Millennium Questions: for an unbiased witness

BABerean2

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It has been my experience that some can never abandon their man-made doctrines.

However, occasionally we find a person who wants to know what the Bible teaches without the doctrines of men.

The following questions are designed for those few who are looking for the truth.


=============================

Millennium Questions:

Can the following questions be examined without ridicule, and condemnation, based on the New Covenant promised in Jeremiah 31:31-34, and found fulfilled in Hebrews 8:6-13, and Hebrews 10:16-18, and Hebrews 12:18-24?

Based on the following scripture, will immortals and mortals both live on the earth for 1,000 years after the Second Coming of Christ? Will there be renewed animal sacrifices in earthly Jerusalem for 1,000 years after the Second Coming of Christ?


Why did Jesus correct the woman at the well when she said earthly Jerusalem was the place to worship?


How many mortals are left alive on the planet at the end of Matthew 25:31-46?


What is the restitution of all things at the return of Christ in Acts 3:20-21?
Will Christ's sacrifice at Calvary also reverse the curse, at His return?


Does death die at the last trumpet in 1 Corinthians 15?


Why did Paul say the Jerusalem above is our home in Galatians 4:24-31?


Was Paul expecting Christ to return "in flaming fire" taking vengeance on those who do not know God in 2 Thessalonians 1:7-10. How would mortals survive this fire?
Does the fire come at the end of Revelation 20?


Did Paul expect both the living and the dead to be judged at the appearing of Christ, in 2 Timothy 4:1?
When is the judgment of the dead in Revelation 20? Is it the same judgment of the dead in Revelation 11:18?


What is the inheritance of the Old Testament Saints in Hebrews 11:1-16?


Is the third temple found in 1 Peter 2:4-10? Is this temple just as real as a temple made of earthly stones?


What was Peter expecting on the day of the Lord when He comes as a thief, in 2 Peter 3:1-13?


Do we find the judgment of both the living and the dead at the 7th trumpet, which is the last trumpet in the Bible, in Revelation 11:15-18? Why do most preachers ignore the time of the judgment of the dead, with reward for some, and destruction for others in Revelation 11:18? What does it prove about the chronology of the Book of Revelation?


Are there multiple visions of Christ's Second Coming in the Book of Revelation, which prove the book is not in chronological order? Please consider the following as possibilities.

.....................................................

Christ returns at the end of Revelation chapter 6, with signs in the sun, moon, and stars, as are found in the Olivet Discourse.
Those at the end of the chapter are hiding from the wrath of the Lamb.
Why would they be hiding if Christ is not present?
The "kings", "captains", "might men", "free", and "bond" are also found in chapter 19 at the return of Christ.

He returns at the 7th trumpet, which is the last trumpet in the Bible, and the time of the judgment of the dead in Revelation 11:15-18.

The beginning of chapter 12 is a history lesson containing the fall of Satan, and the birth and death of Christ, who is the seed promised to crush the head of Satan in Genesis 3:15.

The Second Coming is found in the "harvest" of chapter 14, which is related to the parable of the wheat and tares in Matthew chapter 13.

He comes as a thief at Armageddon, and the greatest earthquake in history is found in chapter 16. This occurs when the 7th angel pours out his vial. What happens to the islands and the mountains during this earthquake?

He comes on a horse in chapter 19.

He comes with the fire, and the judgment of the dead at the end of chapter 20, which agrees with what Paul said in 2 Thessalonians 1:7-10, and 2 Timothy 4:1.
(The time of the judgment of the dead is also found in Revelation 11:18.)
There are no mortals left alive on the planet at the end of Matthew 25:31-46.
Revelation 9:14 proves some of the angels have already been bound in some manner.
Because the two witnesses were bodily resurrected from the dead in Revelation 11, the "first resurrection" at the beginning of Revelation 20 is not the first bodily resurrection in the book.


Is the only way to properly interpret the book through the principle of "Recapitulation"?


.
 

Dave L

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Unless a person is born-again, they cannot believe Jesus' gospel of the kingdom. They are stuck thinking like the Pharisees. They look for a kingdom of sight the flesh can grasp, not a spiritual kingdom of faith viewed by the Born-again.
 
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Deade

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It has been my experience that some can never abandon their man-made doctrines.

However, occasionally we find a person who wants to know what the Bible teaches without the doctrines of men.

The following questions are designed for those few who are looking for the truth.


=============================

Millennium Questions:

Can the following questions be examined without ridicule, and condemnation, based on the New Covenant promised in Jeremiah 31:31-34, and found fulfilled in Hebrews 8:6-13, and Hebrews 10:16-18, and Hebrews 12:18-24?

Based on the following scripture, will immortals and mortals both live on the earth for 1,000 years after the Second Coming of Christ? Will there be renewed animal sacrifices in earthly Jerusalem for 1,000 years after the Second Coming of Christ?


Why did Jesus correct the woman at the well when she said earthly Jerusalem was the place to worship?


How many mortals are left alive on the planet at the end of Matthew 25:31-46?


What is the restitution of all things at the return of Christ in Acts 3:20-21?
Will Christ's sacrifice at Calvary also reverse the curse, at His return?


Does death die at the last trumpet in 1 Corinthians 15?


Why did Paul say the Jerusalem above is our home in Galatians 4:24-31?


Was Paul expecting Christ to return "in flaming fire" taking vengeance on those who do not know God in 2 Thessalonians 1:7-10. How would mortals survive this fire?
Does the fire come at the end of Revelation 20?


Did Paul expect both the living and the dead to be judged at the appearing of Christ, in 2 Timothy 4:1?
When is the judgment of the dead in Revelation 20? Is it the same judgment of the dead in Revelation 11:18?


What is the inheritance of the Old Testament Saints in Hebrews 11:1-16?


Is the third temple found in 1 Peter 2:4-10? Is this temple just as real as a temple made of earthly stones?


What was Peter expecting on the day of the Lord when He comes as a thief, in 2 Peter 3:1-13?


Do we find the judgment of both the living and the dead at the 7th trumpet, which is the last trumpet in the Bible, in Revelation 11:15-18? Why do most preachers ignore the time of the judgment of the dead, with reward for some, and destruction for others in Revelation 11:18? What does it prove about the chronology of the Book of Revelation?


Are there multiple visions of Christ's Second Coming in the Book of Revelation, which prove the book is not in chronological order? Please consider the following as possibilities.

.....................................................

Christ returns at the end of Revelation chapter 6, with signs in the sun, moon, and stars, as are found in the Olivet Discourse.
Those at the end of the chapter are hiding from the wrath of the Lamb.
Why would they be hiding if Christ is not present?
The "kings", "captains", "might men", "free", and "bond" are also found in chapter 19 at the return of Christ.

He returns at the 7th trumpet, which is the last trumpet in the Bible, and the time of the judgment of the dead in Revelation 11:15-18.

The beginning of chapter 12 is a history lesson containing the fall of Satan, and the birth and death of Christ, who is the seed promised to crush the head of Satan in Genesis 3:15.

The Second Coming is found in the "harvest" of chapter 14, which is related to the parable of the wheat and tares in Matthew chapter 13.

He comes as a thief at Armageddon, and the greatest earthquake in history is found in chapter 16. This occurs when the 7th angel pours out his vial. What happens to the islands and the mountains during this earthquake?

He comes on a horse in chapter 19.

He comes with the fire, and the judgment of the dead at the end of chapter 20, which agrees with what Paul said in 2 Thessalonians 1:7-10, and 2 Timothy 4:1.
(The time of the judgment of the dead is also found in Revelation 11:18.)
There are no mortals left alive on the planet at the end of Matthew 25:31-46.
Revelation 9:14 proves some of the angels have already been bound in some manner.
Because the two witnesses were bodily resurrected from the dead in Revelation 11, the "first resurrection" at the beginning of Revelation 20 is not the first bodily resurrection in the book.


Is the only way to properly interpret the book through the principle of "Recapitulation"?


.

Quite a list of questions that will encompass all of the prophecies relating to the "Day of the Lord" in the Old and New Testaments. Let God's Spirit direct you through them and you will get all the answers the Lord want you to have, at this time. Others to be unlocked when appropriate.

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Brian Mcnamee

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Being born again has to do with regeneration and being sealed with the Holy Spirit having received Jesus through faith and repentance. This has nothing to do with the debate on the kingdom. I have gone down this path with you all before and I consider your doctrine the one in error and man made. The fact you make your self both lawyer and judge and hold doctrines you will not abandon either is limiting debate and claiming a monopoly on truth is not possible as this issue is like a horse race with many opinions or entries and you are claiming your horse has won before the race has been run. It will be 20/20 in the rear view mirror and the scripture say study yourself to show yourself approved rightly dividing the word or truth and warns against being led into a wind of doctrine. You are presenting your wind and it blows.
 
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BABerean2

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Being born again has to do with regeneration and being sealed with the Holy Spirit having received Jesus through faith and repentance. This has nothing to do with the debate on the kingdom. I have gone down this path with you all before and I consider your doctrine the one in error and man made. The fact you make your self both lawyer and judge and hold doctrines you will not abandon either is limiting debate and claiming a monopoly on truth is not possible as this issue is like a horse race with many opinions or entries and you are claiming your horse has won before the race has been run. It will be 20/20 in the rear view mirror and the scripture say study yourself to show yourself approved rightly dividing the word or truth and warns against being led into a wind of doctrine. You are presenting your wind and it blows.


If you do not want to answer the questions, the rest of us understand why.



.
 
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Brian Mcnamee

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Ive debated you several times and you never answer the difficulties I have challenged you with but just go on stating your case and arguing in a circle. My objection is the way you state your question as if your own point of view is the one not man made and honest seekers need to follow you. One day perhaps we will go at it again or I can wait and go over it with you when we have more time like 1000 more years.
 
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Timtofly

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It has been my experience that some can never abandon their man-made doctrines.

However, occasionally we find a person who wants to know what the Bible teaches without the doctrines of men.

The following questions are designed for those few who are looking for the truth.


=============================

Millennium Questions:

Can the following questions be examined without ridicule, and condemnation, based on the New Covenant promised in Jeremiah 31:31-34, and found fulfilled in Hebrews 8:6-13, and Hebrews 10:16-18, and Hebrews 12:18-24?

God is judge.

Based on the following scripture, will immortals and mortals both live on the earth for 1,000 years after the Second Coming of Christ?

What does mortal and immortal do with Revelation 20? They have resurrected bodies, and they cannot be killed at the second death. That does not extend to their descendants genetically. They escape the second death because they were chosen by God in their sin nature prior to their physical death. In their resurrected bodies, they have babies. God did not chose their babies nor have those babies physically died. If they disobey Christ, their physical death is not going to save them. If they reject Christ they go to the lake of fire. Perhaps not immediately, but they may have to wait in Death.

There is no question about the first generation. It is the 40th generation living thousands of miles from Jerusalem.

Will there be renewed animal sacrifices in earthly Jerusalem for 1,000 years after the Second Coming of Christ?

What do the OT prophets claim?

Why did Jesus correct the woman at the well when she said earthly Jerusalem was the place to worship?

What does the 1st century have to do with the 28th century?

How many mortals are left alive on the planet at the end of Matthew 25:31-46?

0

What is the restitution of all things at the return of Christ in Acts 3:20-21?

Earth is restored to a pre-fall condition. Those killed in the harvest are resurrected into incorruptible bodies. The curse is lifted. Death can happen. It is not total perfection. That did not work the first time.

Will Christ's sacrifice at Calvary also reverse the curse, at His return?

Not relevant. God declares the 6000 years of punishment is over at the 7th Trumpet. The church was already complete and presented to God at the 6th Seal.

Does death die at the last trumpet in 1 Corinthians 15?

Death does not die. It is made irrelevant in the next reality.

Why did Paul say the Jerusalem above is our home in Galatians 4:24-31?

Paradise is the home of the church. Adam's redeemed descendants are currently living in the Garden. That will not change until the New Jerusalem comes down to earth.

Was Paul expecting Christ to return "in flaming fire" taking vengeance on those who do not know God in 2 Thessalonians 1:7-10. How would mortals survive this fire?

Yes. They don't survive. That is the point.

Does the fire come at the end of Revelation 20?

Revelation 14 and 19

Did Paul expect both the living and the dead to be judged at the appearing of Christ, in 2 Timothy 4:1?

The redeemed (living) will be judged and rewarded. The dead (living) will be killed.

The dead of all time remain dead until the GWT. Judgment is death, but not the second death. The Second Coming is the judgment to end life as we know it. It is the end of sin and the knowledge of evil. Wickedness will be judged and all will die by the end of Armageddon.

When is the judgment of the dead in Revelation 20?

It is in Revelation 20, GWT.

Is it the same judgment of the dead in Revelation 11:18?

Revelation 11, first death. Revelation 20, GWT, second death.

What is the inheritance of the Old Testament Saints in Hebrews 11:1-16?

Paradise

Is the third temple found in 1 Peter 2:4-10? Is this temple just as real as a temple made of earthly stones?

The church is not in the Millennium.

What was Peter expecting on the day of the Lord when He comes as a thief, in 2 Peter 3:1-13?

The completion of the church. Presented as a whole and complete body in the temple of God. Not on earth. In Paradise.

Do we find the judgment of both the living and the dead at the 7th trumpet, which is the last trumpet in the Bible, in Revelation 11:15-18? Why do most preachers ignore the time of the judgment of the dead, with reward for some, and destruction for others in Revelation 11:18? What does it prove about the chronology of the Book of Revelation?

The 7th Trumpet is a celebration. Satan turns it into 3.5 years of sheol on earth.

Sheol only comes at one time during a short 3.5 year period. Sheol does not come to earth at the end of the Millennium. God sends fire down and consumes Satan and his new recruits. Not the same army nor battle as Armageddon.

Are there multiple visions of Christ's Second Coming in the Book of Revelation, which prove the book is not in chronological order?

No, John watched it and recorded it as a literal witness.

Please consider the following as possibilities.

.....................................................

Christ returns at the end of Revelation chapter 6, with signs in the sun, moon, and stars, as are found in the Olivet Discourse.
Those at the end of the chapter are hiding from the wrath of the Lamb.
Why would they be hiding if Christ is not present?

The Lamb carries out the final harvest of the Trumpets and Thunders. The 7th Trumpet is the celebration. Jesus does not play guest to Satan’s 3.5 years. Jesus waits until the battle of Armageddon, then kills all the rest of humanity, binds Satan, and cast the FP and beast into the lake of fire.

The "kings", "captains", "might men", "free", and "bond" are also found in chapter 19 at the return of Christ.

He returns at the 7th trumpet, which is the last trumpet in the Bible, and the time of the judgment of the dead in Revelation 11:15-18.

The beginning of chapter 12 is a history lesson containing the fall of Satan, and the birth and death of Christ, who is the seed promised to crush the head of Satan in Genesis 3:15.

The Second Coming is found in the "harvest" of chapter 14, which is related to the parable of the wheat and tares in Matthew chapter 13.

He comes as a thief at Armageddon, and the greatest earthquake in history is found in chapter 16. This occurs when the 7th angel pours out his vial. What happens to the islands and the mountains during this earthquake?

The Lamb does not leave until Satan's 42 months.

He comes on a horse in chapter 19.

He comes with the fire, and the judgment of the dead at the end of chapter 20, which agrees with what Paul said in 2 Thessalonians 1:7-10, and 2 Timothy 4:1.
(The time of the judgment of the dead is also found in Revelation 11:18.)
There are no mortals left alive on the planet at the end of Matthew 25:31-46.
Revelation 9:14 proves some of the angels have already been bound in some manner.
Because the two witnesses were bodily resurrected from the dead in Revelation 11, the "first resurrection" at the beginning of Revelation 20 is not the first bodily resurrection in the book.
Is the only way to properly interpret the book through the principle of "Recapitulation?

No, Revelation 19 and the battle of Armageddon in Revelation 16 is the same event. There is only one Second Coming, the 6th Seal. Satan gets his time and Jesus leaves and comes back, but it is not a third return. It is the postponement of the inevitable.
 
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Dave L

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No one that I know of is looking for a kingdom like that prior to the 2nd coming, but are expecting a kingdom like that, as of the 2nd coming.
You cannot see the kingdom of faith or you would not be looking for that one.
“Jesus answered and said unto him, ‘Verily, verily, I say unto thee, except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God’.” John 3:3 (NCPB)
 
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Timtofly

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Your statements above contradict each other, and therefore cannot be correct.
No, the curse has nothing to do with death. The body can decay under the curse and death happens sooner than later. But God can kill a perfectly healthy person without any curse or decay. Ask Moses, why he had to die early. Just because there is no sin nature, does not mean there will not be rebellion. There are still rules to live in a world that can still kill someone if not followed. You cannot jump off a 20 story building and not get hurt.
 
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BABerean2

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Yes, Cain killed Abel. Death without the curse. Abel did everything he was supposed to do in obedience to God, and he still died.


Gen 3:17 And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;
Gen 3:18 Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field;
Gen 3:19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.


Rev 22:1 And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.
Rev 22:2 In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations.
Rev 22:3 And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him:
Rev 22:4 And they shall see his face; and his name shall be in their foreheads.


.
 
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Timtofly

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Gen 3:17 And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;
Gen 3:18 Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field;
Gen 3:19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.


Rev 22:1 And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.
Rev 22:2 In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations.
Rev 22:3 And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him:
Rev 22:4 And they shall see his face; and his name shall be in their foreheads.


.
Revelation 20 also declares 1000 years. You have proved that you can interpret Scripture as you see fit. Death and the curse are two different conditions. You have not even pointed out what death is. There is no curse in the next reality. Those verses prove that. The 7th Trumpet removes the curse as well. Does that stop God from allowing Satan 3.5 years? If the 7th Trumpet is the completion of all things, it is the removal of the curse. It is not the removal of 6 times, in Revelation 20, the time frame, 1000 years. If Revelation 20 is a recap, there was a resurrection at the cross of troubled saints. There will be a resurrection of sinners to the GWT. That is what Revelation 20 says no matter how you insert it in history. The curse was removed at the 7th trumpet. It is never re-instated.
 
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BABerean2

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Revelation 20 also declares 1000 years. You have proved that you can interpret Scripture as you see fit. Death and the curse are two different conditions. You have not even pointed out what death is. There is no curse in the next reality. Those verses prove that. The 7th Trumpet removes the curse as well. Does that stop God from allowing Satan 3.5 years? If the 7th Trumpet is the completion of all things, it is the removal of the curse. It is not the removal of 6 times, in Revelation 20, the time frame, 1000 years. If Revelation 20 is a recap, there was a resurrection at the cross of troubled saints. There will be a resurrection of sinners to the GWT. That is what Revelation 20 says no matter how you insert it in history. The curse was removed at the 7th trumpet. It is never re-instated.


The confusion found above is what is required to make the Premill doctrine work.

You appear not to be an unbiased witness, who is willing to honestly answer the questions at the beginning of this thread.


.
 
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DavidPT

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Does death die at the last trumpet in 1 Corinthians 15?

Sometimes you have to answer questions by asking questions of your own.

1 Corinthians 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
55 O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?
56 The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.
57 But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

What about the great white throne judgment? Doesn't death still exist up until the time of the great white throne judgment? Aren't some people still physically dead prior to the time of the great white throne judgment? Until God raises them from the dead how can death have already died at the last trump?

The great white throne judgment, where does it fit per your view? Prior to, during, or after, this same moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump? As to 1 Corinthians 15:51-57 above, in context none of that is also involving the fate of the wicked dead at the time. Because if it is, that would mean 1 Corinthians 15:57 has to also be applied to the wicked who get cast into the LOF. This is why context matters. Verse 57 alone undeniably proves that nothing in verses 51-57 above have a single thing to do with what also happens to the wicked lost in that same moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump.
 
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Timtofly

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The confusion found above is what is required to make the Premill doctrine work.

You appear not to be an unbiased witness, who is willing to honestly answer the questions at the beginning of this thread.
You seem biased on proving there is a Millennium, just so you can declare it does not exist. I am not biased either way.
 
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BABerean2

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You seem biased on proving there is a Millennium, just so you can declare it does not exist. I am not biased either way.

There is a Millennium.
The 1,000 years is symbolic of most of the Church Age.
The Book of Revelation is full of symbolic language as revealed by Christ in Revelation 1:20.
There is a Lamb. However, He is not an animal.


If you were not biased, you would honestly answer the questions at the beginning of this thread, and then see the error of the Premill doctrine.


Destroying the Premill doctrine in less than ten minutes:


.
.
 
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BABerean2

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Sometimes you have to answer questions by asking questions of your own.

1 Corinthians 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
55 O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?
56 The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.
57 But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

What about the great white throne judgment? Doesn't death still exist up until the time of the great white throne judgment? Aren't some people still physically dead prior to the time of the great white throne judgment? Until God raises them from the dead how can death have already died at the last trump?

The great white throne judgment, where does it fit per your view? Prior to, during, or after, this same moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump? As to 1 Corinthians 15:51-57 above, in context none of that is also involving the fate of the wicked dead at the time. Because if it is, that would mean 1 Corinthians 15:57 has to also be applied to the wicked who get cast into the LOF. This is why context matters. Verse 57 alone undeniably proves that nothing in verses 51-57 above have a single thing to do with what also happens to the wicked lost in that same moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump.


The seventh trumpet is the last trumpet in the Bible in Revelation 11:15-18.

I have discussed this with you before, but will say it again.
The time of the judgment of the dead is also found in Revelation 11:15-18.
This is the same time of the judgment of the dead in Revelation 20.
Since the Book of Revelation is not in chronological order, they are both visions of the Second Coming of Christ.

If you will honestly answer the questions at the beginning of this thread, you will see these facts.

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