Limited vs unlimited atonement?

[FreeGrace2]

Here is what Jesus plainly said to His people:

16 He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned. 17 And these signs will follow those who believe: In My name they will cast out demons; they will speak with new tongues; 18 they will take up serpents; and if they drink anything deadly, it will by no means hurt them; they will lay hands on the sick, and they will recover.” Mark 16:16-18

• these signs will follow those who believe: In My name they will cast out demons; they will speak with new tongues; 18 they will take up serpents; and if they drink anything deadly, it will by no means hurt them; they will lay hands on the sick, and they will recover.”

again


24 “Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life. 25 Most assuredly, I say to you, the hour is coming, and now is, when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God; and those who hear will live. 26 For as the Father has life in Himself, so He has granted the Son to have life in Himself, 27 and has given Him authority to execute judgment also, because He is the Son of Man. 28 Do not marvel at this; for the hour is coming in which all who are in the graves will hear His voice 29 and come forth—those who have done good, to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation. John 5:24-29


all who are in the graves will hear His voice and come forth—those who have done good, to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation.

• those who have done good, to the resurrection of life.
• those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation.

JLB

I'm really getting tired of your failure to properly and rightly divide the Word of Truth.

Salvation is by faith in Jesus Christ. That isn't negotiable or arguable.

Finally, Jesus Christ GUARANTEED eternal security to those who receive eternal life.

John 10:28 - I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand.

The first phrase "I give them eternal life" indicates that the "them" are recipients of eternal life. Anything to argue here? I thought not.

The second phrase "and they shall never perish" is the result of being a recipient of eternal life. Anything to argue here? Again, I thought not.

Jesus further drives home the guarantee of eternal security by the third phrase "no one will snatch them out of my hand".

The argument that the believer himself can remove himself from His hand is delusional, because of the first 2 phrases, which guarantee eternal security.

So, all who have received eternal life (recipients of eternal life) are said by Jesus to never perish.

Did you notice that Jesus gave NO CONDITIONS after becoming a recipient of eternal life? Good. I was hoping so.

So, there are NO CONDITIONS to meet for recipients of eternal life.

But your response will always be interesting, since you've been clear about saved people (that would be recipients of eternal life) CAN perish, because of certain conditions.

So, who ya gonna believe?

Jesus said: recipients of eternal life will never perish.

JLB says: recipients of eternal life MAY WELL perish, if certain conditions exist.

I'll choose what Jesus said ALL THE TIME.

I'd suggest an honest and hard look within yourself to try to figure out WHY your claim goes DIRECTLY AGAINST what Jesus said.

That is a very serious probem.

 

[Jack Terrence]

I'm really getting tired of your failure to properly and rightly divide the Word of Truth.

Nobody cares. Who do you think you are?

 

[JamesFW]

I'm really getting tired of your failure to properly and rightly divide the Word of Truth.

Salvation is by faith in Jesus Christ. That isn't negotiable or arguable.

You are correct.

Finally, Jesus Christ GUARANTEED eternal security to those who receive eternal life.

You are correct.

John 10:28 - I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand.

You are correct.

The first phrase "I give them eternal life" indicates that the "them" are recipients of eternal life. Anything to argue here? I thought not.

You are correct.

The second phrase "and they shall never perish" is the result of being a recipient of eternal life. Anything to argue here? Again, I thought not.

You are correct.

Jesus further drives home the guarantee of eternal security by the third phrase "no one will snatch them out of my hand".

You are correct.

The argument that the believer himself can remove himself from His hand is delusional, because of the first 2 phrases, which guarantee eternal security.

You are correct.

So, all who have received eternal life (recipients of eternal life) are said by Jesus to never perish.

You are correct.

Did you notice that Jesus gave NO CONDITIONS after becoming a recipient of eternal life? Good. I was hoping so.

In order to see the whole picture, you must read all the words of Jesus. You have focused on one part without believing everything Jesus said.

So, there are NO CONDITIONS to meet for recipients of eternal life.

Now, if you will read and believe everything Jesus told us, you will find conditions.

But your response will always be interesting, since you've been clear about saved people (that would be recipients of eternal life) CAN perish, because of certain conditions.

So, who ya gonna believe?

Jesus said: recipients of eternal life will never perish.

JLB says: recipients of eternal life MAY WELL perish, if certain conditions exist.

I'll choose what Jesus said ALL THE TIME.

I'd suggest an honest and hard look within yourself to try to figure out WHY your claim goes DIRECTLY AGAINST what Jesus said.

That is a very serious probem.

And your claim is directly against all of Jesus' words. Will you choose what Jesus says?

Here are verses you flatly refuse to believe.

John 5 - 28 Do not marvel at this; for the hour is coming in which all who are in the graves will hear His voice
29 and come forth—those who have done good, to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation.

Jesus mentions 'all' in the grave will come forth. Only two resurrections are mentioned, so all will come forth to the resurrection of life or the resurrection of condemnation. Do you believe this so far?

All will come forth to one of these resurrections, and Jesus also gave us conditions for these resurrections. Do you see the conditions?

Let's see what Jesus said about these conditions. Those who have done good and those who have done evil are the two conditions He gave us. Do you believe this?

It's pretty simple and straight forward. Do good = resurrection of life; do evil = resurrection of condemnation.

Did you not say doing good is keeping the law? According to this belief, no one will come forth to the resurrection of life. Unfortunately, your belief sends everyone to hell. Not a good thing.

So, I will advise everyone to continue doing good; it's a guarantee you will come forth to the resurrection of life.[/QUOTE]

 

[sdowney717]

You are correct.

In order to see the whole picture, you must read all the words of Jesus. You have focused on one part without believing everything Jesus said.



Now, if you will read and believe everything Jesus told us, you will find conditions.



And your claim is directly against all of Jesus' words. Will you choose what Jesus says?

Here are verses you flatly refuse to believe.

John 5 - 28 Do not marvel at this; for the hour is coming in which all who are in the graves will hear His voice
29 and come forth—those who have done good, to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation.

Jesus mentions 'all' in the grave will come forth. Only two resurrections are mentioned, so all will come forth to the resurrection of life or the resurrection of condemnation. Do you believe this so far?

All will come forth to one of these resurrections, and Jesus also gave us conditions for these resurrections. Do you see the conditions?

Let's see what Jesus said about these conditions. Those who have done good and those who have done evil are the two conditions He gave us. Do you believe this?

It's pretty simple and straight forward. Do good = resurrection of life; do evil = resurrection of condemnation.

Did you not say doing good is keeping the law? According to this belief, no one will come forth to the resurrection of life. Unfortunately, your belief sends everyone to hell. Not a good thing.

So, I will advise everyone to continue doing good; it's a guarantee you will come forth to the resurrection of life.

People that will be doing good, Christ means they will be bearing bear good fruit and do so because of the Holy Spirit working in them. These are the fruits of the Spirit, in your life, all of them, against such there is no LAW, and such are not good works. They are what God has caused you to bear in your Christian walk, for we are His workmanship. They bear good fruit because God has created in them the good ground, some bear 30, 60, 100 fold.

23 But he who received seed on the good ground is he who hears the word and understands it, who indeed bears fruit and produces: some a hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.”

If you do not bear good fruit, then God was not at work in your life. God makes the 'tree good and its fruit good. or makes the tree bad and it fruit bad'. A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit, for each type of tree is known by its fruit. Everyone will bear fruit according to their nature. Those who are born of God bear good fruit to God. If your a new creation in Christ, then you will bear good fruit.

His word does not return to Him void but accomplishes the purpose wherewith He sent it.
And God's command is eternal life to believers in Christ.

If you do not bear good fruit, then your not born of God and your going to be cut down and thrown into the fire to be burned.

Those that do good by bearing good fruit will be resurrected to eternal life, well its is a good thing to believe in Christ because it is the work of God that you believe in Christ.
John 6
29 Jesus answered and said to them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent.”

Infact your being disobedient to not believe in Christ, because God commands all men everywhere to repent and believe in his Son. If you do not believe in Christ then you have no eternal life and God's wrath abides on you as you are then one of the sons of disobedience because you refuse to pay heed to God's command to repent and believe.

Acts 17

30 Truly, these times of ignorance God overlooked, but now commands all men everywhere to repent, 31 because He has appointed a day on which He will judge the world in righteousness by the Man whom He has ordained. He has given assurance of this to all by raising Him from the dead.”

If someone denies the resurrection of Christ that is an evil thing men would be doing. Believers in Christ wont deny the resurrection.

Ephesians 2:2
in which you once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience,
Ephesians 5:6
Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of these things the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience.
Colossians 3:6
Because of these things the wrath of God is coming upon the sons of disobedience

1 Peter 2:7-9New King James Version (NKJV)
7 Therefore, to you who believe, He is precious; but to those who are disobedient,

“The stone which the builders rejected
Has become the chief cornerstone,”

8 and

“A stone of stumbling
And a rock of offense.”

They stumble, being disobedient to the word, to which they also were appointed.

9 But you are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, His own special people, that you may proclaim the praises of Him who called you out of darkness into His marvelous light;

Disobedient here means those who refuse to repent and believe in Christ.
They are disobedient to the gospel message.

 

[JLB777]

You've taken this thread WAY OFF topic, which is limited vs unlimited atonement.

My respomses are spot on, because the forgiveness of sins is limited, based on believing, present tense.


Those who believe for awhile, then no longer believe, no longer have the forgiveness of sins which is promised only to those who believe.

If we believe Jesus is Lord but disregard what He says, then we are hypocrites, and don't really believe, because our actions deny Him.

• But why do you call Me ‘Lord, Lord,’ and not do the things which I say?

46 “But why do you call Me ‘Lord, Lord,’ and not do the things which I say? 47 Whoever comes to Me, and hears My sayings and does them, I will show you whom he is like: 48 He is like a man building a house, who dug deep and laid the foundation on the rock. And when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently against that house, and could not shake it, for it was founded on the rock. 49 But he who heard and did nothing is like a man who built a house on the earth without a foundation, against which the stream beat vehemently; and immediately it fell. And the ruin of that house was great.”
Luke 6:46-49



JLB

 

[JLB777]

I'm really getting tired of your failure to properly and rightly divide the Word of Truth.

Salvation is by faith in Jesus Christ. That isn't negotiable or arguable.

Yes, as long as you continue to have faith, you continue to receive the forgivness of sins, which comes by faith in Him.


Your unbiblical doctrine teaches God's precious people, that continuing to have faith in Jesus Christ is not required, which only leads people astray.

Paul called it a doctrine of demons.

Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons, 1 Timothy 4:1


You claim people may believe 10 years ago, and depart from the faith today, and still be saved, even if they become a homosexual, or become a Muslim and confess Allah as their Lord, or even take the mark of the beast and still be saved, because you believe that once a person believes they can never lose that belief, and the salvation that comes from believing.


Complete nonsense, inspired by the devil himself.



JLB

 

[FreeGrace2]

Nobody cares. Who do you think you are?

Maybe try reading some of the other poster's posts will generate some care about truth.

 

[FreeGrace2]

You are correct.
You are correct.
You are correct.
You are correct.
You are correct.
You are correct.

Thank you.

I said this:
"The argument that the believer himself can remove himself from His hand is delusional, because of the first 2 phrases, which guarantee eternal security."

You are correct.

Thanks, again.

You are correct.

In order to see the whole picture, you must read all the words of Jesus. You have focused on one part without believing everything Jesus said.

What does this mean? You've agreed with my analysis of John 10:28 regarding eternal security, and now throw this in??

Now, if you will read and believe everything Jesus told us, you will find conditions.

Conditions for what, exactly? For never perishing? If that were true, how could you agree 8 times with my analysis of John 10:28, in which there are NO CONDITIONS for recipients of eternal life in order to never perish.

And your claim is directly against all of Jesus' words. Will you choose what Jesus says?

Of course I do. And here's what I will choose to do: I will vigorously resist any attempt to try to pit Scripture against Scripture in order to justify a view that Jesus plainly refutes in John 10:28.

Here are verses you flatly refuse to believe.

John 5 - 28 Do not marvel at this; for the hour is coming in which all who are in the graves will hear His voice
29 and come forth—those who have done good, to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil, to the resurrection of condemnation.

Jesus mentions 'all' in the grave will come forth. Only two resurrections are mentioned, so all will come forth to the resurrection of life or the resurrection of condemnation. Do you believe this so far?

Sure. And there is nothing in v.28-29 that changes the clear promise of eternal security for recipients of eternal life.

All will come forth to one of these resurrections, and Jesus also gave us conditions for these resurrections. Do you see the conditions?

yep. Still nothing that contradicts the promise of eternal security.

Let's see what Jesus said about these conditions. Those who have done good and those who have done evil are the two conditions He gave us. Do you believe this?

Yes. But the better question is: do you believe what He MEANT by "done good"?

It's pretty simple and straight forward. Do good = resurrection of life; do evil = resurrection of condemnation.

Do you believe only good people go to heaven and only evil people go to hell?

Did you not say doing good is keeping the law? According to this belief, no one will come forth to the resurrection of life. Unfortunately, your belief sends everyone to hell. Not a good thing.

Well, it's clear that you haven't read any of my previous posts. So I'll inform you now.

John 5:24 occurs BEFORE 5:28,29. " “Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life."

This verse establishes WHEN one possesses eternal life. it's WHEN they believe. Do you believe these words of Jesus?

If you do, then you should understand that John 5:29 refers to believing in Him by the phrase "done good". Not keeping the Law, as it seems you're claiming.

Possession of eternal life is ONLY by believing in Him for it. Jn 5:24. If that isn't established, then one cannot understand anything else Jesus said.

So, I will advise everyone to continue doing good; it's a guarantee you will come forth to the resurrection of life.

Only if you clarify what "doing good" really means. It means to place your full trust in Jesus Christ alone for eternal life. And He will give it to you.

 

[FreeGrace2]

My respomses are spot on, because the forgiveness of sins is limited, based on believing, present tense.

Yet, you don't even understand the Greek present tense, as seen in your poor analysis of it. You've twisted it to mean action every day. And if that action should cease, then the results of that action cease.

Yet, Jesus SMASHED that notion out of the park in John 3:16 and 10:28. He promised that RECIPIENTS of eternal life will never perish.

You can't get around that promise. The result of never perishing is based on receiving eternal life. Not present tense believing out into the future. Which is a false idea.

Those who believe for awhile, then no longer believe, no longer have the forgiveness of sins which is promised only to those who believe.

Based on John 5:24, WHEN does a person POSSESS (HAVE) enternal life?

The answer to that question refutes your claims.

If we believe Jesus is Lord but disregard what He says, then we are hypocrites, and don't really believe, because our actions deny Him.

Can any recipient of eternal life perish? Please answer.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Yes, as long as you continue to have faith, you continue to receive the forgivness of sins, which comes by faith in Him.

Can any recipient of eternal life EVER perish? Jesus said they will NEVER perish.

Your unbiblical doctrine teaches God's precious people, that continuing to have faith in Jesus Christ is not required, which only leads people astray.

Why would anyone who claims to be a believer in Christ charge Jesus' teaching about eternal security an "unbiblical doctrine"?? Horrendous.

Paul called it a doctrine of demons.

Eternal security??? Nonsense. He taught eternal security as well as did Jesus and Peter. In fact, NONE of the human writers of Scripture taught what you believe.

Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons, 1 Timothy 4:1

This is how the Bible describes former believers: apostates. Not unbelievers.

You claim people may believe 10 years ago, and depart from the faith today, and still be saved, even if they become a homosexual, or become a Muslim and confess Allah as their Lord, or even take the mark of the beast and still be saved, because you believe that once a person believes they can never lose that belief, and the salvation that comes from believing.

Simple question: did such people 10 years ago receive eternal life when they believed? yes or no?

Complete nonsense, inspired by the devil himself.

So, the devil inspired Jesus to teach eternal security, huh? That's pretty blasphemous. Rather close to the Pharisees claiming Jesus' miracles were done in the devil's power.

 

[JLB777]

Can any recipient of eternal life EVER perish? Jesus said they will NEVER perish.


Why would anyone who claims to be a believer in Christ charge Jesus' teaching about eternal security an "unbiblical doctrine"?? Horrendous.


Eternal security??? Nonsense. He taught eternal security as well as did Jesus and Peter. In fact, NONE of the human writers of Scripture taught what you believe.


This is how the Bible describes former believers: apostates. Not unbelievers.


Simple question: did such people 10 years ago receive eternal life when they believed? yes or no?


So, the devil inspired Jesus to teach eternal security, huh? That's pretty blasphemous. Rather close to the Pharisees claiming Jesus' miracles were done in the devil's power.

No scripture here.

Man's opinion, man's doctrine.



JLB

 

[bling]

I'm really getting tired of your failure to properly and rightly divide the Word of Truth.

Salvation is by faith in Jesus Christ. That isn't negotiable or arguable.

Finally, Jesus Christ GUARANTEED eternal security to those who receive eternal life.

John 10:28 - I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand.

The first phrase "I give them eternal life" indicates that the "them" are recipients of eternal life. Anything to argue here? I thought not.

The second phrase "and they shall never perish" is the result of being a recipient of eternal life. Anything to argue here? Again, I thought not.

Jesus further drives home the guarantee of eternal security by the third phrase "no one will snatch them out of my hand".

The argument that the believer himself can remove himself from His hand is delusional, because of the first 2 phrases, which guarantee eternal security.

So, all who have received eternal life (recipients of eternal life) are said by Jesus to never perish.

Did you notice that Jesus gave NO CONDITIONS after becoming a recipient of eternal life? Good. I was hoping so.

So, there are NO CONDITIONS to meet for recipients of eternal life.

But your response will always be interesting, since you've been clear about saved people (that would be recipients of eternal life) CAN perish, because of certain conditions.

So, who ya gonna believe?

Jesus said: recipients of eternal life will never perish.

JLB says: recipients of eternal life MAY WELL perish, if certain conditions exist.

I'll choose what Jesus said ALL THE TIME.

I'd suggest an honest and hard look within yourself to try to figure out WHY your claim goes DIRECTLY AGAINST what Jesus said.

That is a very serious probem.

Since Jesus handed ownership of our eternal life in heaven over to us as a pure gift it is ours to do with as we please or are there still conditions?

This eternal life in heaven is also referred to as our inheritance, since we are not in heaven yet, but we do have eternal life (really Christ uses the concept of “life”, we are no longer dying). We have the deed to a home in heaven, but we are not occupying that home yet.

The Hebrew writer in warns Christians in Heb. 12: 16 not to sell (give away) our birthright (inheritance) to our eternal life heaven, which we could do if it is really ours?

Paul in Gal. 6: 8 Whoever sows to please their flesh, from the flesh will reap destruction; whoever sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life. 9 Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up. Explains very specifically that the harvest for Christians sowing after the spirit is “eternal life” and then goes on to say the if we give up (give it up) we will not have the harvest of eternal life.

 

[JLB777]

Yet, you don't even understand the Greek present tense, as seen in your poor analysis of it. You've twisted it to mean action every day. And if that action should cease, then the results of that action cease.

Yet, Jesus SMASHED that notion out of the park in John 3:16 and 10:28. He promised that RECIPIENTS of eternal life will never perish.

You can't get around that promise. The result of never perishing is based on receiving eternal life. Not present tense believing out into the future. Which is a false idea.


Based on John 5:24, WHEN does a person POSSESS (HAVE) enternal life?

The answer to that question refutes your claims.

Can any recipient of eternal life perish? Please answer.

We will receive eternal life at the end of a fruitful life of holiness, in which we will inherit eternal life.

• you have your fruit to holiness, and the end, everlasting life.
• and the end, everlasting life

22 But now having been set free from sin, and having become slaves of God, you have your fruit to holiness, and the end, everlasting life. 23 For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord. Romans 6:22-23


4 But when the kindness and the love of God our Savior toward man appeared, 5 not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit, 6 whom He poured out on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior, 7 that having been justified by His grace we should become heirs according to the hope of eternal life. Titus 3:4-7

• we should become heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

We who have faith in Christ Jesus our Lord, have the hope of eternal life.

• It's called Blessed Assurance.

Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. Hebrews 11:1


Do you have faith in Jesus Christ for eternal life?



JLB

 

[JLB777]

Since Jesus handed ownership of our eternal life in heaven over to us as a pure gift it is ours to do with as we please or are there still conditions?

This eternal life in heaven is also referred to as our inheritance, since we are not in heaven yet, but we do have eternal life (really Christ uses the concept of “life”, we are no longer dying). We have the deed to a home in heaven, but we are not occupying that home yet.

The Hebrew writer in warns Christians in Heb. 12: 16 not to sell (give away) our birthright (inheritance) to our eternal life heaven, which we could do if it is really ours?

Paul in Gal. 6: 8 Whoever sows to please their flesh, from the flesh will reap destruction; whoever sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life. 9 Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up. Explains very specifically that the harvest for Christians sowing after the spirit is “eternal life” and then goes on to say the if we give up (give it up) we will not have the harvest of eternal life.

 

[FreeGrace2]

No scripture here.

More untruth from your posts. I was directly dealing with Jesus' words in John 5:24 and John 10:28.

Man's opinion, man's doctrine.

Let's call it what it actually is: Jesus' PROMISE. Or let's call it His GUARANTEE of eternal security.

If my posts reflect "man's opinion", they should be easily refuted from Scripture.

Yet, you've regularly failed to refute anything in them.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Since Jesus handed ownership of our eternal life in heaven over to us as a pure gift it is ours to do with as we please or are there still conditions?

Where does Scripture say anything about recipients of eternal life having the ability to "do anything" they wish with the gift. It is life itself that He gives. Can eternal life be killed? That would deny the very meaning of "eternal", right?

So, what He gives believers is God's life, which is eternal. So there is NOTHING any recipient can do that removes or eliminates or kills that life.

Jesus was clear: recipients of eternal life will NEVER PERISH. How is that not a guarantee of eternal security?

This eternal life in heaven is also referred to as our inheritance, since we are not in heaven yet, but we do have eternal life (really Christ uses the concept of “life”, we are no longer dying). We have the deed to a home in heaven, but we are not occupying that home yet.

Glad that you bring up "our inneritance". Let's examine what Scripture says about "our inheritance" in Eph 1;
13 And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit,
14 who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession—to the praise of his glory.

So, who are those who are sealed IN HIM with the Holy Spirit? Those "having believed". v.13

So, what is the Holy Spirit described as in v.14? A deposit for "our inheritance".

So, what does this deposit do? GUARANTEES "our inheritance".

So, WHEN does this guarantee occur? The redemption of those who are God's possession: ie, those sealed IN HIM with the Holy Spirit.

Another clear statement of eternal security.

The Hebrew writer in warns Christians in Heb. 12: 16 not to sell (give away) our birthright (inheritance) to our eternal life heaven, which we could do if it is really ours?

1. How can this verse be about getting rid of our inheritance when the Bible says it is GUARANTEED for the day of redemption?

2. Further, how can any recipient of eternal life perish, since Jesus Himself said that recipients of eternal life WILL NEVER PERISH?

Paul in Gal. 6: 8 Whoever sows to please their flesh, from the flesh will reap destruction; whoever sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life. 9 Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up. Explains very specifically that the harvest for Christians sowing after the spirit is “eternal life” and then goes on to say the if we give up (give it up) we will not have the harvest of eternal life.

I repeat the 2 questions above.

 

[FreeGrace2]

We will receive eternal life at the end of a fruitful life of holiness, in which we will inherit eternal life.

What we receive at the end of our lives is eternity itself.

Jesus told us WHEN one receives the gift of eternal life; WHEN one believes in Him, in John 5:24 - “Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life.

What is clear is that those who believe HAVE eternal life. That means they RECEIVE it WHEN they FIRST believed.

So, in John 10:28, Jesus promised that recipients of eternal life WILL NEVER PERISH.
"I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand."

There are NO CONDITIONS for recipients of eternal life for the promise of never perishing.

Yet, your opinion is that there ARE conditions to be met, and that some recipients of eternal life MAY perish.

Which is totally AGAINST what Jesus promised.

Your views are on the wrong side of Scripture.

We have God's eternal life in us right now. And we will experience eternity itself when we die physically.

Or, as Paul said it, "face to face with the Lord".

There is nothing in this post that can be refuted by Scripture. But everything can be denied. That is your choice.

 

[bling]

Where does Scripture say anything about recipients of eternal life having the ability to "do anything" they wish with the gift. It is life itself that He gives. Can eternal life be killed? That would deny the very meaning of "eternal", right?

That is part of the definition of a “gift given” to you, it is yours; you now own it. I did not say you “kill” it, but satan is very willing to accept your eternal life in heaven from you.

So, what He gives believers is God's life, which is eternal. So there is NOTHING any recipient can do that removes or eliminates or kills that life.

Where does it say: “God's life”?

The Bible does not say: “There is nothing you can do about it”, since it is yours.

Jesus was clear: recipients of eternal life will NEVER PERISH. How is that not a guarantee of eternal security?

Eternal life means you will not perish, but Christ did not say: “if you give up the gift and no longer have eternal life you will not perish”.

Glad that you bring up "our inneritance". Let's examine what Scripture says about "our inheritance" in Eph 1;
13 And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit,
14 who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession—to the praise of his glory.

So, who are those who are sealed IN HIM with the Holy Spirit? Those "having believed". v.13

So, what is the Holy Spirit described as in v.14? A deposit for "our inheritance".

So, what does this deposit do? GUARANTEES "our inheritance".

So, WHEN does this guarantee occur? The redemption of those who are God's possession: ie, those sealed IN HIM with the Holy Spirit.

Another clear statement of eternal security.

Having the indwelling Holy Spirit is our assurance (guarantee) of all Christ’s other promises being fulfilled including the promise of eternal life, but as Paul explains elsewhere we can “quench” that Spirit and do what we want.

1. How can this verse be about getting rid of our inheritance when the Bible says it is GUARANTEED for the day of redemption?

The Spirit is our guarantee and we can quench the Spirit.

2. Further, how can any recipient of eternal life perish, since Jesus Himself said that recipients of eternal life WILL NEVER PERISH?

If you have the gift and did not give the gift of eternal life away you will not perish.

I repeat the 2 questions above.

The same answer as above and as you can see you can give your eternal life away (give up).

 

[FreeGrace2]

I did not say you “kill” it, but satan is very willing to accept your eternal life in heaven from you.

My response was about how one might "lose" eternal life; by killing the life. Which, of course, would be ridiculous.

Secondly, why suggest that anyone is able to give their eternal life to satan? What text leads to such a conclusion?

Where does it say: “God's life”?

You mean you don't believe that God is eternal life??

1 John 5:20 - We know also that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true. And we are in him who is true by being in his Son Jesus Christ. He is the true God and eternal life.

Eternal life means you will not perish, but Christ did not say: “if you give up the gift and no longer have eternal life you will not perish”.

He clearly MEANT that by His UNCONDITIONAL PROMISE. Recipients of eternal life will never perish.

How can anyone NOT see that there are NO CONDITIONS for any recipient of eternal life to not perish??

Having the indwelling Holy Spirit is our assurance (guarantee) of all Christ’s other promises being fulfilled including the promise of eternal life, but as Paul explains elsewhere we can “quench” that Spirit and do what we want.

Please explain from Scripture that quenching the Spirit means He is removed from being in the believer.

In fact, Eph 1:13,14 PREVENTS such a notion. He has been given as a deposit which guarantees our inheritance for the day of redemption.

If the Spirit can be removed, then Paul COULD NOT HAVE made such a promise.

The Spirit is our guarantee and we can quench the Spirit.

If quenching means removal of the Spirit, then He is NO GUARANTEE at all. Just empty words.

If you have the gift and did not give the gift of eternal life away you will not perish.

This is fallacious. As if the gift can be given away. What text in Scripture indicates such a thing?

The same answer as above and as you can see you can give your eternal life away (give up).

I see NO SUCH verse in the Bible about giving away the gift of eternal life.

btw, if that were true, then Jesus would have promised this in John 10:28 -
"I give them eternal life, and IF they do NOT give it away, they will never perish."

DId you notice He never said that?

In fact, He gave NO CONDITIONS to recipients of eternal life about never perishing.

Therefore, never perishing is promised to all who are recipients of eternal life.

 

[corinth77777]

ITs possible, that Eternal life is speaking about the quality of life that come forth from God.
in John...