Liturgy

[LutheranHawkeye]

I would like to hear some of the opinions on some churches and there more non traditional services/music? Do you think the lutheran church as a whole finds the non traditional services as a danger or a blessing? Do you personally find the services as a danger or do you like a bit of change?

 

[LutherNut]

I would like to hear some of the opinions on some churches and there more non traditional services/music? Do you think the lutheran church as a whole finds the non traditional services as a danger or a blessing? Do you personally find the services as a danger or do you like a bit of change?

As one worships, so one believes. If they worship like Baptists, soon they will believe as Baptists believe. If they worship like Pentecostals, soon they will believe as Pentecostals believe.

There is a reason why Lutherans worship the way we do. It is is line with our theology.


Jay

 

[LutheranHawkeye]

So do you believe as I that non traditional services are a threat? Turning our Lutheran churches into what feels like new age stuff.

 

[LutheranHawkeye]

I know eliminating all non traditional music in divine service seems drastic but it does feel like a different church. I just know this from attending an Elca Church, but on here I have discovered that there are plenty of Lcms churches with this problem. Does the Wels have this problem as well?

 

[DaRev]

I know eliminating all non traditional music in divine service seems drastic but it does feel like a different church. I just know this from attending an Elca Church, but on here I have discovered that there are plenty of Lcms churches with this problem. Does the Wels have this problem as well?

I have been to a few churches that have "contemporary" services. While there is a right way to do it, I have yet to find a church that does it right. A couple that I have been to don't resemble anything close to being Lutheran. One such is St. John's in Ellisville, MO. The only thing Lutheran about that church is the sign out front. Their "warehouse service" is a piece of work. It's more like a Talk Show atmosphere with the coffee shop in the back and big video screens running commercials for their bookstore and pushing that Rick Warren crap. And there was abosultely nothing sacramental about the service at all.

Now, Trinity Lutheran in Edwardsville, IL probably comes the closest to any I have attended, although it, too, could stand improvement.

My parish here did one that was absolutely horrible. Needless to say, we don't do it anymore.


DaRev

 

[C.F.W. Walther]

I have been to a few churches that have "contemporary" services. While there is a right way to do it, I have yet to find a church that does it right. A couple that I have been to don't resemble anything close to being Lutheran. One such is St. John's in Ellisville, MO. The only thing Lutheran about that church is the sign out front. Their "warehouse service" is a piece of work. It's more like a Talk Show atmosphere with the coffee shop in the back and big video screens running commercials for their bookstore and pushing that Rick Warren crap. And there was abosultely nothing sacramental about the service at all.

Now, Trinity Lutheran in Edwardsville, IL probably comes the closest to any I have attended, although it, too, could stand improvement.

My parish here did one that was absolutely horrible. Needless to say, we don't do it anymore.


DaRev

Try St.marks Lutheran in Eureka were Pastor Darwin Katsten officiates. Their service combines all the essence of traditional liturgy with contemporary songs but not the smaltzy stuff.

 

[Melethiel]

Contemporary services are a BIG no-no. Remember though, there is a difference between contemporary services and contemporary songs. It's not necessary to stick solely to the 16th century greatest hits.

 

[LutheranHawkeye]

I'm so glad my Church uses traditional services and traditional songs. As Luthernut said: As one worships, one believes. I totally see that now. Music is a part of our identity. Luther was really into technology though, do you think he would agree with the latest christian music? Even though musically its crap

 

[Melethiel]

I'm so glad my Church uses traditional services and traditional songs. As Luthernut said: As one worships, one believes. I totally see that now. Music is a part of our identity. Luther was really into technology though, do you think he would agree with the latest christian music? Even though musically its crap

CCM? No...there are some excellent hymns in the contemporary style though.

 

[LutheranHawkeye]

CCM? No...there are some excellent hymns in the contemporary style though.

Sorry I didnt explain enough. I don't like contemporary christian music. I love old and new hymns.

 

[LutherNut]

I'm so glad my Church uses traditional services and traditional songs. As Luthernut said: As one worships, one believes. I totally see that now. Music is a part of our identity. Luther was really into technology though, do you think he would agree with the latest christian music? Even though musically its crap

There certainly are musical styles that do not belong in the worship service at all. A full blown rock band has no business in a worship service. That's not to say that a hymn cannot be accompanied by a guitar... or a brass quintet... or a string ensamble...

As for CCM, while about 90% of it is crap theologically speaking, there are a few that are sound in their message. The real problem is that they are few and far between, and the contemporary services that I have heard seem to find the worst ones available.

 

[LutheranHawkeye]

Change our music.
Eventually we won't need to have service in actual churches. And with that we probably won't need the sacraments anymore, and even doctrine. To me it seems that if you change such a sacred art in the church the rest will go with it.

 

[Colabomb]

I think you all should use the BCP Muwahwahwah!!!

(Just kidding)

 

[Melethiel]

Change our music.
Eventually we won't need to have service in actual churches. And with that we probably won't need the sacraments anymore, and even doctrine. To me it seems that if you change such a sacred art in the church the rest will go with it.

What do you mean by "change our music"? Are you talking theologically or musically? Because if you're talking theologically, I would agree. If musically, I would remind you that the style in Bach's time was much different from that in Luther's time. In fact, Bach (gasp) rewrote many of Luther's settings for the hymns.

 

[LutheranHawkeye]

I was saying ccm is bad theologically and musically. Melethiel I think you know more about the musical part better than anyone else here. Lol do harmonic analysis on a bach hymn and then on a ccm song. I promise you, you won't laugh.

 

[Melethiel]

I was saying ccm is bad theologically and musically. Melethiel I think you know more about the musical part better than anyone else here. Lol do harmonic analysis on a bach hymn and then on a ccm song. I promise you, you won't laugh.

I know perfectly well the differences in harmonic analysis. CCM songs consist of I, IV, and V. Bach puts in a bit more variety, but the hymns still follow predictable progressions. (Trust me, I've done SO much analysis of Bach over the past 2 years )

 

[LutheranHawkeye]

You do know what I'm talking about when I say contemporary christian music. Not like amazing grace and hymns within the past 200 years. I'm talking about the songs that are like: I love you Jesus, you take my sins and you crumple them up and shoot them out of a salad shooter. And that's how I know that I'm SAVVVEEEDD!!! < That is what I'm talking about. Those songs are jokes compared to any hymns.

 

[Melethiel]

I love you Jesus, you take my sins and you crumple them up and shoot them out of a salad shooter. And that's how I know that I'm SAVVVEEEDD!!!

I love it. That's the best spoof I've seen in a while.

And yes, I do know what you mean. I've written countless rants on my blog about it.

 

[LutheranHawkeye]

Yeay I'm glad you found that funny. I thought about it for awhile and figured that would a song on the christian charts soon. Sinning Salad Shooter by K.C and the SunJesus Band.

 

[Colabomb]

Lol, I like CCM and Christian Rock. I would never use it in a liturgy, but it doesn't mean I can't enjoy it on my time lol.