Least Vaccinated States Lead Spike in Children’s Cases -- 30,000 went to hospital in 1 month

RestoreTheJoy

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Humans are notoriously terrible at evaluating risks. I would not leave these decisions up to free choice for that reason alone.
Actually, they are pretty good at it. Most of them manage to keep themselves and their children alive and thriving.

No one should ever mandate what someone ELSE has to do to his own body, in terms of requiring drugs/vaccines/or procedures.
 
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Halbhh

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Still wearing a mask here. It seems wise, since I am around a vulnerable person. I don't need the government to mandate it.

The problem is and always will be mandates, not doing things that we wish to do or decide are best for us.
Well, we have the commonplace mandate of burn bans (no open fires allowed) in very dry areas where wildfire risk is very high.

A mask mandate is similar. You are instructed to limit your own freedom temporarily, for the sake of other people.

That's also just like 1rst Corinthians chapter 8 (and Roman's chapter 14).
 
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ThatRobGuy

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Where there is risk, there must be completely free choice.

That's not how a society manages risk...it can't be, because we'd never have any safety initiatives if that were the case.

Medicine is NOT one-size-fits all.

The "medicine isn't one size fits all" sentiment is often a disingenuous attempt to claim that, because there are minute deviations from person to person, that it somehow equates to the notion that "there shouldn't be a standard protocol".

"One size fits the overwhelming majority" may be a more accurate way to put it.

For instance, there are a small percentage of people who are allergic to penicillin. So a doctor couldn't use the standard medicinal approach for treating a bacterial infection that they'd use the majority of the population.

That's very different than a person saying "I want to treat my meningitis with homeopathic remedies and herbal supplements, because all of our bodies are different after all"

Highlighting differences between humans at a micro level doesn't change the fact that, as a species, we're the same in 99.9% of ways at a macro level with regards to biomechanisms and biochemistry.
 
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RestoreTheJoy

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That's not how a society manages risk...it can't be, because we'd never have any safety initiatives if that were the case.



The "medicine isn't one size fits all" sentiment is often a disingenuous attempt to claim that, because there are minute deviations from person to person, that it somehow equates to the notion that "there shouldn't be a standard protocol".

"One size fits the overwhelming majority" may be a more accurate way to put it.

For instance, there are a small percentage of people who are allergic to penicillin. So a doctor couldn't use the standard medicinal approach for treating a bacterial infection that they'd use the majority of the population.

That's very different than a person saying "I want to treat my meningitis with homeopathic remedies and herbal supplements, because all of our bodies are different after all"

Highlighting differences between humans at a micro level doesn't change the fact that, as a species, we're the same in 99.9% of ways at a macro level with regards to biomechanisms and biochemistry.
We have NO safety initiatives that demand widespread medical invasion of bodies on every single person. We have seat belt laws, and "must be of age" laws, and other mostly reasonable restrictions.

But there's a lot of money still to be made here.

Minute deviations. What a way to spin it.

And trotting out the the fallacy that opposing mandates (not vaccines, but mandates) must mean you "want to treat meningitis with homeopathic remedies", is ludicrous; this conversation has veered far from the path of the logical vein in which I engaged.
 
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ThatRobGuy

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We have NO safety initiatives that demand widespread medical invasion of bodies on every single person. We have seat belt laws, and "must be of age" laws, and other mostly reasonable restrictions.

But there's a lot of money still to be made here.

This is one area where the right is going to need to take a consistent approach here.

They've defended the private/for-profit healthcare model on the grounds that incentivization breeds innovation. A sentiment I agree with in some ways. There's a reason why the US has more specialists and more up-to-date equipment, and some of the best cancer survival rates, and some of the best cardiac-related prognoses. The trade off with that is that our health care "lacks" in some other areas, like affordability, and having the ability to make sure everyone is covered.

...but that's delving into another topic, I digress...

People can't say on one hand "our private/for-profit model creates the best healthcare innovation in the world", and in the next breath, say "I don't trust the healthcare innovation because the company that made it has a profit incentive"

Minute deviations. What a way to spin it.

It's not spin, it's the truth.

There are slight differences between all of us as human beings, but overall, we're overwhelmingly similar with regards to our internal systems and how they work. We've all got the same organs, same digestive structure, etc...

Yes, human beings have tiny differences with each other (some people are allergic to nuts, some people are lactose intolerant, some go bald while other don't, etc...), but it's not like comparing two different species, where the differences are so great that it would warrant taking vastly different approaches to treating/mitigating the same pathogen or condition.

For instance, both Dogs and Humans can technically get heartworm from a bug bite, but it's extraordinarily rare in humans because our immune systems are different from that of a canine.

Or another example, many mammals can get rabies from exposure (like us, and certain pets), however some animals like possums typically don't due to them having a lower body temperature.

The differences from human to human aren't that vast.

Meaning, if the best way to prevent covid in one human to prevent/treat it is vaccination and antibody therapy, it's not going to be a case where the best way for another human to prevent/treat it is an anti-parasitic drug and vitamin C drip.
 
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RestoreTheJoy

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KCfromNC

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Like I said. We don't mandate anything for every person: Though each state and DC has vaccine requirements, every state and DC also allows for exemptions.
Actually, what you said was

"We have NO safety initiatives that demand widespread medical invasion of bodies on every single person."

Everyone who attends public school is certainly a widespread demand, on par with current covid vaccine initiatives. If you feel that nitpicking around the edges of the hyperbole makes your point seem reasonable, go for it, I can't stop you.
 
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RestoreTheJoy

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People can't say on one hand "our private/for-profit model creates the best healthcare innovation in the world", and in the next breath, say "I don't trust the healthcare innovation because the company that made it has a profit incentive"



...

There are slight differences between all of us as human beings, but overall, we're overwhelmingly similar with regards to our internal systems and how they work. We've all got the same organs, same digestive structure, etc...

....

Meaning, if the best way to prevent covid in one human to prevent/treat it is vaccination and antibody therapy, it's not going to be a case where the best way for another human to prevent/treat it is an anti-parasitic drug and vitamin C drip.

No, but they CAN say that they don't trust some politicized, rushed brand new technology when the messaging is all over the place and people have died without and with the injection. And many are saying that; others are not. Leave people alone.

Your second assertion is simply false. One may do well with the injection, and never get sick. Another may do well without the injection and never get sick. Once ill, one may do well with one treatment - or another- while another dies from the same tactic. Anyone that treats humans as "one-size-fits-all" should not be in contact with patients.
 
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RestoreTheJoy

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Actually, what you said was

"We have NO safety initiatives that demand widespread medical invasion of bodies on every single person."

Everyone who attends public school is certainly a widespread demand, on par with current covid vaccine initiatives. If you feel that nitpicking around the edges of the hyperbole makes your point seem reasonable, go for it, I can't stop you.
Again...." every single person" doesn't take it and its none of your business, nor has it ever been. There are millions of home schoolers as well, and they have various perspectives on this.
 
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BNR32FAN

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30,000 children into hospitals with Delta in August (just the 1 month alone).

That's before any spike from schools starting...

Least Vaccinated States Lead Spike in Children’s Cases, Leaving Some Hospitals Stretched
"Just as millions of families around the United States navigate sending their children back to school at an uncertain moment in the pandemic, the number of children admitted to the hospital with Covid-19 has risen to the highest levels reported to date. Nearly 30,000 of them entered hospitals in August.

Pediatric hospitalizations, driven by a record rise in coronavirus infections among children, have swelled across the country, overwhelming children’s hospitals and intensive care units in states like Louisiana and Texas."

Children remain markedly less likely than adults, especially older adults, to be hospitalized or die from Covid-19. But the growing number of children entering the hospital, however small compared with adults, should not be an afterthought, experts say, and should instead encourage communities to take on more efforts to protect their youngest residents.

“It should concern us all that hospitalizations — indicators of severe illness — are rising in the pediatric population, when there are a lot of steps we could take to prevent many of these hospitalizations,”
...

Least Vaccinated States Lead Spike in Children’s Cases, Leaving Some Hospitals Stretched

Schools here in Texas started mid August. Since school has started I’m receiving 2 emails a week saying my child has been in close contact with a person who has tested positive for COVID. My daughter caught it the week before last and I caught it from her last week.
 
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KCfromNC

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Again...." every single person" doesn't take it and its none of your business, nor has it ever been.
It is when they start infecting friends and family - or on topic for the thread, their children - and clogging up the medical system with preventable serious cases. Part of being accepted in public is acceptable behavior.
 
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BNR32FAN

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30,000 children into hospitals with Delta in August (just the 1 month alone).

That's before any spike from schools starting...

Least Vaccinated States Lead Spike in Children’s Cases, Leaving Some Hospitals Stretched
"Just as millions of families around the United States navigate sending their children back to school at an uncertain moment in the pandemic, the number of children admitted to the hospital with Covid-19 has risen to the highest levels reported to date. Nearly 30,000 of them entered hospitals in August.

Pediatric hospitalizations, driven by a record rise in coronavirus infections among children, have swelled across the country, overwhelming children’s hospitals and intensive care units in states like Louisiana and Texas."

Children remain markedly less likely than adults, especially older adults, to be hospitalized or die from Covid-19. But the growing number of children entering the hospital, however small compared with adults, should not be an afterthought, experts say, and should instead encourage communities to take on more efforts to protect their youngest residents.

“It should concern us all that hospitalizations — indicators of severe illness — are rising in the pediatric population, when there are a lot of steps we could take to prevent many of these hospitalizations,”
...

Least Vaccinated States Lead Spike in Children’s Cases, Leaving Some Hospitals Stretched

Most children are too young to qualify for vaccination.
 
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But the overall vaccination rate trend at least hints at how vaccinations help prevent community spread.
If I could winner this a million times I would.
 
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BNR32FAN

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It's unfortunate...

People who oppose vaccination, or are trying to portray covid as "no big deal for kids", have created this false dichotomy where they portray it as the outcomes either being "death" or "mild sniffles", and since the death rates are are infinitesimally low for people under 25, that doesn't mean the outcome for everyone else in that age group will be "mild sniffles"

My state of Ohio is a great example.

When you look at the morality rate of covid for that age group, it's next to nothing. There have been fewer than 40 deaths among people under 25 from the disease in my state. However, when you expand "negative effects" to look at hospitalizations, it tells a different story. There have been over 5,000 hospitalizations from covid among people < 25. Sure, most don't die, but it's safe to assume that if you're admitted to the hospital, you're having a pretty bad time.

It'd be kind of like saying "the risk of dying from severing your pinky with a saw is almost non-existent for a young healthy person...therefore, there's no risk of a 14 year old playing with the table saw"

Vaccinations for people under 18 has just recently been available so a lot of people are still skeptical about giving their children the vaccine since it’s still in the very early experimental stage.
 
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Halbhh

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Schools here in Texas started mid August. Since school has started I’m receiving 2 emails a week saying my child has been in close contact with a person who has tested positive for COVID. My daughter caught it the week before last and I caught it from her last week.
Any of y'all vaccinated? We had a friend that visits us often that got Covid last year (before any of us vaccinated), but we were always meeting outdoors or wearing masks if going indoors, and we didn't get it from her even though she visited us around that time. Also, a neighbor's kid in high school got it recently, but she is vaccinated. So far, that school is still continuing without shutting down, and they have a everyone-always-wears-mask rule in that school.
 
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Any of y'all vaccinated? We had a friend that visits us often that got Covid last year, but we were always meeting outdoors or wearing masks if going indoors, and we didn't get it from her even though she visited us around that time. Also, a neighbor's kid in high school got it, but she is vaccinated.
I have been vaccinated since the end of March ( took my second shot on March 31st. I had also had the virus three months prior shortly before Christmas.
 
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