• Welcome to Christian Forums
  1. Welcome to Christian Forums, a forum to discuss Christianity in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

  2. The forums in the Christian Congregations category are now open only to Christian members. Please review our current Faith Groups list for information on which faith groups are considered to be Christian faiths. Christian members please remember to read the Statement of Purpose threads for each forum within Christian Congregations before posting in the forum.
  3. Please note there is a new rule regarding the posting of videos. It reads, "Post a summary of the videos you post . An exception can be made for music videos.". Unless you are simply sharing music, please post a summary, or the gist, of the video you wish to share.
  4. There have been some changes in the Life Stages section involving the following forums: Roaring 20s, Terrific Thirties, Fabulous Forties, and Golden Eagles. They are changed to Gen Z, Millennials, Gen X, and Golden Eagles will have a slight change.
  5. CF Staff, Angels and Ambassadors; ask that you join us in praying for the world in this difficult time, asking our Holy Father to stop the spread of the virus, and for healing of all affected.

Jews before Moses: who were they what did they believe?

Discussion in 'The Kibitz Klub - JCC Fellowship Forum' started by Lycurgus89, Jul 15, 2020.

  1. Lycurgus89

    Lycurgus89 Mel Gibson's biggest fan

    49
    +17
    United States
    Other Religion
    Single
    Is it true that before Moses, the Jews worshipped Elohim as many gods, or was the worship of only One God present before Moses? When did Jewish polytheism become Monotheism?

    I had read a theory recently, that ancient historians knew Moses as Osarsef, a rebel from upper Egypt, who freed a bunch of slaves and lead them to take Cannan from the Philistines. Osarsef had been a priest in one of the great Egyptian cults, so to keep order in his ranks he systematized a new Law, based on what he learned as a priest, and this became the Pentateuch that would shape the nation of Israel.
     
    We teamed up with Faith Counseling. Can they help you today?
  2. public hermit

    public hermit social troglodyte Supporter

    +4,803
    United States
    Christian
    Single
    US-Others
    In his classic Old Testament Theology, Gerhard von Rad argues that the various tribes that eventually formed ancient Israel each had their own tribal god(s), but that YHWH eventually won out. It is interesting that we find the plural form elohim throughout the Hebrew scriptures. But, of course, it's conjecture based on certain assumptions about how religion evolves.

    Edit: Sorry, I just realized what forum this is. Mea culpa.
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2020
  3. timothyu

    timothyu Well-Known Member

    +4,220
    Canada
    Non-Denom
    Private
    Moses was a Levite, not a Jew. Come to think of it neither was Abraham.
     
  4. Dave L

    Dave L Well-Known Member Supporter

    +5,168
    United States
    Christian
    Married
    Abraham's slaves became his covenant seed through circumcision. At the time. Ishmael was his only circumcised relative. In time a huge family developed through his circumcised blood relatives who were mixed with circumcised non-relatives. But any not circumcised became disowned and expelled as a gentile by default.

    Some were faithful like Abraham. But Gradually the rest became enslaved to the law in order to physically control them until they served their purpose in bringing forth the Messiah. At that time, the unbelievers were excommunicated and placed under God's wrath until the end of time. While the believers remained Abraham's covenant seed and Israel under Christ.
     
  5. BrotherJJ

    BrotherJJ Member

    209
    +107
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    Abraham is where monotheism begins?

    God introduced himself to Abram as: ""I am El Shaddai"" translates = God Almighty.

    Abraham trusted/believed/worshipped one God.

    Onto the word Jew, I did a bible search (KJV) found the word Jew in 2 Kings, Esther, Jeremiah & Zechariah. Having said that, Abram is the origin of the Jew.

    Abram later called Abraham, begats Isaac, begats Jacob who has 12 sons. He gives each one a portion of land in Israel. Each son becomes leader/head of his Tribe.

    The offspring of Judah were called Judahites. In Revelation Jesus is called the Lion of the Tribe of Judah. Today, we call the territory that Jacob gave to Judah the West Bank.
     
  6. timothyu

    timothyu Well-Known Member

    +4,220
    Canada
    Non-Denom
    Private
    And 11 other tribes, all 12 including Jew through Jacob.
     
  7. TreWalker

    TreWalker Jewish Magen Am

    214
    +194
    United States
    Messianic
    Married
    It's not true that before Moses the descendants of Abraham Issac and Jacob worshiped many gods, or saw HaShem as a unity of many gods. Abraham was the first monotheistic believer in HaShem and all his children believed likewise. Yes, the worship of the One G-d was present before Moses, it's the heart and soul of Abraham's belief in G-d.

    Abraham was vehemently against any other gods but El Shaddai. His whole being was focused on the magnification of the One G-d, as opposed to a pantheon.

    I could understand Jews falling into polytheism in Egypt while they assimilated into the society for hundreds of years. But from it's inception with Abraham the Jewish people do not worship many gods. That is the antitheses of being a child of Abraham.
     
  8. Lycurgus89

    Lycurgus89 Mel Gibson's biggest fan

    49
    +17
    United States
    Other Religion
    Single
    Some of you are Christians... I thought this forum was where I ask Jews questions?
     
  9. tampasteve

    tampasteve ✡Messianic✞ Staff Member Administrator CF Senior Ambassador Angels Team Supporter

    +4,243
    United States
    Messianic
    Married
    US-Constitution
    ADMIN HAT ON

    This thread has been moved to a more appropriate forum. Please note that the OP is requesting answers from Jewish members, not other Christians.

    ADMIN HAT OFF
     
  10. tampasteve

    tampasteve ✡Messianic✞ Staff Member Administrator CF Senior Ambassador Angels Team Supporter

    +4,243
    United States
    Messianic
    Married
    US-Constitution
    The other forum was not intended for Christians to respond, but it also was not quite what you were looking for. I moved the thread to a better forum. :)
     
  11. BrotherJJ

    BrotherJJ Member

    209
    +107
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private

    Joshua 24:2And Joshua said unto all the people, Thus saith the LORD God of Israel, Your fathers dwelt on the other side of the flood in old time, """even Terah, the father of Abraham, and the father of Nachor: and they served other gods""".


    Abrahams father Terah & his brother Nachor served other gods.
     
  12. Lycurgus89

    Lycurgus89 Mel Gibson's biggest fan

    49
    +17
    United States
    Other Religion
    Single
    Maybe I should ask, when did God first reveal himself to be the only One God? I remember Exodus pretty well, some of the kingdom years stories and prophets, but correct me if I'm wrong the Israelites never let go of their polytheism until coming back from Babylon, several centuries later.
     
  13. TreWalker

    TreWalker Jewish Magen Am

    214
    +194
    United States
    Messianic
    Married
    Me too.
     
  14. TreWalker

    TreWalker Jewish Magen Am

    214
    +194
    United States
    Messianic
    Married
    Abraham
     
  15. TreWalker

    TreWalker Jewish Magen Am

    214
    +194
    United States
    Messianic
    Married
    Abraham did not.
     
  16. Lycurgus89

    Lycurgus89 Mel Gibson's biggest fan

    49
    +17
    United States
    Other Religion
    Single
    Between Abraham and the Babylonian Exile, did the Israelites spend more years in monotheism or polytheism?
     
  17. ChavaK

    ChavaK להיות טוב ולעשות טוב

    +1,424
    United States
    Judaism
    Widowed
    US-Republican
    Unfortunately Jews can't post on the other forum. I don't think Jews can answer questions here either.
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2020
  18. TreWalker

    TreWalker Jewish Magen Am

    214
    +194
    United States
    Messianic
    Married
    The purpose and goal of Judaism is monotheism, but I think we both know that Israel wandered far and wide in their faithfulness to G-d throughout the years.

    After going down into Egypt eventually the descendants of Abraham mostly assimilated into the culture and did forget about the relationship they had through their forefathers with the G-d of Abraham Issac and Jacob. Until Moses. This is why our sages say Israel took the long route to the promised land, because of the idolatry and continual complaining.

    And of course once in the land they still didn't maintain complete faith throughout their generations. Some more than others. But I don't believe it can be said that since they at times whole heartedly followed other gods that as a whole Israel is polytheistic more than monotheistic.
     
Loading...