Israel does not permit civil marriages or marriages between Jews and non Jews

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Nimrauko

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No, I am saying that you as a human being are fallible and make mistakes. Your zionist interpretation of Judaism and the OT is what is fallible and a mistake. Many, many torah believing Jews agree and look upon the State of Isarel as an abomination.



That is what our scriptures tell us. That is what was demonstrated to the world in 70AD.



I have, a great deal. I say it because it is true BY DEFNITION.

The "why" does not change the "What". . . . you are trying to use your "why" to make the "What" something other than it really is . .

In otherwords, you are trying to use the Law from the Old Covenant to make the RACISM that you embrace something other than racism.

The Law you claim is God's will that you use to day does not change what Israel is doing into something other than Racism . . . it is still Racism.



First of all, Chrsitianity never said that. . . some christians said that. Chrisitanity never taught that. That is not a teaching of Christianity.

Second of all, we are not talking about a religion, but about a SECULAR STATE - a GOVERNMENT - a SECULAR ENTITY.

When the United States did that, the United States was racist.

Israel is doing it today . . that makes Israel racist.

This is a simple fact by definition.




No you can't have interfaith marriages . . . . Look again . . .

And again, this is not about a religion, but what a SECULAR STATE is doing . . . making and implementing racist policies and laws.

.
Funny you call me a zionist, when I am not. I am not for zionist in any sense of the world. I call you the racist dear friend.
 
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Tanakh

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Sense you say that this is not about religion but secular Israel I can assure you that if Israel was a religious state we would be executing those who marry outside of Judaism as for us Jews this it leaving the faith. Tell me are you simply against the secular Israeli government or are you hate-filled toward Judaism, as I strongly see it is the later feeling.
 
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Nimrauko

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Sense you say that this is not about religion but secular Israel I can assure you that if Israel was a religious state we would be executing those who marry outside of Judaism as for us Jews this it leaving the faith. Tell me are you simply against the secular Israeli government or are you hate-filled toward Judaism, as I strongly see it is the later feeling.
Well since she likes to make sweeping gernalazations of people, lets see, shes catholic so she must be anti-semetic.

I am quite upset that she called me a zionist beings I am strongly agaisnt zionism :(
 
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thereselittleflower

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G-d commanded us Jews to have children and to teach them the laws of G-d so I don't see your point in showing the rise in the number of Jews living in Israel when we are commanded to dwell their and carry out G-d's laws. Granted I hate Israel being a secular state but I can only imagine what you would say if Israel were to be a true Torah nation (Theocracy) which is what Israel must become as this is what Israel as always been destined to be. You have said that you are not against Judaism but only against the actions of Israel's current government and yet I can guarantee you that if Israel were to become a Theocracy, the regime of the Torah, then the "Palestinians" will surly be destroyed. I am very sure you would not want that and sense G-d commands Israel to destroy those within the Biblical borders as well as to destroy those who hate Israel but love its enemies then clearly you hate us Jews and G-d's law because no one can love our enemies and then claim they love us as well. You are a hypocrite to say you love Judaism but then say you think the "Palestinians" deserve more. They deserve nothing more then what we Jews are commanded to do to them which is to completely destroy them so now tell me do you really hate the Israeli government or are you really out to stick it to us Jews? In this I am a bit confused with what you say for how can you be for us when you are against the very mandate (the Torah) that says the very thing you so detest; the "mistreatment" of "Palestine" is what you hate and yet the Torah (Jewish law) says to destroy them. So tell me do you still love Judaism or are you just simply delusional?

You make some very fundamenatal errors in your claims above . ..

First, you have confused your zionism with judaism.

They are not the same thing.


Second, you are ignoring G-d's own words and commands to give the non-Jew equal inherentance in the land right along with the tribes of Israel . . . . .

Instead, you want the non-Jew destroyed out of the land rather than obey your G-d and given them equal inheritance in the land with the Jews . . . .
"When a stranger sojourns with you in your land, you shall not do him wrong. The stranger who sojourns with you shall be to you as the native among you, and you shall love him as yourself; for you were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the LORD your God." (Lev 19:33-34).

"So you shall divide this land among you according to the tribes of Israel. You shall allot it as an inheritance for yourselves and for the strangers who reside among you and have begotten children among you. They shall be to you as native-born sons of Israel; with you they shall be allotted an inheritance among the tribes of Israel. In whatever tribe the stranger resides, there you shall assign him his inheritance, says the Lord GOD."(Ezek 47:21-23)

You contradict yourself and your claims, and by your own words calling for the destruction of the Palestinians, the "stranger among you", make yourself a hater of what God has commanded in His Law above!

.
 
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Nimrauko

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You make some very fundamenatal errors in your claims above . ..

First, you have confused your zionism with judaism.

They are not the same thing.


Second, you are ignoring G-d's own words and commands to give the non-Jew equal inherentance in the land right along with the tribes of Israel . . . . .

Instead, you want the non-Jew destroyed out of the land rather than obey your G-d and given them equal inheritance in the land with the Jews . . . .
"When a stranger sojourns with you in your land, you shall not do him wrong. The stranger who sojourns with you shall be to you as the native among you, and you shall love him as yourself; for you were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the LORD your God." (Lev 19:33-34).

"So you shall divide this land among you according to the tribes of Israel. You shall allot it as an inheritance for yourselves and for the strangers who reside among you and have begotten children among you. They shall be to you as native-born sons of Israel; with you they shall be allotted an inheritance among the tribes of Israel. In whatever tribe the stranger resides, there you shall assign him his inheritance, says the Lord GOD."(Ezek 47:21-23)

You contradict yourself and your claims, and by your own words calling for the destruction of the Palestinians, the "stranger among you", make yourself a hater of what God has commanded in His Law above!

.
I dont see where you pulled that rabbit out of.
HE IS SAYING THAT INTERFAITH MARRIAGE IS NOT GOOD. Not that the non-jews should be destroyed. Oy vey.

Your problem really isnt with Zionism so put that smoke screen away. You dont like Judaism as a whole. Lets be real.
 
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thereselittleflower

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Well since she likes to make sweeping gernalazations of people, lets see, shes catholic so she must be anti-semetic.

That's called demonization and ad hominem. Since I am semitic myself, you are very far off base.

I am quite upset that she called me a zionist beings I am strongly agaisnt zionism :(

Then why are you supporting the racist policies and laws of a zionist state?

Why aren't you instead supporting for reform of those laws of the GOVERNMENT to allow intermarriage between Jews and others, especially when those Jews are Jews by birth and not faith and so the Jewish faith has no jurisdiction over them?

The GOVERNMENT is not Judaism . . . it is not religious. . it is a STATE . . a SECULAR STATE.


.
 
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Nimrauko

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That's called demonization and ad hominem. Since I am semitic myself, you are very far off base.



Then why are you supporting the racist policies and laws of a zionist state?

Why aren't you instead supporting for reform of those laws of the GOVERNMENT to allow intermarriage between Jews and others, especially when those Jews are Jews by birth and not faith and so the Jewish faith has no jurisdiction over them?

The GOVERNMENT is not Judaism . . . it is not religious. . it is a STATE . . a SECULAR STATE.


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Because inter faith marriage IS banned by my faith.
And Israel IS a religious state. If you dont realize that then there is no hope for you.

Semetic people can be anti-semetic, so dont think it impossible.
 
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thereselittleflower

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I dont see where you pulled that rabbit out of.

It's called YOUR scriptures . . . . .are you unfamiliar with them? :scratch:

HE IS SAYING THAT INTERFAITH MARRIAGE IS NOT GOOD. Not that the non-jews should be destroyed. Oy vey.

That is a RELIGIOUS issue . . not a STATE issue . .

Israel is not a religion, it is a GOVERNMENT, one that claims to be a DEMOCRACY, which is to promote equality for all of its citizens.

Israel does not do that.

Instead, it promotes Racism, for its laws and policies are racist.


We are talking about a STATE that does not provide any way for NON RELIGIOUS Jews to marry anyone but a Jew . . . .

Since the religions in Israel do not generally permit marriages between faiths, it falls to the government to do so, just as it does in the US.

Israel, which is a ZIONIST SECULAR GOVERMENT, refuses to allow this.

Your problem really isnt with Zionism so put that smoke screen away. You dont like Judaism as a whole. Lets be real.

This is your smoke and mirrors, nothing more. I have nothing to say about Judaism as Jews which to practice it as a religion.

It is ZIONISM which has hijacked Judaism and is using it for its own purposes . . . . and it is Zionism which governs the principles and laws of the STATE of Israel. And there are many, many Torah believing Jews who reject Zionism and the racist policies of Israel just as much as I do. So you are really rallying against not me, but all the Jews whom I stand in union with against such racism in Israel.

So, when you are ready to address these real issues, let me know.

.
 
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Tanakh

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That's called demonization and ad hominem. Since I am semitic myself, you are very far off base.



Then why are you supporting the racist policies and laws of a zionist state?

Why aren't you instead supporting for reform of those laws of the GOVERNMENT to allow intermarriage between Jews and others, especially when those Jews are Jews by birth and not faith and so the Jewish faith has no jurisdiction over them?

The GOVERNMENT is not Judaism . . . it is not religious. . it is a STATE . . a SECULAR STATE.


.

The term anti-semitic was coined by a Jew-hater so I do not use it yet sense Zion is the traditional name for Jerusalem and Zion represents Israel you are very clearly anti-zionist or in other words anti-Jew. The secular state did not institute those laws Judaism did and again a Jew is not allowed to marry a gentile no matter if they are religious or not. The law of marriage is Jewish law and is one of the few religious laws that the secular state adheres to so yes the state is secular but in this case the laws of marriage are religious, although they are not strict enough in most cases.
 
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Nimrauko

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Nimrauko, since the vast majority of Jews in Israel are NON religious, why is it they can't marry who they want to marry?

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Non Religious Jews may marry whom they wish. Observant jews wouldnt dare to marry a goyim.

Oh and one more thing, out of all the countries in the world that are far worse than israel, why do you single out Israel? For your love of israel? No that isnt it. What is the true reason
 
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Tanakh

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Non Religious Jews may marry whom they wish. Observant jews wouldnt dare to marry a goyim.

Oh and one more thing, out of all the countries in the world that are far worse than israel, why do you single out Israel? For your love of israel? No that isnt it. What is the true reason
She clearly serves the pope of Rome sense it takes a Catholic to think like this. The Vatican is simply [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]ed that they don't have Jerusalem and have instilled their sick religion into their followers but then again not much good as come out of the Vatican anyway so it is not shocking that she thinks this way.
 
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thereselittleflower

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The term anti-semitic was coined by a Jew-hater so I do not use it yet sense Zion is the traditional name for Jerusalem and Zion represents Israel you are very clearly anti-zionist or in other words anti-Jew.

That is called the logical fallacy of the Non Sequitor . . ie the Conclusion does not follow.

It is a favorite logical fallacy engaged in often by Zionists. It is, in fact, one of the favorite, for it has a supreficial appearance of reasonableness until one looks at it closer .. .

Zionism is a movement, an ideology. . . it is not a race or a religion.

So, to be against an ideology, a movement is to be neither against a race or a religion.

If it is to be not against a race, then it is highly illogical for one who is against zionism (and we are speaking of Political Zionism for that is what govern's Israel) to be labeled against the Jews.

This is even more evident when one takes into account that there are many, many Jews who are against Zionism . . surely they are not against Jews or Judaism, as they are observant and devout Torah believers.

So the highly illogical and fallacous nature of your argument is exposed for what it is . .a cheep shot that can't even come anywhere close to hitting its intended mark . . . .


The secular state did not institute those laws Judaism did and again a Jew is not allowed to marry a gentile no matter if they are religious or not.

And so you continue to confuse the religion with the state.

Israel is a SECULAR state. As a secular state that claims to be a democracy, it has moral obligations to see that its citizens are treated fairly and equally. It makes for no provision for Jews to marry whom they want, even if they are not religious.

A religion has no jurisdiction over those who are not part of it, to dictate to them what they will or will not do.

And Judaism does not try to dictate to non religiolus Jews what they can or cannot do. Judaism leaves them alone.

It is not Judaism that is at the root of this . . it is Political ZIONISM which has hujacked Judaism and history for its own devices.

The law of marriage is Jewish law and is one of the few religious laws that the secular state adheres to so yes the state is secular but in this case the laws of marriage are religious, although they are not strict enough in most cases.

Laws of marriage in a religion are religious. Laws of a state are secular. Israel discriminates against those Jews who reject Judaism and embrace another religion or atheism/agnosticism. Israel discriminates against any who want to marry a Jew.

And so this is one of the varoius ways the secular state has revealed its racist nature and that is is, indeed, not at all a democracy, which accepts its moral obligation to see that all its citizens are treated fairly.


All you are doing is justifying racism . . nothing more . . .


.
 
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thereselittleflower

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Non Religious Jews may marry whom they wish.

How so? Where is the law that permits and provides civil marriage to such non religious Jews?

Observant jews wouldnt dare to marry a goyim.

Oh and one more thing, out of all the countries in the world that are far worse than israel, why do you single out Israel? For your love of israel? No that isnt it. What is the true reason

First, I disagree that there are so many countries worse that Israel . . . . Israel is guilty of ethnic cleansing and terrible crimes just as are many other countries.

Why do I focus on Israel?

1) There are christians here who support the state of Israel who have absolutely no clue what it is they are supporting, that they are supporting something that stands totally against the Chrisitanity and moral principles they hold dear.

2) These same christians call for the government of the US to support Israel

3) The government of the US sends a huge amount of support to the State of Israel and the majority of those who think it is a good idea know nothing of what the reality is on the ground there or the horrible policies they are supporting.

4)Neither christians or the US support any other country guilty of such horrible crimes in any way that even comes close to the support given Israel.​

The crimes of Israel, its Zionists goals, policies and methods, of perpetuating such crimes and why, need to be brought out into the open so this support can be rationally and logically evaluated.

That's why. :)


.
 
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Nimrauko

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How so? Where is the law that permits and provides civil marriage to such non religious Jews?



First, I disagree that there are so many countries worse that Israel . . . . Israel is guilty of ethnic cleansing and terrible crimes just as are many other countries.

Why do I focus on Israel?

1) There are christians here who support the state of Israel who have absolutely no clue what it is they are supporting, that they are supporting something that stands totally against the Chrisitanity and moral principles they hold dear.

2) These same christians call for the government of the US to support Israel

3) The government of the US sends a huge amount of support to the State of Israel and the majority of those who think it is a good idea know nothing of what the reality is on the ground there or the horrible policies they are supporting.

4)Neither christians or the US support any other country guilty of such horrible crimes in any way that even comes close to the support given Israel.​

The crimes of Israel, its Zionists goals, policies and methods, of perpetuating such crimes and why, need to be brought out into the open so this support can be rationally and logically evaluated.

That's why. :)


.
I see im arguing with a brick wall whoms allegiance lies with rome and rome alone
 
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thereselittleflower

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You make some very fundamenatal errors in your claims above . ..

First, you have confused your zionism with judaism.

They are not the same thing.


Second, you are ignoring G-d's own words and commands to give the non-Jew equal inherentance in the land right along with the tribes of Israel . . . . .

Instead, you want the non-Jew destroyed out of the land rather than obey your G-d and given them equal inheritance in the land with the Jews . . . .
"When a stranger sojourns with you in your land, you shall not do him wrong. The stranger who sojourns with you shall be to you as the native among you, and you shall love him as yourself; for you were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the LORD your God." (Lev 19:33-34).

"So you shall divide this land among you according to the tribes of Israel. You shall allot it as an inheritance for yourselves and for the strangers who reside among you and have begotten children among you. They shall be to you as native-born sons of Israel; with you they shall be allotted an inheritance among the tribes of Israel. In whatever tribe the stranger resides, there you shall assign him his inheritance, says the Lord GOD."(Ezek 47:21-23)

You contradict yourself and your claims, and by your own words calling for the destruction of the Palestinians, the "stranger among you", make yourself a hater of what God has commanded in His Law above!

.

Tanakh, I am sure we would all like an exlanation why you are calling for the destruction of the Palestinians in opposition to these words of the Law and the Prophets

The Zionist tactic, as revealed by Bernstein, after resorting to the anti-semitic card, is first to ignore all issues that expose their errors and crimes . . . . to act as such evidences don't exist . . .

I am well aware of the tactics YOU, my Zionist brethren, use to quiet anyone who attempts to expose any of your subversive acts.
If the person is a gentile, you cry, "you're anti-Semitic," which is nothing more than a smokescreen to hide your actions.
But if a Jew is the person doing the exposing, you resort to other tactics:
* First, you ignore the charges, hoping the information will not be given widespread distribution.
* If the information starts reaching too many people, you ridicule the information and the person or persons giving the information.
* If that doesn't work, your next step is character assassination. If the author or speaker hasn't been involved in sufficient scandal, you are adept at fabricating a scandal against the person or persons.
* If none of these are effective, you are known to resort to physical attacks.
But NEVER do you try to prove the information wrong.


AN AMERICAN JEW IN RACIST MARXIST ISRAEL

The Life of an American Jew
in Racist-Marxist Israel
by Jack Bernstein


http://wake-up-america.net/AN AMERICAN JEW IN RACIST MARXIST ISRAEL.htm


Are you going to continue to employ the same tactics here? You've already employed the first one, the "anti-semitic" smokescreen . . .


.

.
 
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Tanakh

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That is called the logical fallacy of the Non Sequitor . . ie the Conclusion does not follow.

It is a favorite logical fallacy engaged in often by Zionists. It is, in fact, one of the favorite, for it has a supreficial appearance of reasonableness until one looks at it closer .. .

Zionism is a movement, an ideology. . . it is not a race or a religion.

So, to be against an ideology, a movement is to be neither against a race or a religion.

If it is to be not against a race, then it is highly illogical for one who is against zionism (and we are speaking of Political Zionism for that is what govern's Israel) to be labeled against the Jews.

This is even more evident when one takes into account that there are many, many Jews who are against Zionism . . surely they are not against Jews or Judaism, as they are observant and devout Torah believers.

So the highly illogical and fallacous nature of your argument is exposed for what it is . .a cheep shot that can't even come anywhere close to hitting its intended mark . . . .




And so you continue to confuse the religion with the state.

Israel is a SECULAR state. As a secular state that claims to be a democracy, it has moral obligations to see that its citizens are treated fairly and equally. It makes for no provision for Jews to marry whom they want, even if they are not religious.

A religion has no jurisdiction over those who are not part of it, to dictate to them what they will or will not do.

And Judaism does not try to dictate to non religiolus Jews what they can or cannot do. Judaism leaves them alone.

It is not Judaism that is at the root of this . . it is Political ZIONISM which has hujacked Judaism and history for its own devices.



Laws of marriage in a religion are religious. Laws of a state are secular. Israel discriminates against those Jews who reject Judaism and embrace another religion or atheism/agnosticism. Israel discriminates against any who want to marry a Jew.

And so this is one of the varoius ways the secular state has revealed its racist nature and that is is, indeed, not at all a democracy, which accepts its moral obligation to see that all its citizens are treated fairly.


All you are doing is justifying racism . . nothing more . . .


.

Zionism is not a movement it is Judaism, it is the modern zionists that I am against because they are not for Judaism but the further secularization of the state. The state is the religion and the religion is the state, however with the secular state that does apply but if Israel were a religious state this would be the case. And by the way because Israel is a democracy it is this that is harming Israel as this is being done internally rather then by our enemies. Democracy is for losers for it is THEOCRACY that is for us Jews. If a Jew deliberately disobeys the Sabbath for instance it does not matter if the person is religious or not they are to be executed by stoning. The same applies to marriage as this event is very sacred and a Jew cannot just marry anyone they please outside of Judaism. Israel is not meant to be a Democracy which is one of the reasons why Israel cannot truly fulfill its mandate for the only way it can is Theocratic rule. And by the way racism is hate of another race so I fail to see how a ban on marriage outside of religion is racism but then again everything seems to be racism to you especially if it is in Israel.
 
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thereselittleflower

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I see im arguing with a brick wall whoms allegiance lies with rome and rome alone
It is obvious you don't understand me or my words or what Catholicism is or is about. . . .

Obviously you are totally incognizant of the fact that the Jews have called Pope Pius XII and the Catholic Church their greatest friend .. . .

May I recommend familiarizing yourself with actual history:
The Myth of Hitler's Pope: Pope Pius XII

Books like John Cornwell's Hitler's Pope and Garry Wills's Papal Sin (and others) have become New York Times bestsellers by arguing that Pope Pius XII was complicit in the Holocaust by failing to do enough to save the Jews from Nazi extermination. But in The Myth of Hitler's Pope, Othodox Jewish Rabbi David Dalin explodes this newly resurrected, widely accepted, yet utterly bankrupt smearing of a pope who was, in fact, to Jewish survivors of the Holocaust, "a righteous gentile."With devastating scholarship and unblinking honesty, Rabbi Dalin condemns the myth-makers for not only rewriting history, but for denying the testimony of Holocaust survivors -- and hijacking the Holocaust for unseemly political ends.

http://www.conservativebookservice.com/products/BookPage.asp?prod_cd=c6800


You can find it on Amazon:

http://www.amazon.com/Myth-Hitlers-Pope-Against-Germany/dp/0895260344


.
 
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