Italy makes vaccination compulsory

Desk trauma

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This only tells me of you bias and that you support “them” and are quite possibly “one of them”.
I'm one of them without even knowing who "they" are. How insidious.
 
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Desk trauma

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You're not seeming very insidious at present. Perhaps its your special training?
The training must be lost in the mail along with all that round earth shill money I am due.
 
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Aryeh Jay

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The training must be lost in the mail along with all that round earth shill money I am due.

Whoa now! Let’s not get all crazy and start that “round earth” nonsense. We don’t want to have this to end up in the conspiracy area with the nutters.
 
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Trogdor the Burninator

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So debunked, or excused? The two don't mean the same thing. What you are saying is that you give vaccinators an excuse not to undergo double-blind trials for their drugs as is required for other drugs - "for reasons that should be obvious".

No - debunked. Anti-vaxxers make the lack of double-blind trials out as part of some conspiracy, whereas there is a perfectly reasonable explanation - as I pointed out.

What those opposed to vaccines say is that such excuses don't wash - you want us to buy your drugs, you subject them to the same rigour as other drugs - i.e. double-blind placebo trials - this is a matter of science, not ethics.

No - it's a matter of ethics. But if you want the science bit, then as pointed out in the article I linked there are plenty of perfectly scientific ways to determine the effectivensss of vaccines without double blind trials. Just like people do for other (non-vaccine) tests.

If vaccines were subject to such trials, there would be no vaccines, as the trials would prove that vaccines don't work, and that the cure is worse than the disease.

Rubbish. Anti-vaxxers pick up on the "double-blind thing" because they don't understand statistics or science and it gives them something to go "AHA - conspiracy!" about. There are plenty of perfectly scientific ways that we prove vaccines work. The fact that we don't have people dying in the streets of preventable diseases being one
 
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Zoii

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All plagues have a cause. The current autism epidemic is caused by vaccination.

Is this so hard to believe? When you have the majority of the world believing that it came about by a Big Bang, that life evolved, and that there is no God, I can't see why Christians have a problem with believing that the thoughts of man's heart have become darkened.

A law that says you have to breathe oxygen doesn't cause autism is those who obey it.

Most of "modern medicine" is harmful. Sure, surgery, prescription drugs etc. all have their place, but they don't come without side effects, and sometimes, the cure is worse than the disease.
Joshua - time to comprehend what evidence based medicine means
 
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Larniavc

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The world will finely know how science has just been a tool of Satan and that they were deceived when the entire population of Italy has Autism and Cancer in 20 years.
When thimerisal was dramatically reduce/eliminated in the late 90's what happened to autism rates?

Did they decline?
 
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Larniavc

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Unfortunately, they've designed vaccines more subtly than that. Italians will just become more stupid, and sicker (with a small percentage contracting autism, death, cancer etc.). Of course, it might be decades before this can be realised, and by the time it is, the loss in IQ points will make it more difficult for them to overcome the propaganda and attribute their ills to vaccines.
So as well as causing autism vaccines cause low IQ and poor health out comes?

Which vaccines, exactly?
 
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Rick Otto

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It's not "willful ignorance" if you know how vaccines works.
Industry funding of product testing is a conspiracy?
Admiring your bald faced audacity and capacity for deep slumber.
 
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Zoii

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Industry funding of product testing is a conspiracy?
Admiring your bald faced audacity and capacity for deep slumber.
Thats fine whatever you believe - but wheres your evidence. Thats the point...you are expressing opinion backed by no evidence. On the other hand the OP has abundant double-blinded and replicated evidence. Now who is the consumer supposed to believe.... your unfounded comments of peer reviewed research replicated numerous times.
 
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ThatRobGuy

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Anyone who's still an anti-vaxxer at this point has to have such a desire to ignore the evidence-based research in order to preserve their "everything is a conspiracy" dogma, that they literally have to go out of their way to avoid credible scientific research.

The Danish study (that involved 550,000 children...almost every Danish child born from 1991 to 1998), is the conclusive study on the matter.

Of the 550,000, ~450k were vaccinated, ~100k were not.
Their findings:
“There was no increase in the risk of autistic disorder or other autistic-spectrum disorders among vaccinated children as compared with unvaccinated children (adjusted relative risk of autistic disorder, 0.92; 95% confidence interval, 0.68 to 1.24; adjusted relative risk of other autistic-spectrum disorders, 0.83; 95% confidence interval, 0.65 to 1.07).”


It's one thing if conspiracy theorists want to believe that the government is flying planes over their house (all the "Chem Trail" nonsense) or that the government is hiding aliens from us or that George HW Bush and Nixon masterminded the Kennedy assassination, it might make for good fodder, but it doesn't negatively impact anyone else. The movement to not vaccinate kids, however, isn't merely a "harmless wacky theory" like the other things mentioned. It's a direct threat to public health that impacts all of us.

Until the anti-vaxxers can produce a peer-reviewed study that closely watches half a million kids over a period of 7 years and meticulously evaluates all of the results that demonstrates what they're claiming, they have no leg to stand on in this argument.
 
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Rick Otto

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Thats fine whatever you believe - but wheres your evidence. Thats the point...you are expressing opinion backed by no evidence. On the other hand the OP has abundant double-blinded and replicated evidence. Now who is the consumer supposed to believe.... your unfounded comments of peer reviewed research replicated numerous times.
That's fine whatever you believe - no matter that you accept evidence from the perpetrators as valid. You are forming your opinion without researching and repeating what you have been told without any evidence of it being true.
Your supposed to believe whoever you want to believe just like you started out saying, but why you want to believe the foxes when they tell you there's no trouble in the henhouse defies intuition.
 
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Zoii

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That's fine whatever you believe - no matter that you accept evidence from the perpetrators as valid. You are forming your opinion without researching and repeating what you have been told without any evidence of it being true.
Your supposed to believe whoever you want to believe just like you started out saying, but why you want to believe the foxes when they tell you there's no trouble in the henhouse defies intuition.
Quantitative research is not an opinion... its a measure. Did giving substance A cause action B...yes or no...thats NOT an opinion and I think you know that very well and are choosing to be obtuse. But your deliberate choice to be obtuse causes harm to others..thats not an opinion that is measured objectively.

I will retract this though if you can show me double blinded evidence of your position...but you cant and that's why so far you havent offered any references... I on the pother hand can offer you numerous references to quantitative studies.
 
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