JESUS and the APOSTLES OBEYED GOD'S LAW and the SABBATH!

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Hi Listed,

How are you today my friend? Well that is not true so I guess you should have not listened to your friend. Leviticus 23 is talking about the 7x annual Jewish festivals. Some of these festivals can run for 7 days or longer so of course these festivals would include the normal 4th commandment which is a weekly Sabbath from the 4th commandment of God's Law (Exodus 20:8-11). This is because the 4th commandment would have fallen within the time frame of the different festivals. So I am not sure of your the point your trying to make.
Do you really mean the first 3 verses of Leviticus 23 aren't about the weekly sabbath?

23 And the Lord spake unto Moses, saying,

2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, Concerning the feasts of the Lord, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are my feasts.

3 Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation; ye shall do no work therein: it is the sabbath of the Lord in all your dwellings.

Where is this said about any of the other holy days?
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Who are those books addressed to? Contents of the last 4 of your list specifically say children of Israel.Suppose you have a desired answer for your posed rhetorical question.Anything is merely a word. Your argument falls flat trying to say Israel is only a word (name).This quote has nothing to do with the discussion.But we aren't one in Israel. the verse does not say anything about Israel. We are 1 in Jesus as the verse says.Christians aren't Israel in either case. Christians aren't called in Isaac. Christians are called by the One they follow, the Seed of Abraham. Christians don't follow Israel (the law). The law covenant isn't the covenant of Christians.This doesn't say anything about becoming a Jew. This is addressed to the Jew who refuses to accept Jesus as the Messiah. They can't become complete without accepting Him Jesus the Christ well known also as The Messiah.Nothing about Israel here. We are 1 in Christ Jesus as the verse says.What is all? What are we in? I read Christ meaning Jesus. I don't read Israel.Once again, nothing about Israel. believeth on him, all that call upon him, call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.This doesn't say anything about becoming a Jew. This is addressed to the Jew who refuses to accept Jesus as the Messiah. They can't become complete without accepting Him Jesus the Christ well known also as The Messiah.What are you trying to imply with this partial quote? Aren't you trying to mislead Christians taking from 1 sentence and combining it with another?Why aren't you including verses 8 and 9? Why are you insisting the subject is changed? Here are the verses: 8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah: 9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord. The covenant in verse 10 can't be the covenant given to Israel at Sinai. That covenant is: Deuteronomy 4:13 And he declared unto you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even ten commandments; and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.By what are we sanctified? Isn't it the 1 offering in your quote? Your quote says nothing about the law.I read the Gospels and Acts which won't permit your position to be true.

Just trying to dismiss all the scriptures provided in post # 556 does not make them go away. Should we believe you over God's Word? The scriptures say; Let God be true, and every man a liar; as it is written, That you might be justified in thy sayings, and might overcome when thou art judged. Who should we believe God or man? Who should we follow the teachings and traditions of man or the Word of God?
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Do you really mean the first 3 verses of Leviticus 23 aren't about the weekly sabbath?
23 And the Lord spake unto Moses, saying,
2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, Concerning the feasts of the Lord, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are my feasts.
3 Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation; ye shall do no work therein: it is the sabbath of the Lord in all your dwellings.
Where is this said about any of the other holy days?

Already answered please see post # 550 and supporting scriptures and all of Leviticus 23. For a further 200+ supporting scriptures please refer to COL 2:14-17 THE REAL TRUTH linked.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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So what you're doing is trying to establish your view as correct for the Christian. This is done because you know there are no Scripture verses with your desired words. The problems of legalism.Jesus invites us to trust Him and get our rest from Him not provided for by keeping the physical shadow 7th day sabbath. Since you pretend to not know what I'm talking about, its found in Matthew 11:28-30.
From your posts, I do not believe you're here to discuss anything. I say enough to pique (stimulate) interest and promote discussion. Others do the same.

Not at all. You have been provided the the scriptures and questions. You have not answered them.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Nothing in your response responds to any statement made by me. Instead you try to set yourself up as an authority. Your thread and posts have been responded to there.

Please make your statement and case. So far you have made none and shown no scripture that says God's 4th commandment is now abolished and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a Holy day. I did not expect you to though because there are no scriptures for this in God's Word and if there is no scripture for this who should we believe, God of man? Only the believers and followers of God's Word are saved in the Kingdom.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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I referenced the following Scripture in my response:

1 Corinthians 16

Hebrews 10:25

Exodus 20

Hosea 2:11

Jeremiah 31:31-33

Luke 22:20

Rev 1:10

Is there something wrong with your screen? Maybe you didn't read my post. Nothing unusual. The record proves I referenced the above in my response to your post.

Nothing wrong with my screen as said earlier none of the scriptures you have provided say that that 4th commandment (to Remember God's 7th Day Sabbath) is abolished and we are now commanded to Keep Sunday Holy. This is a tradition and teaching of man breaking the commandments of God. Jesus says if we follow the traditions and commandments of man over the Word of God we are not following God in the following scriptures....

Matthew 15:3-9
3, But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition? 4, For God commanded, saying, Honor thy father and mother: and, He that curses father or mother, let him die the death. 5, But ye say, Whosoever shall say to his father or his mother, It is a gift, by whatsoever thou might be profited by me; 6, And honor not his father or his mother, he shall be free. Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition. 7, Ye hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying, 8, This people draws nigh unto me with their mouth, and honors me with their lips; but their heart is far from me. 9, But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

Who should we follow God or Man?
 
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Bob S

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Please make your statement and case. So far you have made none and shown no scripture that says God's 4th commandment is now abolished and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a Holy day. I did not expect you to though because there are no scriptures for this in God's Word and if there is no scripture for this who should we believe, God of man? Only the believers and followers of God's Word are saved in the Kingdom.
Strawman! There is no scripture in the New Testament that tells us we have to observe the weekly Sabbath that was given to Israel only. I have shown you where the 10 commandments with its ritual Sabbath has been done away with and you ignore scripture or try to twist it to mean something pleasing to your belief. 2Cor3:7-11 is still in my Bible and it says the 10 commands were transitory. There is no way to deny those words and to what it is referring.
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Hi Bob, there is no strawman only God's Word has been presented my end. Did you have anything new to add? Everything you are saying here has already been answered already many times through God's Word.
I do not twist any scriptures but only provide God's Word because God's Word is truth.

You have not provided any scriptures that say that God's Law (10 commandments) or God's 4th commandment is abolished and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a Holy day because there is no scriptures in God's Word that say this. This is a tradition and teaching of man over the Word of God breaking God's commandment and Jesus tells us that if we follow the traditions of man over the Word of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9).

Unless you have something new to add to the discussion, I do not see any point in going over the same things over and over that have already been very clearly answered through the scriptures. Which is why I said earlier we may need to agree to disagree.

I have numbered and highlighted sections in your post above in red and provided the linked post reference for some of the more recent posts that have clearly addressed your statements with God's Word. However many more posts are provided in this thread that answer the same......

1. Post # 461

2. Post # 448
3. Post # 446


Who should we believe God or man?

Hope this helps.
 
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bugkiller

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Friend, You are free to believe as you like. I do not judge you. Your salvation is between you and God. We are free to believe God's Word or not. However on the day of judgement it will be the Word of God that will judge all of us. (John 12:47-48)
True. Of course you intend for me to think I do not accept Scripture. What about the Scripture I post and reference that you simply ignore? BTW I'm not the only one who you do this to.

bugkiller
 
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bugkiller

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HEBREWS 4 and Shadows of things to come.....

Just a quick re-post for anyone that wants to talk about Hebrew 4 and God's Sabbath as being a Shadow. God's 4th commandment (Exodus 20:8-11) has never been a shadow of anything because it is part of a finished work of creation given before sin entered into the world....

Some posts and questions that no one has addressed include; Post # 485; Post # 496; Post # 500; Post # 487 and COLOSSIANS 2:14-17 THE REAL TRUTH (linked) as well as the other posts I have sent with the scriptures. Could you please answer the following questions...............

1. Was the 7th Day Sabbath in the creation week part of a finished work or unfinished work?
No. There is no mention of the sabbath in Genesis.
2. Was the 7th Day Sabbath in the creation week made before sin or after sin entered the world?
Again no for the same reason. Besides that the sabbath is not mentioned until Ex 16.
3. Where does it say in God's Word God's 4th commandment the 7th Day Sabbath is abolished and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a Holy day?
We keep telling you it is Jer 31:31-33. You will not listen to the Scripture. There is no reinstatement of the 7th day sabbath to be found in the NT asa command or otherwise. Those in the Gospels were obligated to the law (10 Cs). Those in Acts observing (meeting in the synagogue) largely were Jews.
Please show the scriptures that say............

1. Jesus is the 7th day Sabbath.
Are you asking for a verse with the words "Jesus is the sabbath?" We do find these words about rest spoken to Jews -

28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.

30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light. Mat 11
2. The Sabbath (seventh day) was ever changed from the seventh to the first day of the week?
There is no passage in the NT commanding observance of any day. There is a command to assemble in Heb 10:25.
3. Where we are told to keep the first day of the week holy?
The same place we are told to keep the sabbath holy. Nowhere.
4. Where the first day of the week (Sunday) is ever called a holy day?
None. Again there is no command in the NT to keep any day.
5. That says that Jesus ever kept the first day (Sunday)?
None. Enough of your legalism game for salvation. The rest of the post is deleted for that reason.

bugkiller
 
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bugkiller

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Hi Listed,

How are you today my friend?
Why are you approaching people this way? The only cult I know of that does not do this is the JW. Maybe that is because it has been so long since any of them talked to me. They have only left literature on my gate once in 20 of so years.

bugkiller
 
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bugkiller

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I believe God's Word just not your interpretation of it. We must follow God rather then man (Acts 5:29)
Your response says nothing about the first three verse of Lev 23. The weekly sabbath is the only holy day of Israel with the contents of verse 3.

bugkiller
 
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bugkiller

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bugkiller

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Just trying to dismiss all the scriptures provided in post # 556 does not make them go away. Should we believe you over God's Word? The scriptures say; Let God be true, and every man a liar; as it is written, That you might be justified in thy sayings, and might overcome when thou art judged. Who should we believe God or man? Who should we follow the teachings and traditions of man or the Word of God?
Why do you seem to be unable to answer simple questions?

bugkiller
 
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bugkiller

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Hi Listed,

How are you today my friend? Well that is not true so I guess you should have not listened to your friend. Leviticus 23 is talking about the 7x annual Jewish festivals. Some of these festivals can run for 7 days or longer so of course these festivals would include the normal 4th commandment which is a weekly Sabbath from the 4th commandment of God's Law (Exodus 20:8-11). This is because the 4th commandment would have fallen within the time frame of the different festivals. So I am not sure of your the point your trying to make.

Continuing…………….

When a Holy convocation fell on a weekly Sabbath it was considered a High Day (e.g. John 19:31). The 4th commandments or 7th Day Sabbath is not an “annual” festival Sabbath which are referred to as “special Sabbaths” of “Holy convocation” (e.g. Leviticus 23:24; Sabbath H7677) which can fall on any day of the week.

It is interesting to note in the Old Testament the word Sabbath (shabbath 7676 from shabath 7673 meaning “rest”) is not only used for the weekly Sabbath but is also applied to the first and last days of the annual Jewish Festivals. The Greek Word used in Col 2:16 is Sabbaton simply means to cease from secular work; rest and can be applied to “Holy convocation”.

The monthly New Moon Sabbaths in relation to these festivals as well as the Holy convocations (Sabbaton to cease from work and rest) could fall on any day of the week depending on the year the festival was starting. The Holy convocations were to start the beginning of the annual Jewish feasts. They were to be rest (Sabbath) days (not to be confused with God’s commandment) and restricted or no work was to be done. (Lev 23; Num 10; 28; 29)

A High Sabbath day however was when I Holy convocation annual feast day falls on the same day as God’s weekly Sabbath commandment (Ex 20:8-11). This is an extension of the term "high day" found in the King James Version at John 19:31-42. The seven festivals do not necessarily occur on weekly Shabbat (seventh-day Sabbath) and are called by the name miqra ("called assembly") in Hebrew (Lev. 23). Three of them occur in spring: the first and seventh days of Pesach (Passover), and Shavuot (Pentecost) which occurs in summer. Three occur in fall, in the seventh month, and are also called shabbaton: Rosh Hashanah (Trumpets); Yom Kippur, the "Sabbath of Sabbaths" (Atonement); and the first and eighth days of Sukkoth (Tabernacles). Sometimes the word shabbaton is extended to mean all seven festivals. The Gospel of John says of the night immediately following Christ's burial that "that sabbath day was a high day" (19:31-42). That night was Nisan 15, just after the first day of Passover week (Unleavened Bread) and an annual miqra and rest day, in most chronologies. The King James Version may thus be the origin of naming the annual rest days "High Sabbaths" in English (source: wiki).

This does not include the other special Sabbaths of Leviticus 23:24: 32; 38-39. These were also special Sabbaths (not weekly) that could fall on any day of the week; in the Day of Atonement, the Feast of Tabernacles (booths) and First Fruits. The same Hebrew words used for these days in the texts above are;

Leviticus 23:24
sabbath H7677
שׁבּתון
shabbâthôn
shab-baw-thone'
From H7676; a sabbatism or special holiday: - rest, sabbath.

This was a special sabbath which could be on any day of the week...

Leviticus 23:32
sabbath H7676
שׁבּת; shabbâth; shab-bawth' Intensive from H7673; intermission, that is, (specifically) the Sabbath: - (+ every) sabbath.

The same word used as the weekly sabbath of the 4th commandment although this was not a weekly sabbath and could fall on any day of the week depending on which year it is observed.

For more detailed study withe over 200+ supporting scripture please see and COL 2:14-17 THE REAL TRUTH linked.

There is no abuse of Mark 2:27-28. When using this scripture I have only stated that the Sabbath was made for mankind and Jesus is the Lord of the Sabbath and it is the Lord’s Day and this does not refer to Sunday. Here let’s see what it says? I have highlighted the key sections for you as I am only repeating God’s Word.

Mark 2:27-28
27, And he said unto them, The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath: 28, Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the Sabbath.



The 7th Day Sabbath is the 4th commandment of God’s Law (Exodus 20:8-11) and only God is the maker of it. Why do you feel insulted by scripture? They are God’s Words not mine. It is Jesus that says we must believe and follow the Word of God over the traditions and teaching of man that break the commandments of God not me (see Matthew 15:3-9).
I do not think either listed, Bob S nor I am insulted by Scripture. Your statement listed is, is a real hoot.

bugkiller
 
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LoveGodsWord

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Why are you approaching people this way? The only cult I know of that does not do this is the JW. Maybe that is because it has been so long since any of them talked to me. They have only left literature on my gate once in 20 of so years. bugkiller

There is nothing wrong with calling anyone a friend is there?
 
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LoveGodsWord

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True. Of course you intend for me to think I do not accept Scripture. What about the Scripture I post and reference that you simply ignore? BTW I'm not the only one who you do this to.
bugkiller

What scripture have you posted that you feel I have ignored?
 
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