Matthew 24:15-31, Future Or Fulfilled?

Truth7t7

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Matthew 24:15-31KJV "Future" or "Fulfilled"?

Many teach parts of, or all of the three items below have been fulfilled?

1.) Verse 15, "Daniels Abomination Of Desolation".

2.) Verse 21, The "Great Tribulation".

3.) Verses 29-31, "The Second Advent".

A Closer Look At The Verses And Context.

Verse 15 Daniel's abomination of desolation causes verses 16-21 to take place.

"When They Shall See"

When they see the abomination, they flee to the mountains from the fields and roof tops.

"For Then" Shall Be Great Tribulation

This abomination causes the "Great Tribulation" in verse 21 with the words "For Then" shall be "Great Tribulation"

The second advent in verses 29-30 is dependant on verse 21 in the "Great Tribulation"

Verses 29-30 are tied to verse 21 by the words below.

"Tribulation Of Those Day's'

(29) "Immediately after the tribulation of those days"

(30) "They shall see the Son of Man coming"

The abomination of desolation verse 15, the "Great Tribulation" in verse 21, and the second advent in verses 29-31 are all tied together by the "Time Stamp" inseparable, this can't be broken as these events are future, as we know the second advent seen is future.

Does verse 15 cause verses 16-21 to take place? 100% Yes!

Do verses 29-31 take place immediately after the event of verse 21? 100% Yes!

"Three Future Events" That Are Bound Together By The "Time Stamp" Inseparable.

Jesus Christ Is Lord

Truth7t7
 
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NDL

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Matthew 24:15-31KJV "Future" or "Fulfilled"?

Many teach parts of, or all of the three items below have been fulfilled?

1.) Verse 15, "Daniels Abomination Of Desolation".

2.) Verse 21, The "Great Tribulation".

3.) Verses 29-31, "The Second Advent".

A Closer Look At The Verses And Context.

Verse 15 Daniel's abomination of desolation causes verses 16-21 to take place.

"When They Shall See"

When they see the abomination, they flee to the mountains from the fields and roof tops.

"For Then" Shall Be Great Tribulation

This abomination causes the "Great Tribulation" in verse 21 with the words "For Then" shall be "Great Tribulation"

The second advent in verses 29-30 is dependant on verse 21 in the "Great Tribulation"

"Tribulation Of Those Days"

Verses 29-30 are tied to verse 21 by the words, "Tribulation Of Those Day's"

(29) "Immediately after the tribulation of those days"

(30) "They shall see the Son of Man coming"

The abomination of desolation verse 15, the "Great Tribulation" in verse 21, and the second advent in verses 29-31 are all tied together by the "Time Stamp", this can't be broken, as these events are future, as we know the second advent seen is future.

Does verse 15 cause verses 16-21 to take place? 100% Yes!

Do verses 29-31 take place immediately after the event of verse 21? 100% Yes!

"Three Future Events" That Are Bound Together By The "Time Stamp" Inseparable.

Jesus Christ Is Lord

Truth7t7

It's not my intention to be disrespectful or crass, but does it matter who teaches what? Is doctrine granted validity on the basis that someone teaches it?

I am not trying to be difficult, nor is it my intention to be disrespectful. Yes...the abomination of desolation is a future event. How do I know this? Because shortly after this event, does Jesus destroy him:

2 Thessalonians 2:7-8: "For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:"

Rev 19:11-15: "And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war. His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself. And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God. And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean. And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God."
 
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BABerean2

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Luk 19:41 And when he was come near, he beheld the city, and wept over it,

Luk 19:42 Saying, If thou hadst known, even thou, at least in this thy day, the things which belong unto thy peace! but now they are hid from thine eyes.

Luk 19:43 For the days shall come upon thee, that thine enemies shall cast a trench about thee, and compass thee round, and keep thee in on every side,

Luk 19:44 And shall lay thee even with the ground, and thy children within thee; and they shall not leave in thee one stone upon another; because thou knewest not the time of thy visitation.



Luk 21:20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.
Luk 21:21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto.
Luk 21:22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.
Luk 21:23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people.
Luk 21:24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
(The future Second Coming of Christ comes when the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.)



Luk 23:27 And there followed him a great company of people, and of women, which also bewailed and lamented him.
Luk 23:28 But Jesus turning unto them said, Daughters of Jerusalem, weep not for me, but weep for yourselves, and for your children.
Luk 23:29 For, behold, the days are coming, in the which they shall say, Blessed are the barren, and the wombs that never bare, and the paps which never gave suck.
Luk 23:30 Then shall they begin to say to the mountains, Fall on us; and to the hills, Cover us.
Luk 23:31 For if they do these things in a green tree, what shall be done in the dry?


Claiming that the Olivet Discourse has nothing to do with 70 AD requires one to ignore Luke 19:41-44, and Luke 23:27-31, and John 10:22, and the events of 167 BC.

Can any viewpoint built upon ignorance be correct?


.
 
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NDL

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Luk 19:41 And when he was come near, he beheld the city, and wept over it,

Luk 19:42 Saying, If thou hadst known, even thou, at least in this thy day, the things which belong unto thy peace! but now they are hid from thine eyes.

Luk 19:43 For the days shall come upon thee, that thine enemies shall cast a trench about thee, and compass thee round, and keep thee in on every side,

Luk 19:44 And shall lay thee even with the ground, and thy children within thee; and they shall not leave in thee one stone upon another; because thou knewest not the time of thy visitation.



Luk 21:20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.
Luk 21:21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto.
Luk 21:22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.
Luk 21:23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people.
Luk 21:24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
(The future Second Coming of Christ comes when the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.)



Luk 23:27 And there followed him a great company of people, and of women, which also bewailed and lamented him.
Luk 23:28 But Jesus turning unto them said, Daughters of Jerusalem, weep not for me, but weep for yourselves, and for your children.
Luk 23:29 For, behold, the days are coming, in the which they shall say, Blessed are the barren, and the wombs that never bare, and the paps which never gave suck.
Luk 23:30 Then shall they begin to say to the mountains, Fall on us; and to the hills, Cover us.
Luk 23:31 For if they do these things in a green tree, what shall be done in the dry?


Claiming that the Olivet Discourse has nothing to do with 70 AD requires one to ignore Luke 19:41-44, and Luke 23:27-31, and John 10:22, and the events of 167 BC.

Can any viewpoint built upon ignorance be correct?


.
I'm confused. Which person on this thread claimed the Olivet Discourse had nothing to do with events that had already taken place?

The ultimate, and final, culmination of events spoken of in the Olivet Discourse have yet to take place - but that doesn't mean that history hasn't provided us with foreshadows of what we are to see in the future.
 
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BABerean2

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I'm confused. Which person on this thread claimed the Olivet Discourse had nothing to do with events that had already taken place?

The ultimate, and final, culmination of events spoken of in the Olivet Discourse have yet to take place - but that doesn't mean that history hasn't provided us with foreshadows of what we are to see in the future.

That would be Truth7t7, who created this thread.
It was certainly not me.

He even denies that Luke 21:24 had anything to do with 70 AD.

The following is my humble opinion...



Compare Luke's Gospel to that of Matthew if you want to understand the timing.


Jesus Foretells Destruction of the Temple (These subtitles are found in e-Sword.)


Luk 21:5  Then, as some spoke of the temple, how it was adorned with beautiful stones and donations, He said, 

Luk 21:6  "These things which you see—the days will come in which not one stone shall be left upon another that shall not be thrown down." 

(Mat 24:2  And Jesus said to them, "Do you not see all these things? Assuredly, I say to you, not one stone shall be left here upon another, that shall not be thrown down." )





Luk 21:7  So they asked Him, saying, "Teacher, but when will these things be? And what sign will there be when these things are about to take place?" 

(Mat 24:3  Now as He sat on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately, saying, "Tell us, when will these things be? And what will be the sign of Your coming, and of the end of the age?")

( Mar 13:3  Now as He sat on the Mount of Olives opposite the temple, Peter, James, John, and Andrew asked Him privately, 

Mar 13:4  "Tell us, when will these things be? And what will be the sign when all these things will be fulfilled?") 





Luk 21:8  And He said: "Take heed that you not be deceived. For many will come in My name, saying, 'I am He,' and, 'The time has drawn near.' Therefore do not go after them. 

(Mat 24:5  For many will come in My name, saying, 'I am the Christ,' and will deceive many. )



Luk 21:9  But when you hear of wars and commotions, do not be terrified; for these things must come to pass first, but the end will not come immediately."

(Mat 24:6  And you will hear of wars and rumors of wars. See that you are not troubled; for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.) 



Jesus Foretells Wars and Persecution



Luk 21:10  Then He said to them, "Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. 

(Mat 24:7  For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places. )



Luk 21:11  And there will be great earthquakes in various places, and famines and pestilences; and there will be fearful sights and great signs from heaven. 

(Mat 24:7  For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places. )



Luk 21:12  But before all these things, they will lay their hands on you and persecute you, delivering you up to the synagogues and prisons. You will be brought before kings and rulers for My name's sake. 

(Mat 24:9  "Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name's sake.)
 (Read Acts 22:19-20, where Paul reveals that he fulfilled this text.)



Luk 21:13  But it will turn out for you as an occasion for testimony. 

Luk 21:14  Therefore settle it in your hearts not to meditate beforehand on what you will answer; 

Luk 21:15  for I will give you a mouth and wisdom which all your adversaries will not be able to contradict or resist. 

Luk 21:16  You will be betrayed even by parents and brothers, relatives and friends; and they will put some of you to death. 

Luk 21:17  And you will be hated by all for My name's sake. 

(Mat 24:10  And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another. )



Luk 21:18  But not a hair of your head shall be lost. 

Luk 21:19  By your patience possess your souls. 

(Mat 24:13  But he who endures to the end shall be saved.) 



Jesus Foretells Destruction of Jerusalem



Luk 21:20  "But when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, then know that its desolation is near. 

(Mat 24:15  "Therefore when you see the 'ABOMINATION OF DESOLATION,' spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place" (whoever reads, let him understand), 



Luk 21:21  Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, let those who are in the midst of her depart, and let not those who are in the country enter her. 

(Mat 24:16  "then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains.) 



Luk 21:22  For these are the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled. 

Luk 21:23  But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! For there will be great distress in the land and wrath upon this people. 

(Mat 24:19  But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! )



Luk 21:24  And they will fall by the edge of the sword, and be led away captive into all nations. And Jerusalem will be trampled by Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled. 
(Almost all Bible scholars agree that the first part of the verse above is about 70 AD. At the end of the verse we find a period of time known as “the times of the Gentiles”. In the verses that follow we find the future Second Coming of Christ.)


The Coming of the Son of Man



Luk 21:25  "And there will be signs in the sun, in the moon, and in the stars; and on the earth distress of nations, with perplexity, the sea and the waves roaring; 

(Mat 24:29  "Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken.) 



Luk 21:26  men's hearts failing them from fear and the expectation of those things which are coming on the earth, for the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 

Luk 21:27  Then they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. 

(Mat 24:30  Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.) 



Luk 21:28  Now when these things begin to happen, look up and lift up your heads, because your redemption draws near." 

(Mat 24:33  So you also, when you see all these things, know that it is near—at the doors!)

:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::



From "Antiquities of the Jews" by Josephus, Book 12, chapter 7

"6. When therefore the generals of Antiochus's armies had been beaten so often, Judas assembled the people together, and told them, that after these many victories which God had given them, they ought to go up to Jerusalem, and purify the temple, and offer the appointed sacrifices. But as soon as he, with the whole multitude, was come to Jerusalem, and found the temple deserted, and its gates burnt down, and plants growing in the temple of their own accord, on account of its desertion, he and those that were with him began to lament, and were quite confounded at the sight of the temple; so he chose out some of his soldiers, and gave them order to fight against those guards that were in the citadel, until he should have purified the temple. When therefore he had carefully purged it, and had brought in new vessels, the candlestick, the table [of shew-bread], and the altar [of incense], which were made of gold, he hung up the veils at the gates, and added doors to them. He also took down the altar [of burnt-offering], and built a new one of stones that he gathered together, and not of such as were hewn with iron tools. So on the five and twentieth day of the month Casleu, which the Macedonians call Apeliens, they lighted the lamps that were on the candlestick, and offered incense upon the altar [of incense], and laid the loaves upon the table [of shew-bread], and offered burnt-offerings upon the new altar [of burnt-offering]. Now it so fell out, that these things were done on the very same day on which their Divine worship had fallen off, and was reduced to a profane and common use, after three years' time; for so it was, that the temple was made desolate by Antiochus, and so continued for three years. This desolation happened to the temple in the hundred forty and fifth year, on the twenty-fifth day of the month Apeliens, and on the hundred fifty and third olympiad: but it was dedicated anew, on the same day, the twenty-fifth of the month Apeliens, on the hundred and forty-eighth year, and on the hundred and fifty-fourth olympiad. And this desolation came to pass according to the prophecy of Daniel, which was given four hundred and eight years before; for he declared that the Macedonians would dissolve that worship [for some time].

7. Now Judas celebrated the festival of the restoration of the sacrifices of the temple for eight days, and omitted no sort of pleasures thereon; but he feasted them upon very rich and splendid sacrifices; and he honored God, and delighted them by hymns and psalms. Nay, they were so very glad at the revival of their customs, when, after a long time of intermission, they unexpectedly had regained the freedom of their worship, that they made it a law for their posterity, that they should keep a festival, on account of the restoration of their temple worship, for eight days. And from that time to this we celebrate this festival, and call it Lights. I suppose the reason was, because this liberty beyond our hopes appeared to us; and that thence was the name given to that festival. Judas also rebuilt the walls round about the city, and reared towers of great height against the incursions of enemies, and set guards therein. He also fortified the city Bethsura, that it might serve as a citadel against any distresses that might come from our enemies. "


Josephus confirms above the understanding of the Jews of his time, who knew that Daniel had predicted the events of 167 BC, by Antiochus Epiphanes.
Josephus confirms it as a historical fact.

John 10:22 is a reference to the celebration of Hanukkah each year by the Jews of Jesus time.

The Book of Matthew was addressed mainly to a Jewish audience. Jesus was telling the Jews of His time that something similar to 167 BC would happen during 70 AD. Not only did Antiochus desecrate the temple, but he also attacked the city killing thousands of Jews and stopped the temple sacrifices. The temple sacrifices would also stop in 70 AD, due to the destruction of the temple. Based on John 10:22, the Jews were well aware of this historical fulfillment of Daniel’s prophecy. Luke’s Gospel was written to more of a Gentile audience, so he spelled it out for them.


Matthew 24:15-16 and Luke 21:20-21 are clearly parallel accounts, because we have the exact same warning to flee from Judea to the mountains in the second verse of each Gospel.



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Truth7t7

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Berean you have not responded to the claims below, are the verses below tied together by the "Time Stamp" 100% Yes, you can't separate the events as clearly explained.

You don't need to wander off from Matthew 24:15-31, its self explanatory, no Josephus or history books needed, 1+1+1=3

1.) Verse 15, "Daniels Abomination Of Desolation".

2.) Verse 21, The "Great Tribulation".

3.) Verses 29-31, "The Second Advent".

A Closer Look At The Verses And Context.

Verse 15 Daniel's abomination of desolation causes verses 16-21 to take place.

"When They Shall See"

When they see the abomination, they flee to the mountains from the fields and roof tops.

"For Then" Shall Be Great Tribulation

This abomination causes the "Great Tribulation" in verse 21 with the words "For Then" shall be "Great Tribulation"

The second advent in verses 29-30 is dependant on verse 21 in the "Great Tribulation"

Verses 29-30 are tied to verse 21 by the words below.

"Tribulation Of Those Day's'

(29) "Immediately after the tribulation of those days"

(30) "They shall see the Son of Man coming"

The abomination of desolation verse 15, the "Great Tribulation" in verse 21, and the second advent in verses 29-31 are all tied together by the "Time Stamp" inseparable, this can't be broken as these events are future, as we know the second advent seen is future.

Does verse 15 cause verses 16-21 to take place? 100% Yes!

Do verses 29-31 take place immediately after the event of verse 21? 100% Yes!

"Three Future Events" That Are Bound Together By The "Time Stamp" Inseparable.

Jesus Christ Is Lord

Truth7t7
That would be Truth7t7, who created this thread.
It was certainly not me.

He even denies that Luke 21:24 had anything to do with 70 AD.

The following is my humble opinion...



Compare Luke's Gospel to that of Matthew if you want to understand the timing.


Jesus Foretells Destruction of the Temple (These subtitles are found in e-Sword.)


Luk 21:5  Then, as some spoke of the temple, how it was adorned with beautiful stones and donations, He said, 

Luk 21:6  "These things which you see—the days will come in which not one stone shall be left upon another that shall not be thrown down." 

(Mat 24:2  And Jesus said to them, "Do you not see all these things? Assuredly, I say to you, not one stone shall be left here upon another, that shall not be thrown down." )





Luk 21:7  So they asked Him, saying, "Teacher, but when will these things be? And what sign will there be when these things are about to take place?" 

(Mat 24:3  Now as He sat on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately, saying, "Tell us, when will these things be? And what will be the sign of Your coming, and of the end of the age?")

( Mar 13:3  Now as He sat on the Mount of Olives opposite the temple, Peter, James, John, and Andrew asked Him privately, 

Mar 13:4  "Tell us, when will these things be? And what will be the sign when all these things will be fulfilled?") 





Luk 21:8  And He said: "Take heed that you not be deceived. For many will come in My name, saying, 'I am He,' and, 'The time has drawn near.' Therefore do not go after them. 

(Mat 24:5  For many will come in My name, saying, 'I am the Christ,' and will deceive many. )



Luk 21:9  But when you hear of wars and commotions, do not be terrified; for these things must come to pass first, but the end will not come immediately."

(Mat 24:6  And you will hear of wars and rumors of wars. See that you are not troubled; for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.) 



Jesus Foretells Wars and Persecution



Luk 21:10  Then He said to them, "Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. 

(Mat 24:7  For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places. )



Luk 21:11  And there will be great earthquakes in various places, and famines and pestilences; and there will be fearful sights and great signs from heaven. 

(Mat 24:7  For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places. )



Luk 21:12  But before all these things, they will lay their hands on you and persecute you, delivering you up to the synagogues and prisons. You will be brought before kings and rulers for My name's sake. 

(Mat 24:9  "Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name's sake.)
 (Read Acts 22:19-20, where Paul reveals that he fulfilled this text.)



Luk 21:13  But it will turn out for you as an occasion for testimony. 

Luk 21:14  Therefore settle it in your hearts not to meditate beforehand on what you will answer; 

Luk 21:15  for I will give you a mouth and wisdom which all your adversaries will not be able to contradict or resist. 

Luk 21:16  You will be betrayed even by parents and brothers, relatives and friends; and they will put some of you to death. 

Luk 21:17  And you will be hated by all for My name's sake. 

(Mat 24:10  And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another. )



Luk 21:18  But not a hair of your head shall be lost. 

Luk 21:19  By your patience possess your souls. 

(Mat 24:13  But he who endures to the end shall be saved.) 



Jesus Foretells Destruction of Jerusalem



Luk 21:20  "But when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, then know that its desolation is near. 

(Mat 24:15  "Therefore when you see the 'ABOMINATION OF DESOLATION,' spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place" (whoever reads, let him understand), 



Luk 21:21  Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, let those who are in the midst of her depart, and let not those who are in the country enter her. 

(Mat 24:16  "then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains.) 



Luk 21:22  For these are the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled. 

Luk 21:23  But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! For there will be great distress in the land and wrath upon this people. 

(Mat 24:19  But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! )



Luk 21:24  And they will fall by the edge of the sword, and be led away captive into all nations. And Jerusalem will be trampled by Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled. 
(Almost all Bible scholars agree that the first part of the verse above is about 70 AD. At the end of the verse we find a period of time known as “the times of the Gentiles”. In the verses that follow we find the future Second Coming of Christ.)


The Coming of the Son of Man



Luk 21:25  "And there will be signs in the sun, in the moon, and in the stars; and on the earth distress of nations, with perplexity, the sea and the waves roaring; 

(Mat 24:29  "Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken.) 



Luk 21:26  men's hearts failing them from fear and the expectation of those things which are coming on the earth, for the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 

Luk 21:27  Then they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory. 

(Mat 24:30  Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.) 



Luk 21:28  Now when these things begin to happen, look up and lift up your heads, because your redemption draws near." 

(Mat 24:33  So you also, when you see all these things, know that it is near—at the doors!)

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From "Antiquities of the Jews" by Josephus, Book 12, chapter 7

"6. When therefore the generals of Antiochus's armies had been beaten so often, Judas assembled the people together, and told them, that after these many victories which God had given them, they ought to go up to Jerusalem, and purify the temple, and offer the appointed sacrifices. But as soon as he, with the whole multitude, was come to Jerusalem, and found the temple deserted, and its gates burnt down, and plants growing in the temple of their own accord, on account of its desertion, he and those that were with him began to lament, and were quite confounded at the sight of the temple; so he chose out some of his soldiers, and gave them order to fight against those guards that were in the citadel, until he should have purified the temple. When therefore he had carefully purged it, and had brought in new vessels, the candlestick, the table [of shew-bread], and the altar [of incense], which were made of gold, he hung up the veils at the gates, and added doors to them. He also took down the altar [of burnt-offering], and built a new one of stones that he gathered together, and not of such as were hewn with iron tools. So on the five and twentieth day of the month Casleu, which the Macedonians call Apeliens, they lighted the lamps that were on the candlestick, and offered incense upon the altar [of incense], and laid the loaves upon the table [of shew-bread], and offered burnt-offerings upon the new altar [of burnt-offering]. Now it so fell out, that these things were done on the very same day on which their Divine worship had fallen off, and was reduced to a profane and common use, after three years' time; for so it was, that the temple was made desolate by Antiochus, and so continued for three years. This desolation happened to the temple in the hundred forty and fifth year, on the twenty-fifth day of the month Apeliens, and on the hundred fifty and third olympiad: but it was dedicated anew, on the same day, the twenty-fifth of the month Apeliens, on the hundred and forty-eighth year, and on the hundred and fifty-fourth olympiad. And this desolation came to pass according to the prophecy of Daniel, which was given four hundred and eight years before; for he declared that the Macedonians would dissolve that worship [for some time].

7. Now Judas celebrated the festival of the restoration of the sacrifices of the temple for eight days, and omitted no sort of pleasures thereon; but he feasted them upon very rich and splendid sacrifices; and he honored God, and delighted them by hymns and psalms. Nay, they were so very glad at the revival of their customs, when, after a long time of intermission, they unexpectedly had regained the freedom of their worship, that they made it a law for their posterity, that they should keep a festival, on account of the restoration of their temple worship, for eight days. And from that time to this we celebrate this festival, and call it Lights. I suppose the reason was, because this liberty beyond our hopes appeared to us; and that thence was the name given to that festival. Judas also rebuilt the walls round about the city, and reared towers of great height against the incursions of enemies, and set guards therein. He also fortified the city Bethsura, that it might serve as a citadel against any distresses that might come from our enemies. "


Josephus confirms above the understanding of the Jews of his time, who knew that Daniel had predicted the events of 167 BC, by Antiochus Epiphanes.
Josephus confirms it as a historical fact.

John 10:22 is a reference to the celebration of Hanukkah each year by the Jews of Jesus time.

The Book of Matthew was addressed mainly to a Jewish audience. Jesus was telling the Jews of His time that something similar to 167 BC would happen during 70 AD. Not only did Antiochus desecrate the temple, but he also attacked the city killing thousands of Jews and stopped the temple sacrifices. The temple sacrifices would also stop in 70 AD, due to the destruction of the temple. Based on John 10:22, the Jews were well aware of this historical fulfillment of Daniel’s prophecy. Luke’s Gospel was written to more of a Gentile audience, so he spelled it out for them.


Matthew 24:15-16 and Luke 21:20-21 are clearly parallel accounts, because we have the exact same warning to flee from Judea to the mountains in the second verse of each Gospel.



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NDL

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Berean you have not responded to the claims below, are the verses below tied together by the "Time Stamp" 100% Yes, you can't separate the events as clearly explained.

You don't need to wander off from Matthew 24:15-31, its self explanatory, no Josephus or history books needed, 1+1+1=3

1.) Verse 15, "Daniels Abomination Of Desolation".

2.) Verse 21, The "Great Tribulation".

3.) Verses 29-31, "The Second Advent".

A Closer Look At The Verses And Context.

Verse 15 Daniel's abomination of desolation causes verses 16-21 to take place.

"When They Shall See"

When they see the abomination, they flee to the mountains from the fields and roof tops.

"For Then" Shall Be Great Tribulation

This abomination causes the "Great Tribulation" in verse 21 with the words "For Then" shall be "Great Tribulation"

The second advent in verses 29-30 is dependant on verse 21 in the "Great Tribulation"

Verses 29-30 are tied to verse 21 by the words below.

"Tribulation Of Those Day's'

(29) "Immediately after the tribulation of those days"

(30) "They shall see the Son of Man coming"

The abomination of desolation verse 15, the "Great Tribulation" in verse 21, and the second advent in verses 29-31 are all tied together by the "Time Stamp" inseparable, this can't be broken as these events are future, as we know the second advent seen is future.

Does verse 15 cause verses 16-21 to take place? 100% Yes!

Do verses 29-31 take place immediately after the event of verse 21? 100% Yes!

"Three Future Events" That Are Bound Together By The "Time Stamp" Inseparable.

Jesus Christ Is Lord

Truth7t7

Please have patience with me, as my question might seem silly (but it is genuine):

What's to debate here? You're stating a fact...okay. What am I missing?
 
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Truth7t7

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Please have patience with me, as my question might seem silly (but it is genuine):

What's to debate here? You're statingpart act...okay. What am I missing?
I agree what is stated is fact, as the abomination of desolation, great tribulation, and second advent are future events "Fact"!

There are many posters that believe some or all of these events are fulfilled.

jgr believes 2 were fulfilled in 66-70AD, the abomination and great trib, in the Roman Destruction Of Jerusalem, he believes in a future second advent, but denies the second advent is seen in Matthew 24:29-31

Berean believes the abomination of desolation as seen in Matthew 24:15 was also fulfilled in 66-70AD, but he believes the great tribulation and second advent is seen in Matthew 24:29-31, and are future, they will correct me if I'm wrong?

Many believe and teach Antiochus Epiphanies, Titus, Nero, were fulfillment of the Antichrist of Daniel.

Many believe the second advent isn't seen in Matthew 24:29-31, and they build a symbolic premise around this.

This is called "Partial Preterism" by many, Matthew 24 in the Olivet discourse is the "Preterist" test case.

Hope that helps a bit
 
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icxn

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Matthew 24:15-31KJV "Future" or "Fulfilled"?
Why not Both?

Quote:
The passions lying hidden in the soul provide the demons with the means of arousing impassioned thoughts in us. Then, fighting the intellect through these thoughts, they force it to give its assent to sin. When it has been overcome, they lead it to sin in the mind; and when this has been done they induce it, captive as it is, to commit the sin in action. Having thus desolated the soul by means of these thoughts, the demons then retreat, taking the thoughts with them, and only the specter or idol of sin remains in the intellect. Referring to this our Lord says, "When you see the abominable idol of desolation standing in the holy place (let him who reads understand) ..." (Matt. 24:15). For man’s intellect is a holy place and a temple of God in which the demons, having desolated the soul by means of impassioned thoughts, set up the idol of sin. That these things have already taken place in history no one, I think, who has read Josephus will doubt; though some say that they will also come to pass in the time of the Antichrist. - St Maximos the Confessor, Four Hundred Texts on Love
 
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