Messianic Judaism vs. Conservative Christianity

[visionary]

I can certainly relate. I too feel like an outcast at Synagogue, and I frankly don't like modern day Christianity enough to go to church. I'd have to go to a more liberal church like Episcopal or MCC to even tolerate it.

I often question whether I made the right choice becoming Messianic since I hate feeling rejected by most of the Jews in the world.

Why would rejection by another sect of Judaism surprise you or make you feel rejected.. just because you believe in Yeshua as the Messiah.. well the disciples and Yeshua himself experienced this... so you are in good company

 

[yonah_mishael]

I used to visit an MCC congregation once in a while. I also had a good friend in an Episcopal church. Recently there was a tornado in my hometown (last Sunday) that ripped away 30% of the city, including the MCC building. We all face rejection at one point or another. It's something that develops character. (I doubt anyone else on this forum has ever been to MCC, though.)

By the way, what did you think of the 2004 movie production of Phantom?

I'm Reform (attending a Conservative synagogue now with complete openness), and I've experienced the feeling of being an outsider in Orthodox synagogues, too. It's not just you.

 

[yedida]

I used to visit an MCC congregation once in a while. I also had a good friend in an Episcopal church. Recently there was a tornado in my hometown (last Sunday) that ripped away 30% of the city, including the MCC building. We all face rejection at one point or another. It's something that develops character. (I doubt anyone else on this forum has ever been to MCC, though.)

By the way, what did you think of the 2004 movie production of Phantom?

I'm Reform (attending a Conservative synagogue now with complete openness), and I've experienced the feeling of being an outsider in Orthodox synagogues, too. It's not just you.

I'm not sure what an MCC is. Is it Messianic Catholic Church maybe?

 

[yonah_mishael]

Metropolitan Community Church

 

[Jase]

By the way, what did you think of the 2004 movie production of Phantom?

I liked it, although not as much as the stage production. I did get to play the Phantom in a local theatre showcase. I'm doing Les Mis this summer ( my favorite musical).

I'm Reform (attending a Conservative synagogue now with complete openness), and I've experienced the feeling of being an outsider in Orthodox synagogues, too. It's not just you.

Yeah, but at least as Reform, you have a large group of Jews who agree with you. I'd be in good company in the US as Reform because most Jews here are that. Messianics, however are rejected by every Jewish sect.

 

[INTJ-F]

MCC is a church where sodomites and trangenders are specifically welcomed as fellow believers. Very liberal and ecumenical.

 

[Jase]

MCC is a church where sodomites and trangenders are specifically welcomed as fellow believers. Very liberal and ecumenical.

Wow. That is extremely insulting. A sodomite is a temple prostitute. And there is nothing wrong with transgender people. Last I checked, Jesus ate with sinners. He didn't insult them.

That is not something I'd expect from the Jewish community.

 

[GuardianShua]

Wow. That is extremely insulting. A sodomite is a temple prostitute. And there is nothing wrong with transgender people. Last I checked, Jesus ate with sinners. He didn't insult them.

Are you sure you're in the right forum? This is not the Conservative Christian forum.

The laws of God are very narrow and not liberal.

 

[Jase]

The laws of God are very narrow and not liberal.

The laws of God were written for the Israelites in a specific culture and time. God did not condemn transgendered people nor did he ever call gay people sodomites. A sodomite is not a gay person, it was a Shrine prostitute (a Qadesh).

 

[ContraMundum]

MCC is a church where sodomites and trangenders are specifically welcomed as fellow believers. Very liberal and ecumenical.

Every church is full of sinners, and the sixth commandment (as we number them) is broken more by straight people than others. Everyone should be welcome in any congregation claiming to be following Jesus. We all have sins that burden us and that we struggle to repent of.

 

[yedida]

Wow. That is extremely insulting. A sodomite is a temple prostitute. And there is nothing wrong with transgender people. Last I checked, Jesus ate with sinners. He didn't insult them.

That is not something I'd expect from the Jewish community.

As Messianics we believe that the laws of God remain intact. Within that Law, homosexuality is an abomination. Therefore, we don't see any room for an active homosexual in God's word. A non-active who is just trusting Hashem for their salvation, is quite welcome. We're a love the sinner, hate the sin group, not a hate the sinner.

 

[ContraMundum]

As Messianics we believe that the laws of God remain intact. Within that Law, homosexuality is an abomination. Therefore, we don't see any room for an active homosexual in God's word. A non-active who is just trusting Hashem for their salvation, is quite welcome. We're a love the sinner, hate the sin group, not a hate the sinner.

If you truly believed that God's laws remained "intact" then you would have to execute by stoning the homosexual. You must clarify your position. You only believe some of God's laws are "intact".

 

[yedida]

If you truly believed that God's laws remained "intact" then you would have to execute by stoning the homosexual. You must clarify your position. You only believe some of God's laws are "intact".

We do have to abide by the civil laws that are a part of our country, state, city.
I follow what I can by law, and if it's something that I should be following (as many were for the temple service).
I do expect people to use a little bit of common sense.

 

[ContraMundum]

We do have to abide by the civil laws that are a part of our country, state, city.

Not if they contradict God's laws. It's easy for me, as I believe I live under the New Covenant, and I believe the death sentence for sinners has been borne by Jesus. I don't believe you can live under contradictory covenants or laws.

I follow what I can by law, and if it's something that I should be following (as many were for the temple service).
I do expect people to use a little bit of common sense.

Ever read this?

 

[INTJ-F]

If you truly believed that God's laws remained "intact" then you would have to execute by stoning the homosexual. You must clarify your position. You only believe some of God's laws are "intact".

Now Messiah Yeshua is the High Priest. He will decide when and where to carry out His judgment. What makes you think we have the authority to decide when and where judgment will be carried out???

Why are those who disagree and argue with MJ allowed to be in this forum and harass those who obey Torah? Isn't this suppose to be a safe place? They should take their anti-Torah stance to the liberal "christianity" boards.

 

[yedida]

Not if they contradict God's laws. It's easy for me, as I believe I live under the New Covenant, and I believe the death sentence for sinners has been borne by Jesus. I don't believe you can live under contradictory covenants or laws.



Ever read this?

Nope, but I'm not "keeping" the Law for salvation but because of salvation.
And I don't fallow Rabbinic laws, only what's in the Bible.
And even if I wanted to bring back the old stoning mandate (which I don't), I would have to have priests and judges to bring the person to, and I don't have this.
I believe that the curse of the breaking of the law has been paid for, but I don't believe that we can now just do whatever we please just because we are now under Grace.

 

[INTJ-F]

Ever read this?

Why do we need to read someone else's propaganda / doctrines when we have the bible with the Holy Spirit to guide us?

I don't believe you can live under contradictory covenants or laws.

so why are you in the MJ forum trying to tell us what to believe and not believe? Go back to your anglican forum and leave us alone unless you want to understand what we believe and why.

Another one 'Plunk'

 

[INTJ-F]

[move]

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[Jase]

Within that Law, homosexuality is an abomination.

The Hebrew never mentions homosexuality, or calls it an abomination. Leviticus condemns pagan prostitution before the god Molech in his temples as a To'evah (a cultural taboo - something the Israelites should refrain from). Abomination is a bad translation.

Therefore, we don't see any room for an active homosexual in God's word. A non-active who is just trusting Hashem for their salvation, is quite welcome. We're a love the sinner, hate the sin group, not a hate the sinner.

And yet, most Jews, in light of modern evidence about orientation unavailable to the Biblical authors have claimed the law needs reinterpretation.

Incidentally, according to the Talmud, no man was ever brought up on charges of homosexuality.

 

[yedida]

The Hebrew never mentions homosexuality, or calls it an abomination. Leviticus condemns pagan prostitution before the god Molech in his temples as a To'evah (a cultural taboo - something the Israelites should refrain from). Abomination is a bad translation.

And yet, most Jews, in light of modern evidence about orientation unavailable to the Biblical authors have claimed the law needs reinterpretation.

Incidentally, according to the Talmud, no man was ever brought up on charges of homosexuality.

There weren't too many capital crimes prosecuted period. I heard somewhere that they had decided that 7 death sentences in 70 years were too many.