Lineage of Mary, mother of Jesus

[Bladerunner]

Of course, I'm aware of what the blood curse is and where people get the idea from. However, I see no reason to extend that particular curse beyond Jeconiah's immediate children. And indeed, it's Jeconiah's sons who are carried off into exile never to sit on the throne. However, after the exile, it appears to me that Zechariah and Haggai had no problem with thinking Zerubbabel could be messiah/king. So it makes me think that Jeremiah's saying was only about Jeconiah's sons. It would also seem that Matthew is unaware of such a curse or he surely wouldn't have used that line as Jesus' lineage. So, I just disagree that there is such a thing as a blood curse on all of Jeconiah's descendants throughout all of time - I don't think it's supportable by the text and it doesn't seem that Zechariah, Haggai or Matthew believed in such a thing either.

I give you the passages of what GOD said: The Blood Curse is there which is why, Jesus came from the seed of a woman.

It is up to you to believe it or not. I believe My GOD is SOOooooooo powerful that He makes sure that everyword in the Bible is by His selection.

My question is: for those that study the Bible, How can they believe that Mankind can change the WORD of GOD when John 1:1 tells us the 'WORD was GOD'.

Blade

 

[Yekcidmij]

I give you the passages of what GOD said: The Blood Curse is there which is why, Jesus came from the seed of a woman.

And I gave an alternate interpretation that seems better than yours. I know you think your interpretation is delivered to you by God, but I doubt it. I think your interpretation has been conjured up in your own mind. So at this point you have to argue that your interpretation is not only correct, but given by God. Good luck.

It is up to you to believe it or not. I believe My GOD is SOOooooooo powerful that He makes sure that everyword in the Bible is by His selection.

Well, if you can counter my points, please do so. I would hate to think that God is unable to defend his word.

My question is: for those that study the Bible, How can they believe that Mankind can change the WORD of GOD when John 1:1 tells us the 'WORD was GOD'.

Of course nobody has said that, so your point is moot.

 

[prodromos]

My question is: for those that study the Bible, How can they believe that Mankind can change the WORD of GOD when John 1:1 tells us the 'WORD was GOD

God's word is not God the Word.

 

[Bladerunner]

And I gave an alternate interpretation that seems better than yours. I know you think your interpretation is delivered to you by God, but I doubt it. I think your interpretation has been conjured up in your own mind. So at this point you have to argue that your interpretation is not only correct, but given by God. Good luck.



Well, if you can counter my points, please do so. I would hate to think that God is unable to defend his word.



Of course nobody has said that, so your point is moot.

"Thus saith the LORD, Write ye this man childless, a man that shall not prosper in his days: for no man of his seed shall prosper, sitting upon the throne of David, and ruling any more in Judah." (Jer. 22:30). This "blood Curse" was given to Jeconiah. The legal line of David.

Joseph was of the Jeconiah line and if Jesus was from that line, He could not sit on David's Throne.

Joseph the Son-in-law of Heli was adopted by Heli, thereby giving him all the heirships. Joseph adopted Jesus as did Heli.
In Luke 3:23.."And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed ) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli,"

Thus we wind up with two lines to David.
Matthew shows us the Legal Line from Abraham to David to Solomon to Jacob to Joseph.

Luke gives us the blood (biological) line from Adam to David to Nathan to Mary.

Blade

 

[prodromos]

Luke gives us the blood (biological) line from Adam to David to Nathan to Mary.

They are both Joseph's lines as explained in post #27

 

[Bladerunner]

God's word is not God the Word.

John 1:1.."In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."

God's WORD is GOD.. He spoke our universe into being. When People want to change the WORD of God with words of their own, then they deny GOD's Word in any way they can. This is not only dangerous but borders on blasphemy.

BLade

 

[prodromos]

John 1:1.."In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."

God's WORD is GOD.. He spoke our universe into being. When People want to change the WORD of God with words of their own, then they deny GOD's Word in any way they can. This is not only dangerous but borders on blasphemy.

BLade

God's word is the inspired writings collected into the Scriptures, comprising of the Old Testament and the New Testament. It is not God.
God the Word is the eternally begotten Son of the Father, of one essence with the Father, without beginning or end.
Those who conflate the two are speaking nonsense.

 

[Bladerunner]

They are both Joseph's lines as explained in post #27

"It states that St John of Damascus suggested that Luke's genealogy is that of Mary. This is not true. St John of Damascus gives the same understanding as Sextus Julius Africanus that both genealogies are of Joseph due to his fathers being brothers with the same mother but of different fathers, she having remarried after the death of her first husband. The first brother died before producing an heir, so the other brother raised up seed for him with his widow. The child born as a result was Joseph."

Yeah, I have heard of that before and it just does not fit. Besides it seems to be a lot of double talk. Fathers being Brothers (we know one name but not the other) with same mother of different fathers (no names) and on and on and on...........................?

This is Catholicism at its best. Deny the WORD of GOD for the POPE is the VICOR of Christ.

In the End, Joseph was adopted according to scriptures and Jewish tradition by Mary's father Heli. Thus, the needed Legal and Blood lines completed as promised. Jesus will sit on David's throne during the millennium.

The Word of GOD without changing it tells us the true story. Believe it or not, it is your decision.


Blade

 

[Bladerunner]

God's word is the inspired writings collected into the Scriptures, comprising of the Old Testament and the New Testament. It is not God.
God the Word is the eternally begotten Son of the Father, of one essence with the Father, without beginning or end.
Those who conflate the two are speaking nonsense.

Where did the Holy Spirit go? You only speak of two. there is a trinity!

The Word of GOD is His Authority. When Man changes these Words, Man is placing his Sovereignty of that of God's.

Blade

 

[prodromos]

Yeah, I have heard of that before and it just does not fit.

Sure it does. In fact it is the only explanation that does no violence to the Scriptures.

Besides it seems to be a lot of double talk. Fathers being Brothers (we know one name but not the other) with same mother of different fathers (no names) and on and on and on...........................?

What are you talking about? All their names are recorded in the two genealogies. The only name not recorded is that of Joseph's grandmother, who was at one time married to Matthat, the descendant of David through Nathan, and at another time married to Matthan, the descendant of David through Solomon. She gave birth to a son to each of her husband's, Jacob to Matthan and Heli to Matthat. One of the sons married but died before producing an heir, so his brother raised up seed with his widow in accordance with the law. Thus was Joseph born.

This is Catholicism at its best. Deny the WORD of GOD for the POPE is the VICOR of Christ.

I'm not Catholic. Never have been, never will be. Nuff said.

In the End, Joseph was adopted according to scriptures and Jewish tradition by Mary's father Heli.

Please quote the Scriptures and Jewish tradition which state this.

The Word of GOD without changing it tells us the true story. Believe it or not, it is your decision.

You have added to God's word by claiming that Joseph was adopted by Heli and that Heli was Mary's father. Scripture says no such thing.

 

[prodromos]

Where did the Holy Spirit go? You only speak of two. there is a trinity!

My goodness! You didn't mention the Holy Spirit in your earlier post either. I guess that makes you a closet heretic too.

The Word of GOD is His Authority. When Man changes these Words, Man is placing his Sovereignty of that of God's.

Since you have added to God's word in your above interpretation, I guess that makes you guilty as charged.

 

[Bladerunner]

Sure it does. In fact it is the only explanation that does no violence to the Scriptures.

What are you talking about? All their names are recorded in the two genealogies. The only name not recorded is that of Joseph's grandmother, who was at one time married to Matthat, the descendant of David through Nathan, and at another time married to Matthan, the descendant of David through Solomon. She gave birth to a son to each of her husband's, Jacob to Matthan and Heli to Matthat. One of the sons married but died before producing an heir, so his brother raised up seed with his widow in accordance with the law. Thus was Joseph born.

I'm not Catholic. Never have been, never will be. Nuff said.

Please quote the Scriptures and Jewish tradition which state this.

You have added to God's word by claiming that Joseph was adopted by Heli and that Heli was Mary's father. Scripture says no such thing.

I have not added nothing. I give you the scripture. It was also a Jewish tradition where the Father of the Bride would adopt the Husband as a son. This would ensure Heirship.

I thought we were on the same page. I said, Joseph is the Legal Line to David and Mary is the Biological line to David.

You don't agree with this?

Blade

 

[Yekcidmij]

It was also a Jewish tradition where the Father of the Bride would adopt the Husband as a son. This would ensure Heirship.

Can you cite a source for this?

 

[Bladerunner]

Can you cite a source for this?

You have LOCKE at the end... Is it a trick question? The Second Treatise on Civil Government by John Locke

Now pray tell me, what has this to do with Mary's Genealogy?

Blade

 

[prodromos]

I have not added nothing. I give you the scripture.

You have an interpretation which adds to Scripture. The Scriptures say

"Joseph, the son of Heli, the son of Matthat, the son of Levi, the son of Melchi, ..."​

You make it read "Joseph, the adopted son of Heli, ...", ergo you add to Scripture

It was also a Jewish tradition where the Father of the Bride would adopt the Husband as a son. This would ensure Heirship.

You have failed to provide any basis for your claim Book titles are not evidence.

I thought we were on the same page. I said, Joseph is the Legal Line to David and Mary is the Biological line to David.

You don't agree with this?

You claim Luke gives Mary's genealogy. That claim is without basis.

 

[Yekcidmij]

You have LOCKE at the end... Is it a trick question? The Second Treatise on Civil Government by John Locke

Now pray tell me, what has this to do with Mary's Genealogy?

Blade

Not even sure what you're talking about. Something about my signature line? It's in every post...it's a signature line.

 

[prodromos]

Not even sure what you're talking about. Something about my signature line? It's in every post...it's a signature line.

And here I was thinking that he was referencing Locke

 

[Bladerunner]

You have an interpretation which adds to Scripture. The Scriptures say

"Joseph, the son of Heli, the son of Matthat, the son of Levi, the son of Melchi, ..."​

You make it read "Joseph, the adopted son of Heli, ...", ergo you add to Scripture

You have failed to provide any basis for your claim Book titles are not evidence.

You claim Luke gives Mary's genealogy. That claim is without basis.

Well, it is ok, it is your choice!

Blade

 

[Bladerunner]

Not even sure what you're talking about. Something about my signature line? It's in every post...it's a signature line.

OK, thought that was part of your statements.

Blade

 

[mark kennedy]

I was just reading through the 1st chapter of Matthew and all the begats and I read something I never paid attention to before. Joseph, Mary's husband is a descendant of King David not Mary. So I was trying to find what Lineage Mary is from. I can't find it, even when I did a web search. So who is Mary a descendant of?

Mary was Judean but I'm not so sure she was a direct descendant of David. It really doesn't matter because with her marriage to David she enters his family.