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JESUS and the APOSTLES OBEYED GOD'S LAW and the SABBATH!

Discussion in 'Sabbath and The Law' started by LoveGodsWord, Sep 13, 2017.

  1. stuart lawrence

    stuart lawrence Well-Known Member

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    I will repeat. King David committed wilfull sin, yet he repented of it and was forgiven
    .so wilfull sin cannot be Unrepentant sin
     
  2. stuart lawrence

    stuart lawrence Well-Known Member

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  3. stuart lawrence

    stuart lawrence Well-Known Member

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    I repeat.
    Those whose christianity is based on a willingness to surrender their lives to Christ will never be judged based on observing the law.
    Those who want a christianity that is based on observing the law, will have to be judged by their observance of the law, for that is the religion they wanted
     
  4. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    Here let me help you. I will answer the question for you. According to the scriptures if anyone is living a life staying in unrepentant sin they are transgressing God's Law because sin is the transgression of God's Law and the penalty for sin is death (1 John 3:4; Romans 6:23) The gift is there (Jesus; God's Word) but that person has rejected God's gift so there is no salvation for them so they are not in a saved state and are in danger of the judgements of God. If they continue in sin they will receive the penalty of sin which is death (Hebrews 10:26-27; Hebrew 6:4-8; Romans 2:12-13; Romans 3:19; Romans 6:23; Romans 3:19).

    Ok what if now they decide, no I want to be saved and decide I am going to stop my sin. By stopping their sin and observing God's Law save them? No because by the deeds of the Law shall no flesh be justified in his sight because by the law is the knowledge of sin only (Romans 3:20).

    However, if they hear or read God's Word and come to Jesus just as they are full of sin, believing (Isaiah 64:4; 1 John 1:9) God's Word and confess their sins to Jesus and repent of their sins because they believe and have faith in God's Word are they then in a saved state? Yes they are because their salvation is by grace through faith in Jesus (God's Word) and not of works lest any man should boast. It is a gift of God.

    Do you understand the difference between the two statements now how they are not the same thing when you say...
    They are clearly not the same thing. The first is supported by scripture (Romans 2:12-13; Romans 3:19; Romans 3:9; Romans 3:19) because sin is the transgression of God's Law and if we sin we fall under the penalty of the Law (1 John 3:4; Romans 6:23). The second statement is talking about observing God's Law for your salvation.

    Hope this helps you,

    In Christ Always!

     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2017
  5. stuart lawrence

    stuart lawrence Well-Known Member

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    How are you helping me? I've already correctly addressed your question many times.
     
  6. stuart lawrence

    stuart lawrence Well-Known Member

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    And I yet again repeat. There is no difference in those two statements for you link you statement to being in a saved/ justified state. I just ratified the truth of what your statement actually neans
     
  7. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    Not sure what this has to do with what we are talking about as you brought this up before and I already answered it. This is repented sin not unrepented sin :D. We are talking about unrepentant sin.
     
  8. stuart lawrence

    stuart lawrence Well-Known Member

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    Let's put this another way, see if it helps you to understand.
    People who want a christianity based on obeying the law, may well have Unrepentant sin, for basing religion in observing the law is not religion based on loving God.
    However, if a person has a christianity based in a willingness to surrender their life to Christ, their christianity must be based on loving God and his son.
    Such people will always repent of sin, as surely as night follows day, they can do nothing else
     
  9. stuart lawrence

    stuart lawrence Well-Known Member

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    It has to do with your belief that wilfull sin is Unrepentant sin
     
  10. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    Ok Stuart, believe what you like. It is ok with me. I will let others read the scriptures and decide for themselves. You have not addressed any of my questions you just avoided them. Its ok I answered the question myself for you in post #104 and provided scripture to show you what I believe so we can leave it at that now. Nice chatting with you.

    In Christ Always
     
  11. stuart lawrence

    stuart lawrence Well-Known Member

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    That's cute. I did address the points you raised that I read, you just avoided addressing much of what I wrote.
    There is reading the scriptures, being led of the Holy Spirit in doing so, and reading the scriptures, without being led of the Holy Spirit in doing so. Two different things, the result is two different understandings of the true message
     
  12. stuart lawrence

    stuart lawrence Well-Known Member

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    Therefore no one will be declared righteous in his sight by observing the law/ not committing sin, rather through the law we become conscious if sin
    Rom3:20

    How can anyone who acknowledges sin is the transgression of the law not agree with the above?
     
  13. stuart lawrence

    stuart lawrence Well-Known Member

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    It is not enough, simply to read the literal words of the Bible. The Pharisees of Jesus day knew the letter of the then scriptures inside and out, but were blinded to the true message contained in them
     
  14. stuart lawrence

    stuart lawrence Well-Known Member

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    You are so confused.
    On the one hand you state if we sin we fall under Gods laws.
    Then you quote:
    Their sins and lawless deeds i will remember no more.
    Let me help you here
    Before you get saved you live a lifestyle of sin, you do not choose or want to follow God.
    Once you get saved you in your heart do want to obey God for that is where his laws have been placed.
    But though that is what you in your heart want, you will still sin in your flesh. But now, if you have had a true conversion you will have great remorse at your sin, and naturally repent of it.
    Completely different from choosing a lifestyle of sin.
    Therefore, as the believer still commits sin they feel bad about committing, that sin will not place them back under the law.
    Therefore it is incorrect to say.
    Sin places you back under the law, for the true born again Christian, their sins and lawless deeds will be remembered no more.
    They cannot be remembered no more if your sin places you back under the law.
    You must rightly divide the word. And you must cite scripture that supports what you are staying, much of the time you do not do that
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2017
  15. stuart lawrence

    stuart lawrence Well-Known Member

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    You see, I have not the time or inclination to go through your whole posts pointing out and explaining your citing of scripture incorrectly to support what you state. You do it all the time as I have been pointing out to you.
    In the above you state

    If they continue in sin they will receive the penalty of sin which is death.
    You then cite rom3:9 in support of that statement. And you confirm it by citing that scripture in support of sin being the transgression of the law and if we sin we fall under the penalty of the law. Rom3:9 states:

    What shall we conclude then?Are we any better? Not at all! We have already made the charge that Jews and gentiles alike are all under sin.

    That verse in no ways endorsing your statement. It is showing the believer needs righteousness apart from observing the law. It isn't showing if a believer commits sin they will receive the death penalty/ be put under the law

    You quote rom3:19 to support the same statement.

    Now we know that whatever the law says it says to those who are under the law so that every mouth may be silenced and the whole world held accountable to God.

    What follows that verse?

    Therefore no one will be declared righteous in his sight by observing the law, rather through the law we become conscious if sin.

    At best you ripped the context out of the verse. That verse is not either stating if a believer commits sin they will receive the death penalty.

    Yesterday you cited heb8:10-12 in support of the law being the foundation of the NC and the judgement to come. Heb8:10-12 states:
    Their sins and lawless deeds i will remember NO MORE.
    You also yesterday cited rom 3:20 in support of your view the law is the foundation of the NC and the judgement to come. Rom3:20 states:

    Therefore no one will be declared righteous in his sight by observing the law, rather through the law we become conscious of sin.

    How on earth can that verse support your belief the law is the foundation of the NC and the basis of the judgement to come?

    You then cite heb10:26 in regard to Unrepentant sin, when it regards wilfull sin. You say the two are the same thing.
    I point out to you they are not, for David committed wilfull sin but repented of it.

    You cite scripture incorrectly to support your beliefs all the time, and as I said, I will not go over every verse you cite incorrectly to support your views, it would take far too long
    So when you say you cite scripture to support your beliefs, much of the time you incorrectly cite much scripture to endorse what you state
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2017
  16. stuart lawrence

    stuart lawrence Well-Known Member

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    .
     
  17. Lulav

    Lulav Everyone will give an account Staff Member Administrator CF Staff Trainer Supporter CF Senior Ambassador

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    Let's remember to

    ADDRESS POST NOT POSTER.png
     
  18. Dkh587

    Dkh587 David דויד Supporter

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    Christ taught more than just the 10 commandments

    Deuteronomy 6:4-5 and Leviticus 19:18 are the 2 greatest commandments, and they're not from the 10

    When the devil was tempting him, he quoted the Deuteronomy, not Exodus

    Matthew 5:17 shows that the Messiah taught the full and correct meaning of the law and the prophets

    He didn't just stop at 10

    Even Peter taught from the law

    1 Peter 1:15-16
    But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation; Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy.

    "Be ye Holy, for I am Holy" is not in the 10 commandments. It's actually from the book of Leviticus
     
  19. Lulav

    Lulav Everyone will give an account Staff Member Administrator CF Staff Trainer Supporter CF Senior Ambassador

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    I always find this helpful

    LAW OF LOVE HANGER.JPG
     
  20. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    I like that illustration thanks for sharing
     
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