Lack of finances=lack of faith?

Is not having money or having little money a sign of weak faith or no faith?

  • No, money has no bearing on who you are as a Christian

  • No, the poorer actually have a deeper faith than the rich

  • Yes, weak faith.

  • If you are a real Christian you cannot be poor.


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Knight

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All things are possible provided it is Gods will that they happen. God's will is the one thing missing from your equation. Whatever we ask, according to His will, will be given. Christ knew this as well.

Luke 22:42
42"Father, if you are willing, take this cup from me; yet not my will, but yours be done."
 
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TheScottsMen

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Knight said:
All things are possible provided it is Gods will that they happen. God's will is the one thing missing from your equation. Whatever we ask, according to His will, will be given. Christ knew this as well.

Luke 22:42
42"Father, if you are willing, take this cup from me; yet not my will, but yours be done."


I am not doing any type of equation. The bible is not an equation but a living thing. Gods WILL is in Gods WORD (LOGOS) THE BIBLE! To know if one is in Gods WILL is to read what the word say.
 
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TheScottsMen

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TheScottsMen said:
I am not doing any type of equation. The bible is not an equation but a living thing. Gods WILL is in Gods WORD (LOGOS) THE BIBLE! To know if one is in Gods WILL is to read what the word say.

Also; you stated about Jesus in the Garden:

42"Father, if you are willing, take this cup from me; yet not my will, but yours be done."

Let us read this. Jesus ends with "yet not my will". Then whos will was it? Jesus must have known WHAT the will of GOD is to say that. "but yours be done." Jesus KNEW God the Fathers will. Just as again, ALL those that have gone through the conversion, or born again experience do. We know it through the LIVING WORDS, the LOGOS, The Bible. Gods WORD, THE LOGOS, THE BIBLE tells us those that are in christ shall lay hands on the sick and they shall be healed. THIS IS THE WILL OF GOD. If you deny this, you deny the word, the scripture, the bible!

Let God be true and every man a liar!
 
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TheScottsMen

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jeffthefinn said:
Then tell us why everyone is not healed?
Jeff the Finn

Either Gods a liar, or its faith.

Which do you think?

Do you believe God will heal you? Do you believe? If you do, then as Jesus says, let this be done so you joy may be full.
 
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Knight

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Andrew said:
not true.

Care to explain what you mean?

Paul wrote about his "thorn in the flesh." I believe that is what jeff was referring to. I've heard theories that this thorn was not necessarily physical. Is this what you were referring to?
 
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TheScottsMen

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<It is neither, sometimes healing does not happen, Did St Paul lack faith? He was not healed. You leave out The Lord, and think that he is a genie that grants whatever you think is good, but thank God he does not do that.
Jeff the Finn>

First off, the verse you are looking for is

2Co 12:7 And by reason of the exceeding greatness of the revelations, that I should not be exalted overmuch, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, a messenger of Satan to buffet me, that I should not be exalted overmuch.
2Co 12:8 Concerning this thing I besought the Lord thrice, that it might depart from me.
2Co 12:9 And he hath said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my power is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my weaknesses, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.
2Co 12:10 Wherefore I take pleasure in weaknesses, in injuries, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses, for Christ's sake: for when I am weak, then am I strong.

So just what did the Lord mean when he said his grace was sufficient for Paul? Did the Lord say to stay infected by this devil? No, he says his grace was sufficient. So what is grace?

Grace is something that you do not earn, nor do your deserve. It is what was given to us by Christ on the cross. Through grace we are saved by faith. Through faith we are able to use the name of Christ in prayer.

But lets look at using the name of Christ for our desires a little better.

First off, when it comes to infirmites, viruses, money, whatever, are suppose to have a care in the world about these things? NO. We are to cast them on the Lord.

1Pe 5:7 casting all your anxiety upon him, because he careth for you.

We are NOT to be worried or anxious about ANYTHING. Including money or disease.

Phi 4:6 In nothing be anxious; but in everything by prayer and supplication(request) with thanksgiving let your requests be made known unto God.

So then, what are we to do when problems arise?

Mar 11:24 Therefore I say unto you, All things whatsoever ye pray and ask for, believe that ye receive them, and ye shall have them.


Mat 21:21 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Verily I say unto you, If ye have faith, and doubt not, ye shall not only do what is done to the fig tree, but even if ye shall say unto this mountain, Be thou taken up and cast into the sea, it shall be done.
Mat 21:22 And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, believing, ye shall receive.

there is no IFS, no ANDS, and no BUTS in this scripture. Is there?
But what about the will of God? We must be in the will of good to keep our prayers met. So what is to be in the will of God?

1Jo 5:14 And this is the boldness which we have toward him, that, if we ask anything according to his will, he heareth us:
1Jo 5:15 and if we know that he heareth us whatsoever we ask, we know that we have the petitions which we have asked of him.

So, how are we in the will of God? When his WORDS (The Bible, The scripture is WITHIN us, and we are WITHIN HIM! Then and only then are we able to receive our answers to our prayers.

Joh 15:7 If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ask whatsoever ye will, and it shall be done unto you.

"What if my desires are wrong?" Well why don't you get saved? Or if you are out of fellowship with God, then you need to repent. Those who are out of fellowship with God and those who are unsaved aren't going to be able to make Mark 11:24 work for them anyways. But a man who is saved and walking in fellowship with God has the right desires IN HIS HEART. You can't tell me a believers desires will be wrong if he is walking with God and keeping his flesh under subjection to his RECREATED, HUMAN, SPIRIT. A Christian is suppose to crucify the flesh. But in Mark 11:24, God is talking about the desires of the heart (spirit). We must realize that it is God's will that ALL OF our needs be met - Spirtual, Physical, financial or material.

Though we do not live under the Old Testament, we can understand more about the nature of God by studying the Old Testament. In the OT God promised more to his people then just spirtual things, but he promised them that if they would obey him, they would PROSPER financially and materially ( Deut 28:1-14)

God has given us EVERY provision for us for every area of our lives. He told his people in the Old Testament if they would obey them they would eat of the good of the land (Deut 28:1-14 Isa 1:19) The phrase "the good of the land" carries the implication that God's people are to PROSPER materially.

The Lord said that He would give good gifts to His children (Matt 7:11). Our heavenly Father is concenred about us ( I Peter 5:7) and in Mark 11:24 he is talking about the desires of our hearts and how to receive them.

All things must be ASKED in Jesus name. This is the key to ALL New Testament prayers. OT prayers were not through Jesus name nor did man have access to Gods throne room as we do now through our great high priest, Jesus.

Joh 16:23 And in that day ye shall ask me no question. Verily, verily, I say unto you, if ye shall ask anything of the Father, he will give it you in my name.
Joh 16:24 Hitherto have ye asked nothing in my name: ask, and ye shall receive, that your joy may be made full.

"... that your joy may be full". This applies to everything in your life! Including spiritual and material! For instance, how in the world could your joy be full if you are laying in bed sick? If your rent is not paid? If collection groups are calling you every day demanding money? Are these problems to big or to small for God to fix? Is God willing to heal your cancer but not pay your bills? Why are you limiting Gods work in your life?

Mat 6:33 But seek ye first his kingdom, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.

ALL THINGS SHALL BE ADDED TO US when we seek the Kingdom of God. Each and EVERY Born Again spirit filled Christian has the Kingdom of God within them!

Rom 14:17 for the kingdom of God is not eating and drinking, but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit.

Luk 17:21 neither shall they say, Lo, here! or, There! for lo, the kingdom of God is within you.

Amen
 
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SnuP

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jeffthefinn said:
The huge problem with that view is it treats God as some sort of genie and nothing more. Where is the Be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind? Where is the concern to do the Lord's Will?
Jeff the Finn

It is by the renewing of our mind that we make way for God's blessing and provision. It is by abiding in His will that we find Jahovah Jirah. The reason that people don't get healed is because some aspect of their flesh is standing between them and God. The same aplies to finances. When you learn to look to God as your provision, then He becomes that provision, not before. These are all heart issues.
 
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SnuP

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TheScottsMen said:
Either Gods a liar, or its faith.

Which do you think?

Do you believe God will heal you? Do you believe? If you do, then as Jesus says, let this be done so you joy may be full.

More often times then not, the acctuall reason why someone can't get healed is because they cannot recieve from God, usually because of a love deficit.
 
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Photini

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Hm...I wanted to vote, but don't see a response up there that I would select. I would say money should not have bearing on your faith as a Christian. It seems though that the more comfortable one is, the less likely or harder it may become to have your heart fixated only on God.
 
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look

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These apply only to Christians...

If your money has you, then you will be disobedient to God's will...

Wealth is given to those who make evangelism their top priority, Those who make the Kingdom of God FIRST PLACE...

Money makes an excellent servant, but it makes a terrible master...

A lack of understanding produces a wealth of misunderstanding...

Don't let your experience interpret the scriptures, let the scriptures interpret your experiences and then adjust accordingly...

Let the Lord be magnified, which hath pleasure in the prosperity of his servant.

mglisten.gif
If any man has ears, let him hear...
 
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water_ripple

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How 'bout NO. At least not for me. We always have a lack for finances and although this causes some difficulties, my faith in God does not lack. We perservere through the hard times and give thanx to God for the good. Money does not control or ruin my life. I have all the things I need, and more importantly the thing I love...my family. God has provided me with peace and deep relationships that I treasure. No material possesion could even begin to compare.

I feel I would be poor if I did not have faith in God and all the money I wanted. I don't feel poor because I trust in God and He fills me up. Things that are green and wrinkly do not fill me with peace. Only unease.
 
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SavedByGrace3

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GraftMeIn said:
What is so wrong with death of the flesh?

As a child I sat in a chair next to a hospital bed and watched my mother die. She suffered so badly that they had to drug her and knock her out. He could barely see, speak or hear. She was only 47. I was 13.
This was not the will of God by any stretch of imagination or twisted logic. It is never the will of God that one of His children go through such torture, to leave this world early in life, and leave a man a widower and a child without a mother. This happened 36 years ago. My children did not have grandmother.
A close friend had a stroke at the age of 46. He had been a system analyst with a fortune 500 company for many years. Now he cannot do anything for himself. He cannot use the computer or do 90% the things he used to do. His wife and family are deprived of the husband and father that once cared and nurtured them. Nothing good came from this. Nothing. They are troopers and are taking it all in the way a loving family should. But this is not the will of God for them.
There are so many things wrong with this commonly held concept that it is the will of God that we suffer unimaginable pain and sorrow and die young. It speaks of a twisted and warped image of God that in no way resembles the Jesus image we are told to hold to. It seeks to justify ones self at the expense of God.
 
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water_ripple

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I have witnessed the pain and suffering that is left over from the "death of the flesh". I've worked in nursing homes and tended to members of my family that were dying and watched them pass. This is an awful thing to see. Sometimes they have passed by clinging to life taking a struggling breath once every minute or so. Sometimes they pass quickly seemingly to just ceasse to be. And other times they speak on their death-bed of God and light birds, songs, smiles, and peace.

I have tasted this pain and confusion. Sometimes wrath consumes me. It interfers with my life. I still cannot let my cousin's suicide go. But, God is helping me every day.

Watching the deterioration of a person is a hideous event. It can sink the spirits and fill one with confusion and anger. It can fester the soul; it's happened to me. But, I trust in God's word that He has made a place for us free from suffering. I find some comfort here.
 
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Andrew

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I have seen my mother go thru tears and pain after the doc told her her stomach ulcer was cancerous.

I rem the dreaded phone call in the office, being told to come home straight away after work as she had something to tell all the children.

I rem standing in her room with my other siblings. I rem her on the bed with my dad hugging her as she broke the news to us.

My mother is a jovial person who laughs easily, I've never seen her so sad and distraught.

I rem how she dreaded the endoscopy, the pain she felt, the fears, the hopelessness, when that tube was stuffed down her throat,

I rem seeing her after 3/4 quarters of her stomach was cut out, I rem seeing her in the ICU, whispering weakly to me "water, water",

I rem her recovering in hospital for more than a month, hallucinating and fearful in the night, feeling the pain of the stiches,

I rem how the whole room stank when they had to clear her bowels, no dignity.

I rem how sad she was when she realised that she could not eat normally anymore, since she only has a quarter of a stomach left,

I rem the spasms and pain she would have to endure when she ate a little more than the little portion that she should eat...

Now, you tell me that is the will of God!? Stand before me, and I will give you the five-fold ministry across thy face!
 
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