Jesus as a thief (secrect rapture), In Glory @ end fo trib?

[engrapho]

Trick question, if the rapture is when Jesus comes as secret thief, and the coming at the end of the trib is not the thief coming but a coming where every eye can see Him. What happens to that theology if I can prove the thief coming has not happend when the tribulation is almost over?

Want to know what single verse kills that theology?

Rev 16:15 (should start @ verse 12) Jesus warns he is to come as a theif, this is after the 6th angel and the battle of armagedden is about to happen. Jesus is still to come as a thief!

I've gone to ever christain book store and looked at every comentary I can find. They all avoid the verse or lift it from its context!

 

[called]

hmm... i'm confused with the question. i understand that since no one knows when the second coming is Jesus said that he will come "like a thief in the night" meaning it's sudden and like i said before, no one knows.

 

[engrapho]

Read Rev 16:15 and you'll see Jesus is warning He is still to come as a thief. This in the context is at the end of the tribulation. Thats when the battle of Armageden happens. Start @ vers 12

 

[called]

1 Thessalonians 5:2

 

[engrapho]

1 Thess 5:4 You are not in darkness that it should surprise you.

 

[called]

yes, and? just because i am not in darkness doesn't mean i know the exact date and time the Lord's coming agian.

 

[engrapho]

I don't know exactly either. I don't know how much time is in between those verses or how long till we reach that time.

Have you ever thought about how churches push certain things a lot, and yet you don't see those phrases in the bible or the same concern. Any warnings in the bible about being left behind? I want to be left behind. Another trick statement! lol

 

[called]

your questions aren't clear to me.

 

[engrapho]

Sorry about that, I was refering to being left behind. Where in the bible does it warn Christians not to be left behind?

 

[called]

hmm... asking difficult questions which i, at my young age, am having to think really hard on. i know there's a verse... but question is... where? hmm....

 

[engrapho]

Did not know your age.

Here is the verse which is miss used by the church for christians getting raptured and the lost left behind.

(Luke 17:34-37 NIV) I tell you, on that night two people will be in one bed; one will be taken and the other left. {35} Two women will be grinding grain together; one will be taken and the other left." {36} {37} "Where, Lord?" they asked. He replied, "Where there is a dead body, there the vultures will gather."

· Let me guess, you always thought this passage was about the rapture. The one taken was taught to be the Christian, and the one left was in big trouble! NOT SO, I would rather be the one left. These that are taken, will be going to the Battle of Armageddon. I don’t understand how we can take verses 34 and 35, yet ignore verse 37. WHERE are they going? I believe it is to battle against the Lord.

The very idea that the righteous are taken first, leaving the unrighteous behind is wrong. It is the unrighteous first. See this point in the next passages.

(Mat 13:24-30 NIV) Jesus told them another parable: "The kingdom of heaven is like a man who sowed good seed in his field. {25} But while everyone was sleeping, his enemy came and sowed weeds among the wheat, and went away. {26} When the wheat sprouted and formed heads, then the weeds also appeared. {27} "The owner's servants came to him and said, 'Sir, didn't you sow good seed in your field? Where then did the weeds come from?' {28} "'An enemy did this,' he replied. "The servants asked him, 'Do you want us to go and pull them up?' {29} "'No,' he answered, 'because while you are pulling the weeds, you may root up the wheat with them. {30} Let both grow together until the harvest. At that time I will tell the harvesters: First collect the weeds and tie them in bundles to be burned; then gather the wheat and bring it into my barn.'"

Matthew 13:30 says it all, first collect the weeds, then gather the wheat. In the following verses, the Bible is interpreting itself.

 

[called]

*thinking* a pity i have a lot of homework or i would read the whole book of revelation... hmm... i have little time to finish this paper. *sigh* 17 and still procrastinating on papers.

 

[engrapho]

Do your school work would be best.

 

[marmaladePRO]

yeah, do your school work and then read the entire book of rev. if for no other reason then cause it says your blessed for readin' it...

 

[called]

yeah, but this paper's boring me to tears

 

[Blessed-one]

Originally posted by engrapho
{37} "Where, Lord?" they asked. He replied, "Where there is a dead body, there the vultures will gather."

These that are taken, will be going to the Battle of Armageddon.

.... i don't exactly get u, so what happens to all the judgements that are before the battle? r they intended for Christians only?

 

[engrapho]

Sorry you don't get me. If you have read the book of Rev you would know that all christians are sealed and protected from the wrath of God.

Isn't that how God did in Moses day. All of Israel was protected from the curese! Or the the three hebrews; Shad, Meshak, Abindigo. Or Daniel in the lions den. God went thru with them.

 

[parousia70]

As it was in the days of Noah, so shall it be at the coming of the Son of Man.

As It was in the days of Lot, so shall it be at the coming of the Son of Man.

What happened in Noah's day?
The flood came and the wicked were "TAKEN" in Judgement, and the righteous (Noah & his family) were "LEFT BEHIND" on Earth.

What happened in Lots Day?
The wicked of Sodom were "TAKEN" in the Judgement of fire and brimstone, and the righteous (Lot) was "LEFT BEHIND" on Earth.

"So shall it be at the coming of the Son of Man"

2 in the field, one (wicked) will be taken( in Judgement) and the other (righteous) will be LEFT BEHIND(on Earth), EXACTLY as it was in the days of Noah & Lot.

Sure Sounds more preferable to be "left behind" in light of this comparison dosen't it?

 

[engrapho]

No, you need to read about Noah a little closer; Luke 17:27 says it was the DAY Noah entered (NOT 7 yrs later), also Lk 17:29 'The DAY Lot left' (not 7 yrs later)

Also your so wrong about who is left behind, Luke 17:37 'Where lord are they taken?" Where vultures are!

 

[parousia70]

Perhaps you misunderstood me.
I am in agreement with you. (so far)

It is the Wicked who are taken and the righteous who are left behind.

I do not adhere to a 7 year Rapture -> Judgement time frame.
I have no idea where you got that notion.

For Paul Says the 2nd coming IS the Day of the lord that comes as a theif in the night.(1 Thess 5:2)

And Peter says that on the day of the lord that comes as a theif in the night, the Heavens and earth pass away.(2 Peter 3:10)

Not rapture first, then 7 years, then 1000 years, then heavens and earth passing.

The Bible teahes it was all to ocourr in one fell swoop.