It Comes To A Head On Wednesday

[Redwingfan9]

I already get every weekend. The lawyer wants to take that from me and go to every other. I am willing to do three weekends a month, but no lower than that. My kids deserve more of my time than every other weekend and one day during the week.

The original court ordered one was Monday evening to Thursday afternoon. I can no longer do that, so we went to the every weekend verbal agreement. Maybe that explains it more for you.

Have you guys tried mediating this dispute?

 

[Sparagmos]

I probably sound resentful here, but if you heard me speak you wouldn't get that sense. Resentment, grudges and other such things take too much energy and I don't engage in them. It's apparently one of my redeeming qualities according to my girlfriend. Lol

They get fed more than Ramen for sure. Also do lots of things for them and with them when I can. We do lots of things with my girlfriend and her son as well. She even bought us SeaWorld annual passes so we can go there as well.

The thing you sounded resentful about was paying $550 to take care of your kids. It sounds like you are young, and still have a low-wage job. All parents have to make sacrifices for their kids, but you are talking about it as if this money is going to her needs, rather than to your kids’ needs. Kids cost money, and many parents have to work two jobs to take care of their family’s basic needs. That’s more a fact of life than the court or your ex being unreasonable.

 

[Isilwen]

Have you guys tried mediating this dispute?

Yes. We only did so because I brought up the fact that in our divorce decree it states that if either of us has a problem we are to try and resolve it on our own, failing that, we are to do mediation and failing that it then goes to the courts. She skipped the first two steps and when I pointed out what the divorce decree says, the lawyer set up mediation.

Mediation was slated for an hour, it lasted 15 minutes. I went in good faith that we could come to an agreement, my ex-wife and her lawyer only wanted what they wanted and wouldn't budge. I believe it was only done so they could check it off that it was done and nothing more. The mediator seemed frustrated by them. He didn't say anything, but the looks he would give me when he would come in with their demands showed enough.

 

[HappyHope]

Don’t know if any of you will remember, but I was served with child support modification papers back in July 2019. It has taken till now for a final hearing. It was supposed to be May, but Covid happened. Her lawyer asked that a motion for continuance be granted because anything other than an in-person hearing would prejudice my ex-wife. Wednesday’s hearing will be virtual anyway. I am still representing myself.

I just received her exhibits on Thursday and the lawyer is going to ask for me to pay $553 a month. That effectively leaves me with under $600 a month to live off of. It will increase her income to almost $1800 a month clear as she receives disability for her income. The lawyer has it in her bed that she’ll be able to have the kids removed from my insurance and that will free up income for me. She’s failing to understand that the plan through my employer remains the same premium whether there is one kid or twenty kids on the plan. It does not change when a child has been removed. That makes my income higher than what it truly is.

To give you an idea of what intake home per year, because of my insurance I grossed 23k last year, but only brought home a little over 16k net income. That was before my insurance went up back in December. So far this year, I have grossed $17,200 and only brought home a little under $8,000.

If she was to win, I would make less from that point forward per year than I have so far this year.

I just don’t know what to do. If the judge awards her what they are asking for, I cannot survive on that little per month. It almost makes me not want to work at all because all I am doing is working to pay my ex-wife money for child support. I won’t do that because all it will do is land me in jail and my driver’s license taken from me.

Everyone who is a friend of mine, co-worker, family or girlfriend’s family say that she won’t be able to get that much. The judge will see that makes me destitute and put her at much more advantaged. I just don’t know.

I am scared, very scared!

Don’t know if any of you will remember, but I was served with child support modification papers back in July 2019. It has taken till now for a final hearing. It was supposed to be May, but Covid happened. Her lawyer asked that a motion for continuance be granted because anything other than an in-person hearing would prejudice my ex-wife. Wednesday’s hearing will be virtual anyway. I am still representing myself.

I just received her exhibits on Thursday and the lawyer is going to ask for me to pay $553 a month. That effectively leaves me with under $600 a month to live off of. It will increase her income to almost $1800 a month clear as she receives disability for her income. The lawyer has it in her bed that she’ll be able to have the kids removed from my insurance and that will free up income for me. She’s failing to understand that the plan through my employer remains the same premium whether there is one kid or twenty kids on the plan. It does not change when a child has been removed. That makes my income higher than what it truly is.

To give you an idea of what intake home per year, because of my insurance I grossed 23k last year, but only brought home a little over 16k net income. That was before my insurance went up back in December. So far this year, I have grossed $17,200 and only brought home a little under $8,000.

If she was to win, I would make less from that point forward per year than I have so far this year.

I just don’t know what to do. If the judge awards her what they are asking for, I cannot survive on that little per month. It almost makes me not want to work at all because all I am doing is working to pay my ex-wife money for child support. I won’t do that because all it will do is land me in jail and my driver’s license taken from me.

Everyone who is a friend of mine, co-worker, family or girlfriend’s family say that she won’t be able to get that much. The judge will see that makes me destitute and put her at much more advantaged. I just don’t know.

I am scared, very scared!

Be sure to keep all your paperwork in order for your court date. Make sure your situation is crystal clear.

My uncle's first wife took him to court to get more child support at one point. When the paperwork was sorted, it was shown my uncle had actually overpaid his child support by a few cents. The judge was very harsh with my uncle's first wife telling her she better not waste the court's time again. She had future opportunities to try and get more child support but she never did after that.

 

[Isilwen]

The thing you sounded resentful about was paying $550 to take care of your kids. It sounds like you are young, and still have a low-wage job. All parents have to make sacrifices for their kids, but you are talking about it as if this money is going to her needs, rather than to your kids’ needs. Kids cost money, and many parents have to work two jobs to take care of their family’s basic needs. That’s more a fact of life than the court or your ex being unreasonable.

I am forty-five years old and work as an EMT, well within my skill set as that is all I know. I actually make more than most EMTs in this area as I have been with the same company for almost four years now and have gotten some raises and am very good at what I do, having done this for almost 19 years off and on.

What you don't see is what I see because this is my life and not yours. You don't see her posting pictures of her going to Fleming's Steakhouse for dinner, or as I mentioned before, see her going to a seafood place and getting a crab boil at $25 a pound or going out here or there. Yet the kids are in shoes with holes in them when they come to me, or in clothes too small for them. She can go out to expensive restaurants, why can she not buy them new clothes or even go to a thrift store as I have done or shopped the clearance isles in Walmart as I have done? I don't see what I am already paying her going towards these kids. I was in arrears and didn't know it till I received a letter from the state. Apparently, I was in arrears from the start because of when the divorce hearing happened. So, I got that paid as soon as I could. She received $299 dollars at once. Do you know what she told me she did with it? Put her cat down. I have given her $4300 above and beyond child support out of three tax refunds since being divorced. I have provided for my children above and beyond what I was obligated to.

Hell, I was even given more than I was supposed to give because according to how much I had them per week and my income, I only had to give $68.48 a month, I chose to give her $100 and had that court-ordered.

Her rent is only $468 a month for a 3/2. She no longer has a car payment, and she gets $486 in food stamps. Her boyfriend lives with her and there is no way he is living there free, although he too is on disability, but has a rental that he owns and a side business or two. She once told me that he brings in close to $2000 a month.

So, if she was to win the $553 a month from me, she will have close to $1800 a month and leaving me with less than $600. Child support is supposed to make the households even, not make one better than the other. What part of the $1200 difference makes the households even?

Also, don't forget, I have her bank statements for the last year. I see what she has done with her money. There isn't much there for the kids, and what she says she has spent on the dog, her car, and other expenses aren't showing there either.

many parents have to work two jobs to take care of their family’s basic needs.

Many times that is because they are living outside their means or want the finer things in life, not all the time, but many times. I choose to spend time with my children. To me, time with them is more valuable than money that I can give them that may or may not even go to them. I don't want to hear as someone else said, you worked too much daddy, we wanted your time. I know what it is like as a child to want more time with my parent and not being able to get it because of how much they worked.

I am not resentful, I am defensive though. That I will give you.

 

[NerdGirl]

Don’t know if any of you will remember, but I was served with child support modification papers back in July 2019. It has taken till now for a final hearing. It was supposed to be May, but Covid happened. Her lawyer asked that a motion for continuance be granted because anything other than an in-person hearing would prejudice my ex-wife. Wednesday’s hearing will be virtual anyway. I am still representing myself.

I just received her exhibits on Thursday and the lawyer is going to ask for me to pay $553 a month. That effectively leaves me with under $600 a month to live off of. It will increase her income to almost $1800 a month clear as she receives disability for her income. The lawyer has it in her bed that she’ll be able to have the kids removed from my insurance and that will free up income for me. She’s failing to understand that the plan through my employer remains the same premium whether there is one kid or twenty kids on the plan. It does not change when a child has been removed. That makes my income higher than what it truly is.

To give you an idea of what intake home per year, because of my insurance I grossed 23k last year, but only brought home a little over 16k net income. That was before my insurance went up back in December. So far this year, I have grossed $17,200 and only brought home a little under $8,000.

If she was to win, I would make less from that point forward per year than I have so far this year.

I just don’t know what to do. If the judge awards her what they are asking for, I cannot survive on that little per month. It almost makes me not want to work at all because all I am doing is working to pay my ex-wife money for child support. I won’t do that because all it will do is land me in jail and my driver’s license taken from me.

Everyone who is a friend of mine, co-worker, family or girlfriend’s family say that she won’t be able to get that much. The judge will see that makes me destitute and put her at much more advantaged. I just don’t know.

I am scared, very scared!

I'm very sorry to hear about your situation. As a woman who was a single mother for many years, I cannot stand women who think they can or should milk their ex boyfriends or husbands for all they can get, in the name of child support. I think child support orders should factor in the living situation, income, expenses, etc, of the man just as much as the woman.

Pray that you get a fair and understanding judge to hear your case. Speak plainly and calmly about your concerns. They are valid. Explain everything that you explained here in your post.

Wishing you the best, and a favorable outcome.

 

[NerdGirl]

It might sound like a lot but you know it costs a fortune to raise a child. How would you provide for your child if you had custody? I was a single dad raising my daughter and I had to work all the OT I could get and take on a part time job too. Does my daughter appreciate it, nope. All I ever hear is how I was always working and she never saw me. It doesn't matter though, I did it for her not for the praise.

It will be tough for a while but the kids are worth it.

For whatever it's worth, I raised my son on a very small income, by myself and without help. It is quite possible.

 

[Isilwen]

I'm very sorry to hear about your situation. As a woman who was a single mother for many years, I cannot stand women who think they can or should milk their ex boyfriends or husbands for all they can get, in the name of child support. I think child support orders should factor in the living situation, income, expenses, etc, of the man just as much as the woman.

Pray that you get a fair and understanding judge to hear your case. Speak plainly and calmly about your concerns. They are valid. Explain everything that you explained here in your post.

Wishing you the best, and a favorable outcome.

Thank you so much! I wish there were more women like you and my ex-girlfriend.

My ex-girlfriend had her mother as an example. When her mother and father divorced, her lawyer said we're going to take him for everything he's got. Her mom said that we will do no such thing and asked for the minimum child support that she could get.

 

[NerdGirl]

You are talking like your wife is getting the money for herself, but she’s not.

To be fair, there is no way to control what she does with the money. Nobody's going to track her down and demand receipts to prove she spent the money on daycare and applesauce cups instead of a new pair of earrings for herself. Just sayin'.

 

[NerdGirl]

Thank you so much! I wish there were more women like you and my ex-girlfriend.

My ex-girlfriend had her mother as an example. When her mother and father divorced, her lawyer said we're going to take him for everything he's got. Her mom said that we will do no such thing and asked for the minimum child support that she could get.

That's exactly how it works in most court systems, sadly. When I would go to the child support mediations, my ex wouldn't show up, so they'd say "do you know what he does for a living?" I said, "Well, I think he paints houses, but I'm not sure since we don't keep in contact." And they said, "Well, let's look at the highest possible income bracket for painters and go with that."

It felt very wrong and one-sided to me. After a few years, I just went back to court and dismissed the order altogether. I didn't want this man involved in my life or my son's life (for many reasons) and it felt stingy and greedy to demand money from him. The judge even asked me if someone was coercing me into dismissing the order. I guess they didn't expect that someone would rather be a little poorer but keep her conscience clear.

 

[Isilwen]

That's exactly how it works in most court systems, sadly. When I would go to the child support mediations, my ex wouldn't show up, so they'd say "do you know what he does for a living?" I said, "Well, I think he paints houses, but I'm not sure since we don't keep in contact." And they said, "Well, let's look at the highest possible income bracket for painters and go with that."

It felt very wrong and one-sided to me. After a few years, I just went back to court and dismissed the order altogether. I didn't want this man involved in my life or my son's life (for many reasons) and it felt stingy and greedy to demand money from him. The judge even asked me if someone was coercing me into dismissing the order. I guess they didn't expect that someone would rather be a little poorer but keep her conscience clear.

I applaud you for how you handled it! She is not likely to dismiss it as it seems she only cares for money.

I offered to take the kids for the school year as not to expose them and ultimately her (her immune system is gone and it would be a death sentence for her) to Covid-19 in school as she was sending them for in-person learning. My girlfriend would have stayed with them and worked from my place and helped them during the day for the three days I was at work. The last two days I would do it. She ignored the offer.

She really just wants the money and I feel like these kids are only pawns to get money from me.

 

[NerdGirl]

I get that, but you don't seem to understand that I literally have no money at all to pay a lawyer. They want at least $2000 up front in one payment to retain them.

I don't even bring home $2000 in four paychecks.

I'm in a similar situation lol. I've been advised to get a lawyer, and I'm like "You realize I'm going to have trouble just paying rent, right?" Where do they think these extra thousands of dollars for a lawyer will come from?

 

[NerdGirl]

I applaud you for how you handled it! She is not likely to dismiss it as it seems she only cares for money.

I offered to take the kids for the school year as not to expose them and ultimately her (her immune system is gone and it would be a death sentence for her) to Covid-19 in school as she was sending them for in-person learning. My girlfriend would have stayed with them and worked from my place and helped them during the day for the three days I was at work. The last two days I would do it. She ignored the offer.

She really just wants the money and I feel like these kids are only pawns to get money from me.

Tragically, that is the case sometimes. I've seen some incredibly greedy, vengeful women out there when it comes to custody and child support cases.

 

[Sparagmos]

I am forty-five years old and work as an EMT, well within my skill set as that is all I know. I actually make more than most EMTs in this area as I have been with the same company for almost four years now and have gotten some raises and am very good at what I do, having done this for almost 19 years off and on.

What you don't see is what I see because this is my life and not yours. You don't see her posting pictures of her going to Fleming's Steakhouse for dinner, or as I mentioned before, see her going to a seafood place and getting a crab boil at $25 a pound or going out here or there. Yet the kids are in shoes with holes in them when they come to me, or in clothes too small for them. She can go out to expensive restaurants, why can she not buy them new clothes or even go to a thrift store as I have done or shopped the clearance isles in Walmart as I have done? I don't see what I am already paying her going towards these kids. I was in arrears and didn't know it till I received a letter from the state. Apparently, I was in arrears from the start because of when the divorce hearing happened. So, I got that paid as soon as I could. She received $299 dollars at once. Do you know what she told me she did with it? Put her cat down. I have given her $4300 above and beyond child support out of three tax refunds since being divorced. I have provided for my children above and beyond what I was obligated to.

Hell, I was even given more than I was supposed to give because according to how much I had them per week and my income, I only had to give $68.48 a month, I chose to give her $100 and had that court-ordered.

Her rent is only $468 a month for a 3/2. She no longer has a car payment, and she gets $486 in food stamps. Her boyfriend lives with her and there is no way he is living there free, although he too is on disability, but has a rental that he owns and a side business or two. She once told me that he brings in close to $2000 a month.

So, if she was to win the $553 a month from me, she will have close to $1800 a month and leaving me with less than $600. Child support is supposed to make the households even, not make one better than the other. What part of the $1200 difference makes the households even?

Also, don't forget, I have her bank statements for the last year. I see what she has done with her money. There isn't much there for the kids, and what she says she has spent on the dog, her car, and other expenses aren't showing there either.



Many times that is because they are living outside their means or want the finer things in life, not all the time, but many times. I choose to spend time with my children. To me, time with them is more valuable than money that I can give them that may or may not even go to them. I don't want to hear as someone else said, you worked too much daddy, we wanted your time. I know what it is like as a child to want more time with my parent and not being able to get it because of how much they worked.

I am not resentful, I am defensive though. That I will give you.

That’s a lot more info, thank you. I’m sorry for assuming you were younger! You must live in an area with far lower wages and costs of living than where I am. The income you described is below the poverty line where I am. I do think the disparity in incomes, does fit the number of people being supported. Children aren’t really cheaper than adults, they need new clothes and shoes more often and have extracurricular activities and school expenses. So if she is supporting three people and you are supporting one her having three times as much money seems about right. I don’t say that to in any way minimize the unfairness of your ex neglecting your kids to buy things for herself. That is very sad. I know nothing about how you can address her neglect of the kids but it seems like it would be relevant to the court.

 

[Sparagmos]

To be fair, there is no way to control what she does with the money. Nobody's going to track her down and demand receipts to prove she spent the money on daycare and applesauce cups instead of a new pair of earrings for herself. Just sayin'.

I didn’t know she was being so irresponsible before the OP explained it. Is that right? He can’t show the court she’s being negligent and get more custody?

 

[Isilwen]

I do think the disparity in incomes, does fit the number of people being supported.

I think you missed what I was saying though. I have to find it again, but basically, child support is supposed to make both households equal in income. This way, one household doesn't become the fun household and the other the kids just don't want to go to because it's no fun.

Right now, even with what I pay her in child support now, she gets more than me. Giving her $553 a month makes it so that she is $1200 more than me. That is not equal. Not by a long shot.

You mentioned extra-curricular activities, we are to split those per the divorce decree. Clothes? I have to buy them clothes for over there and my home? Seems unfair to me. She doesn't have to provide anything for them out of her own money, it must all come from me? Okay, she has rent and utilities. Well, so do I. Seems I am having to pay double, pay for my own household and hers. Where does she have any financial responsibility of her own with the kids? She gets to just use my money for the kids and her own she gets to galavant?

That is why the households are supposed to be equal. If I have to work all the time to support my house and hers, when do I get to spend time with the kids? I'm sorry, but this dog won't hunt when it comes to that.

I will answer your statement of neglect and your question to the other poster in another reply.

 

[Isilwen]

He can’t show the court she’s being negligent and get more custody?

It is very hard to prove that a parent is neglecting their children when they are using child support money. Technically, while the money is supposed to be used for the kids, they can just as well say that they paid the rent or for food or utilities with it and that is part of their taking care of the children.

She would have to physically harm them for a court to look into allegations of neglect and more than likely, CPS would have to be involved as well.

I am going to do the virtual hearing and try and prove my case. I don't mind paying another $50 or even $100 and being able to keep my being able to have them every weekend. That would be a win to me. That is what I am hoping for.

 

[Sparagmos]

I think you missed what I was saying though. I have to find it again, but basically, child support is supposed to make both households equal in income. This way, one household doesn't become the fun household and the other the kids just don't want to go to because it's no fun.

Right now, even with what I pay her in child support now, she gets more than me. Giving her $553 a month makes it so that she is $1200 more than me. That is not equal. Not by a long shot.

You mentioned extra-curricular activities, we are to split those per the divorce decree. Clothes? I have to buy them clothes for over there and my home? Seems unfair to me. She doesn't have to provide anything for them out of her own money, it must all come from me? Okay, she has rent and utilities. Well, so do I. Seems I am having to pay double, pay for my own household and hers. Where does she have any financial responsibility of her own with the kids? She gets to just use my money for the kids and her own she gets to galavant?

That is why the households are supposed to be equal. If I have to work all the time to support my house and hers, when do I get to spend time with the kids? I'm sorry, but this dog won't hunt when it comes to that.

I will answer your statement of neglect and your question to the other poster in another reply.

I’m sorry, perhaps I misunderstood again. Do the kids spend equal time in each home? Then I would agree the $$ should be equal.

 

[Isilwen]

I’m sorry, perhaps I misunderstood again. Do the kids spend equal time in each home? Then I would agree the $$ should be equal.

They do not.

When I mean equal, I mean equal in incomes. Not time or anything other than income. Child support is not supposed to make one parent rich and the other destitute. That is what I mean by equal.

 

[Sparagmos]

They do not.

When I mean equal, I mean equal in incomes. Not time or anything other than income. Child support is not supposed to make one parent rich and the other destitute. That is what I mean by equal.

So, not to beat a dead horse but if the kids are spending most of their time with one parent, that parent will have to spend more money on the kids. If the incomes were equal but one parent had to spend twice as much on food and expenses that’s not fair.