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Man of Lawlessness

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by Bobfeed123, Oct 23, 2021.

  1. 3 Resurrections

    3 Resurrections That's 666 YEARS, folks

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    Timtofly, I would be interested in how you address the crushing of Satan under the feet of the believers in Romans 16:20. Paul promised this would "shortly" happen in their experience. How can Satan still be existing in this current generation if God "crushed" him under the believers' feet back in those days?

    As far as the demonic blending with the human race, yes, that happened beginning with the Genesis 6 marriages of the celestial "sons of God" with human women, which created a hybrid race at that time. This hybrid race was entirely destroyed in the flood, but some further examples of it re-emerged again later, such as Goliath of Gath, those "giants" in the land of Canaan that Israel under Joshua's leadership was supposed to entirely destroy, etc. I believe the Greeks took these very real former examples of hybrid, demi-god creatures, and based their mythology on that.

    But with the destruction of the entire Satanic realm in AD 70, this is no longer a threat that could afflict this world. God is incrementally working to purge various kinds of evil from this planet over the millennia.
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2021
  2. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    Yes, he will be a Jew. And also descended from the Julio-Claudians (from Revelation 17:10).

    To understand the end times prophecies, a person must track the timeline of the arch villain of the end times as he goes through different function roles, the revealed man of sin/man of lawness being one of them.

    Begins as the little horn - leader of the EU. Daniel 7.

    then as the prince who shall come, following Gog/Magog. Daniel 8, Daniel 9.

    then anointed the King of Israel, coming in his own name, becoming the Antichrist. Jesus being the rightful king of Israel, coming in the name of the Lord. John 5:43, John 12:13, 1John2:18.

    then as the revealed man of sin in the kjv, man of lawlessness in your version. The 2Thessalonians 2 act. Ending his time as the Antichrist.

    then as the beast, dictator of the EU, kingdom of the beast. Revelation 13, Revelation 17:17.
    _________________________________________________________________

    It should be noted when the bible first starts talking about the person, it doesn't list all the functional roles initially. It just covers the person from his start to his end.

    Such as the little horn in Daniel 7 makes no mention of him being the prince who shall come, nor as being the Antichrist, nor as the revealed man of sin, nor as the beast. Those things are added in later passages as more was revealed about the person over time.

    But what it does do is take the person's actions to his end, like in Daniel 7 and 8.

    revealed as the "man of lawlessness" in 2Thessalonians2, his actions are also mentioned in Daniel 7:25.

    25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

    The laws of Moses, given from God to the children of Israel through Moses, defined when they were to keep the different holy days, and feasts, temple ordinances.

    As the beast, the arch villain of the end times will stop those things, or at least pervert them to his liking.
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2021
  3. honestal

    honestal New Member Supporter

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    “Most Reformation writers and all Reformers themselves, from Martin Luther, John Calvin, and John Knox identify the Roman Catholic Church with the Whore of Babylon… Identification of the Pope as the Antichrist was written into Protestant creeds such as the Westminster Confession of 1646. The identification of the Roman Catholic Church with the Whore of Babylon is kept in the Scofield Reference Bible.” {http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whore_of_Babylon_(historicism)}

    “Wycliffe, Tyndale, Luther, Calvin, Cranmer; in the seventeenth century, Bunyan, the translators of the King James Bible and the men who published the Westminster and Baptist confessions of Faith; Sir Isaac Newton, Wesley, Whitfield, Jonathan Edwards; and more recently Spurgeon, Bishop J.C. Ryle and Dr. Martin Lloyd-Jones; these men among countless others, all saw the office of the Papacy as the antichrist.” {All Roads Lead to Rome, p. 205}

    “Luther … proved, by the revelations of Daniel and St. John, by the epistles of St. Paul, St. Peter, and St. Jude, that the reign of Antichrist, predicted and described in the Bible, was the Papacy.” {D’aubigne’s History of the Reformation of the Sixteen Century, book vi, chapter xii, p. 215}

    “‘He shall speak great words against the Most High…’ To none can this apply so well or so fully as to the popes of Rome. They have assumed infallibility, which belongs only to God. They profess to forgive sins, which belongs only to God. They profess to open and shut heaven, which belongs only to God. They profess to be higher than all the kings of the earth, which belongs only to God…” {Adam Clarke’s Commentary on the Bible, his notes on Daniel 7:25}

    “He (Daniel) especially desired to know respecting the little horn, which made war with the saints, and prevailed against them. Here is foretold the rage of papal Rome against true Christians.” {Matthew Henry’s Concise Commentary}

    “Some persons think us too severe and censorious when we call the Roman pontiff Antichrist. But those who are of this opinion do not consider that they bring the same charge of presumption against Paul himself, after whom we speak and whose language we adopt… I shall briefly show that (Paul’s words in II Thess. 2) are not capable of any other interpretation than that which applies them to the Papacy.” {Institutes of the Christian Religion, by John Calvin}

    “The oracles of God foretold the rising of an Antichrist in the Christian Church: and in the Pope of Rome, all the characteristics of that Antichrist are so marvelously answered that if any who read the Scriptures do not see it, there is a marvelous blindness upon them.” {The Fall of Babylon, by Cotton Mather}
     
  4. Timtofly

    Timtofly Well-Known Member

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    Greek mythology is not about your close to gnostic views of half angel half human hybrids.

    Angels have no capability to reproduce. Never have, never will. All the "sexual reproductive" references about Satan are figurative, and not literal.

    Greek mythology is Satan's imagination at work. Not literal either.

    Satan is the only literal being in human form as declared by Paul in 2 Thessalonians 2.

    The defeat of Satan is ongoing. Satan being cast out of heaven is constantly ongoing, as in accusing the brethren night and day, non stop. Of course nothing he brings can stick. Because Jesus is the advocate on our behalf constantly reminding Satan what happened on the Cross.

    While the crushing of Satan's head and the bruising of one's heal is figurative, it is an ongoing figurative phenomenon. 70AD was not a resolution of finality in regards to fallen angels and Satan's role in spiritual battles.

    If you claim Revelation was pre 70AD, and the angels were bound then, how were they loosed before they were bound? Revelation claims they were bound, loosed in the 5th Trumpet, but never bound again. They will never be defeated nor do they even appear again. They have then been in the Lake of Fire since 70AD. There literally, according to preterist, are no rebellious angels anymore. They are all in the Lake of Fire. There is no coming out of the LOF.

    Jude clears this up:

    "And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day."

    Most accept this happened before Adam and Eve disobeyed. Some claim it happened in Noah's day. Yet you claim it happened in 70AD?

    When did the angels leave their ordained jobs? It is logical to think that Satan worked on the angels before humans. Satan was not even allowed to rebel nor visit earth for the first 1000 years of creation. He was not bound. He was not allowed to rebel period even if he had thoughts to that end.

    So no point in stating Satan nor the angels rebelled until a few years, 30, a little season of time, longer prior to Adam's disobedience.

    But the angels could talk amongst themselves, associate, form cliques or whatever angels do. There are constellations and groups of stars in the sky, no? It is not just a field of a single non stop pattern. Stars are in groups. God states:

    "And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:"

    This is the official job posting for the stars, angels. So having groups and cliques is not wrong. Having just an even arrangement with no patterns at all would be wrong. The angels job is to be signs in the sky, and they have been faithful for all of creation, at least 2/3rds of them have. I think that they even had choices about their arrangements. They just could not change their minds each day. That would make for some confusing signs to us humans below. Any changes would be gradual over time, which even that side affect would not thwart Satan's allowance to turn men's hearts away from God to science and the theory of evolution.

    The whole point being that the angels that were bound would not be loosed until the end of Adam's punishment.

    This coming and going of fallen angels does not make logical sense. These fallen angels have been bound and not even part of any spiritual battles going on. But that is a totally different subject.

    Jude claims they have been bound in everlasting chains. 6000 years of everlasting. Not coming and going as needed.

    Only after the Second Coming will they be loosed and end up in the Lake of Fire when their last attempt at heaven is thwarted. There is no longer any need after that for their existence. Yes angels are expendable like humans and even more so. They have far less accountability. Their main task just being a star and moving through the firmament. Limited opportunity to move to a more demanding position, and rather inconspicuous for the most part as there are trillions of them up there, and easily lost in the shuffle, not that humans pay them much attention for the most part any way. It is a thankless job, and the only reward is being an angel. Who knows, maybe in the next reality they will have more opportunity to shine?

    Other than the fact there are the spiritual battles with which may be some sort of vacation time away from their night jobs. Who knows, could be a totally different set of angels, or not angels at all, but one can speculate a little?
     
  5. 3 Resurrections

    3 Resurrections That's 666 YEARS, folks

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    With all due respect to those gentlemen, they were incorrect. They were not considering the "anti-christ" in the context of what it meant to those Jews living in the first century.

    I mentioned two things that 1 John 2:22 and 1 John 4:3 said were markers of the "anti-christ" spirit.

    One, they would deny the Father and the Son.
    Two, they would deny that Christ had already come in the flesh.
    Question: Does the papacy deny both of those things? If not, then they are not the "Anti-christ" which John said was already in the world as he was writing.

    Jesus foretold that many men after Him would come claiming, "I am Christ, and The Time is at hand". What specific THE Time" would they have been referring to? This was directly connected to the Daniel 9:25 prophecy of "Messiah the Prince" coming to His people. Everybody in Israel in the year AD 30 had been anticipating this, from the Pharisees on down to the Samaritan woman at the well.

    "And as all the people were in expectation, and all men mused in their hearts of John, whether he were the Christ or not;" (Luke 3:15).

    "The woman saith unto him, I know that Messias cometh, which is called Christ: when he is come, he will tell us all things." (John 4:25).

    "And they which were sent were of the Pharisees. And they asked him, and said unto him, Why baptizest thou then, if thou be not that Christ, nor Elias, neither that prophet?" (John 1:24-25).

    When the Jewish leadership and Christ's own people generally refused to acknowledge that He had actually been the fulfillment of that Daniel 9:25 prophecy, they quickly went looking for a substitute - a "false Christ" - a "pseudo-Christ" - an "anti-christ". They had to do this as close to the prophesied AD 30 year as possible, in order to be a plausible match for Daniel's specific year of the Christ's appearance, so that the people would believe them to be the genuine fulfillment of that prophecy.

    As I said above, this first-century context of the "Anti-christ", or the many "false Christs" vainly trying to fulfill Daniel 9:25's prophecy dated to AD 30 has no relevance in today's context, far removed from that temporal prophecy related to the first century.

    Confessions and creeds, while giving honest attempts at consolidating key doctrines, should not be considered infallible. Neither were those who held to them infallible.
     
  6. 3 Resurrections

    3 Resurrections That's 666 YEARS, folks

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    Timtofly, according to your lengthy post #24, you have still not addressed the Romans 16:20 verse which states that God was going to crush Satan under the feet of the believers "shortly". Please, can you give me your best understanding of this verse? Did He or did He not crush Satan under their feet back then? If He did do what Paul said He was going to do "shortly", then you and I have other things to worry about than the Satanic realm today.
     
  7. Timtofly

    Timtofly Well-Known Member

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    It was in there. Figurative and ongoing. I explained why. Satan is very limited in what he can do. Until Satan is bound for 1000 years, he insanely repeats what he can do over and over again, every minute of the day.
     
  8. Valletta

    Valletta Well-Known Member

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    Please, by brother, do not spread fabrications about Catholics. I assure you, Catholics don't think the Pope is God. Pope Pius V never said such a thing, that such a lie survives to this day shows the strength of Satan, the great deceiver. Pope Pius V, after saying he was a SERVANT of God, then spoke of God:

    "Pius Bishop, servant of the servants of God, in lasting memory of the matter.

    He that reigneth on high, to whom is given all power in heaven and earth, has committed one holy Catholic and apostolic Church, outside of which there is no salvation, to one alone upon earth, namely to Peter, the first of the apostles, and to Peter’s successor, the pope of Rome, to be by him governed in fullness of power. . ." Full text at: https://www.papalencyclicals.net/Pius05/p5regnans.htm

    Ask yourself why anyone would think it was necessary to spread lies about a pope, and why such lies would be so embraced.
     
  9. Acts29

    Acts29 Member

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    First, don't let the chapter break interrupt the context here. Chapter one, Paul, writing to Gentiles, describes the first Day of the Lord in which Jesus comes with the angels and the elect are gathered. See the 6th Seal in Rev. Then, chapter 2 applies in the decades that follow. Now you may understand why they will told they missed the Day of the Lord in verse 2. There is more than one Day of the Lord.

    No.

    He is a King so he is the law essentially. He will not claim to be Jesus. His heart is too prideful to do that. He will stand in the Temple and claim to be God at the very end of his term and will be destroyed at the brightness of Jesus' coming at the 7th Trumpet. So, he won't fool anyone.

    Observe the passage you quoted very carefully above. The lawless one is revealed and destroyed in verse 8, at the 7th Trumpet. THEN, in verse 9 another lawless one will come and deceive with signs and wonders. This is the beast and false prophet that arise AFTER the 7th Trumpet, just as written in Revelation.

    Yes. His name is Nebuchadnezzar, King of Babylon at Nineveh, the Assyrian King of the North in Daniel 11. He will crush all the kingdoms in the Middle East like eggs in his hand. Jonah's prophecy shall be fulfilled.
     
  10. Acts29

    Acts29 Member

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    I am sorry you had to endure this. I agree with you, completely. The discord in the church, Catholic vs Protestant etc., is the reason the world does not know Christ.

    John 17:20 “I do not pray for these alone, but also for those who will believe in Me through their word; 21 that they all may be one, as You, Father, are in Me, and I in You; that they also may be one in Us, that the world may believe that You sent Me.

    There is one Christ and one church. Unity will unlock the greatest revival the world has ever known. Unity does not mean everyone has to agree on every single point, but there should be respect and honor between brethren. Those of us in whom Christ has been revealed by the Father have become family. It is high time we act like it.
     
  11. jgr

    jgr Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Please respond with credible evidence disproving each of these historical papal claims:


    Pius IX was described as "the living Christ", and "the Lamb of the Vatican".

    Pius X said: "The Pope...is Jesus Christ Himself, hidden under the veil of flesh."

    Pius XI, on 30 April 1922, in the Vatican throne room, said: "You know that I am the Holy Father, the representative of God on the earth, the Vicar of Christ, which means that I am God on the earth."

    The Canon Law in the Gloss on the Extravaganza of John XXII, AD 1316-1334, calls the Roman pontiff "Our Lord God the Pope."

    Martin V was addressed as: "The most holy and most blessed, who holds the celestial jurisdiction, who is Lord over all the earth...the anointed...the ruler of the universe, the father of kings, the Light of the World."

    During the Vatican Council, 9 January 1870, it was stated: "The Pope is Christ in office, Christ in jurisdiction and power...we bow down before thy voice, O Pius, as before the voice of Christ, the God of truth; in clinging to thee, we cling to Christ."

    The Roman Catholic theologian Thomas Aquinas said: "There is no difference between the Pope and Jesus Christ."

    Cardinal Henry Edward Manning said: "He [the Roman pope] was elevated to be, in his Divine Master's Name, King of kings and Lord of lords."

    “All the names which in the Scripture are applied to Christ, by virtue of which it is established that He is over the church, all the same names are applied to the Pope.” Robert Cardinal Bellarmine, De Conciliorum Auctoriatate (On the Authority of the Councils) Bk 2, chap. 17 Bellarmine (1542-1621), a professor and rector at the Jesuit Gregorian University in Rome, is generally considered to have been one of the outstanding Jesuit instructors in the history of this organization.

    “The pope is of so great dignity and so exalted that he is not mere man, but as it were God, and the vicar of God. He is the divine monarch and supreme emperor, and king of kings. Hence the pope is crowned with a triple crown, as Kind of heaven and of earth and of the lower regions.” Lucius Ferraris, Prompta Bibliotheca, vol.6, art.Papa II” (Ferraris was an Italian Catholic canonist and consultor to the Holy Office in Rome.)

    “We hold upon this earth the place of God Almighty.” Pope Leo XIII, in an encyclical letter dated June 20, 1894, The Great Encyclical Letters of Leo XIII, p. 304.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2021
  12. jgr

    jgr Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Since it was God who raised up the Reformers to reclaim His true Church from the spiritual darkness and oppression of centuries of the apostasized papal antichrist,

    Was God incorrect?
     
  13. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    She was aware that the Messiah would come, who is called Christ.

    In 1John2:18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.

    Just as there is only one singular Christ - who is Jesus - that the woman knew was coming, the people of that day following the death and resurrection of Jesus, were aware that there will be one singular Antichrist coming.

    John 12:13 Took branches of palm trees, and went forth to meet him, and cried, Hosanna: Blessed is the King of Israel that cometh in the name of the Lord.

    Mark 15:32 Let Christ the King of Israel descend now from the cross, that we may see and believe. And they that were crucified with him reviled him.

    To become the Antichrist, the person must be anointed the King of Israel, coming in his own name, meaning one who God did not intend to be their King.

    No one has been anointed the King of Israel instead of and against the true Christ - Jesus, the rightful King of Israel.... yet.
     
  14. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    You question is improperly phrased.

    Was God incorrect?
    Why were the reformers incorrect concerning the Antichrist?

    God did not say that the Pope was the Antichrist anywhere in the bible. The reformers were the ones making that claim.

    The Pope cannot be the Antichrist - because he was never anointed the King of Israel coming in his own name. And will never be anointed the King of Israel because his religion is not Judaism and is not a Jew.

    Jesus was the righteous branch descended from David. Why do you think it says the abominable branch for the person in Isaiah 14:19-20 who destroys his land and his people?

    19 But thou art cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch, and as the raiment of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit; as a carcase trodden under feet.

    20 Thou shalt not be joined with them in burial, because thou hast destroyed thy land, and slain thy people: the seed of evildoers shall never be renowned.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2021
  15. Valletta

    Valletta Well-Known Member

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    What if people actually checked the veracity of the statements before posting them on websites or in forums? Why can anti-Catholic fabrications survive for centuries? How often do you see Catholics make up fake quotations about those of other religions? Try taking a careful look at the material you present.
    No one in the world can prove someone else never said something, without a proper citation for a quotation this is impossible. A proper citation would date, location, publication, etc. I would stay away from repeating negative information that is not cited so as to not be involved in slander. And of course, just because it is in an anti-Catholic publication does not mean it is true--I would check the sources cited in the publication.

    Unless I can find the source I can't find it. I would be glad to discuss any but you have to locate the source, some kind of text I can examine. I did find the source of one of your statements. it is an encyclical letter and was easy to find. Note that the quotation is only a phrase within a sentence, I have provided the entire rather long sentence from the encyclical with your portion bolded:

    "But since We hold upon this earth the place of God Almighty, who will have all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth, and now that Our advanced age and the bitterness of anxious cares urge Us on towards the end common to every mortal, We feel drawn to follow the example of Our Redeemer and Master, Jesus Christ, who, when about to return to heaven, implored of God, His Father, in earnest prayer, that His disciples and followers should be of one mind and of one heart: I pray . . . that they all may be one, as thou Father in Me, and I in Thee: that they also may be one in Us. And as this divine prayer and supplication does not include only the souls who then believed in Jesus Christ, but also every one of those who were henceforth to believe in Him, this prayer holds out to Us no indifferent reason for confidently expressing Our hopes, and for making all possible endeavors in order that the men of every race and clime should be called and moved to embrace the unity of divine faith."

    The full encyclical letter is at:https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_...s_of_Pope_Leo_XIII/The_Reunion_of_Christendom

    This is valid Catholic teaching, we find Jesus to be both Our Redeemer and Master. I don't find anything disturbing in this statement, I agree that we should "follow the example of Our Redeemer and Master, Jesus Christ, who, when about to return to heaven, implored of God, His Father, in earnest prayer, that His disciples and followers should be of one mind and of one heart."

    If you can locate a source for the other statements I would be glad to discuss those as well.
     
  16. 3 Resurrections

    3 Resurrections That's 666 YEARS, folks

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    God's infallibility does not translate into man's infallibility. He has always used flawed instruments to accomplish His purpose.

    I learned a very hard lesson early on by sitting in a cult-like church for the first 16 years of my married life, until I got out by God's mercy. NEVER, NEVER, NEVER trust the one holding the Book more than the Book itself. That applies to the Reformers also, though I do have agreement with many of them on various key doctrines of soteriology.

    Paul's "Man of Lawlessness" was presently in place as he was writing II Thessalonians 2; being restrained by someone with whom the Thessalonians were well familiar, because Paul said they knew what was restraining that Man of Lawlessness (2 Thess. 2:6). That meant BOTH the "Man of Lawlessness" and his "restrainer" were individuals known to the Thessalonians. By studying the history of the times, I know exactly who both men were: Menahem the first Zealot leader who managed to get into the temple in AD 66, presenting himself as the King of the Jews, exalting himself over every other Zealot leader contending for that title, and the man who did his best to restrain Menahem's purpose - the former high priest Ananias, before whom Paul went on trial in Acts 23:2. Menahem murdered that high priest Ananias who had been working against him, but in revenge, Menahem was consequently murdered by Ananias's son, Eleazar, only a few weeks later. Paul when on trial actually prophesied the death of that high priest Ananias who commanded that he be struck on the mouth, when he retorted "God is about to smite thee, thou whited wall." Sure enough, soon after Paul's trial in AD 60, Ananias was murdered by Menahem in AD 66.

    But the very brightness of Menahem's coming on the scene as King of the Jews was snuffed out almost as soon as it began, which is the way Paul described this man's very brief, meteoric rise to power, and his consequent destruction.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2021
  17. 3 Resurrections

    3 Resurrections That's 666 YEARS, folks

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    Not quiiiiiiiite correct. To become the Antichrist / Man of Lawlessness, Paul said that this person was going to "exalt himself over everything that is called God, or that is worshipped" (not that what was called God in those days actually was God, and not that the Antichrist would actually succeed in getting many other people besides himself to exalt him).

    There were many Zealot leaders contending with each other to achieve the "King of the Jews" title in those first-century days. Each would try to "exalt himself" over everyone else that wanted to be called God (aka, the "King of the Jews" - a title that only Christ the Messiah deserved to have).
     
  18. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

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    Going into the temple sitting, claiming to have achieved God-hood, is not what makes the person the King of Israel. In fact, just the opposite, the Jews will reject him from continuing as their King of Israel at that point.

    To become the Antichrist, the person will be anointed the King of Israel, by the false prophet. The Jews believe that Elijah will come in preparation for the messianic age.

    In Judaism, they believe the messiah will be anointed the King of Israel by a known prophet. In Revelation 13, the false prophet does miracles including calling fire down from heaven like Elijah did in in his battle with the prophets of baal.


    I challenge that claim you are making. It goes against fundamental Jewish belief.

    In Judaism the belief is that the messiah will in no way be divine.

    To know what the Jews believe about the messiah, go to https://www.jewfaq.org/mashiach.htm

    From that site...

    (my comments in brackets and blue)

    "The mashiach will be a great political leader [the little horn leader of the EU] descended from King David (Jeremiah 23:5) [he will be a Jew]. The mashiach is often referred to as "mashiach ben David" (mashiach, son of David). He will be well-versed in Jewish law, and observant of its commandments (Isaiah 11:2-5) [his religion will be Judaism, he will also be into Kabbalah]. He will be a charismatic leader, inspiring others to follow his example. He will be a great military leader, who will win battles for Israel [the little horn will stage his EU army in Greece as a deterrent to Gog/Magog]. He will be a great judge, who makes righteous decisions (Jeremiah 33:15). But above all, he will be a human being, not a god, demi-god or other supernatural being."

    So that runs counter to your claim about some zealots wanting to be called God.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2021
  19. jgr

    jgr Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I don't deny that there could be misquotes in the list. However, it is highly unlikely that all of them are errant.

    So the reasonable approach is to consider those which appear legitimately attributed.

    Is the following citation accurate?

    "The Canon Law in the Gloss on the Extravaganza of John XXII, AD 1316-1334, calls the Roman pontiff "Our Lord God the Pope."
     
  20. 3 Resurrections

    3 Resurrections That's 666 YEARS, folks

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    Chapter and verse on this, please. I have yet to encounter a text that says the False prophet was going to anoint the Antichrist King of Israel.

    Actually, it is immaterial what the current Jewish belief is on this subject today. That is because Paul's discussion of the Man of Lawlessness and his restrainer was of two individuals who were presently alive at the time he was writing to the Thessalonians, and were individuals known to them. Paul had discussed this subject in person with the Thessalonians, and was reminding them of that discussion in 2 Thess. 2:5-7.

    "Remember ye not, that when I was yet with you, I told you these things? And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time. For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way."

    The Zealot contenders for the role of the King of Israel in those days were trying vainly to become Daniel 9:25's prophesied "Messiah the Prince" - Messiah meaning "The anointed One", or the "Christ". The Zealots' purpose was being restrained by the covetous high priesthood that wanted to maintain the status quo with Rome in order to keep the money flowing into their own pockets.

    Daniel's "Messiah the Prince" was prophesied to appear in the year AD 30, (as Christ Jesus did at the beginning of His ministry), but His own "received Him not". Instead, each Zealot leader went about trying to "exalt himself" by becoming a military-type leader who would kick Rome to the curb, as they thought that prophesied Messiah intended to do.

    The False Prophet was the religious leadership in Israel, who kept the "fire from heaven" burning on the altar in the Temple. They opposed the Zealots, and wanted to maintain the Romans in power, since it was to their financial benefit to do so. Because the existing religious leadership opposed their purpose in rebelling against Rome, The Zealots scrapped the whole appointed high priesthood at the beginning of the rebellion, and cast lots to elect their own high priest - the ordinary citizen called Phannias, who had no idea what he was doing, and who became the puppet of the Zealots. This puppet high priest was to anoint the one Zealot leader who would became the so-called "messiah" by defeating Rome.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2021
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