Jesus Christ / Joseph Smith

[Ironhold]

You reading a Wikipedia page is no substitute for actually asking Smaneck what she believes. Please don't reduce people to Wikipedia articles...

...especially when the Baha'i faith maintains its own official website.

 

[GracetotheHumble]

You reading a Wikipedia page is no substitute for actually asking Smaneck what she believes. Please don't reduce people to Wikipedia articles...

If you want information on the Missouri Synod I wouldn't be opposed to you going to the wiki page.

 

[GracetotheHumble]

...especially when the Baha'i faith maintains its own official website.

And the link to that site is on the wiki page.

 

[Jane_Doe]

If you want information on the Missouri Synod I wouldn't be opposed to you going to the wiki page.

I'd be opposed to looking at the wiki page to find out what GttH believes. That is, unless the page was written solely by GttH, and then I'd be okay reading it because it would be a primary source.

 

[drstevej]

I'd be opposed to looking at the wiki page to find out what GttH believes. That is, unless the page was written solely by GttH, and then I'd be okay reading it because it would be a primary source.

Assuming it was current. Sometimes our views change.

 

[Jane_Doe]

Assuming it was current. Sometimes our views change.

I agree with you there

 

[smaneck]

I know what's written here: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bahá'í_Faith

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bahá'í_Faith

You read a wiki article and that means you get to tell me what I believe about the Bible? Not!

And that's more than enough for me to know its wrong.

No one cares if you think it is right or wrong. You still don't get to tell me what I believe.

 

[FredVB]

It's simply a fact that the majority of New Testament scholars, both Christian and non-Christian, regard the Pastorals (sans Philemon) as later works, not written by St. Paul himself. That's not an attack, because regardless of whether they are authentically Pauline or not doesn't change the fact that they are Scripture and belong in the Canon--a place they have had for as long as the Church has been talking about a Canon.

An important thing to remember is there is basis to know what books are scriptures that are included with others, they are all under inspiration of Yahweh's Spirit. They don't have certain contradiction between them, even though controversial subject matter is addressed. They minister to believers reading them, for their relationship with God through Christ. They teach, even while the writers were not having clear understanding themselves in some things, with some parts unique in teaching, so that believers are guided in the right direction, and there is conviction to where we go the wrong way in something. The writers are generally recognized, though certainly in some of these cases there was a loss to the designation with the texts, and those writers were not remembered later. But of those that gave contribution to the new testament of the Bible they certainly were with close involvement with one or more of the Apostles. The manuscripts for testimony to the written books in the new testament are enough with some close to the generation in which new testament books were written. Over time those books stand up to tests to them. They are distinct in these things.

 

[Christian Apologist]

You know, it's good form to actually say something instead of just posting links, pics, or videos in an OP.

Heber C. Kimball stated: "The Holy Ghost is a man; he is one of the sons of our Father and our God" (Journal of Discourses, vol.5, p.179).

 

[FredVB]

Heber C. Kimball stated: "The Holy Ghost is a man; he is one of the sons of our Father and our God" (Journal of Discourses, vol.5, p.179).

I had heard or read the name before, I am sure. But I went to look up his name. He rose high in the hierarchy of the Mormon Latter-Day Saints, I can still see how when he was young he was quickly deceived and led along by feelings, which may be why the warming in the bosom is an important part of their conversion experience. In his leadership he took a number of wives, with feelings as basis for its rightness, and he gave his fourteen year old daughter as one of the wives for Joseph Smith.

The Spirit of God is not a man, God was eternally the self-existent being without limit, and never had started out as a man. Mormon beliefs as this about the Holy Spirit being a man and a son of the Father have no basis in the Bible and sharply disagree with statements in the Bible. Yahweh is the one and only true God, the Father, Logos the Word with God who is God and in the incarnation became the Son of God, and the Spirit of God are all that same one God, a single being, together. They work in unity and are never in disagreement. The redemption through Christ that was a mystery until it came is the only effective thing for anyone's salvation, which they have if they respond with repentant faith that God enables for that salvation, coming through Christ being reconciled to God and living in a new way through that.

 

[Christian Apologist]

I had heard or read the name before, I am sure. But I went to look up his name. He rose high in the hierarchy of the Mormon Latter-Day Saints, I can still see how when he was young he was quickly deceived and led along by feelings, which may be why the warming in the bosom is an important part of their conversion experience. In his leadership he took a number of wives, with feelings as basis for its rightness, and he gave his fourteen year old daughter as one of the wives for Joseph Smith.

The Spirit of God is not a man, God was eternally the self-existent being without limit, and never had started out as a man. Mormon beliefs as this about the Holy Spirit being a man and a son of the Father have no basis in the Bible and sharply disagree with statements in the Bible. Yahweh is the one and only true God, the Father, Logos the Word with God who is God and in the incarnation became the Son of God, and the Spirit of God are all that same one God, a single being, together. They work in unity and are never in disagreement. The redemption through Christ that was a mystery until it came is the only effective thing for anyone's salvation, which they have if they respond with repentant faith that God enables for that salvation, coming through Christ being reconciled to God and living in a new way through that.

 

[FredVB]

View attachment 285446

The Mormon Latter-Day Saints leaders went off in an extreme direction among the wider culture where they were with including polygamy, or more properly polygeny, though it seemed acceptable from some certain old testament Bible passages. But it must have had some influence on the wider culture for over a century, now secular society has more tolerance of a growing number of committed relationships in a living union of more than two persons.

 

[Ironhold]

The Mormon Latter-Day Saints leaders went off in an extreme direction among the wider culture where they were with including polygamy, or more properly polygeny, though it seemed acceptable from some certain old testament Bible passages. But it must have had some influence on the wider culture for over a century, now secular society has more tolerance of a growing number of committed relationships in a living union of more than two persons.

"I'd rather a polygamist that doesn't polyg than a monogamist who doesn't monog." -> US Senator Boise Penrose, in response to the Congressional hearings on whether or not the church was practicing polygamy past the 1890 prohibition.

As the Senator noted, many of the politicians who were leveling accusations against the church were known to be having extra-marital affairs, and thus their opposition to the church was the height of hypocrisy.

 

[FredVB]

"I'd rather a polygamist that doesn't polyg than a monogamist who doesn't monog." -> US Senator Boise Penrose, in response to the Congressional hearings on whether or not the church was practicing polygamy past the 1890 prohibition.

As the Senator noted, many of the politicians who were leveling accusations against the church were known to be having extra-marital affairs, and thus their opposition to the church was the height of hypocrisy.

There is no denying that there is an abundance of hypocrites. There is still the issue that the polygamists don't just don't. Many still will, when they can. Underage girls, as in that case, get used with this too. Even where it seems acceptable, it is not at a good direction for a people, and some are at a disadvantage getting used for that. It is not at all a godly direction for any. Still, the perfect will of the heavenly Father, as it is in heaven, goes far beyond what we speak of and what most settle with.

 

[Christian Apologist]

"I'd rather a polygamist that doesn't polyg than a monogamist who doesn't monog." -> US Senator Boise Penrose, in response to the Congressional hearings on whether or not the church was practicing polygamy past the 1890 prohibition.

As the Senator noted, many of the politicians who were leveling accusations against the church were known to be having extra-marital affairs, and thus their opposition to the church was the height of hypocrisy.

 

[Ironhold]

View attachment 289330

How does what you posted relate to what I posted?

As it is, the theology holds that they're one in unity, purpose, and divine nature rather than the literal unity mainstream Christianity holds.

 

[Christian Apologist]

How does what you posted relate to what I posted?

As it is, the theology holds that they're one in unity, purpose, and divine nature rather than the literal unity mainstream Christianity holds.

here's is the mainstream teaching on the Godhead, what would you disagree with it Ironhold ?

 

[Christian Apologist]

E. Calvin Beisner

God in Three Persons

The Christian Church throughout history has found in order to remain faithful to the teachings of the New Testament regarding the person and work of Christ, it had to affirm at least the following doctrines:

The doctrine of the Trinity----that in the nature of the One True God, there are three distinct persons, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, each fully God, Coequal and Coeternal

When we have said these three things, then—that there is but one God, that the Father and the Son and the Spirit is each a distinct person—we have enunciated the doctrine of the Trinity in its completeness.


We may condense this into a somewhat shorter statement, one which is more precise: In the nature of the God, there are three distinct persons, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit ( or substance ) of the one true God, there are three distinct persons, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit p 24



“The Nicene Creed, then, with centuries of theological discussion and controversy behind it, still teaches of the Trinity as the New Testament does: that the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, while distinct from each other personally, are the same God” p 153



Trinity

first used by Theophilus (A.D. 168 A.D. - 183 A.D.), or from the Lat. trinitas, first used by Tertullian (A.D. 220 A.D.), to express this doctrine. The propositions involved in the doctrine are these: 1. That God is one, and that there is but one God (Deut 6:4; 1 Kings 8:60; Isa 44:6; Mark 12:29,32; John 10:30). 2. That the Father is a distinct divine Person (hypostasis, subsistentia, persona, suppositum intellectuale), distinct from the Son and the Holy Spirit. 3. That Jesus Christ was truly God, and yet was a Person distinct from the Father and the Holy Spirit. 4. That the Holy Spirit is also a distinct divine Person.

(from Easton's Bible Dictionary, PC Study Bible formatted electronic database Copyright © 2003, 2006 Biblesoft, Inc. All rights reserved.)



Homoousios -God- Godhead- Substance- Essence- Being –Nature [ all Synonyms ]

One being. Three persons. In other words, one "what" and three "who"s. There is one being, God. There are three persons: God the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. The distinction is between being and person. One being, three persons. One what, three who's.


All the Persons of the Holy Trinity are IDENTICAL IN ESSENCE but DISTINCT IN PERSONS


John Ankerberg [Everything You Ever Wanted to know about Mormonism]

Page 104-105

1. There is Only One God

2. The Father is God;

3. Jesus Christ, the Son, is God

4. The Holy Spirit is a Person, is eternal and is therefore God

5. The Father, Son and Holy Spirit are distinct persons.


Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary

(n.) The union of three persons (the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost) in one Godhead, so that all the three are one God as to substance, but three persons as to individuality.



“Within the one Being that is God, there exists eternally three coequal and co-eternal persons, namely, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.”

(White, James R. “The Forgotten Trinity” (p. 26). Baker Publishing Group. Kindle Edition)

 

[Ironhold]

Again ->

How does what you posted relate to the comment you quoted above?

 

[ewq1938]