Jesus was pro-abortion....

[JesusFreak4545]

What? That's news to you! "[O]ne thing I know from the Bible is that Jesus was not against women having a choice in continuing a pregnancy. Jesus was for peace on earth, justice on earth, compassion on earth, mercy on earth, and choice on earth," Rev. Mark Bigelow told Fox News host Bill O'Reilly in a recent letter.

Unsurprisingly, Bigelow – pastor of the Congregational Church of Huntington in Centerport, N.Y., an affiliate of the United Church of Christ – serves on the Clergy Advisory Board for the Planned Parenthood Federation of America.
Click here to read the rest of the article.
Is anyone else as upset and outraged as I am from reading this?

 

[fragmentsofdreams]

Some people like to distort ideas like justice, mercy, love, and compassion in order to support their agenda. I must note that it happens on both sides.

 

[wildernesse]

Why should I be upset and outraged? I'm glad that there are clergy working with Planned Parenthood--more Christians should because everyone (women and men) needs to know about their reproductive health and making the best choices for their family.

Abortion is a last ditch effort--one that wouldn't have to be made nearly as often if people had access to adequate birth control and reproductive health education. Planned Parenthood provides much needed reproductive health information and healthcare--mostly discounted, which is great for people in poverty who often don't have access to adequate healthcare, reproductive or otherwise.

Providing adequate healthcare for those in need is something that I think Jesus would have been for.

--tibac

 

[seebs]

I know people who have gotten advice from Planned Parenthood on how to start having kids, and make sure their kids will be as healthy as possible; it's not as if it's a one-sided organization.

Given that Jews believed that you became a "person" at birth, I wouldn't be surprised if Jesus was at least *raised* that way. He never addressed the question directly.

 

[WildHeart75]

No way would Jesus have supported abortion. I am in complete disbelief that anyone would think such a thing. Apparently some people haven't been reading their bible and actually thinking about Jesus' words and how he said them or else you would see that He would not have supported such a thing.

He told us to keep the commandments, which includes "Thou shall not kill"

 

[DeputyDan]

I agree with Wildheart75 only for slightly differing reasons.

But still agree...............

 

[Texas Lynn]

Outraged? absolutely not. Inspired? Quite. The Dude hit it out of the ballpark with that one. he was 100% right.

Note the phrasing: "not against"! Antis, try if you like to find proof otherwise, but it isn't there.

Christ honored troubled young women when no one else would; it is an outrage how the wowsers of to day castigate them in his name. they have much to repent for on that score.

 

[S Walch]

Did they have abortions in Jesus' Day?

 

[Texas Lynn]

Today at 10:34 PM S Walch said this in Post #8

Did they have abortions in Jesus' Day?

Of course.  Mostly they were herbally induced.  The same local wise women who did midwifery generally did abortions as well.

Surgical abortion was rare until the 1950s because it was dangerous for the woman.  In the U.S. it was outlawed in the late 1900s as a part of the turf war between the newly emerging profession of physicians and traditional midwives.




 

 

[undead1]

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=29896 is the article.

Removed comment. -KC

 

[dnich163]

Don't agree at all that Jesus would have anything to do with abortion.
For me it is against creation, and consequently against God.

Jesus came to set us free, not to imprison us.

David

 

[Job_38]

Seeing that Jesus valued the life of children in many senarious, I doubt he would be for murdering them. Just a thought.

 

[jseek21]

I believe that the good reverend in that letter has some major soul searching to do.

Jesus NEVER gave ANY indication that he was pro choice. Our God is a just and holy God, but He is also a BALANCED God. He cannot go against Himself. God has shown through His Word that abortion is not only against his propositional revelation for man, but is absolute murder.

I was adopted. My birth mother was 17 when I was born. She had a choice. She chose not to kill me but loved me enough to give me to another family. I cannot thank her enough for this.

Maybe the good reverend should put himself in the position of the child in question. It's easy for me.

-Dr. Jonathan Morgan

 

[jseek21]

An emotional uneasiness about abortion, infanticide, euthanasia, and the abuse of genetic knowledge is not enough. To stand against the present devaluation of human life, a significant percentage of people within our society must adopt and live by a world view which not only hopes or intends to give a basis for human dignity but which really does. The radical movements of the sixties were right to hope for a better world; they were right to protest against the shallowness and falseness of our plastic society. But their radicalness lasted only during the life span of the adolescence of their members. Although these movements claimed to be radical, they lacked a sufficient root. Their world view was incapable of giving life to the aspirations of its adherents. Why? Because it, too-like the society they were condemning-had no sufficient base. So protests are not enough. Having the right ideals ' is not enough. Even those with a very short memory, those who can look back only to the sixties can see that there must be more than that. A truly radical alternative has to be found.

 

[Wasp]

3rd March 2003 at 11:35 PM wildernesse said this in Post #3

Why should I be upset and outraged? I'm glad that there are clergy working with Planned Parenthood--more Christians should because everyone (women and men) needs to know about their reproductive health and making the best choices for their family.

Abortion is a last ditch effort--one that wouldn't have to be made nearly as often if people had access to adequate birth control and reproductive health education. Planned Parenthood provides much needed reproductive health information and healthcare--mostly discounted, which is great for people in poverty who often don't have access to adequate healthcare, reproductive or otherwise.

Providing adequate healthcare for those in need is something that I think Jesus would have been for.

--tibac

Abortion is a last ditch effort???  If you follow the Bible's guidelines for life, it is clear, premarital and extramarital sex is a sin.  Pregnancy is a blessing, and it should be viewed as so, not an inconvenience.  Jesus would have been for murder?  If you have an doubt over whether a fetus is a person, read Psalm 139.  In addition, Jesus would have loved the sinner, but hated the sin.  Just because Jesus loves the person does not mean that he would condone their sinful actions.

Any minister or individual who thinks themself to be a christian and then supports abortion or Planned Parenthood should really evaluate their stance with Christ.

 

[jseek21]

"Abortion is a last ditch effort--one that wouldn't have to be made nearly as often if people had access to adequate birth control and reproductive health education. Planned Parenthood provides much needed reproductive health information and healthcare--mostly discounted, which is great for people in poverty who often don't have access to adequate healthcare, reproductive or otherwise."

First off, killing a child is not healthcare, it is murder.

Secondly, Planned Parenthood gets their money through abortions. That is how they pay their bills. This group is not giving birth control information in a right mindset, to prevent a person from getting pregnant. Hey, if they did that they'd be out of a job!

Read this: http://www.carm.org/abortion.htm

Now, to put on my angry eyes:

Abortion is NOT a last ditch effort. That is a lie from the pit of hell! Abortion is a quick and unloving way out of your sin. That's right, your sin. It is because of YOU that this child must die. Try this: if you don't want to get pregnant, DON'T HAVE SEX! Studies show that one in one people who practice abstinence will not get pregnant. WOW, isn't that amazing? Who would have thought?! Adoption is a last ditch effort, and much better and more loving than abortion. let's see, kill a child to cover your sin or let it live, hmmm....

Truthfully, abortion is just about the most barbaric, unsanitary, cruel, and morally and societarily degenerative idea I can think of.

-Dr. Jonathan Morgan

 

[Evening Mist]

Abortion is NOT a last ditch effort. That is a lie from the pit of hell! Abortion is a quick and unloving way out of your sin. That's right, your sin. It is because of YOU that this child must die. Try this: if you don't want to get pregnant, DON'T HAVE SEX! Studies show that one in one people who practice abstinence will not get pregnant. WOW, isn't that amazing? Who would have thought?! Adoption is a last ditch effort, and much better and more loving than abortion. let's see, kill a child to cover your sin or let it live, hmmm....

It is very easy to point your finger and make accusations. Very easy to kick the woman who is already down, isn’t it? Abortion is one of our great tragedies, but the sin took place long before any particular woman had sex, and the blame belongs to all of us.

We are all to blame. We have created a culture that does not support motherhood, and does not respect childhood. As long as women are herded through delivery rooms like objects on a conveyor belt, as long as children are abused, neglected, and overlooked, as long as families are treated scornfully for taking advantage of welfare, as long as people make rude comments about breastfeeding, as long as mothers are unreasonably expected to bear the brunt of childcare 24/7 and stay “sweet” through it all, as long as men get away with abandoning their families, as long as we value unrealistic “thinness” and “youthfulness” in the appearance of women, as long as deny gratifying employment to mothers and fathers, as long as the intelligence and the talents of little girls are overlooked and their role as sex objects is over-glorified, as long as women and children are exploited in every way, shape and form --- as long as all this goes on in our society, we can only blame ourselves for the consequences.

We all share the blame equally. Not only for the children who are lost, but the women who are scarred. The most damaging thing you can do is point your finger at women and heap responsibility for the sins of the world on their heads. We have all sinned, and in our sin, we have all played a part in the murder of our children.

 

[wildernesse]

Planned Parenthood is a non-profit organization that is committed to providing and advocating for reproductive healthcare for all. In 2000, its clinics served more than 2.6 million people.

According to its most recent annual report, the largest chunk of income was from its clinics--241 million dollars. The next two biggest chunks of income are 202.7 million from governmental grants and contracts and 189.5 million from private contributions. It's total revenue for fy 2001 was 672.6 million--so you see, these three groups are close to evenly divided.

So, Planned Parenthood gets most of its money from clinics? Well, what are the most frequent services at those clinics? Most of its clients (nearly 2 million women) received reversible contraception--in other words, prescriptions for the pill, barriers, etc. Over a million women were given pregnancy tests. And over a million women were given breast exams. These are the top 3 services of Planned Parenthood in 2000. The fourth is abortion--not even 200,000 women. So yes, while Planned Parenthood does get paid from abortions, it is not the bulk of their income. It doesn't pay the bills.

So it looks like jseek21 is incorrect when he says that Planned Parenthood wants women to be irresponsible so they can make money off of abortion--supplying birth control is their primary clinic business!

Planned Parenthood provides healthcare such as STD testing and primary care, usually at a discount. They develop sex ed classes and talk about AIDS prevention. They distribute condoms and provide vasectomies to men. They want people to make informed, responsible choices.

I think that providing healthcare and education to people, especially to low-income people who are traditionally denied access to adequate healthcare at any level, is something that is compassionate. I stand by my earlier statement that I think more Christians should work with Planned Parenthood.

Planned Parenthood Annual Report

Condemning women who have chosen abortion is not right. It is neither a Christian's place, nor the way to prevent further abortions.


--tibac

 

[Dewjunkie]

Good points, Evening Mist. I would also add that (as much as many hardline Christians hate to admit it) sin is sin. While abortion is (in my belief) murder, condemning women who have chosen it is not anyone's place. It's between them and God, just like a hypocrite will answer for their hypocrisy, or a liar will answer for their lies. I am not God, so I cannot condemn, but I am a Christian, so I must love them the same as Jesus would have.

As a father who has lost a child, the thought of women throwing children away sickens me. As a human, the thought of women killing children saddens me. As an adopted child, the fact my biological mother chose adoption makes me thankful. As a Christian, my faith commands me to love sinners the same as believers, and worry about the plank in my own eye before pointing out the sawdust in others'. I only wish other Christians would heed this fact of faith.

 

[jseek21]

Taking words out of context seems to be the best way to resolve issues here...

I never said it was only a woman's fault. Studies show that a man is just as responsible as a woman for a pregnancy. I am completely supportive of helping women, but also not harming children.

The view that all men are beating their wives and children and created chaos is not correct. It is however what we see in our culture. You are not going to turn on NBC Nightly News and see a story about Bob who is working to provide for his family and loves his wife and children. People don't want to see that. They want sensationalism. So we come to think that the bad men are the norm. This is not true. I know many people, and I don't know one man that fits in this catagory.

Secondly, I have talked with a women who formerly was the district manager for 12 planned parenthoods. I will try and find her testimony and post it here. It is absolutely horrid.

Lastly, everyone knows that an organization's own reports on itself are not always accurate. You must get your information from an unbiased, unaffiliated group.

-Dr. Jonathan Morgan