Mark or sign in the hand or forehead

[CherubRam]

For contemplating only. Do not reply to this thread.

Mark or sign in the hand or forehead


Revelation 13:16
It also caused people everywhere, great and small, rich and poor, free and slave, to accept a mark in their right hands or upon their foreheads, 17 so no one could buy or sell unless they had the mark of the beast, or its name, or the number of its name.

18 This calls for wisdom. Let the person who has insight calculate the number of the beast, and the number of a man. That number is six hundred and sixty six.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations



Revelation 19:20
But the beast was captured, and with it the false prophet who had performed the signs on its behalf. With these signs he deceives those who had received the mark of the beast and worshiped its image. The two of them were thrown alive into the fiery lake of burning sulfur.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

The marks are signs and the signs are marks. The sign is the mark of the beast.

What sign is specifically made with the right hand that would also involve the forehead, and that is attributed to a (beast / nation?)



The parabolic meaning of beast

(Ecc 3:18) I said in mine heart concerning the estate of the sons of men, that God might manifest them, and that they might see that they themselves are beasts. (Peoples of the nations.)


Israel's descendants were mixed among the gentiles, or as stated, "seed of men mixed with the seed of beasts"

(Jer 31:27) Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will sow the house of Israel and the house of Judah with the seed of man, and with the seed of beast.

God pronounced that His New Marriage Covenant to Israel would be with the beasts.(Nations)


(Hos 2:18) And in that day will I make a covenant for them with the beasts of the field, and with the fowls of heaven, and with the creeping things of the ground: and I will break the bow and the sword and the battle out of the earth, and will make them to lie down safely.

(Beasts / Nations) (Field / world) (Nations use birds and other creatures to represent their nations.)



Beast Are Kingdoms Or Nations


Psalm 57:4
I am in the midst of lions; I am forced to dwell among ravenous beasts— men whose teeth are spears and arrows, whose tongues are sharp swords.

Daniel 7:17
‘The four great beasts are four kings that will rise from the earth.

Daniel 7:23
“He gave me this explanation: ‘The fourth beast is a fourth kingdom that will appear on earth. It will be different from all the other kingdoms and will devour the whole earth, trampling it down and crushing it.

Revelation 16:10
The fifth angel poured out his bowl on the throne of the beast, and its kingdom was plunged into darkness. People gnawed their tongues in agony

Revelation 17:11
The beast who once was, and now is not, is an eighth king. He belongs to the seven and is going to his destruction.

Revelation 17:12
“The ten horns you saw are ten kings who have not yet received a kingdom, but who for one hour will receive authority as kings along with the beast.


For contemplating only. Do not reply to this thread.

 

[SkyWriting]

Mark or sign in the hand or forehead


Revelation 13:16
It also caused people everywhere, great and small, rich and poor, free and slave, to accept a mark in their right hands or upon their foreheads, 17 so no one could buy or sell unless they had the mark of the beast, or its name, or the number of its name.

18 This calls for wisdom. Let the person who has insight calculate the number of the beast, and the number of a man. That number is six hundred and sixty six.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations



Revelation 19:20
But the beast was captured, and with it the false prophet who had performed the signs on its behalf. With these signs he deceives those who had received the mark of the beast and worshiped its image. The two of them were thrown alive into the fiery lake of burning sulfur.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

The marks are signs and the signs are marks. The sign is the mark of the beast.

What sign is specifically made with the right hand that would also involve the forehead, and that is attributed to a (beast / nation?)



The parabolic meaning of beast

(Ecc 3:18) I said in mine heart concerning the estate of the sons of men, that God might manifest them, and that they might see that they themselves are beasts. (Peoples of the nations.)


Israel's descendants were mixed among the gentiles, or as stated, "seed of men mixed with the seed of beasts"

(Jer 31:27) Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will sow the house of Israel and the house of Judah with the seed of man, and with the seed of beast.

God pronounced that His New Marriage Covenant to Israel would be with the beasts.(Nations)


(Hos 2:18) And in that day will I make a covenant for them with the beasts of the field, and with the fowls of heaven, and with the creeping things of the ground: and I will break the bow and the sword and the battle out of the earth, and will make them to lie down safely.

(Beasts / Nations) (Field / world) (Nations use birds and other creatures to represent their nations.)



Beast Are Kingdoms Or Nations


Psalm 57:4
I am in the midst of lions; I am forced to dwell among ravenous beasts— men whose teeth are spears and arrows, whose tongues are sharp swords.

Daniel 7:17
‘The four great beasts are four kings that will rise from the earth.

Daniel 7:23
“He gave me this explanation: ‘The fourth beast is a fourth kingdom that will appear on earth. It will be different from all the other kingdoms and will devour the whole earth, trampling it down and crushing it.

Revelation 16:10
The fifth angel poured out his bowl on the throne of the beast, and its kingdom was plunged into darkness. People gnawed their tongues in agony

Revelation 17:11
The beast who once was, and now is not, is an eighth king. He belongs to the seven and is going to his destruction.

Revelation 17:12
“The ten horns you saw are ten kings who have not yet received a kingdom, but who for one hour will receive authority as kings along with the beast.


For contemplating only. Do not reply to this thread.

At State fair we all got stamps on our right hands so we could get back in a second time.
We couldn't get back in to buy or sell without that mark!

 

[SkyWriting]

For contemplating only. Do not reply to this thread.

You can reduce the response options by posting on your blog.

 

[dlamberth]

For contemplating only. Do not reply to this thread.

I can't help but think that I'd rather be contemplating on God. As a Lover of God, that seems much more useful and in line with my spiritual path.

 

[CherubRam]

Bumping for viewing.

 

[CherubRam]

It just occurred to me that some here may not know how to do a Internet key word search. Oh well!

 

[Zoness]

Revelations is impressive only in the sense that it says so much metaphorically that humans can make literally any conclusions they want from it. As a side effect that also means it lowers the legitimacy of any end time claims or symbolism derived from it, since for each claim there could be ten counterclaims. Even the diversity of thought on just CF shows the lack of concensus among Christians about what to take out of Revelations. If you're not Christian, it makes even less sense than it does to Christians

 

[CherubRam]

Revelations is impressive only in the sense that it says so much metaphorically that humans can make literally any conclusions they want from it. As a side effect that also means it lowers the legitimacy of any end time claims or symbolism derived from it, since for each claim there could be ten counterclaims. Even the diversity of thought on just CF shows the lack of concensus among Christians about what to take out of Revelations. If you're not Christian, it makes even less sense than it does to Christians

2 Corinthians 4:3
And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

 

[Zoness]

2 Corinthians 4:3
And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing.
In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

Ah yes a classically boring excuse. I was hoping for something a little more thought out but oh well. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[CherubRam]

Ah yes a classically boring excuse. I was hoping for something a little more thought out but oh well. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

The bible explains what certain words mean when used as a parable. There is no if and by golly.

 

[awitch]

The bible explains what certain words mean when used as a parable. There is no if and by golly.

How do you know what's a parable and what's literal? What criteria are we supposed to use? I want to be able to pick a story, apply the rules, and make a definitive conclusion. How do I do that?

I'm often told by some Christians that to understand the Bible you need to "have the Holy Spirit". Do you agree with that? Because if you know that I'm not a Christian, then you know I don't have the Holy Spirit, so you should know that I won't be able to understand it, and therefore, posting standalone Scripture is senseless.

 

[CherubRam]

How do you know what's a parable and what's literal? What criteria are we supposed to use? I want to be able to pick a story, apply the rules, and make a definitive conclusion. How do I do that?

I'm often told by some Christians that to understand the Bible you need to "have the Holy Spirit". Do you agree with that? Because if you know that I'm not a Christian, then you know I don't have the Holy Spirit, so you should know that I won't be able to understand it, and therefore, posting standalone Scripture is senseless.

It does require a spirit of discernment, but you are welcome to try.
One example is that if it sounds fantastic or stupid, then is probably a parable. Another problem you will encounter is the question of wither it is a TRANSLATION or a INTERPRETATION.

 

[awitch]

It does require a spirit of discernment, but you are welcome to try.

There is no reason to try. Why regurgitate passages when you know we can't understand them without some intervention from a deity that you know we don't acknowledge in the first place? If we're to believe every soul's fate is hanging on belief that we can't even begin to understand unless we already believe then I can only conclude that god is malicious. I don't think gods are malicious.

One example is that if it sounds fantastic or stupid, then is probably a parable. Another problem you will encounter is the question of wither it is a TRANSLATION or a INTERPRETATION.

'Stupid' and 'fantastic' are extremely subjective terms. I can easily argue the entire core of Christianity is parable (more fantastic than stupid, btw).

 

[Zoness]

It does require a spirit of discernment, but you are welcome to try.
One example is that if it sounds fantastic or stupid, then is probably a parable. Another problem you will encounter is the question of wither it is a TRANSLATION or a INTERPRETATION.

Where do you draw the line? Genesis, Job? Many accept the Virgin birth as literal and that sounds extremely fantastic to me but it's near heresy to not take it literally. Others believe the that the Trinity is wrong but that position is regarded as actual heresy.

 

[CherubRam]

Where do you draw the line? Genesis, Job? Many accept the Virgin birth as literal and that sounds extremely fantastic to me but it's near heresy to not take it literally. Others believe the that the Trinity is wrong but that position is regarded as actual heresy.

The bible was written in a way that only the most spiritually inclined could properly interpret it.

 

[CherubRam]

There is no reason to try. Why regurgitate passages when you know we can't understand them without some intervention from a deity that you know we don't acknowledge in the first place? If we're to believe every soul's fate is hanging on belief that we can't even begin to understand unless we already believe then I can only conclude that god is malicious. I don't think gods are malicious.



'Stupid' and 'fantastic' are extremely subjective terms. I can easily argue the entire core of Christianity is parable (more fantastic than stupid, btw).

The bible was written in a way that only the most spiritually inclined could properly interpret it.

 

[Zoness]

The bible was written in a way that only the most spiritually inclined could properly interpret it.

Conveniently, the only people who have the correct interpretation are those who agree with you, huh? Personally, I find that Catholics and Orthodox to be really spiritual. If Christianity is true, they're probably the most correct.

It's a shame you're not sure, I think that lends credence to the idea that people just pick and choose what they want to see out of the Bible. To be fair, its pretty easy to do, given its radically inconsistent messages at times. It's how you get everything from Catholicism, to Unitarian Universalism to Pentecostalism. If it were clear, there would be nothing to argue about.

Can Buddhists interpret it? They're pretty spiritual guys. I know some awfully spiritual Hindus at work who might have ideas about the Bible too, I'll ask them about it at lunch tomorrow.

Circular logic is a boring fallacy though.

Anyway, I'll leave ya to that.

 

[akaDaScribe]

Revelations is impressive only in the sense that it says so much metaphorically that humans can make literally any conclusions they want from it. As a side effect that also means it lowers the legitimacy of any end time claims or symbolism derived from it, since for each claim there could be ten counterclaims. Even the diversity of thought on just CF shows the lack of concensus among Christians about what to take out of Revelations. If you're not Christian, it makes even less sense than it does to Christians

I think it's one of those things that becomes real clear when it actually hits.

 

[awitch]

The bible was written in a way that only the most spiritually inclined could properly interpret it.

That's a super convenient way to dismiss anyone who disagrees with your preheld beliefs without ever having to consider an alternate point of view.

 

[CherubRam]

Conveniently, the only people who have the correct interpretation are those who agree with you, huh? Personally, I find that Catholics and Orthodox to be really spiritual. If Christianity is true, they're probably the most correct.

It's a shame you're not sure, I think that lends credence to the idea that people just pick and choose what they want to see out of the Bible. To be fair, its pretty easy to do, given its radically inconsistent messages at times. It's how you get everything from Catholicism, to Unitarian Universalism to Pentecostalism. If it were clear, there would be nothing to argue about.

Can Buddhists interpret it? They're pretty spiritual guys. I know some awfully spiritual Hindus at work who might have ideas about the Bible too, I'll ask them about it at lunch tomorrow.

Circular logic is a boring fallacy though.

View attachment 238184

Anyway, I'll leave ya to that.

The Seventh Day Adventist are the most knowledgeable about prophecy. The Catholics are the least knowledgeable about the bible.