

Christian ladies should be modest-the culture can't dictate how we dress.

I get tired of seeing ones cleavage-what is so special about that?

A LOT!




Which is why I only wanna see that much (and more) of my Wife.
When I am married.

Not every girl at the beach.