Jesus and the God of the Old Testament

[simonpeter]

This is why I push the trinity. As the OP indicated there is a behavior difference between the God (God the Father) we find in the OT opposed to the God (Jesus God the Son) we find in the NT. Because God does not change, this requires two distinct personalities. When we examine the historical facts of the Gospels we note easily the trinity - three distinct beings yet only one God.

In the OT for instance we are told no human can see God and live yet thousands have seen Jesus (God the Son) and lived. I believe that God inspired the Bible. As such I believe that there are no contradictions.

bugkiller

This is a good point and possibly the only way to deal with this apparent contradiction. God the father and God the son are distinct persons, thus displaying different attributes.

 

[cyberlizard]

Indeed, there is a good deal of Neomarcionism among Christians today because they cannot stomach and deal with the concepts presented by the Old Testament, especially in reference to the attributes of God the Father. So instead of dealing with it they brush it under the rug or assume an artificial boundary between the Old and New Testaments.

I was going to say something similar but thought about it again... Marcionite teaching has influenced the church to a marked degree, just look at what he taught about the Jews and how his teachings affected later church leaders, leading to the vitriolic diatribes of people like golden mouth.


Steve

 

[cyberlizard]

This is why I push the trinity. As the OP indicated there is a behavior difference between the God (God the Father) we find in the OT opposed to the God (Jesus God the Son) we find in the NT. Because God does not change, this requires two distinct personalities. When we examine the historical facts of the Gospels we note easily the trinity - three distinct beings yet only one God.

In the OT for instance we are told no human can see God and live yet thousands have seen Jesus (God the Son) and lived. I believe that God inspired the Bible. As such I believe that there are no contradictions.

bugkiller

yet it is the same God, as God is one.

plus there are multiple examples in the OT where God is seen by men. Seeing God is not just a NT concept.


Steve

 

[chingchang]

I don't see the OT God as fierce except when man forced him to.

I didn't realize we had that power. Wow...we can force God.

CC

 

[bugkiller]

yet it is the same God, as God is one.

plus there are multiple examples in the OT where God is seen by men. Seeing God is not just a NT concept.

You give a statement with no support. If what you say is true then Moses, God or both are lying Ex 33:20. Do you understand the implications of this?

bugkiller

 

[bugkiller]

I didn't realize we had that power. Wow...we can force God.

CC

Great point!

bugkiller

 

[cyberlizard]

You give a statement with no support. If what you say is true then Moses, God or both are lying Ex 33:20. Do you understand the implications of this?

bugkiller

Genesis 32v30 - So Jacob called the place Peniel, saying, “It is because I saw God face to face, and yet my life was spared.”

Exodus 24v11 - But God did not raise his hand against these leaders of the Israelites; they saw God, and they ate and drank.

Judges 13v - 17Then Manoah inquired of the angel of the LORD, “What is your name, so that we may honor you when your word comes true?” 18He replied, “Why do you ask my name? It is beyond understanding.” 19Then Manoah took a young goat, together with the grain offering, and
sacrificed it on a rock to the LORD. And the LORD did an amazing thing while Manoah and his wife watched: 20As the flame blazed up from the altar toward heaven, the angel of the LORD ascended in the flame. Seeing this, Manoah and his wife fell with their faces to the ground. 21When the angel of the LORD did not show himself again to Manoah and his wife, Manoah realized that it was the angel of the LORD. 22“We are doomed to die!” he said to his wife. “We have seen God!”

Exodus 6v2 - God also said to Moses, “I am the LORD. I appeared to Abraham, to Isaac and to Jacob as God Almighty, but by my name the LORDb I did not make myself known to them.

The above passages do not contradict your cited text.

I would ask, according to the above passages, which God did they see if not the one and only God.


Steve

p.s. I would not make statements if I did not think I could back them up with scripture.

 

[Lulav]

[byti

 

[Lulav]

nm

 

[Emmy]

Dear simonpeter. You had some good replies, but like you, I feel the same. Jesus and God are : God-Father and God-Son, they are both Love. The O.T. is a History of the Israelites and their Prophets. God was in the process of establishing His Kingdom. God spoke through the Prophets, and the Israelites were surrounded by Heathen-Tribes and their cruel gods. It was no easy task, and the Prophets were the mouth-pieces of God. As we know, no two people think alike, although they are describing the same picture, or scene. When Jesus came in time, He showed us God as God is really, a loving Heavenly Father who wants us back again. Jesus called Himself " Son of Man", while He lived on Earth, and when chasing those buyers and sellers out of God`s House, with a whip, Jesus was " Man showing His righteous indignation." When Jesus prevented the stoning of the Adulteress: He told the accusing crowd: " Who is without sin may throw the first stone." The Bible tells us how they all left quietly, and Jesus forgave the Adulteress and told her: " Go and sin no more." The Bible is God`s Word to man, written by God-inspiring men and women, they all loved God yet used different words to talk to us. God is God simonpeter, God-Father made us in His image, and God-Son died for us that we might live. Jesus is our Saviour and the way back to God. Our part now is to REPENT, to exchange our selfish and unloving character INTO selflessly loving and forgiving as God has forgiven us. I say this humbly and with love. Greetings from Emmy, sister in Christ.

 

[simonpeter]

If you'd like to talk about that time just give me the and we'll start, ok?

 

[Stryder06]

This is a good point and possibly the only way to deal with this apparent contradiction. God the father and God the son are distinct persons, thus displaying different attributes.

They are also One. God the Father and God the Son aren't at odds with each other. One doesn't do something the Other disagrees with.

 

[cyberlizard]

They are also One. God the Father and God the Son aren't at odds with each other. One doesn't do something the Other disagrees with.

that's a very good point, God always agrees with Himself (whichever person) God is not schizophrenic!


Steve

 

[Hammster]

Really? so you believe that the G-d of the OT in the NT stands for the same things?

God is the same yesterday, today and forever. God does not change.

 

[John 07]

the OT God is fierce and strong, whereas Jesus is tender and loving.

I would agree that Jesus is loving and tender
but I don't think he's just/only loving and tender.

I think this way because of the 'white horse' verses from Rev 19 already mentioned and also these two verses:

Revelation 2:22 Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds. 23 And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.

Revelation 6:16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
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