Judge rules California's decades-old assault weapon ban violates Second Amendment

[ThatRobGuy]

I generally agree with your post, although I do have an issue with this part I quoted. What you show here is a few items on the paperwork that has to be filled out. However, there's also an electronic background check that happens after the paperwork is completed which is the ultimate decider of whether the person can legally make the purchase.

...the three things I mentioned are the things in an electronic NICS check that they run after the paperwork is completed.

- Criminal history records (felonies, some misdemeanors, certain drug offenses)
- Mental health records (if a person is involuntarily institutionalized)
- Protection orders

 

[Belk]

Yeah, I get what you mean there. But if something is written by someone who knows what they are talking about, and yet the reader of those words dismisses the words on the page as simply words on a page as if they are nothing more than that and have no meaning or truth behind them, it doesn't make what is written any less true.

Agreed it does not make it any less true. Likewise if the reader adds meaning that was never intended or otherwise misunderstands the message being conveyed it does not make it less true. However, it does make the persons understanding incorrect.

 

[civilwarbuff]

The bible by itself is just a book.

Actually it is a collection or series of books.

 

[Belk]

Actually it is a collection or series of books.

Fair enough. It is a compendium.

 

[civilwarbuff]

I sure hope I never go into surgery with a doctor that thought that while reading his books in college.

Maybe that's how flat Earthers got into their pickle.......

 

[civilwarbuff]

whom understands the knowledge, not the book.

I am scratching my head over who in the world believes any such thing?.......

 

[Aldebaran]

Maybe that's how flat Earthers got into their pickle.......

Their pickle as opposed to getting into NASA? Imagine a flat earther working for NASA, especially as an astronaut!

 

[Belk]

I am scratching my head over who in the world believes any such thing?.......

I agree. However getting some to acknowledge that books have to be interpreted to be understood seems an uphill battle.

 

[Aldebaran]

I agree. However getting some to acknowledge that books have to be interpreted to be understood seems an uphill battle.

Naturally a book needs to be interpreted, but if the writer was articulate enough, the reader would have no problem correctly interpreting what is written.
See? You just interpreted what I wrote, and I trust you did so correctly.

 

[Belk]

Naturally a book needs to be interpreted, but if the writer was articulate enough, the reader would have no problem correctly interpreting what is written.
See? You just interpreted what I wrote, and I trust you did so correctly.

Human language is host to a wide array of problems even among contemporary speakers of the same language. Did you ever play the whisper game as a child? Add complexities like multiple languages and different time frames and interpretation becomes very difficult even for specialists.

 

[Aldebaran]

Human language is host to a wide array of problems even among contemporary speakers of the same language. Did you ever play the whisper game as a child? Add complexities like multiple languages and different time frames and interpretation becomes very difficult even for specialists.

I see problems on this forum with language every day. It fuels plenty of arguments.

 

[civilwarbuff]

However getting some to acknowledge that books have to be interpreted to be understood seems an uphill battle.

Interpreted how?........can you explain what you mean in more detail than one/two sentences?

 

[Belk]

I see problems on this forum with language every day. It fuels plenty of arguments.

Exactly my point. We have difficulty in the here and now let alone trying to translate writings from a different millennium.

 

[Aldebaran]

Exactly my point. We have difficulty in the hear and now let alone trying to translate writings from a different millennium.

People have had that long to study it and compare the writings to each other to carefully interpret them.
If we dismiss writings from the past, then what's the point of reading? How is history passed down through the generations if we're not to believe what we read? How can history be learned from?

 

[Belk]

Interpreted how?........can you explain what you mean in more detail than one/two sentences?

Certainly. When humans read something there are multiple interpretations happening simultaneously. First our brains are taking stylized lines and converting them in phonetic representations that we translate into human speech. We are also translating the speech into an understanding of what the words are trying to convey. This whole process is very complex and fraught with errors that all human communications are prone to.


Does that answer your question?

 

[Belk]

People have had that long to study it and compare the writings to each other to carefully interpret them.
If we dismiss writings from the past, then what's the point of reading? How is history passed down through the generations if we're not to believe what we read? How can history be learned from?

Do not mistake me, I am not saying to discount them. But to claim we have such a good understanding that we are able to use them to interpret the future is... problematic at best. This should be readily apparent to anyone who looks at how poorly those who have attempted the feat up to this point have failed.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

It sounds like in the Czech Republic, just like in Switzerland, gun ownership isn't hooked in with an American-style libertarian ethos. It's more about national defense policy than a person's "inalienable rights".

Actually, much of the Czech gun culture is rooted in an individual right to personal self-defense, as well as "tyranny prevention"...primarily because they experienced two forms of tyranny, to a much more extreme level than us, and much more recently. (their experience with tyranny far exceeds what the US experienced under Great Britain, they just don't talk about it as much and don't try to use it to justify every policy they make like many conservatives in our country do) They were occupied by Nazis, and then immediately afterwards, Communists, and they weren't prepared to let it happen again. Nobody in our country alive today has every experienced a British occupation. There are several people still alive in the Czech Republic today who experienced both the Nazi and Soviet Occupations.

Like you said, Switzerland's gun culture is more about national defense, which is why they have mandatory military service and gun training, but the gun has to be locked up in the house, and the ammo is kept at the armory.

Czech Republic issuing concealed carry permits for self-defense would indicate that their gun culture tends to have some additional similarities to ours with regards to carrying a firearm for personal self-defense, separate from any sort of national defense initiatives.

 

[civilwarbuff]

Certainly. When humans read something there are multiple interpretations happening simultaneously. First our brains are taking stylized lines and converting them in phonetic representations that we translate into human speech. We are also translating the speech into an understanding of what the words are trying to convey. This whole process is very complex and fraught with errors that all human communications are prone to.


Does that answer your question?

Nope:......
speech

Definition of speech
1a : the communication or expression of thoughts in spoken words
b : exchange of spoken words : conversation
2a : something that is spoken : utterance
b : a usually public discourse : address
3a : language, dialect
b : an individual manner or style of speaking
4 : the power of expressing or communicating thoughts by speaking
Merriam-Webster

That is unless you read out loud to your self......

 

[Belk]

Nope:......
speech

Definition of speech
1a : the communication or expression of thoughts in spoken words
b : exchange of spoken words : conversation
2a : something that is spoken : utterance
b : a usually public discourse : address
3a : language, dialect
b : an individual manner or style of speaking
4 : the power of expressing or communicating thoughts by speaking
Merriam-Webster

That is unless you read out loud to your self......

I don't understand what you are trying to convey here. Are you claiming that when we read we are not converting the words into human speech?

 

[civilwarbuff]

I don't understand what you are trying to convey here. Are you claiming that when we read we are not converting the words into human speech?

Uh, maybe you do but I don't find it necessary. My lips don't move when I read......