John Nelson Darby - False Teacher/False Prophet?

Dorothea

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This guy along with others I'd read about and heard about, sound like false teachers during a time in history when much supposed "revelations" were happening in the UK and around that area. Here's some info on Darby:

John Nelson Darby

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A "particular interpretation of Christ's return ... was developed by an Irish Protestant, John Nelson Darby (1800-1882)." Darby saw a second coming of Christ, which he "believed would precede the time of troubles, or 'tribulation,' mentioned in several New Testament passages, [which] he called the 'secret rapture.' It would be perceptible only to the true Christians, both living and dead, who would be united with Christ and protected from the tribulation. This rapture could occur at any time, Darby felt, a belief which added a sense of immediacy to his message. The prophecies relating to non-Christians, such as the binding of Satan and the Battle of Armageddon, would occur later. Christ would come a third time and conclude the history of the world. Furthermore, Darby believed that no denomination could encompass all of the present and past Christians who would be caught up in the secret rapture; hence, he believed that the true church was a spiritual entity, not a physically perceptible structure. Finally, like many other nineteenth-century millenarians and nonmillenarians, Darby divided the history of the world into a series of eras, or 'dispensations.'" [1]
John Nelson Darby spread his beliefs while visiting the United States and Canada 1862-1877. "He was a very appealing speaker and also intolerant to criticism. At first he tried to win members of existing Protestant congregations to his sect, but met with little success. He then spread his end-times message to influential clergymen and laymen in churches in major cities without insisting they leave their denominations." [2]
"The foundation of the Darbyite message was that when evil is seen in society, Christians are to rejoice because that is a sign of the imminent return of Christ." [3]
The "very foundation of the Darbyite philosophy was a belief that all manifestations of the decay or degeneration of civilization were but further signs of the imminent return of Christ to 'rapture' His saints." [4]
"Geographically, the doctrine moved from its original foothold in the large cities of New York, Boston, Chicago, and St. Louis to the northeast and Midwest. Later it spread to the West and South, where it is very strong still. The doctrine is not taught in the liberal Protestant denominations but is taught in independent nondenominational and full-gospel churches and in some evangelical churches. Fundamentalist churches do not realize how relatively new the doctrines are." [5]
"The term 'fundamentalist' has replaced the term 'conservative' in common usage, and the prime division within Protestant Christendom is now held in the public mind to be one between 'liberals' and 'fundamentalists', all the latter being Darbyite in doctrine." [6]
"But what is this Darbyism? We need to go to the British Isles to trace its roots. John Nelson Darby (1800-1882) was trained at Trinity College in Dublin, but soon became dissatisfied with institutional Christianity and its various denominations. At the age of 28 he started a small association devoted to Christian evangelism, and that group grew quickly, soon starting a second branch in Plymouth, England. By 1930 the group was given the name 'The Plymouth Brethren,' and the association continued to grow to form a number of chapters.
"Darby began to develop his seven-age dispensationalism about this time. By 1835 he added 'secret rapture,' and had gradually added dispensations up to 1838. One can imagine the excitement during those years as these men worked on their theories--it must have seemed as if God had unlocked the secrets of the Bible to them. Yet even a superficial study of the Brethrens' proceedings reveals that their road was a very rocky one, full of dissension and acrimony. Napolean Noel's two-volume The History of the Brethren (Denver: W. F. Knapp, 1936), in fact, documents one of the most contentious histories imaginable for a Christian fellowship. It is easy to conclude that Darby ran his organization with an iron hand, and was ruthless when one of the Brethren contradicted him on a fine point of his system." [7]

Darby's System

Darby's "system eventually became known as 'dispensationalism,' although it is more properly described as 'seven age dispensationalism' to distinguish it from the biblical 'two age dispensationalism' that recognizes two 'ages'" (Mt. 12:32, Gal. 1:4, Heb. 6:5). The system itself hardly needs explanation due to its immense popularity in modern Christian circles In short it offers the following seven dispensations (Scofield Bible note on Gen. 1:28):
  • 1 - Gen. 1:28 - Innocence
  • 2 - Gen. 3:7 - Conscience or moral responsibility
  • 3 - Gen. 8:15 - Human Government
  • 4 - Gen. 12:1 - Promise
  • 5 - Ex. 19:1 - Law
  • 6 - Acts 2:1 - Church
  • 7 - Rev. 20:4 - Kingdom
"Darby divided the Bible into seven periods of time (dispensations) and eight ages. The present 'age' is not among them, it being unforeseen by Daniel and the rest of the Old Testament prophets and which is a great parenthesis inserted between the 69th and 70th week of Daniel. Advocates vary on whether the 'secret rapture' is to occur in the beginning, middle, or end of the 70th week."

"Darby's system provides for two tracks of salvation--one for Jews, and one for Gentiles. This had been the cause of another of the Brethren's internal battles, centering on B. W. Newton (1807-1899), who regarded this idea as a 'full fledged heresy.' Newton's voice would be echoed in our own era by modern theologian Bernard Ramm who wrote, 'The sharp division of the church and Israel, each going its own unique course through history into eternity is a remarkable piece of theological heresy.' Perhaps Darby had taken Rom. 11:26, 'And so all Israel will be saved,' out of its context--a passage intended to get Gentiles in Rome who had been treating Jews as second class citizens to understand through the olive tree allegory that God's glorious plan (the 'mystery' of Rom. 11:25) provided salvation for both Jews and Gentiles through Christ Jesus. Some of the Roman house churches were working at cross purposes with God by their treatment of the Christians of Jewish ancestry, and Paul wanted them to accept the Jews into their churches with the same love that they had for non-Jewish Christians (Rom 15:7)."

John Nelson Darby - SourceWatch

Darby supposedly had a vision of the Rapture and ideas he got. So did Joseph Smith. In fact, around the same time as Darby, Smith was around. Sounds like a crazy time.

Here is a podcast of the Orthodox view of this whole mess.

The Rapture Part 2 - The Man in Black Orthodox Podcast - Icon New Media Network
 

WaltonM

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Joseph Smith's beliefs were carried on in the Mormon church. And Mormonism is seen as outside Christianity.

Darby's beliefs were carried on in the Plymouth Brethren. So are the Plymouth Brethren a cult? Darby influenced Dwight Moody, a popular evangelist. Is Moody a cult leader? Is Moody Bible Institute a cult?

The answers are no, so I think there is a lot that is just plain wrong in that criticism of Darby. I know Darby didn't have visions. And he didn't teach two tracks of salvation.
 
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Dorothea

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The source I posted isn't from a biased (meaning my own faith's (Orthodox) site). This is common knowledge on him in basic websites from other Christian sects, it seems. It seems to me that he was a good talker. And what do you call a person who makes up their own interpretations of what the Bible is, then teaches it to others, and has a huge following on this erroneous understanding of the Scriptures? And he did have a real loathing for the Church Fathers, apparently. So, he thinks they are all liars, but he seems to know the Truth. Hmmm, I think I'd rather believe those who were taught by the Apostles then a man who detached himself from the Anglican Church and wherever else to get as far away from Apostolic succession as he could. Sounds like a charlatan to me, to be perfectly honest.
 
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WaltonM

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The source I posted isn't from a biased (meaning my own faith's (Orthodox) site). This is common knowledge on him in basic websites from other Christian sects, it seems.

My experience is that the Orthodox lump all PRotestants together. Since when do the Orthodox want to distinguish between Protestant beliefs?

and anyone can put up a website with incorrect information...

lots of bloggers have tried to critize Rick Warren because his books are popular. their criticism contains lots of false information.

does the Southern Baptist Convention put out materials against Darby? How about the Assemblies of God? Both denominations officially warn about Mormons...but not Darby...why is that?




It seems to me that he was a good talker. And what do you call a person who makes up their own interpretations of what the Bible is, then teaches it to others, and has a huge following on this erroneous understanding of the Scriptures?

If you are Orthodox, don't you just call that person a Protestant?


And he did have a real loathing for the Church Fathers, apparently. So, he thinks they are all liars, but he seems to know the Truth. Hmmm, I think I'd rather believe those who were taught by the Apostles then a man who detached himself from the Anglican Church and wherever else to get as far away from Apostolic succession as he could. Sounds like a charlatan to me, to be perfectly honest.

Like I said, the Plymouth Brethren has carried on Darby's teachings. Are they considered a cult? Do the Plymouth Brethren repudiate Darby?

The answer is no. Plymouth Brethren are evangelical Christians. Many evangelicals are dispensationalist. This board includes a subboard called dispensationalism, in the christian section.
 
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Dorothea

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I have not said they are a cult. I have not heard the priest on the podcast call them that. Just that he has erroneous teachings.

Anyway, I'm done with this thread. It was something I needed to get out after learning about him, and I don't want to continue arguing about it. The mods can close this thread if they wish.
 
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Frogster

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I have not said they are a cult. I have not heard the priest on the podcast call them that. Just that he has erroneous teachings.

Anyway, I'm done with this thread. It was something I needed to get out after learning about him, and I don't want to continue arguing about it. The mods can close this thread if they wish.

Point being,you can enjoy ALL the translations.:)
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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This guy along with others I'd read about and heard about, sound like false teachers during a time in history when much supposed "revelations" were happening in the UK and around that area. Here's some info on Darby:

John Nelson Darby

From SourceWatch


Jump to: navigation, search
A "particular interpretation of Christ's return ... was developed by an Irish Protestant, John Nelson Darby (1800-1882)." Darby saw a second coming of Christ, which he "believed would precede the time of troubles, or 'tribulation,' mentioned in several New Testament passages, [which] he called the 'secret rapture.' It would be perceptible only to the true Christians, both living and dead, who would be united with Christ and protected from the tribulation. This rapture could occur at any time, Darby felt, a belief which added a sense of immediacy to his message. The prophecies relating to non-Christians, such as the binding of Satan and the Battle of Armageddon, would occur later. Christ would come a third time and conclude the history of the world. Furthermore, Darby believed that no denomination could encompass all of the present and past Christians who would be caught up in the secret rapture; hence, he believed that the true church was a spiritual entity, not a physically perceptible structure. Finally, like many other nineteenth-century millenarians and nonmillenarians, Darby divided the history of the world into a series of eras, or 'dispensations.'" [1]
John Nelson Darby spread his beliefs while visiting the United States and Canada 1862-1877. "He was a very appealing speaker and also intolerant to criticism. At first he tried to win members of existing Protestant congregations to his sect, but met with little success. He then spread his end-times message to influential clergymen and laymen in churches in major cities without insisting they leave their denominations." [2]
"The foundation of the Darbyite message was that when evil is seen in society, Christians are to rejoice because that is a sign of the imminent return of Christ." [3]
The "very foundation of the Darbyite philosophy was a belief that all manifestations of the decay or degeneration of civilization were but further signs of the imminent return of Christ to 'rapture' His saints." [4]
"Geographically, the doctrine moved from its original foothold in the large cities of New York, Boston, Chicago, and St. Louis to the northeast and Midwest. Later it spread to the West and South, where it is very strong still. The doctrine is not taught in the liberal Protestant denominations but is taught in independent nondenominational and full-gospel churches and in some evangelical churches. Fundamentalist churches do not realize how relatively new the doctrines are." [5]
"The term 'fundamentalist' has replaced the term 'conservative' in common usage, and the prime division within Protestant Christendom is now held in the public mind to be one between 'liberals' and 'fundamentalists', all the latter being Darbyite in doctrine." [6]
"But what is this Darbyism? We need to go to the British Isles to trace its roots. John Nelson Darby (1800-1882) was trained at Trinity College in Dublin, but soon became dissatisfied with institutional Christianity and its various denominations. At the age of 28 he started a small association devoted to Christian evangelism, and that group grew quickly, soon starting a second branch in Plymouth, England. By 1930 the group was given the name 'The Plymouth Brethren,' and the association continued to grow to form a number of chapters.
"Darby began to develop his seven-age dispensationalism about this time. By 1835 he added 'secret rapture,' and had gradually added dispensations up to 1838. One can imagine the excitement during those years as these men worked on their theories--it must have seemed as if God had unlocked the secrets of the Bible to them. Yet even a superficial study of the Brethrens' proceedings reveals that their road was a very rocky one, full of dissension and acrimony. Napolean Noel's two-volume The History of the Brethren (Denver: W. F. Knapp, 1936), in fact, documents one of the most contentious histories imaginable for a Christian fellowship. It is easy to conclude that Darby ran his organization with an iron hand, and was ruthless when one of the Brethren contradicted him on a fine point of his system." [7]

Darby's System


Darby's "system eventually became known as 'dispensationalism,' although it is more properly described as 'seven age dispensationalism' to distinguish it from the biblical 'two age dispensationalism' that recognizes two 'ages'" (Mt. 12:32, Gal. 1:4, Heb. 6:5). The system itself hardly needs explanation due to its immense popularity in modern Christian circles In short it offers the following seven dispensations (Scofield Bible note on Gen. 1:28):
  • 1 - Gen. 1:28 - Innocence
  • 2 - Gen. 3:7 - Conscience or moral responsibility
  • 3 - Gen. 8:15 - Human Government
  • 4 - Gen. 12:1 - Promise
  • 5 - Ex. 19:1 - Law
  • 6 - Acts 2:1 - Church
  • 7 - Rev. 20:4 - Kingdom
"Darby divided the Bible into seven periods of time (dispensations) and eight ages. The present 'age' is not among them, it being unforeseen by Daniel and the rest of the Old Testament prophets and which is a great parenthesis inserted between the 69th and 70th week of Daniel. Advocates vary on whether the 'secret rapture' is to occur in the beginning, middle, or end of the 70th week."

"Darby's system provides for two tracks of salvation--one for Jews, and one for Gentiles. This had been the cause of another of the Brethren's internal battles, centering on B. W. Newton (1807-1899), who regarded this idea as a 'full fledged heresy.' Newton's voice would be echoed in our own era by modern theologian Bernard Ramm who wrote, 'The sharp division of the church and Israel, each going its own unique course through history into eternity is a remarkable piece of theological heresy.' Perhaps Darby had taken Rom. 11:26, 'And so all Israel will be saved,' out of its context--a passage intended to get Gentiles in Rome who had been treating Jews as second class citizens to understand through the olive tree allegory that God's glorious plan (the 'mystery' of Rom. 11:25) provided salvation for both Jews and Gentiles through Christ Jesus. Some of the Roman house churches were working at cross purposes with God by their treatment of the Christians of Jewish ancestry, and Paul wanted them to accept the Jews into their churches with the same love that they had for non-Jewish Christians (Rom 15:7)."

John Nelson Darby - SourceWatch

Darby supposedly had a vision of the Rapture and ideas he got. So did Joseph Smith. In fact, around the same time as Darby, Smith was around. Sounds like a crazy time.

Here is a podcast of the Orthodox view of this whole mess.

The Rapture Part 2 - The Man in Black Orthodox Podcast - Icon New Media Network
I don't think he is any different than the SDAs Ellen White or the JW's or the Mormons's Joseph Smith.
They all sound alike to me :)



.
 
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Keachian

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I don't think he is any different than the SDAs Ellen White or the JW's or the Mormons's Joseph Smith.
They all sound alike to me :)



.

They are all alike in their explicit denial of Christ's coming as tying up all OT prophecy.
 
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thereselittleflower

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Joseph Smith's beliefs were carried on in the Mormon church. And Mormonism is seen as outside Christianity.

Darby's beliefs were carried on in the Plymouth Brethren. So are the Plymouth Brethren a cult? Darby influenced Dwight Moody, a popular evangelist. Is Moody a cult leader? Is Moody Bible Institute a cult?

The answers are no, so I think there is a lot that is just plain wrong in that criticism of Darby. I know Darby didn't have visions. And he didn't teach two tracks of salvation.

While Darby got some things about Christiainty right, he got other things wrong.

This was one of them.
 
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It is a good translation.I enjoy mine.Behind alot of bibles there is a story.Liberals put together the NRSV,yet I enjoy it too,and so do alot of Catholics. It is even gender inclusive.:D

I like Darby's translation because he consistently attempted to use the closest English equivalent word to the Greek word. For example, the Greek word is translated as servant consistently in Darby's translation rather than the somewhat-misleading minister, servant, and deacon in other translations.
 
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I have not said they are a cult. I have not heard the priest on the podcast call them that. Just that he has erroneous teachings.

Anyway, I'm done with this thread. It was something I needed to get out after learning about him, and I don't want to continue arguing about it. The mods can close this thread if they wish.

You did, however, brand him as a false prophet. He did not make a single prophecy during his lengthy life, so the charge that he was a prophet, much less a false prophet, is erroneous, at best.
 
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Rev Randy

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Depends on if you're defining prophesy as foretelling or forth-telling. He certainly did the latter, and to great detriment of the Church.
QFT
False teacher would suit him better than false prophet.
 
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What Darby essentially did was revive 'Chiliasm' (look it up). He and C.I. Scofield gained such a voice in Evangelicalism that their teaching is the majority opinion in that movement. Doesn't make it right though; and it is surely the cause of much disagreement now.
 
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thereselittleflower

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What Darby essentially did was revive 'Chiliasm' (look it up). He and C.I. Scofield gained such a voice in Evangelicalism that their teaching is the majority opinion in that movement. Doesn't make it right though; and it is surely the cause of much disagreement now.

Not just revive it, but give it all sorts of twists and turns.
 
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pshun2404

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It is a good translation.I enjoy mine.Behind alot of bibles there is a story.Liberals put together the NRSV,yet I enjoy it too,and so do alot of Catholics. It is even gender inclusive.:D

Yeah in its attempt to avoid maleness it even has "orphans" being snatched from their mothers breasts. Real quality scholarship! Ophans would not have mothers but they did not want to offend people by saying "fatherless" Oi!
 
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pshun2404

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You did, however, brand him as a false prophet. He did not make a single prophecy during his lengthy life, so the charge that he was a prophet, much less a false prophet, is erroneous, at best.

True but because he spread false doctrine he is a false teacher.

Paul
 
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