John 15:9-17

[Xeno.of.athens]

If you keep my commandments you will abide in my love, said, Jesus. What does that mean?

 

[Gregory Thompson]

If you keep my commandments you will abide in my love, said, Jesus. What does that mean?

Jesus teaches to love, so if you continue to love, you will abide in it. God is love.

 

[truthisfreedom2019]

That all of the instructions that he taught were on how one should live, are love; either to God or your fellow man.

 

[ViaCrucis]

If you keep my commandments you will abide in my love, said, Jesus. What does that mean?

Our love of God, our love of our Lord, is not in empty words, but in lives of faithful action. Namely "Love your neighbor as yourself." As we are reminded by Paul, John, and James in different ways that the chief commandment, the commandment that subsumes all other commandments, is love; and that it is love of others. For, St. John writes, "If anyone says they love God but hates their brother, they are liars and the truth is not in them." And St. Paul says that the fullness of God's Law is summed up in the commandment, "You shall love your neighbor as yourself." And St. James reminds us that if we violate even the smallest commandment we have transgressed the whole of the Law; but in showing discrimination and prejudice we violate the royal law of love, "Love your neighbor as yourself.".

St. Augustine reminds us in his homily on 1 John,

"See what we are insisting upon; that the deeds of men are only discerned by the root of charity. For many things may be done that have a good appearance, and yet proceed not from the root of charity. For thorns also have flowers: some actions truly seem rough, seem savage; howbeit they are done for discipline at the bidding of charity. Once for all, then, a short precept is given you: Love, and do what you will: whether you hold your peace, through love hold your peace; whether you cry out, through love cry out; whether you correct, through love correct; whether you spare, through love do you spare: let the root of love be within, of this root can nothing spring but what is good." - St. Augustine of Hippo, Homily 7 on 1 John, 8

And St. Paul again reminds us in his first epistle to the Corinthians, that without love we have and do nothing--even should we speak all languages human or even angelic, even should we have faith great enough to remove mountains, even if we should sell all our belongings and give all to the poor and offer up our bodies to be burned in the fire. Without love, it's just noise.

The mark of Christ's disciples is that we love. Without love it is impossible to serve Christ and live as His disciple in this world.

So, if we have any affection for Christ, even as our Lord said to St. Peter, "Do you love Me?" We are to live in obedience to Him as our Lord, as He said to Peter, "Feed my sheep."

It is easy enough to say, "I love God" and then go on living idly and continue to sow injury against our neighbor, after all, didn't the hypocrites do this exact thing? Isn't this why Christ rebuked them and called them white washed sepulchers? Isn't this why our Lord Himself taught, "wide is the way of destruction"?

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

I am thinking that abiding in Christ's love is about living in love. One learns what living in Christ's love is and experiences it by obeying Christ's commandments.

 

[bling]

I am thinking that abiding in Christ's love is about living in love. One learns what living in Christ's love is and experiences it by obeying Christ's commandments.

Our Love does grow with use (experiencing God's Love), but can we do anything righteous without first have at least some Godly type Love, which is a gift from God (1 Cor. 13:1-4)

 

[Clare73]

If you keep my commandments you will abide in my love, said, Jesus. What does that mean?

Submission to Jesus is required for abiding.

 

[Guojing]

If you keep my commandments you will abide in my love, said, Jesus. What does that mean?

He means exactly what he stated there.

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

He means exactly what he stated there.

Do you think that not obeying his commandments means not abiding in his love?

 

[Guojing]

Do you think that not obeying his commandments men's not abiding in his love?

The more important question you should actually ask is, "Do you think Jesus was speaking to you, in that passage", given what he already stated in Matthew 15:24?

 

[Ligurian]

If you keep my commandments you will abide in my love, said, Jesus. What does that mean?

John 15 is all about abiding. The Greek word means continue, endure, stay.
The word for keep means to guard, hold fast, preserve, watch.

But the word for Commandment is singular, not plural.

John 15:10 If ye keep My Commandment ye shall abide in My love,
even as I have kept My Father's Commandment and abide in His love.

10 ἐὰν τὰς ἐντολάς μου τηρήσητε, μενεῖτε ἐν τῇ ἀγάπῃ μου, καθὼς ἐγὼ τὰς ἐντολὰς τοῦ πατρός μου τετήρηκα καὶ μένω αὐτοῦ ἐν τῇ ἀγάπῃ.

So... what was the Father's Commandment to Ιησους?
(Deuteronomy 18:18-19)

John 12:49 For I have not spoken from Myself: but the Father which sent Me, He gave Me a Commandment, what I should say and what I should speak.[50] And I know that His Commandment is Life Everlasting: whatsoever I speak therefore, even as the Father said unto Me, so I speak.

It's what Ιησους spoke to His Disciples:

(Isaiah 49:21, John 14:23-24, John 17:6-8, John 7:16-17)

John 14:23 Ιησους answered and said unto him, If a man love Me he will keep My words, and My Father will love him, and We will come unto him and make Our abode with him.

Keep the Commandment = Works

Jeremiah 31:15-17 A voice was heard in Rama of lamentation and of weeping and wailing, Rachel would not cease weeping for her children because they are not.[16] Thus saith the Lord: Let thy voice cease from weeping and thine eyes from thy tears, for there is a reward for thy works, and they shall return from the land of thine enemies.[17] There shall be an abiding home for thy children.
[18] I have heard the sound of Ephraim lamenting, and saying, Thou hast chastened me and I was chastened. I as a calf was not willingly taught: turn Thou me and I shall turn, for Thou art the Lord my God.[19] For after my captivity I repented, and after I knew I groaned for the day of shame, and shewed Thee that I bore reproach from my youth.[20] Ephraim is a beloved son, a pleasing child to me, for because My words are in him I will surely remember him. Therefore I made haste to help him, I will surely have mercy upon him, saith the Lord.LXX

Revelation 3:7-13 And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write: These things saith He that is holy, He that is true, He that hath the key of David, He that openeth and no man shutteth, and shutteth and no man openeth:[8] I know thy works. Behold, I have set before thee an open door and no man can shut it, for thou hast a little strength, and hast kept My word and hast not denied My name. ...[10] Because thou hast kept the word of My patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world to try them that dwell upon the Earth.[11] Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.

krateo = kratos; to use strength, seize or retain:--hold (by, fast), keep, lay hand (hold) on, obtain, retain, take (by).

I.o.w., hold on even tighter than you did when you had a little strength. This is what the last days require: hold on, and keep holding on.

 

[Ligurian]

Do you think that not obeying his commandments men's not abiding in his love?

John 14:21-24 He that hath My Commandments and keepeth them, he it is that loveth Me. And he that loveth Me shall be loved of My Father, and I will love him and will manifest myself to him.[22] Judas saith unto Him, not Iscariot, Lord, how is it that Thou wilt manifest Thyself unto us, and not unto the world?[23] Ιησους answered and said unto him, If a man love Me he will keep My words, and My Father will love him, and We will come unto him and make Our abode with him.[24] He that loveth Me not keepeth not My sayings; and the word which ye hear is not Mine, but the Father's which sent Me.

John 15:13-14 Greater love hath no man than this: that a Man lay down His life for His friends: ye are My friends, if ye do whatsoever I Command you.

 

[BBAS 64]

Good Day

Certainly part of a bigger context, a good work is IMHO is "The True Vine" by Murray.

Work info: True Vine: Meditations for a Month on John 15:1-16 - Christian Classics Ethereal Library

In Him

Bill

 

[Soyeong]

If you keep my commandments you will abide in my love, said, Jesus. What does that mean?

The Bible often uses the same terms to describe aspects of the nature of God as it does to describe aspects of the nature of God's law, such as with it being holy, righteous, and good, and it could not accurately be described as such if it were not God's instructions for how to act in accordance with those aspects of His nature. When we express aspects of God's nature through our obedience to His law, such as by doing what is righteous, we are expressing our love for that aspect of who God is, which is why there are many verses in both the OT and the NT that connect our love for God with our obedience to His commandments. So our love for God is not extrinsically related to His commandments such that what God values in obedience in general, but rather it is intrinsically related insofar as everything that He has commanded was specifically commanded for the purpose of teaching us how to love an aspect of His nature.

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

The Bible often uses the same terms to describe aspects of the nature of God as it does to describe aspects of the nature of God's law, such as with it being holy, righteous, and good, and it could not accurately be described as such if it were not God's instructions for how to act in accordance with those aspects of His nature. When we express aspects of God's nature through our obedience to His law, such as by doing what is righteous, we are expressing our love for that aspect of who God is, which is why there are many verses in both the OT and the NT that connect our love for God with our obedience to His commandments. So our love for God is not extrinsically related to His commandments such that what God values in obedience in general, but rather it is intrinsically related insofar as everything that He has commanded was specifically commanded for the purpose of teaching us how to love an aspect of His nature.

You make a good point here yet I wonder who the "us" might be when the scriptures are read because it is more than obvious that the Law was given through Moses to the people of God with Moses who heard God voice in the mountain and to their descendants. One might argue that Christians are descendants through Jesus Christ and their union with him by faith but if one applies that scriptural line of reasoning one must also accept the other elements in the same line of reasoning which point to the cessation of the law, perhaps referring to the ceremonial laws, and possibly to aspects of the national laws that applied to the ancient state of Israel. If one does that then your statements have considerable merit.

 

[Soyeong]

You make a good point here yet I wonder who the "us" might be when the scriptures are read because it is more than obvious that the Law was given through Moses to the people of God with Moses who heard God voice in the mountain and to their descendants. One might argue that Christians are descendants through Jesus Christ and their union with him by faith but if one applies that scriptural line of reasoning one must also accept the other elements in the same line of reasoning which point to the cessation of the law, perhaps referring to the ceremonial laws, and possibly to aspects of the national laws that applied to the ancient state of Israel. If one does that then your statements have considerable merit.

Yes, Galatians 3:26-29 directly connects being children of God through faith in Christ with being children of Abraham, heirs to the promise, and John 8:39, those who are children of Abraham are doing the same things that he did, which was being blessed by repenting from his wickedness and by expressing God's nature through walking in His way in obedience to His law and multiplying his decedents by teaching his children and those of his household how to live blessed lives through following his example in accordance with faith in the promise and spreading the Gospel that was made known in advance to him (Genesis 12:1-5, Genesis 18:19, Genesis 26:4-5, Deuteronomy 30:11-16, Galatians 3:8, Acts 3:25-26).

The only way for there to be a cessation of certain laws is if what they teach us about how to love God's eternal nature is no longer true, which is why all of God's righteous laws are eternal (Psalms 119:160). For example, in 1 Peter 1:16, we are told to have a holy conduct for God is holy, which is a quote from Leviticus where God was giving instructions for how to have a holy conduct, such as keeping God's Sabbaths holy (Leviticus 19:2-3) and refraining from eating unclean animals (Leviticus 11:44-45). So by following God's instructions for how to have a holy conduct for He is holy, we are expressing that holiness is an aspects of God's nature that we love, while those who refuse to follow those instructions are expressing that holiness is an aspect of God's nature that they do not love, which is why Jesus said in John 14:23-24 that those who love him will obey his teachings, those who do not love him will not obey his teachings, and that his teachings are not his own, but that of the Father. The only way that instructions for how to have a holy conduct as God is holy to cease is if God is no longer eternally holy, so those claim that those laws have ceased are denying that He is holy and are bearing false witness against Him by misrepresenting Him as not being holy.

If the authors of the Bible did not hold a concept of the category of ceremonial law that contains exactly the same set of laws as our concept, and the concept of which laws are ceremonial varies widely from person to person, then we would be misunderstanding the Bible by interpreting it as referring to a category that we had created, and any doctrine based off of a category that we had created would be creating our own doctrine, so it is important to establish that we have derived from the Bible an exact set of laws that belong to the category of ceremonial law, however, the Bible never lists that and never even refers to the category of ceremonial law.

There are any numbers of ways that I could categorize God's laws, such as based on which part of the body is most commonly used to obey/disobey it, such as with the law against theft being a hand law, but if I were to create my own doctrine out of a category that I had created, such as saying that hand laws have ceased, then I would be in error. I'm not denying that certain laws can arguably be described as ceremonial, just as certain laws can arguably be described as hand laws, but we should be careful not to create our own doctrine out of categories that we have created that have not been derived from the Bible.

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

Yes, Galatians 3:26-29 directly connects being children of God through faith in Christ with being children of Abraham, heirs to the promise, and John 8:39, those who are children of Abraham are doing the same things that he did, which was being blessed by repenting from his wickedness and by expressing God's nature through walking in His way in obedience to His law and multiplying his decedents by teaching his children and those of his household how to live blessed lives through following his example in accordance with faith in the promise and spreading the Gospel that was made known in advance to him (Genesis 12:1-5, Genesis 18:19, Genesis 26:4-5, Deuteronomy 30:11-16, Galatians 3:8, Acts 3:25-26).

The only way for there to be a cessation of certain laws is if what they teach us about how to love God's eternal nature is no longer true, which is why all of God's righteous laws are eternal (Psalms 119:160). For example, in 1 Peter 1:16, we are told to have a holy conduct for God is holy, which is a quote from Leviticus where God was giving instructions for how to have a holy conduct, such as keeping God's Sabbaths holy (Leviticus 19:2-3) and refraining from eating unclean animals (Leviticus 11:44-45). So by following God's instructions for how to have a holy conduct for He is holy, we are expressing that holiness is an aspects of God's nature that we love, while those who refuse to follow those instructions are expressing that holiness is an aspect of God's nature that they do not love, which is why Jesus said in John 14:23-24 that those who love him will obey his teachings, those who do not love him will not obey his teachings, and that his teachings are not his own, but that of the Father. The only way that instructions for how to have a holy conduct as God is holy to cease is if God is no longer eternally holy, so those claim that those laws have ceased are denying that He is holy and are bearing false witness against Him by misrepresenting Him as not being holy.

If the authors of the Bible did not hold a concept of the category of ceremonial law that contains exactly the same set of laws as our concept, and the concept of which laws are ceremonial varies widely from person to person, then we would be misunderstanding the Bible by interpreting it as referring to a category that we had created, and any doctrine based off of a category that we had created would be creating our own doctrine, so it is important to establish that we have derived from the Bible an exact set of laws that belong to the category of ceremonial law, however, the Bible never lists that and never even refers to the category of ceremonial law.

There are any numbers of ways that I could categorize God's laws, such as based on which part of the body is most commonly used to obey/disobey it, such as with the law against theft being a hand law, but if I were to create my own doctrine out of a category that I had created, such as saying that hand laws have ceased, then I would be in error. I'm not denying that certain laws can arguably be described as ceremonial, just as certain laws can arguably be described as hand laws, but we should be careful not to create our own doctrine out of categories that we have created that have not been derived from the Bible.

I see where you went with the ideas from your previous post. I do not agree with the theology expressed in your most recent post.

 

[Soyeong]

I see where you went with the ideas from your previous post. I do not agree with the theology expressed in your most recent post.

Please explain why you do not agree.

 

[Xeno.of.athens]

Please explain why you do not agree.

I am unwell today, it must wait until I am feeling better.

 

[Soyeong]

I am unwell today, it must wait until I am feeling better.

I'm sorry to hear that, I pray that you will get well soon.