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Jerusalem is the capital of Palestinian Arabs

Discussion in 'Messianic Judaism' started by CherubRam, Dec 6, 2017.

  1. Dave-W

    Dave-W Welcoming grandchild #7, Arturus Waggoner! Supporter

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    That is a heretical offshoot group.
     
  2. CherubRam

    CherubRam My name is Michael, I am a Judaic Christian.

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    That may be true, but there are those who believe it.
     
  3. Lotuspetal_uk

    Lotuspetal_uk Say 'CHEESE!!!!'

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    I would place such people in the same box as the KKK tbh - they both share anti-Semitic views and we should not even entertain them for a millisecond.
     
  4. Dave-W

    Dave-W Welcoming grandchild #7, Arturus Waggoner! Supporter

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    Of course. But when Malcolm X made his pilgrimage to Mecca, he saw muslims of every ethnicity; and found out that Elijah Mohammad had led black muslims in the US astray from real islam.
     
  5. CherubRam

    CherubRam My name is Michael, I am a Judaic Christian.

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    Malcolm X killed by the Nation of Islam
    On Feb. 21, 1965, the former Nation of Islam leader Malcolm X was shot and killed by assassins identified as Black Muslims as he was about to address the Organization of Afro-American Unity at the Audubon Ballroom in Harlem. He was 39.
     
  6. Ronald

    Ronald Exhortations Supporter

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    The news is filled with hate and lies. Yes, Jerusalem will be a stumbling block for the nations of the world and those who choose to attack Israel will be destroyed.

    "Behold, I will make Jerusalem a cup of drunkenness to all the surrounding peoples, when they lay siege against Judah and Jerusalem. And it shall happen in that day that I will make Jerusalem a very heavy stone for all peoples; all who would heave it away will surely be cut in pieces, though all nations of the earth are gathered against it." Zech. 12:2, 3
    In Zech. 13 we see 2/3 of the Jews being cut off, but 1/3 remnant being saved and put through the fire and this remnant will no longer be blind to Jesus.
    Continue on to the next chapter and we see Jesus return and standing on the Mount of Olives.
    Zech. 14:12 describes in detail the effects of a nuclear blast/ neutron bomb, a plague by which the Lord destroys all who come against Jerusalem: "Their flesh shall dissolve (melt) while they stand on their feet, Their eyes shall dissolve in their sockets, And their tongues shall dissolve in their mouths."
    Exciting times we are living in ... the End Times.
     
  7. Ygrene Imref

    Ygrene Imref Well-Known Member

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    Especially since Israel is a people, not a physical nation. (At least, the one the Most High is talking about.)
     
  8. CherubRam

    CherubRam My name is Michael, I am a Judaic Christian.

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    Israel is addressed as a nation. Hebrews are a people. The bible addresses Israel as multinational.
     
  9. CherubRam

    CherubRam My name is Michael, I am a Judaic Christian.

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    Zech 13 is about 70 AD and beyond.
     
  10. CherubRam

    CherubRam My name is Michael, I am a Judaic Christian.

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    Regards to Nation of Islam.
    That may be from whom I have heard it from.
     
  11. CherubRam

    CherubRam My name is Michael, I am a Judaic Christian.

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    Zech 14 may be defective because not all of it agrees with other scriptures. Needs more study.
     
  12. Ygrene Imref

    Ygrene Imref Well-Known Member

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    And what one nation on the earth is like Your people Israel, whom God went to redeem for Himself as a people and to make a name for Himself, and to do a great thing for You and awesome things for Your land, before Your people whom You have redeemed for Yourself from Egypt, from nations and their gods? "For You have established for Yourself Your people Israel as Your own people forever, and You, O LORD, have become their God. - 2 Samuel 7:23-24

    O LORD, there is none like You, nor is there any God besides You, according to all that we have heard with our ears. "And what one nation in the earth is like Your people Israel, whom God went to redeem for Himself as a people, to make You a name by great and terrible things, in driving out nations from before Your people, whom You redeemed out of Egypt? - 1 Chronicles 17:20-21

    For the LORD has chosen Jacob for Himself, Israel for His own possession. - Psalms 135:4

    At that time," declares the LORD, "I will be the God of all the families of Israel, and they shall be My people." Thus says the LORD, "The people who survived the sword Found grace in the wilderness-- Israel, when it went to find its rest." The LORD appeared to him from afar, saying, "I have loved you with an everlasting love; Therefore I have drawn you with lovingkindness. Again I will build you and you will be rebuilt, O virgin of Israel! Again you will take up your tambourines, And go forth to the dances of the merrymakers. - Jeremiah 31:1-4

     
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  13. CherubRam

    CherubRam My name is Michael, I am a Judaic Christian.

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    This is what God has spoken through His prophets.


    Genesis 17:3

    Abram fell facedown, and God said to him, 4. "As for me, this is my covenant with you: You will be the father of many nations. 5. No longer will you be called Abram; your name will be Abraham, for I have made you a father of many nations. 6. I will make you very fruitful; I will make nations of you, and kings will come from you. 7. I will establish my covenant as an everlasting covenant between me and you and your descendants after you for the generations to come, to be your God and the God of your descendants after you.


    Genesis 35:11
    And God said to him, "I am God Almighty; be fruitful and increase in number. A nation and a community of nations will come from you, and kings will come from your body.


    Exodus 12:37
    The Israelites journeyed from Rameses to Succoth. There were about six hundred thousand men on foot, besides women and children. 38. Many other people went up with them, as well as large droves of livestock, both flocks and herds.


    Leviticus 19:34
    The alien living with you must be treated as one of your native-born. Love him as yourself, for you were aliens in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.


    Leviticus 24:22
    You are to have the same law for the alien and the native-born. I am the LORD your God.


    Numbers 15:15
    The community is to have the same rules for you and for the alien living among you; this is a lasting ordinance for the generations to come. You and the alien shall be the same before the LORD :


    Joshua 8:33
    All Israel, aliens and citizens alike, with their elders, officials and judges, were standing on both sides of the ark of the covenant of the LORD, facing those who carried it—the priests, who were Levites. Half of the people stood in front of Mount Gerizim and half of them in front of Mount Ebal, as Moses the servant of the LORD had formerly commanded when he gave instructions to bless the people of Israel.


    Esther 8:17
    In every province and in every city, wherever the edict of the king went, there was joy and gladness among the Jews, with feasting and celebrating. And many people of other nationalities became Jews because fear of the Jews had seized them.

    The word "Jew" was a nickname assigned by the Babylonians to anyone who either lived in or came from the area of Judea.

    Psalm 2:4
    The One enthroned in heaven laughs; the Lord scoffs at them. 5. Then he rebukes them in his anger and terrifies them in his wrath, saying, 6. "I have installed my King
    on Zion, my holy hill." 7. I will proclaim the decree of the LORD : He said to me, "You are my Son; today I have become your Father. 8. Ask of me, and I will make the nations your inheritance, the ends of the earth your possession.


    Psalm 82:8
    Rise up, O God, judge the earth, for all the nations are your inheritance.


    Psalm 111:6
    He has shown his people the power of his works, giving them the lands of other nations.


    Isaiah 9:3
    You have enlarged the nation and increased their joy; they rejoice before you as people rejoice at the harvest, as men rejoice when dividing the plunder.


    Isaiah 14:1
    The LORD will have compassion on Jacob; once again he will choose Israel and will settle them in their own land. Aliens will join them and unite with the house of Jacob.


    Isaiah 26:15
    You have enlarged the nation, O LORD; you have enlarged the nation. You have gained glory for yourself;
    you have extended all the borders of the land.


    Isaiah 44:5
    One will say, 'I belong to the LORD '; another will call himself by the name of Jacob; still another will write on his hand, ['The LORD's / Yahwah],' and will take the name Israel.


    Isaiah 56:3
    Let no foreigner who has bound himself to the LORD say, "The LORD will surely exclude me from his people."- 6. And foreigners who bind themselves to the LORD to serve him, to love the name of the LORD, and to worship him, all who keep the Sabbath without desecrating it
    and who hold fast to my covenant-
    7. these I will bring to my holy mountain and give them joy in my house of prayer. Their burnt offerings and sacrifices will be accepted on my altar; for my house will be called a house of prayer for all nations."
    8. The Sovereign LORD declares— he who gathers the exiles of Israel: "I will gather still others to them besides those already gathered."


    Ezekiel 47
    21. "You are to distribute this land among yourselves according to the tribes of Israel. 22. You are to allot it as an inheritance for yourselves and for the aliens who have settled among you and who have children. You are to consider them as native-born Israelites; along with you they are to be allotted an inheritance among the tribes of Israel. 23. In whatever tribe the alien settles, there you are to give him his inheritance," declares the Sovereign LORD.


    Zechariah 2:10
    "Shout and be glad, O Daughter of Zion. For I am coming, and I will live among you," declares the LORD. 11. "Many nations will be joined with the LORD in that day and will become my people. I will live among you and you will know that the LORD Almighty has sent me to you. 12. The LORD will inherit Judah as his portion in the holy land and will again choose Jerusalem. 13. Be still before the LORD, all mankind, because he has roused himself from his holy dwelling."


    Matthew 12:21
    In his name the nations will put their hope."



    The Parable of the Tenants
    Luke 20
    9. He went on to tell the people this parable: "A man planted a vineyard, rented it to some farmers and went away for a long time. 10. At harvest time he sent a servant to the tenants so they would give him some of the fruit of the vineyard. But the tenants beat him and sent him away empty-handed. 11. He sent another servant, but that one also they beat and treated shamefully and sent away empty-handed. 12. He sent still a third, and they wounded him and threw him out.
    13. "Then the owner of the vineyard said, 'What shall I do? I will send my son, whom I love; perhaps they will respect him.' 14. "But when the tenants saw him, they talked the matter over. 'This is the heir,' they said. 'Let's kill him, and the inheritance will be ours.' 15. So they threw him out of the vineyard and killed him. "What then will the owner of the vineyard do to them? 16. He will come and kill those tenants and give the vineyard to others." When the people heard this, they said, "May this never be!" 17. Jesus looked directly at them and asked, "Then what is the meaning of that which is written:

    " 'The stone the builders rejected
    has become the capstone? 18. Everyone who falls on that stone will be broken to pieces, and he on whom it falls will be crushed."

    19. The teachers of the law and the chief priests looked for a way to arrest him immediately, because they knew he had spoken this parable against them. But they were afraid of the people.


    Acts 3:25
    And you are heirs of the prophets and of the covenant God made with your fathers. He said to Abraham, 'Through your offspring all peoples on earth will be blessed.'


    Romans 2:28
    For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: 29. But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.


    Romans 3:29
    Is God the God of Jews only? Is he not the God of Gentiles too? Yes, of Gentiles too,


    Romans 4:13
    It was not through law that Abraham and his offspring received the promise that he would be heir of the world, but through the righteousness that comes by faith. 14. For if those who live by law are heirs, faith has no value and the promise is worthless, 15. because law brings wrath. And where there is no law there is no transgression.
    16. Therefore, the promise comes by faith, so that it may be by grace and may be guaranteed to all Abraham's offspring—not only to those who are of the law but also to those who are of the faith of Abraham. He is the father of us all. 17. As it is written: "I have made you a father of many nations." He is our father in the sight of God, in whom he believed—the God who gives life to the dead and calls things that are not as though they were.


    Romans 4:18
    Against all hope, Abraham in hope believed and so became the father of many nations, just as it had been said to him, "So shall your offspring be."


    Romans 8:17
    Now if we are children, then we are heirs—heirs of God and co-heirs with Christ, if indeed we share in his sufferings in order that we may also share in his glory.


    Romans 9:6
    It is not as though God's word had failed. For not all who are descended from Israel are Israel. 7. Nor because they are his descendants are they all Abraham's children. On the contrary, "It is through Isaac that your offspring will be reckoned." 8. In other words, it is not the natural children who are God's children, but it is the children of the promise who are regarded as Abraham's offspring.


    Romans 9:24
    even us, whom he also called, not only from the Jews but also from the Gentiles?


    Romans 10:12
    For there is no difference between Jew and Gentile—the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him,...


    Romans 10:19
    Again I ask: Did Israel not understand? First, Moses says, "I will make you envious by those who are not a nation;...


    1 Corinthians 14:21
    In the Law it is written: "Through men of strange tongues and through the lips of foreigners I will speak to this people, but even then they will not listen to me," says the Lord.


    Ephesians 2:12
    remember that at that time you were separate from Christ, excluded from citizenship in Israel and foreigners to the covenants of the promise, without hope and without God in the world.


    Ephesians 2:19
    Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and aliens, but fellow citizens with God's people and members of God's household,...


    Ephesians 3:6
    This mystery is that through the gospel the Gentiles are heirs together with Israel, members together of one body, and sharers together in the promise in Christ Jesus.


    Galatians 3:28
    There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.


    Galatians 3:29
    If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.


    Colossians 3:11
    Here there is no Greek or Jew, circumcised or uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave or free, but Christ is all, and is in all.


    Titus 3:7
    so that, having been justified by his grace, we might become heirs having the hope of eternal life.
     
  14. Ygrene Imref

    Ygrene Imref Well-Known Member

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    Are you saying these verses point to Israel being a physical nation by definition?

    Certainly God allots land to Israel; that is the inheritance, and consequence as royalty/children of God. But, is it Israel's identity?

    Is land the identity of Israel, or is it the people that identify Israel (and, I am not taking solely about blood.)

    Didn't the King of Israel say the Kingdom is not of this world, and the ones who follow the commandments of God are the King's brother, sister (relative,) and therefore heirs to that Kingdom that is yet to be beholden in this plane of existence? If I recall correctly, He was even offered to control all territories within tangibility on the planet - and He refused because His Kingdom is to come (and, because of who He is.)


    I worry people focus too much on physical Israel as the Israel God talks about. If/when physical Israel is razed, it will cause discord and faithlessness - as it will imply God was a liar by allowing "Israel" to fall, and be destroyed.
     
  15. CherubRam

    CherubRam My name is Michael, I am a Judaic Christian.

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    You're rambling. The scriptures I posted speak for themselves.
     
  16. Ygrene Imref

    Ygrene Imref Well-Known Member

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    Yes, and it says several times that Israel is a people.

    God gave His people land as an inheritance, but as far as identity: it is not the land that identifies Israel. The people identify Israel.

    I wasn't rambling; Christ Himself said that His Kingdom is not of this world. So, suffice it to say that everyone "looking to the East, or to the West" for the Kingdom - whose Capital City is Jerusalem - are looking in vain. (Matthew 24:26).

    The dragon is making war with the remnant. The principalities and powers have been given authority to do this against us for a time. There is no nation on this planet that is not under the influential evolution of one of these principalities/powers/fallen. But, there are people whose hearts are untouched by the enemy, and represent the remnant of Godliness and the Most High - and therefore Israel (Revelation 7:9, 14).
     
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2017
  17. Ronald

    Ronald Exhortations Supporter

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    God told Abraham, he would be the father of many nations, Israel being one of them.
     
  18. Ronald

    Ronald Exhortations Supporter

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    I suppose you place the Revelation events around that time as well?
    Sorry, Zech. chapter 12 within a short time will seem like reading a newspaper about current events. Chapters 13 & 14 concern future events soon to follow.
    If you are an Amillenialist, don't bother responding, I don't care to go down that road.
     
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2017
  19. CherubRam

    CherubRam My name is Michael, I am a Judaic Christian.

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    Yes, it does take people to make a nation.
     
  20. CherubRam

    CherubRam My name is Michael, I am a Judaic Christian.

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    Have a good evening Ronald. Good night.
     
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